To get better perspective on the significance of Osama bin Laden’s death for al Qaeda, Pakistan-U.S. relations and the war in Afghanistan, I talked to Bruce Riedel. Riedel spent nearly 30 years as a CIA officer focusing on terrorism; he served as senior advisor to three U.S. presidents on Middle East and South Asian issues; and he chaired President Obama’s first interagency review of policy toward Afghanistan and Pakistan.
Amar C. Bakshi: Can al Qaeda survive the death of Osama bin Laden in any meaningful sense?
Bruce Riedel: The death of Bin Laden is a very severe blow for al Qaeda. And it comes at a particularly bad time for al Qaeda. The organization has already been under severe pressure from the drone strikes and it has looked out of touch with the revolutions in the Arab world. It’s an open question whether it will be able to adapt to this new environment.
Its strength is that it still is deeply enmeshed in the jihadist culture of Pakistan. The fact that bin Laden was hiding in the heartland of the Pakistani nation and that he’s being eulogized by senior members of Lashkar-e-Taiba and other jihadist groups shows how much al Qaeda is entangled in the Pakistani jihadist establishment. That’s its greatest strength today - it’s not alone but rather part of a syndicate of terrorists. It will continue to pose a threat as long as it has these Pakistani allies.
Pakistan is a very complicated country. And the raid on bin Laden’s hideout has only underscored how complicated it is. He clearly had a support structure that allowed him to hide out in Abbottabad for the last several years.
It’s strains credulity to believe that the Pakistani army didn't know Osama bin Laden was hanging out in a garrison city, which is home to three Pakistani regiments and a military academy. How high up in the Pakistani Army this information went is an open question.
But I think it’s safe to say that bin Laden and al Qaeda enjoyed a significant support base in Pakistan and that support base is still there. That’s what makes the al Qaeda problem in Pakistan a continuing, serious worry.
A lot of people on the Global Public Square comment threads expressed skepticism that Pakistan didn't know about the U.S. operation, arguing that it would be hard for the U.S. to fly right by this garrison without eliciting a stronger Pakistani response.
Conspiracy theories about what Pakistan knew and who in Pakistan knew what are going to be prevalent. You can count on it. Both John Brennan and Leon Panetta have said on the record that no Pakistani was given any advance warning of the raid for fear that if we did bin Laden would have been tipped off.
It’s a pretty damning indictment. If the president’s counter-terrorism advisor and the Director of Central Intelligence Agency, and soon to be Secretary of Defense, are right that they felt we couldn’t trust Pakistan on this information and it says a lot about the U.S.-Pakistani relationship today.
Can you elaborate on Pakistan’s - or at least some elements of the Pakistan government’s - interest in supporting bin Laden and fellow terrorists?
One has to start by recognizing Pakistan’s incredible complexities and contradictions. There’s little reason to believe Pakistani President Asif Zardari had any knowledge of where bin Laden was hiding. After all, his wife, Benazir Bhutto, was assassinated with the help of al Qaeda according to the United Nations report on her death.
The jihadist sub-culture in Pakistan - most notably Lashkar-e-Taiba - has moved ideologically very close to al Qaeda in the last five or six years. We saw that in Mumbai in 2008 when Lashkar-e-Taiba attacked the targets of al Qaeda - Indians, yes, but also Westerners and Jews.
The Pakistani army is even more complicated. The Pakistan military officials rightly point out that they’re at war with part of the jihadist sub-culture in Pakistan and have 140,000 men deployed on the Afghan border - more than NATO does.
And yet at the same time it’s clear that the Pakistani military retains links with groups like Lashkar-e-Taiba and that the Pakistani Intelligence Service was deeply involved in the planning of the Mumbai operation.
So we’re talking about a situation in which we have contradictions within contradictions. But it’s clear that since 9/11, al Qaeda made a high-priority on building relationships with Pakistani groups and in many ways al Qaeda over the last decade has been “Pakistanized.” It has seen Pakistan as its most important refuge and also its more important target - for obvious reasons.
Pakistan is a country severely stressed by the militancy within it and it’s the country with the world’s fastest growing nuclear arsenal. For al Qaeda it is the strategic prize.
How should and how will bin Laden’s death affect U.S. strategy and U.S. troop levels in Afghanistan?
I think this raid demonstrates that President Obama’s much-criticized AfPak policy produced the big success by focusing resources on looking for al Qaeda, which the president always said was his number one objective in Afghanistan and Pakistan. He succeeded in doing what the Bush Administration failed to do - getting high-value target number one.
The helicopters that flew into Pakistan staged from a base in Afghanistan. They couldn’t have done it any other way. I think that on the question of troop levels they should stay where they are, which is a function of what our commanders in the field believe is necessary based on the battlefield situation this summer and on conditions on the ground.
I think it would be premature to say that the death of Osama bin Laden means we can now have a substantial troop withdrawal in Afghanistan. The gains we’ve made in the last two years are still very fragile and I think we would be putting those at great risk.
The gains in combating terrorism or nation building?
The gains in fighting the Afghan Taliban, which has been Osama bin Laden’s ally for more than a decade and which has eulogized him as a martyr since his death and the gains in terms of trying to build an Afghan security force, army and police that can deal with the Taliban without substantial American combat forces. Those processes of degrading the Taliban and building up the Afghan army are showing signs of progress, but there’s still a long, long way to go.
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No doubt the U.S. military is highly superior and the enemies in this backward Af-Pak region are impressed. It creates fear but doesn't win hearts. After Bin Laden's death, the al Qaeda might be dormant for a while. As disks and sticks had been found in the compoind, members might as well keep a low profile momentarily. It gives them time to re-invent itself and strike back later. It is the ideology of hatred that will live on, like Hitler's. We still have Neo-Nazis 60 years after his death.
I totally beieve that pakistan knew the whereabouts of Osama Bin Laden – These pakistanis have a very unique belonging and respect for the man. Pakistan Is known to always play double dealing. We want to please the WEST so we can keep on gettin the aid .. 1.3 billion dollars.. WOW ..
all of this going into the pockets of the wealthy and the rich – and at the same time .. we need to please the ISLAMIC leaders because our faith tells us to do so. These so called mullahs are our spirtual leaders.
PLS .. OBAMA.. stop this aid. STOP THIS MONEY – let them rot.
These magotts are untrustworthy... and this operaton just got them offguard and IN THIER FACE..
BAUAHAHAH
I strongly disagree with you..Benizir Bhuto was elected there twice..as president , and here husband now...both of them was elected by moderates...and the assassination of her and the twice military coup of Mushariff to put a stamp down on the appearent attempt by the minority takeover of that country ....
Do not pretend to be pakistani. I can smell indian curry from your note.
The dastardly, lying and coward Bush warned Pakistan "You are with us or against us". Pakistan was left with no alternative but to co-operate with USA against its will. Thus, Pakistan can never be blamed for any dirty deed like the hiding or cold blooded killing of bin Laden. Pakistan had, and has, nothing against bin Laden or any other Muslim group as a Muslim country.
USA, because of its dirty tactics, has problems and creates problems for other countries. USA marines are stationed in Pakistan against Pakistan wishes. Thus, Pakistan had no alternative but to "give ahead" to the killing of bin Laden and then protest for apearance sake.
USA is such a dirty country that two humble Pakistani citizens were killed in cold blood by a CIA operative Raymond Davis and Pakistan Government could take no action. At the same time a third was runover and killed in cold blood by a vehicle belonging to US Consulate. Pakistan Government still could not take any action.
Pakistan was a peaceful country before Bush's threat. Thus, it would be better if dirty USA, not Pakistan, were to leave the World in peace and get behind its dirty and filthy borders and stay there.
However, all this does not mean that Pakistan is not ruled by a pack of filthy rats servile to the wishes of the bloody USA!
Jal – be careful what you wish for – it might happen.
Let me first eat my cow kababs... then I will replay indian questions... just hate spreading.....You know nothing... must of out of school.... out of work....no money to buy education for yourself. Oh yeah... monkeys will help you to rule.... go and give some milk to snack gods first.
Stop pretending to be a Pakistani. You dumb INDIOT!!!
I totally agree with you, however, if you are an Indian, why do you pretend to be a despicable paki? Lying, Begging and terrorism is not the Hindu/Indian way of life. When you pretend to be a paki not only are you insulting us Indians but taking yourself down to their level...
i would like to say that u been believing on the stories your media n government is creating for their own interests.On one side u people want to live in peace but on the other side u need peace n prosperity for your own people.Just tell me if someone attacks on your house n kill all of your house fellows what would u do.Its really easy to say things like that but what is creating the hatred against america , you people should concentrate on that.All the nations have a right to live with peace n prosperity not only Americans.If we dont respect others freedom n solidarity ,world can never be a better n peaceful place..Its time to condemn american government against their unjustified actions so that not only we bu t all the people on earth can leave with peace n love.
Muhammad Ali Farooq : Cow Kebabs ?? your Pakistani conscience will make you gobble pork kebabs for money !!
I am pakistani and i have been to pakistan many times. it is a corrupt country. i come from a affluent family in pakistan and study abroad. once my pakistani passport was expired and upon entering pakistan, my father only had to make a call to get me into the country on an expired passport. pakistan is exaclt how it has been portrayed by the whole bin laden debacle and don't let people with pakistani pride tell you other wise. i love my country, but the corruption needs to be flushed out.
i love how the originator of this comment claimed to be paki, and all paki's are bashing him and accusing him of not being paki. based on what? did you do a dna test? do you have his birth certificate? this is pakistani pride. it's based on brain washing and hate. i see this in my own family and i see it in most other pakistani families. it's gross. and why attack the indians? the worst thing we did was split from india because both the indians and pakistanis were enslaved by the BRITISH. yet we immoratilze the british in that part of the world. our people lived in peace before the british. most people will never see that and we will keep blaming each other. the divide and conquer startegy worked, at least for the british. your comments don't show that you want peace and prosperity. they only show hate and jealousy. educate yourselves on why we are all this way and maybe you wont feel that way.
Wow Samira, I really wish everyone in Pakistan thinks like you.
Thats wrong with you Indians you start maligning the truth with Pakistan hatred. understand the problem and try to resolve it rather than acting like a pakistani. The whole region needs massive education and basic necessities uplift. Industries are required to give people jobs and bring them on the right track through reliable resources.
I can assure you that silent majority of Pakistan are liberal with moderate attitude towards religion and life ( which is islam by the way) and wants these bast** terrorist to get out of their country. We want safe secure and loving Pakistan.
Wrong. They will strike bad hard to prove that have some cohesion left. We need to foil any and all acts of desperation on their part. If we can defend against their retaliations we will destroy their hearts and minds.
If you are correct and most Pakistani citizens like to see these terrorists dead. Why is that we have not see any evidence of joy in the people and country. There were not a single clue the country was glad THIS guy was dead. And why Pakistan today is the breading ground for terrorists? to an extend to kill own citizens and plan bombs in the Mosque and kill the brothers. Do you see you any reason in your defense while the terrorists who were born in Pakistan planting bombs in Holy places like mosques and fight in the name of religion. There is NO doubt in any one mind what Pakistan is and how they support terrorism. I think it is high time stop breading terrorists.
This so called Osama deprives education for Women and implement so called Muslim law while enjoyed marrying women scholars? WOW you don't practice what you preach What a Joke!!!
Man there so many pakies living in canada now ... mostly doing low life jobs or living of welfare for free.. they breath liks pigs .. on other hands if you see most of docters are in hospitals are Indians .. lots of mps and ministers are Indians doing great for our nation ... INDIANS ALL THE WAY
WOW! There is so much hatred expressed on these forums just because of race and people say race nowadays doesn't mean anything. Believe me race means a lot to people. If you want to know I am a Pakistani living in Canada. @Jason. Do some research before you start making arguments out of nothingness and have no evidence to back them up. My dad has a PhD. degree in plant genetics and he still can't get a job because of race. Don't bullshit me with other stuff and act like race doesn't play a part in anything today. As for all the hatred, that's the reason we humans have never been able to have peace among us for centuries. It was because something always separated us religion, race, beliefs, ideas, and interests. One prime example of this is Europe. Europe has gone through decades of pain, war, diseases etc. Now they are all together and the last war they fought was WW II. God gave us minds so we can think for ourselves, provide for our families and use our intelligence to do a variety of things. My personal belief is when we humans bicker, fight, argue and spit hatred over really small things it brings us below the level of animals. Just think this for a second, if all the money used on military, firearms and drugs was used for better health and education would we be in this state today? No! Just try to think rationally for once and understand how things work. Also, spewing your hatred towards other people on the internet is not doing any one good.
I;m Indian and i don;t have to prtend or say anything to MAke Pakistan look bad, cause everyone know what Paki is all about.
People in Pakistan may not have been paid to hide Osama's location as if they knew it. They could have been paid to point out his location in a place where he wasn't and a place such as on the tribal mountainous border areas of Pakistan and Afghanistan where it no one could prove what they were saying wasn't so. Thus allowing him to hide where he did because it was hard for anyone to believe he would be there. Thus he could be protected by low level government officials who did not necessarily know he was there and didn't care to look. They could just spread rumors about who lived in the compound such as it was just a very conservative religious family who valued their privacy. Because terrorists would be crazy to live here with all the military around. I know as a kid in the prairie states of North America, there was always some kids who in a quiet secretive voice spread the half truths that kept us other kids out of certain neighboring towns and off the reservations. As an adult I learned that most of these whisperings were just out right lies or built around some event that happened once and was turned into something that was sure to happen all the time. Just pointing and saying don't go near that house, their crazy, would keep neighbors from going near. A few people could have been paid to start the rumors and water them when ever necessary without even questioning why or who was doing it.
@ samira – u r awsome.
Forget it, dumbass. Pakistani's love dollars more than Bin-Laden, had anyone known they would have fingered him long time ago to get the $25 million on his head.
Thankyou Samira for your wise words. Whoever started this comment does not matter..., he wants to incite hatred and seeing some comments he has succeded. We are all the same..., and I just dont mean Indians or Pakistanis...A stable and successful Pakistan is a priority for India. We have the same culture..., wear the same clothes, talk the same language and by the way, eat the same curry
. Corruption is a top priority for the whole region. Each and every individual has to work to solve this issue. The citizens of every region (Pakistan, India, Russia, Brazil America, China etc.) want peace. Unfortunately Politicians find ways to incite communities against each other. Politics is all about money and power..., religion is tool to achieve money and power. Every little sane comment helps in stopping and confronting morons (plenty of them here in this forum). You have to keep repeating the truth as lies also always get repeated. I believe only in one thing and that is the truth. It always comes out. Just as it has now. So Samira and all other sane individuals here, please speak out, I will do so too. Together we can stop this stupid vicious circle of hatred. Thankyou. Satyameva Jayate.
the US just hands the money over to the corrupt leaders of pakistan........ the aid is not used properly....... it is used to fill the bank accounts of the president and the rest of his gang. I don't understand why the US is so concerned about a few billion of dollars..... it's never going to mention the fact that this war on terror has actually benefited their economy greatly. The US continues to operate in Iraq as an excuse to steal the resources of Iraq, resources such as oil.
I fully agree with PakinCanada- Pakistan can never be trusted. If you ask anyone on the streets of India- all the way back to 9/12/2001- they would have told you that Osama is in Pakistan along with all the known terrorists in the world. The ISI is complicit with all the fundamentalists, LET and also have helped hide India's underworld kingpin Dawood Ibrahim. USA should wake up to this fact and not aid them and also pull out troops from Afghanistan- the people there do not want to live in democracy, they prefer tribal and warload governments -no point wasting precious American lives- President Obama please pull out our troops
@ayesha
What exactly is Imran Khan's claim to credibility and representation? ZILCH.
It doesn't matter what Imran Khan says about America. It does NOT take a bit away from the fact that Pakistani army recruit and nurture extremists to further their nefarious agenda. Ditto with their intelligence agency, the ISI.
Former ISI cheif Durrani claims that they need to do it to enhance their so called 'Strategic Depth'. Running with the hare and hunting with the hounds only lasts so long. For Pak it did end, last Sunday.
Surprisingly, Pak's shenanigans of harboring Al Qaeada and nurturing the Haqqani network while milking the USA of Billions of $$$ lasted a whole decade. It leaves a feeling of disbelief both at the naivety of the USA(/West) and the hubris of Pak's army/ISI to believe that they ride the USA and manipulate as they pleased.
Also you would be aware, politics is not a Cricket Fan Club. Your cricket hero Imran Khan doesn't even matter in the larger scheme of things, Elections. Did you check this out?? : http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pakistan_Tehreek-e-Insaf#General_elections
Why our Indian friends have to spoil every site with thir curry farts laced accents. Can we get all get along... I wish Rodney Kings was a moderator when Indian and Pakistanis face off.
@Smells Like Curry
Rather not dignify your racist rant. So, I am NOT addressing that part of your comment.
About getting along portion, though, it's gotta be a two way street.
From elsewhere in this discussion :
"India and Pakistan getting along is possible only if the latter is willing even consider that option. If you are current with the happenings out there, you will understand how tough ( I don't want to say impossible) it is to deal with lies, deception and blatant terrorism.
Major attacks by Pak based terrorists on India in the last decade alone have been on :
1. The Indian Parliament
2. Mumbai the financial hub
3. Akshardham – A very famous temple
4. Indian Institute of Science – a top research institute.
They are what frustrate India.
In 1999, the Pakistani Army unilaterally waged a war at Kargil : http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kargil_War
President Clinton weighed on India to not retaliate, else history would have been different. He also summoned Pak's Prime Minister Nawaz Sharif and threatened to cut the aid off if they don't call their army back. Guess who was heading the Pak army at that time? The sweet talking, media savvy Musharraf.
Now, do you understand that 'getting along' with Pak needs reciprocation from Pakistan ? A closer look would make it amply clear."
Wow, the narratives some of you present are so faulty and uneducated. Why not learn something about this region before you spout off with anger and frustration? Yes, Pak/US relations have been fragile. BUT, they have lost many lives in the wake of terrorism, they are a young country and yes they have many to please. Stopping aid to this war torn region would only hurt US in the end. They are a muslim state, not a terrorist state, and there is a difference. Problems? Absolutely, but they're not as clear cut as you armchair politicians make them to be. The US aids and stops aid at it's convenience leaving leaders who desperately rely on it feeling the same. There are two sides to every story. Meanwhile, I support my country, military, and military family. Stop spouting hate when you don't know what you're talking about.
Quoting
"...Learned, rational and modern Muslim leaders and intellectuals of yore like Jinnah and Sir Syed Ahmed Khan have gradually been turned into near-fanatics by those writing our textbooks and harbouring blind hatred for Hindus. So the great leaders of the past are taught in schools as being the original purveyors of a theocratic state, a notion that has no roots in reality whatsoever....."
Here's the original :
http://www.dawn.com/2011/05/08/smokers-corner-not-my-faith-really.html
Sure . your use of "These Pakistanis" gives away who your are Mr Desi.
let pakistan speek for its self.
a rich friend told me to join hands to defet my enemy and i will pay u as much as u think.and also the rich man told me that if i didnt help him i will be the next victim of that eivil.
what i am now is because of the united states fo america.
ones the CIA and ISI were friends in afganistan in fight against aginst USSR .so i help my rich friend .and now i am paying the price. please u all must go to history.
I would like to know why Pakistan blames all their ills on US. Will they ever grow up and own up to responsibility? Wonder how they manage to run a whole country with immature tactics used in kids' games. Peek a boo, anyone?
@J. Von
Unfortunately, you could be very right. Read the book 'Taliban : The Tip of the Holy Iceberg' ?http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/1439270570
It gives a great account of what's wrong in Pakistan.
Now, all the Pakistanis on this forum are going to jump and try to discredit the author Mobarak Haider and attempt to sully his credibility 'coz they don't want to know the bitter truth.
this war on terror has turned pakistan backwards.... on top of that are the corrupt politician in pakistan, this includes the current president. There was a time when Pakistan was one of the fastest growing economies in Asia, there was hope for pakistan, now all of that has changed....... We are in a big mess..... the biggest in our history
@ayesha
Correction.
Pakistan pushed the civilized world to the brink and refuses to reform. What is anyone supposed to do when you harbor terrorists who go on murderous flying missions???
All the crap about the USA leaving them in the lurch after the Afghan-Soviet war is a non-starter. If Pakistan had no selfish interest, why on earth did they even join the war? It was equally funded by Saudi Arabia but Pak only complains about the USA, why?
The fact of the matter is that the Afghan-Soviet war was an experiment for the Pakistani Army/ISI that succeeded beyond their wildest dreams. They then wanted to replicate it against India and also morph it to utilize in their other nefarious designs. The symbiotic relationship between Pakistan and the terrorist organizations is what resulted in 9/11. Those extremists were also deliberately used in the Mumbai attacks of 26/11/2008.
Only Pakistan is to blame for continuing to nurture terrorism and radicalizing big portions of their population that provides a steady supply of foot soldiers of terror.
See how some responsible members of your intelligentsia lamented in the opinion pieces yesterday :
1. http://www.dawn.com/2011/05/06/the-emperors-clothes.html
2. http://www.dawn.com/2011/05/07/a-history-of-bungling.html
I think that He is right and things will be a lot different since we drone Them and got Bin Laden!!1 They will never really recover like They use to be... This will help Obama time table to get Our troops out of Afghanistan by the end of the year!!!
tthe physionomie of the var between saint raphael to saint tropez nazis in saint raphael dutch german austria and muslims iranian turkish maroco in defense in frejus in sainte maxime nazis from argentina holland austria and evangeliste and what else a group terrorist make trouble in middle east some names welknow from holland nazis come from south africa selouse group argentina nazis ancestra come now in france from holland turkish iranian maroco close to terrorism group enought to caused trouble in world was meeting in january where all this people make a new order mondial try to play a second world war the implications of mayors evangeliste from saint raphael to sainte maxime with the presence of maxima house kngdom of holland and friend some are children from nazis two countries caused trouble for jewish communauty and liberal muslims frenchs today in danger more and ever still for me my communication block still for me no assistance from mayors police know perfectely what they done with this meeting confidential defense joelle esther benyayer what i need to said the jewish in france pay the price already more and 400 antismetisme acte in small town villeurbanne where my oncle live also member of the french ministery of defense provocation ot the army extreme right european made in personne tcaused trouble to my family france have a response to give like holland the roseraie is place where i stay also in france behind is lodge evangeliste in montpellier sainte maxime santa monica is organisation nazis european in saint raphael and port frejus old commandant of french army armand heckert was close to nazis group and you see im block joelle esther benyayer what else hannobre in monte carlo the south of france play the second wolrld war and the french president dont react joelle esther benyayer
Wha-?
what have you been drinking?
Best rambling speech I have heard in a long time!
The Pakistani ISI and military have been badly humiliated. There may be elements within those organizations, the same elements that perpetrated Mumbai, that are thinking of handing al-Qaeda a miniaturized nuke. We need to make it very clear to the Pakistani military, right now, that the detonation of a nuke on US soil will result in the instant incineration of Rawalpindi.
pakistan is country born with hatred .. pple are uneducated 85% illitracy rate ... they are so low can eat pork for money or sell there sisters and mothers for money.. one hand they hate states on other hand they would f0k there mothers to come to states... you cant trust these animals ... They have India phobiea in 60 years India is well know settled country but pak is know country with terrorist horboring .. they need to come out of stone age and see whats there in world ..
You must be the world most ignorama. Pakistan was born out of the need to not be bullied by the majority Hindua in post Independent India. It was built with secular constitution. But India did whatever it could to thwart Pakistan's progress. In fact Gandhi was very responsible for Jinna joining the crowd for partition. Had Gandhi not favored Nehru over the well experienced Jinna to be the first prime minister of independent India, there would have been NO Pakistan. That is what Indian students told me.
Pakistanis and Indians are the same. They are the same culture and background. Pakistan was India before the independence. The people have families in both the nations spread out. Pakistan being much smaller always worried about getting gobbled up by India since India is 4 times bigger in land and the 6 times bigger in population. India has advanced much faster in the 60 years economically. Pakistan was split in 2 nations during a civil war by Indian interference and so Pakistan will not trust Indian intentions in the destruction of Pakistan. Although Pakistan is a nerve center of Alqueda and Taliban. None of the 9/11 terrorists were Pakistanis. None of the leaders of Alqueda leaders are Pakistanis. They take refuge in Pakistan due to the sympathizers in the Pakistan population. Alqueda is mostly Arabs and North Africans. No Iranians or Pakistanis or Bengalis or Indians.
I know one thing for damn sure.
Indians literally stink. They eat some ingredient in their food (forgot the name) that
causes them to stink un-naturally when they sweat.
Also usually they are butt ugly.
Also they are always ready to bash pakistan as though they have no problems in india at all.
Whatever problems India has they keep within India...Pakistan and Pakistanis are a problem for the whole world. 90% of ever terrorist plot in Europe has a Pakistani connection according to the British. Gofigure.
Indians massacre 5000 Muslims in Gujrat, by hacking to pieces thousands of women and children, they have also killed over 100, 000 muslims in Kashmir. In my view, Indians are bigger terrorists than the Pakistans.
I just wanted to leave a note for my Indian brothers and sisters .
When arguing with a pakis/porkis remember these are terrorist bred , madrassa educated illiterate, who come from a failed corrupt country. their knowledge is what the illiterate mullahs taught them.
these are snakes, rats, low level animals whosw leaders are two timming , back stabbing, terrorist.
these are sc/st tribes converted to muslims with no family value, no culture but of violence and terrorism, which has come to roost.
these muslims are looked down by the arabs who know these are the discard of indian society.
the thing these porki pigs can do is to beg and they beg good as they have been living off the aid from uSA.
when cornered as these porkis are now they spew venom, but they can be eliminated.
wait Indians they are self destruting , these low level animals will explode. we just have to watch the fun.
only 34.000 dead there is 170 millons to go.
Reply to mamta: Talk about spewing venom, you actually should read your response. You are spewing venom. This is like 2 snakes spewing venom on each other and neither dies. You are all hopeless. The language you used seems like you have also been educated in some madrasa. Shameful.
I have read a lot of these responses and it does not help anyone gain any understanding by stereo typing the people of any country or ethnic group in the world.
Every country and ethnic group are made up of individuals organized into families and into communities. Every country and ethnic group is divided into smaller power groups that work for their own interest but not necessarily the good of the country as a whole.
The United States went through this when at first people were New Yorkers first and Virginians first and Americans second. When I was young people were upset if people of different Christian sects married each other.
There are certain power groups in Pakistan who have a self interest in protecting the terrorist and others that would hang them and others that just don't care as long as it is not in my neighborhood. From watching the television and internet reports one can see that Pakistan is not a totally closed community because the outside world could come in and watch the military inspect the Osama's compound.
The soldiers just stood there and made no threatening moves toward anyone around the compound.
Now, yes, some people were rounded up including the people who lived in the compound and it remains to be seen what the people who took these people into custody do with these people. That will tell a story.
It just seems that in looking in at Pakistan the power in the country is divided up between the military, the local governments, and the national government and to a certain extent they are each a law unto themselves. Its also difficult to know who is running the show and who is making the rules.
Now in the United States the power is also very divided up and no one person runs the whole show and this power can also be abused by certain power centers.
But my point is this that no country is simple and speaking of a country as if it were a single person with a single voice and putting down the whole country for that helps no one and only insults everyone within that particular country.
Many of the countries in the Middle East and North Africa are busy these days trying to redefine themselves so most of our old stereo types and prejudices are irrelevant any way and only exposes the ignorance of the person who does it,
@Michelle
Totally see where you are coming from. Looking only at the comments on this forum might not give enough information to understand that the opinions are NOT prejudiced stereotyping. A look back at recent history of Pakistan and putting together major happenings starting from Zia-Ul-Haq's dictatorial regime in Pakistan, trends will become obvious that the society has been systematically mis-led and manipulated. Given the rapid population growth during the same period, Pakistan now has more than the critical number of extremists in their population to hold their country hostage, heck, even a super power hostage.
The manipulative strategy on part of Zia and his military, ISI successors yielded short term strategic gains in Afghanistan and India. At some point in the 90s, the strategy back-fired and proved to be a frankenstein. It has become something that Pakistan cannot wish away nor control. This is the frustration that you see haunting the USA, Afghanistan and India.
Listening to their 'ghairat brigade' commentators on their cable TV will show how much they are consumed by conspiracy theories, a product of the manipulation of an entire generation of pakistanis
To see how some of their more reasonable, open minded journalists lament the state of their country just read the latest articles from after Bin Laden's death. It is important to call the facts to help prevent another 9/11, Mumbai attack or Bali bombings. Articles follow :
1. http://www.dawn.com/2011/05/06/the-emperors-clothes.html
2. http://www.dawn.com/2011/05/07/a-history-of-bungling.html
3. http://www.dawn.com/2011/05/05/grab-the-reins-of-power.html
@Michelle
And here is what Salman Rushdie has to say about Pakistan on NewsWeek : http://www.newsweek.com/2011/05/05/pakistan-a-terrorist-state.html
Let me warn you, this is not a flattering account either. On the other hand, it is incriminating.
Thank you Michelle for such a well thought out comment. Pakistan and India have been fighting over Kashmir since they both gained independence from the Brits in 1947. They were a minority in India, when the Brits came in the Muslims were so infuriated they refused to assimilate into society and lost power. Before the Brits, for 350 years they ruled that subcontinent. US has given them the cold shoulder many times throughout US/Pak relations and they cozied up with the Chinese because they have always feared India. Both are friends with the US, but Pak does have divergent interests, especially since the 1960's when they tried to take Kashmir. It's complicated and has many factions just as you've said sympathetic towards those like Al Quaida. Much of the country is anti-American because they feel the aid we send props their leads who muzzle their voices. "Does Pakistan really stand with the US against terrorism" – they are asking the same question – "Does the US stand with us as an ally?" Well, it depends on what's going on as to whether we stand with them. Just not black and white. US would go a long way to continue to help them in a meaningful way.
Lynn,
You referred to Muslims of India (before partition) as separate entity. Obviously, your knowledge if Indian history is VERY limited to see referring to the Mughul's rule as "they ruled the subcontinent". While you speak negatively of Pakistan, you spoke nothing about how the police of the so called secular state of Indian idly watched as innocent civilian Muslim men, women (including pregnant ones) , and children were burned alive with gas. Despite your Anglo sound name, I have no doubt that you are an Indian.
Well said Samira at least you have the guts to speak the facts unlike others who just want to sweep the realities under the carpet. I'm an Indian and the only gleam of hope I see in Pakistan is the people like you my sister !!
JAL MADE MY DAY. Quates "Pakistan was a peaceful country."???????!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!?!?!?!?! I don't know what world he lives in. A peaceful counry... can't get enough laugh...
it seems like Indians are the next biggest threat to US. It is not a joke, just see the facts coming from US govt. According to US commerece department, 4 million high-tech jobs have been trasnfered from US to Indian since 2007. It is expected 2.5 millions more jobs will be transfrerd to India in next three years. Indians investment in the US is lowest among top 50 countries investing in US (India is not even in top 50). According to Indian govt Indians living in US invested over 4 billions in India. It was hard cash that should have been invested in US., Indians have taken over American hospitality industry, according to statistics Indians own 78% US motels. Indians are fastest growing immigrant community in US due to high birth rate and huge family system. A study shows that an average Indian immigrant to US sponsors 5 family members in life time compare to 1 Mexican, 2 Phillipino, 1 Chiese and 0 European citizens. I see a huge treeat to US jobs and stability. I am sure most Americans do not want to see their cities taken over by Indians. simple facts
A little known hearing by the US 9th Circuit Courts of Appeal was heard on Monday May 2nd, one day after the months-in-the-planning order was given to kill bin Laden. Barack Obama's eligibility hearing will now advance to the SCOTUS, and along with rising gasoline prices and catastrophic numbers of unemployed Americans, the upcoming political battle should get very, very, interesting.
Can anyone say, Wag the Dog?
Pakistan is terrorist nation. Use their religion to kill christians and hindus in their own country. Killed so many hindus in Kashmir and all over India for severl years. It is a sanctuary for all inslamic terrorists causing destruction all over the world. It is their islamic schools that teach them the hatred towards non-islamic religions. Their true nature can be seen by their support to all terrorists and recently killed on.
I am Hindu, and American of Indian origin. Before reading further, please note that many people in Pakistan are very poor and want to only live their lives in peace. They want no jihad. They are more to be pitied than censured. They get screwed by landowners and the mullahs. And by the Government/Army.
I have lots of Muslim friends (Indian). Very, very decent people.
Indian muslims, the overwhelming majority of them, maybe 99.9%, are regular, nice people.
Pakistani Punjab, however, is a different story (this is the province that is the core of Pakistan..Islamabad and the region around it, in loose terms). Why have many Pakistani Muslims become Taliban/Taliban-wannabees?
In general, this is how Islamic radical Terror gets its fodder:
Encourage people, however poor, to have as many children as possible. Assure them that the kids will be taken care of, and will earn an education.
People who make maybe $3 a day will have 7 kids.
These kids, as soon as they are 4 or 5, will enrolled in a madrassah. The madrassah, often funded by Saudi money or US money (aid after being laundered anywhere between 2 and 5 times), then feeds the child, clothes him, makes him learn Arabic, then the Koran, the Hadith (life of the Prophet) etc.
After 7-10 years, the kid has a degree in something like "Islamic Jurisprudence".
There are no jobs in what the kid has learnt. What jobs are there, the kid is not qualified for.
Kid (now almost a man) is increasingly disillusioned..by the day.
The Maulavi at the madrassa escorts him to the nearest "Army of Allah" camp. This is the un-uniformed army of Pakistan, with camps all throughout the Islamabad-Rawalpindi-Muzaffarabad area (Pak Punjab and the so-called "Azad" –or "Free"– Kashmir region of Pakistan).
The kid/man is told how he can earn a livelihood through jihad. Against India, against the US..etc. Through any of the Tanzeems– Al Qaida is a US manufactured name, for the most part, the many real organizations go by names like Lashkar-e-Taiba/Jaish-e-Mohammad, the various "Harkat"s etc..
The rest of the story ...well, it is becoming clearer as the days go by..
All right, now the self-proclaimed Mughal heirs of India can bring on their cow-piss drinking videos of Hindus...
For some strange reason, I don't think the Seals are gonna be watching.
First, it's not amazing at all that the US commandos could get in and get out. America couldn't scramble a fighter on 9/11 to save the World Trade Center towers nor the Pentagon, and the hijackers of the fourth plane, apparently headed toward the White House, were stopped by passengers using serving carts as a battering ram – not a jet in sight. So the seemingly slow Pakistani response isn't a surprise. It's also not a surprise – nor a particular insult – that Pakistan wasn't told. Only Americans were told. Not Brits (who might have known a helpful thing or two), not anyone. Security was beyond crucial here – five minutes' warning and Osama probably would have escaped.
Don't worry Bud Man,those bozoes are going to be more popular than Jesus Christ once their names become public!
John-Really, you think that the Navy Seals are bozos...Man I hope you meet one and run your mouth real soon.
would be a great thing for a retire seal to be around when you open you mouth like that...the drs, will probably have to use pig lips for your trans plant..
I am no SEAL...but in honor of my friend who was on TEAMSIX in the past...I would rip your lips off...in an instant.
That seal team was not perfect. 4 kills and only 1 was an armed combatant. They tried to destroy the crippled top secret helicopter but did such a sloppy job they all but personally gave China the means to create next gen stealth systems. That intact tail boom will give the Chinese, Russians and Pakistani's aerospace designers the breakthrough in material composition and design to bring their stealth programs to our level. IMHO they did not perform their jobs well, how did those operators become members of DEVGRU if they fail at basic demolitions? I am not a engineer but I can tell alot about stealth design from that picture. It looks like the engine exhaust was channeled through the tail boom most likely to be mixed with fresh air to significantly reduce thermal signatures, the faceted deisgn and the stabilizer swashplate cover also gives away tons of secrets. I would not be surpised if it used the next gen bearingless transmission system to further reduce it's auditory detection. Man that 1 piece of the heli could be the greatest military blunder if it can be successfully reversed engineered by our enemies. Yes we got Bin Laden but we gave our adversaries the means to penetrate sophisticated air defenses with impunity. Mr. President next time send in the Rangers or a Green Beret Alpha Team.
That was one of the worse comparisons I have ever read in my life! What would you have had the U.S. government do, shot down civilian airliners? Keep in mind no one could have known at that time that planes were going to be used as missles on that specific day. Its far different when MILITARY choppers are flying over a large military town, land and conduct a 40 minute operation in which the world most wanted man was killed. Your comparisons make no sense at all, you sir I can tell have never served in the military so I don't expect you to really have a clue as to the S.O.P. when it comes to blowing up airplanes with hundreds of civilians but come on just think about what you said for a minute.
I don't think his comment meant to be malicious. I think what he was trying to say is that as advanced as the USA is, we couldn't scramble fighter jets quick enough to catch the other jets on 911. So if we couldn't do it in time, there was no way Pakistan was going to get to our osama raid fast enough.
Sgt. It is unacceptable that four planes could leave Boston and switch off their transponders and deviate from their flight paths, and Jets not be scrambled to intercept them. How could our air defense system be so lax, we have Air bases there just for such a purpose. As soon as the controllers lost contact, there should have been contact with the military.
The fourth airliner was headed for the Capitol, not the White House. September 11 was chosen because the plotters knew that Congress would be in session. The BS about the White House target was spread by Bush to justify his running around like a headless chicken on 9/11.
I see that the American public is still having a gigantic field day over the brutal murder of the purported Usama bin Laden. I don't think that even the Germans got that carried away. Let's just hope that we don't succeed in Afghanistan as we have absolutely no right to be there. We are indeed arrogant and self righteous!
He was a mass murderer who refused to surrender for at least ten years. I'm all for getting out, but 'hope we don't succeed'? What does that mean?
Kinda like the giant field day the Arab world had on 9/11? Nothing self-righteous about bringing a MASS-MURDERER to justice. If you don't like this country, I hear Pakistan is ver nice in the Spring. Pack your $h!t and git!
i think the small one is already a paki !
"Hope we don't succeed in Afghanistan ?" The term "self rightious" is a proper term but it should be applied to YOU. Americans are dying in that country and, while I don't necessarily agree with the strategy, I want Americans to succeed so that they can come home..... You certainly have a right to your opinion but, my opinion is that you should be ashamed....
Troll...
ditto
You don't want us to succeed?? You would rather our young men and women die for nothing over there just for the sake your ideology? If you want to talk "arrogant" and "self righteous", look in the mirror. Comparing the the situation in Germany 1945 to the death of Bin Laden shows how completely ignorant you are.
im with you on that one bro he is an idiot
Thanks Rasheed Mendenhall!!!
whoops, make that rashard mendenhall...
it is true your voice is small very small ...still I'll humble myself and address you....
your expression sound like that of a bitter bitter sour sour lemon...
get yourself a peppermint and always put one in before you ever say anything
you should be aware that I make stupid people realize just how stupid they really are...
people are laughing already before i made this post...
Don't defend OBL....Either American did right thing or not is not the case...OBL was an asshole who has murdered more Pakistani then Americans.....This OBL shit need to get out of your mind...Thanks Obama for killing that eveil if you really have done that but all indications are this was CIA stagged saga week before Obama Election kick-off...
Essense of a muslim or Paki living in the US and enjoying its hospitality all the while plotting its downfalll, typical paki/ muslim terrorist
Ditto.
Have you been to any of their gatherings? It's like being in a dangerous area of Pak.
That is so true. THESE PAKISTANIS and Most MUSLIMS are so Hypocrytical and can not be trusted. I know many such cases who like to enjoy all the benefit but wish the downfall of US. PAKIS for sure are two timing bastards. Only thing that smells from them is terrorism.
It is amazing that you were forced to leave India cuz your race and dark color. Have you ever seen any fair color Indian in US or Canada? I bet not all Indians are dark and ugly. There are high cast Brahmin who rule india and would not leave India. It is amazing that you guys are treated so bad by India but you do not let any opportunity to attack Pakistanis. Let me tell you Pakistani American are not termites who is eating up American jobs and economy. American economy was messed up cuz good paying job were givein to monkeies with curry accent. Indians are the main reason why US NCLB act was enacted by Pres Bush. Talk to any Americans they will tell you that there is not bigger threat to US than India who is slowy eating up our economy. Stop bringing ugly people to US.
@To Low Cast Indians
Surely, you don't even consider China as a player of important in the world economy, eh?
Pakistan's deluded defence and foreign policy might be as simple as 'fight whoever is in the east'. That rule doesn't apply to the increasingly globalized world economy.
What kind of victory are you speaking of? We can never establish peace in lands that have not experienced it in millienia. We can never create stability when it should be the people of that nation creating it. We can be brothers and sisters to that nation, not mothers or fathers. Let them decide their fate, let us support them. I a catholic will stand shoulder to shoulder with my Muslim brothers if they wish it and I will never force them to turn from their most holy of text because of the might of my nation. The human spirit is far greater then a thousand atomic bombs.
1 small idiot.
The US gives billions of dollars worth of arms and weapons parts to Pakistan. It seems senseless to me to sell them the very tools they use to attack us and augment the militants. (http://www.thehindu.com/news/the-india-cables/the-cables/article1983608.ece; http://assets.opencrs.com/rpts/RS22757_20090824.pdf) Who's provide weapons and cover for Pakistan now? China? Russia? Germany? No, the US should use the aid it gives to Pakistan as leverage to force the military and intelligence officers to be on our side. The Pakistani military needs to respect the fact that the aid it gets comes from hardworking Americans' tax dollars. Hiding bin Laden in a compound is not just a slap in the face to the CIA but to the American people.
Who's *going to* provide weapons and cover for Pakistan now?
Raj you are speaking on Behalf of Indian Extremists because you are probably naturalized American. Nevertheless, No one in the entire world's media has even given a .01 % possibility that Pakistan has helped U.S in finding OBL but cannot publicly state because Osama's followers could burn Pakistan down to ashes. Do you all know that no one in Pakistan is safe from these ruthless killers. Osama's killers slaughters over 34000 Pakistani's since the 9/11 that is a significant number compare to what we Americans lost in 9/11 or compare to what England lost in their train bombing or what India lost in Mumbai attacks or what Spain lost in Madrid train bombing. We Americans should praise Pakistani's for their Sacrifices in the name of America's war on terror. Pakistani's fought America's war against Soviet Union in early 80's and in the result of that we have lost countless lives. Do you all know that since 9/11 Pakistan's economy has suffered the loss of 68bn dollars and received 38bn dollars in Military aides. It is not cheap to fight terrorists. Making peace free but we do not like anything that comes free...
You seem to support a failing/failed state. Pakistan has to do a serious introspection if it wants to become a credible country. No point blaming India/Indians when your leaders/military/ISA are to blame for the common people's plight. How can you justify 9/11, mumbai attack/ uk attack........and many more that were purely tageted against civilians?
Bilal, the differencce is that other countries you have mentioned are targetted by terrorists your country (Paki) has supported over past 20 years, whereas in case of Pakistanis that were killed – they were killed by people your country supported. What you reap is what you sow.
If Pakistand wants piece it needs to realize it can't export terrorisom.
Prolem is that the world has been too tolerant to Pakistan. Despite knowing Pakistan (though just blamed on A Q Khan) exported nuclear technology and parts to other friends (Libya, North Korea, Iran etc), and has gone unpunished. Promoted terrorism in India for past 25 years (incluidng serial blasts in Mumbai in 93 and many other attacks), yet gone unpunished
Bilal – Biin Laden has killed 34,000 of your countrymen while hiding in your country for about 5 years and you didn't know about it or choose to ignore it? The rest of the world, including your arch-enemy India, are trying to get you to realize your country is committing suicide and all you do is go deeper into denial. If Pakistan is an Islamic country, is it not prohibited to commit suicide, just as a follower of Islam is prohibited from committing suicide?
Spoken like a true Pakistani! Hey i saw a compound spring up on 42nd street, i guess ill ignore it! Stop supporting terrorists, stop forcing your religion on others. Stop complaining if you dongt want US help, besides our money. Just go it alone and shut up!
@Bilal
Curious where you get those numbers from. Are you adding up the numbers below ?
1. Shias killed by your majority Sunnis
2. People who dies in last years floods
3. People who died in the earth-quake of 2005.
4. Pakistani terrorists killed in action in Mumbai, Afghanistan
5. Christians killed by religious zealots
6. Hindus killed by religious zealots
Or, worse yet, is that what they are teaching in your history books these days?
You gotta find better sources, coz your history books are written by bigots and conspiracy theorists. Simple evidence is the fact that you are taught that Jews are monkeys and Christians are pigs.
Bilal,
Small correction. You have either forgot or not aware of how many Indians died in Kashmir.
In the name of India, Pakistan has been breeding Terrorists and it is has started paying a price for it. Hope they will wake up and stop supporting terrorists. One example.. Pakistan claims they do not know OBL in their country ( No one believes that other ). However, they have been harboring noted Indian born terrorist in their country openly and they refused to send him back to India. His name is Dawood Ibrahim, he along with ISI planned 1993 attacks, and kills hundreds people in Mumbai. While he lives freely in Karachi he has been granted Pakistani passport and claims they do not his existence in the country. Therefore, it is not new for Pakistani Govt. to harbor criminals and support terrorism.
Fact is always a problem. We all know from many years that Pakistan is a complex country and not trust worthy. We are repeating this fact again and again. Meantime, Pakistan is getting more money from USA on pretext of helping us to fight terrorist. In reality they are not helping but hiding most of the terrorist and supporting them indirectly. This fact is a problem and how to deal with it ? if we cut off with Pakistan totally than it is not easy to catch those terrorist in Pakistan. USA do not have stretegy to attack Pakistan as an enemy country and finish there all nuclear establishments once for all. This is the real solution for real peace in this world. Unless they are not punished seriously, they are going to play such mischief again and again.
I am just fascinated to see how naive and gullable the american people are.....the state (Obama and Co) are taking you guys for a ride and you people are stupid enough to believe him. I though Pakistan was packed with brainless people but America sure takes the lead – where do you guys think from? possibly your toes! If ISI was implicit then America would never ever have been able to find Osama – they have places/safe houses that the USA cannot even dream of accessing! anyhow American people wake up before its too late....the American establishment is just playing another of its and this time its just too stupid to accept!!Bin Laden has long been dead – killed by either Bus-bin laden or Obama bin Laden, the timing is just to jump start an exit strategy from Afghanistan and in the process win the next elections! NO WONDER REPUBLICANS ARENT DANCING THEIR HEADS OFF!
Dirka Dirka Dirka? Ohhh Muhamud JiHad! Dirk Dirk Allah!
Damn, with a brain like yours, I'm amazed you could work a keyboard.
Obvious troll is obvious.
wow ...are you an idiot !
Raj,
That's Indian side of you that is speaking, Pakistan has suffered more than any other country (30,000 killed) in this so called war in terrorism, if you think Pakistan should be attacked for harboring terrorist then Indian should be attacked as well for supporting Baluchistan separatist and killing people of Kashmir, Raj when emotions over take your mind then a person just B.S.
Regards
Peace loving Canadian
What you just mentioned is the Pakistani refrain of the blackmail + guilt trip combination. Almost certainly, you are a Canadian Pakistani and you have been drilled to constantly argue for 'your land' the only place you owe allegiance to irrespective of your citizenship.
The constant refrain from Pakistan is :
1. 'USA can't win this war without us.'
2. 'We lost more people to Islamic terrorism than the entire world together.'
3.'If you need us to hunt the terrorists we are harboring, you better pay us in the Billions'
4. 'We lost our former prime minister Benazir to the very same terrorists.'
As long as growing high-value terrorists is a good business proposition for Pakistan, they will continue to nurture them. They are playing a very high stakes game which will end and when it does, it will be disaster for you first.
As regards Benazir, Musharraff has a lot fo questions to answer.
A few years back Stephen Cohen said 'Pakistan is the only country that negotiates with a gun to it's head.' If you were to ask him now, he would say, 'Pakistan has learnt how to milk the naive USA (west in general) with lies, utter lies and when they don't work veiled threats and blackmail.
Agree with HA above, the west has been exceedingly naive in handling the menace that is Pakistan.
Sorry peace lover you dont read the news enough. How few Pakistanis really get tried for horrendous acts against their own people, raping kids as brides, killing girls that were raped.
This is no Govt and we give them 2.8 billion a year. Not the people the Govt, read more and then tell me how peace loving this country is.
They the Pakistanis are taking to the streets to swear vengance against america. where are the authorities, they hate us to cause we would not let them harbor a killer in plain sight.
Ram, the United States can't win this war because of Pakistan. It was protecing Bin Landen while stuffing their pockets with American dollars and recieving new american military vehicles. IMHO it was Pakistan that forced us to stay in Afghanistan for so long. 30,000 dead? where are they buried? I am sure they sacrificed a few soldiers to make it appear they are complying while secretly helping the Taliban and Al'Qeada keep the pressure on the Americans. Their Motive. Let the American's die so they can keep giving miltary aid to offset the rapid growth of India's military might. We cut off those funds. India we be way out of Pakistan's defense capabilities in 3 years. I will not care if India take out Pakistan. Who care about a country that helps terrorists kill people.
I agree with Raj. This is the real solution.
Hey BhaRATi hater, if you want to take out Pakistan's nuclear weapons then do it yourself, don't try to hide behind Americans.
Oh and don't forget to drink your Gau Jal, Rat Milk, and swim in the dirty excrement infested ganga water like the Rampi$$deshi that you are.
If I remember history right, India all but did take Pak out and it was only the intercession of the US that prevented it. Next time, I say give India all the muntions they need to finish that runt of a country off.
Pakis drink camel urine, Got their women raped by their arab conquerors for free and Cut their own dcks to make it look like the pedaphile Mohameds camel chwed dck. And go bleed some goats to death to celebrate ur pedaphiles festival Id
thank you for exposing them Amrullah. India was a friend of the USSR in the Cold War, when Pakistan and Afghanistan were helping the U.S. Millions of Afghans died fighting the Soviet tyranny, and Pakistan devoted significant resources to fighting the Soviet invasion. Then America screwed them both and kissed Hindu ass, calling them "natural allies." It's no wonder Pakistan's military has fallen behind and bin Laden was able to become popular for a while.
All these Indians know this. They are looking to exploit America and take jobs away from Americans through outsourcing. Just last week, they decided to exclude U.S.firms from a billion dollar defense project.
India will be the ruin of America and Pakistan. They will ruin the U.S. economy and divide Pakistan and Afghanistan into mini-states, all run by "democratically elected leaders" like Zardari and Karzai.
@Quaint
All your rants are accurately mentioned in the past tense.
The present is :
Pakistan has been nurturing terrorism as a state policy. Zial-Ul-Haq's initial strategy was to use terrorism to expand into Afghanistan and bleed India. Through they continue to insist that Osama was created by USA, it was Pakistan who sought to use his Al Qaeada and the Taliban as an extension of their foreign policy. When he attacked America, you started playing the double game.
Hunting with the hounds and running with the hare will only last so long. It probably did, on Sunday.
Will the future be :
A Pakistan that is a responsible country and world citizen ? Will they renounce evil designs and reform themselves? Do they want to? Can they, even if some want to ? Based on the trends of the past 3 decades, the answers to the questions ring very dangerous, very scary.
India is dealing with America and also the rest of the world through trade and diplomatic channels. Everything is out in the open. The world knows that. Unfortunately for you, the world also knows that Pakistan continues to nurture and harbor lunatic terrorist organizations like Al Qaeada, Lashkar E Taiba.
You are evil as you try to defame India where true insult and shame is for people like you and your cult who thrive on islamist hatred for non muslims ans want to dominate the world.This will never happen.Liquidation of Pakistan will bring world peace and balochistan will be independent and Pakistan occupied Kashmir will one day belong to India
I thought It would enlightening to see what intellectuals like Salman Rushide think about Pakistan and I do not want to share this to insult Pakistan but bring to light some truths discerned.
Its ok to drink cow urine, but not ok to eat OSAMA shit, that what u have been doing for so many year. Now everyone knows,
I must say that this is the best time for India. Pakistan globally has become so notorious ( a lot of it) due to its own fault. I can sense that every Indian......sees that Pakistan is breathing its last breath and the US will take off the ventilator at any moment...Am I correct or what.........?? You can see the hate that people post in these message boards specially people with Indian origins.......I have one small message for all Pakistani hating Indians...................India..........is not USA.....................get through your skull....India is still a 3rd world country where 95% people live below the poverty line.........Sure there are corrupt people in Pakistan but your ultimtae wish that Pakikstan will end will never come true............The US has no interest in attacking Pakistan and nothing like that will happen......
@Taimur, That's very sad commentary looking through the conspiracy theorists prism again.
As regards your imaginative assumptions about India/Indians, nothing can be far from the truth.
India hopes, seemingly against hope, that Pakistan change their way from being the neighborhood thug to a responsible member of the world. The USA will leave the place sooner or later. Whose problem is Pakistan then going to be? India's.
More than the USA, India has a lot of experience with Pakistani nurtured terrorism. Worse yet, Pakistan at least puts a facade of co-operation with them for the Billions. With India, they flat out refuse!
What you are seeing on these forums is exasperation and frustration of having dealt with an incorrigible thug in the neighborhood. A thug you can't just move away from.
Time to introspect instead of pointing fingers? Hey, it was time 2 decades ago.
Ram Shkaer.........No offense........Let me ask you... thing .........Who wants to be the biggesst thug of South Asia........It is your INCREDIBLE INDIA..................Pakistan is the only country that has not accepted Indian might and India cannot swallow that...........So please enough about Indian experience to deal with Pakistan..................
Keep digging and throwing mud. The fact remains that Osama was found in Abbottabad, a military garrison town. Fact remains that all the below who's who of Al Qaeada were caught IN Pakistan.
1. Abu Zubaida
2. Abdul Rahim Nashiri
3. Khaled Sheikh Mohammed
4. Abu Faraj Al Libbi
5. Abu Laith
6. Osama bin Laden
Hamid Karzai was indeed prophetic when he said that Osama would be found in some urban area in Pakistan. It wouldn't be far fetched to imagine that Al-Zawahiri is hiding somewhere in Pakistan too.
Any imaginations of yours that you want to ascribe to India/Indians will not take away from the fact that Pakistan nurtured, sheltered and continues to use terrorism as state policy. And no, now it's not just India's experience, it's the WORLD'S experience with Pakistan. Do we have to see more to understand that? That would go beyond NAIVETY to STUPIDITY.
The bottom line is, Pakistan continues to choose the wrong path of lies, utter lies, veiled threats and blackmail. Unfortunately, you don't see a better path either. With a population of 170 Million, changing how you think, understand and form perspectives is almost an impossible task. Any management guru will tell you that.
I can totally sympathise with you. You are only a product of the rotten system. However, it's people like you who form the support system for the terrorists killing thousands of women, men and innocent children.
Dude – US Forces came into your country in a military town and killed the guy most likely your military or ISI guys were harboring. They routinely fire on your homes and properties and people using drones and kill people as if they are targets in video games. If that is not attacking Pakistan what is – are you delusional or in total denial!!.
Obviously India is not USA – does not take a genius to note that but did it occur to you that your beloved Pakistan is probably worse off than even Sri Lanka and Bangladesh?
Mr. Shaker no personal attacks please.......I will be brief.....Look at the other side.........All 6 were caught in Pakistan.....It means Pakistan is helping the US and the rest of the world.........Yes there are extremist elements in Pakistan but 95% of the country is not like that....Look at your India....You aint a develped country...where people bury their daughters when they are born...Where the ritual of "Sati"happens in your rural areas.......Cast system is prevalent only in your country......So for God's sake............look at yourself in the mirror.................As for Hamid Karzai....he no more than an Indian Agent sitting in Afganistan...........Enough said
@Taimur, You start off with a request on no personal attacks, but ask me to look in the mirror. See the contradiction?The same rule should apply equally.
Those terrorist masterminds were caught in Pakistan. Why do you think they were IN Pakistan in the first place? Why not Britain, China ? The answer has to be that they have both overt and covert support from Pakistan.
And, dude your Indian history is very dated. Sati is almost unheard of these days. Alas, you won't get it because you are similarly drilled to believe that Jews are monkeys and Christians are pigs.
You say only 5% of Pakistan is extremists, now that's that is 8.5 Million extremists based on your current population of 170 Million. The conspiracy theories propagated by your political system and media will ensure that the number will be higher in the coming years.
Gotta say bro, as I put all these together, I really feel bad for you. You try to defend whatever you can, but you know there is not much defend. I understand your plight. Hope you get a good night's sleep if a bomb doesn't blow up in your neighborhood.
All your finger pointing will not take a bit away from the fact that Osama attacked the USA with strong support from Pakistan. After the attack, Pakistan continued to not just shelter him but provided him with luxury under the loving care of their military in Abbottabad.
Shaker................You can say whatever you want.............All I can say is that nothing can end your jealousy.....You are a filthy curry smelling indian....which is what people say to all Indians abroad................Noone wants to be a curry smelling indian...........
Texas Ranger............If you are an indian........go fu$$ your sister.............If not go nuke your own house.........
@Taimur
Truth is bitter. Keep your cool. Introspection is important for you to get better.
Taimur – You surely have got all facts wrong. We do not have 95% below poverty line, have you ever been to India? Inspite of all the corruption there is growing middle class. Our defence budget is only 2.5% of GDP. It is not begging USA for aid or any other foreign country. Pakistan on the contrary is making nukes instead of feeding it's own people. Begging china and usa for aid. Zia-ul-haq once said we will eat grass but fight indians. That's the beauty of democracy , things eventually precolate to grass root. We do not have to fight you, you will all kill each other pretty soon with the hatred that runs deep in you all. If not for India you would have been fighting among your self. Your Military needs India to show as a threat and unify the country.Hatred only brings the worst in people and blindess that you can not see your own downfall.
Taimur,
You just proved WHO YOU ARE REALLY by using such a language here. Thanks for showing the WORLD WHO you people really are and kind of anger and hate you have for Indian. There is no reason for the rivalry other than your brains have been rotten with preaches by your Politian’s who survive by twisting the facts. Indian never sent terrorists to your country. Indian never attacked Pakistan.
It is time Pakistan and its citizens to open their eyes and stop breading those so called Jihadist (bunch of looser with no purpose in life). In your terms, you keep saying 30,000 Pakistanis died by them and you still feed them and bread them. Are you out of your MIND?
Indian is the country who won the freedom by Peace. You many never know the really meaning for that or you will ever understand.
@Raj: You just don't go and attack a nuclear power. Remember, nuclear weapons are hardly there to be used ever. They're there as a deterrence. I don't think involving in another military misadventure is affordable and in US interest. Pakistanis are of course going to look after their interest before ours first. I think i would make more sense to withold the aid we give them until they come to realize that taking the side of US has great benefits and advantages for tne economy and military of Pakistan.
I think the world community should get together and help Pakistan destroy its nuclear arsanel and facilities before it falls into the hands of the terrorists...and if they are not ready to co-opearte then India, Israel and US should acheive this in a joint operation
Bin Laden or Indians.
it seems like Indians since Bin Laden is dead. according to US commerece department, 4 million high-tech jobs has been trasnfered from US to Indian since 2007. It is expected 2.5 millions more jobs will be transfrerd to India in next three years. Indians investment in the US is lowest among top 50 countries investing in US. According to Indian govt Indians living in US invested over 4 billions in India. It was hard cash that should have been invested in US., Indians have taken over American hospitality industry, according to statistics Indians own 78% US motels. Indians are fastest growing immigrant community in US due to high birth rate and huge family system. A study shows that an Indian sponsor 5 family members in life time compare 1 Mexican, 2 Phillipino, 1 Chiese and 0 European citizens. I see a huge treeat to US jobs and stability. I am sure most Americans do not want to see their cities taken over by Indians. simple facts
As a veteran, I am finding it rather ridiculous questioning anything, is he dead (OBL)? Quite simply if he was alive he would have announced it. He would rub it in our faces. Seeing photos of his death offers no proof. People have made their decisions and will continue holding on to what they believe. The US always has to answer questions. Others do not. Nam POWs had bamboo splints shoved under their finger nails. Imagine that pain. War is war, you do what is necessary. If dunking heads works, do it. I find it ridiculous that the US has to be gentlemen in a war. The media causes the stir. This OBL issue has been beaten to death. Once all the details are in full, publish it. Stop the speculations. Let's move on.
I hope he was actually captured alive and being personally being water boarded by OBAMA himself!! As a conspiracy theory it makes complete sense to me – show no photos, show no burial, claim he was buried at sea, interrogate the heck out of the psychopathic murderer at Gitmo!! Brilliant....
I agree with you Brenda. I find it very ironic when Obama is opposed to water boarding as torture but Assassination and Bombing using drones is FINE!!
THANK YOU FOR YOUR SERVICE !!! and an insightful opinion
Pakistan is an uncertain ally at best, and a completely untrustworthy partner at worst. The country's leadership may not have been sheltering Bin Laden, but the next layer down of officialdom is riddled with corruption. We have used drones so extensively because when our ground forces try to catch the enemy unawares, he is being tipped off by locals before our troops arrive. We should withdraw nearly all aid and restore humanitarian aid selectively. The leadership needs to pay a political price for their complicity or indifference .
Pakistan is like a Whore. You pay she performs. USA pays her – It kills some terrorists. Terrorists and Arab money comes in for Wahabi stuff they let you have a free reign – train the kids to kill and fill their minds with medieval Jihadi mumbo-jumbo. Want some Nukes – pay well and she shall deliver!! It is a total dog eat dog country. Before Musharraf every other President of Pakistan from 1947 on was killed by the next guy to be replaced. That is the culture. They blew up Bhutto – no regard for a woman either.
Jay if Pakistan is a whore.................Don't ya know...........Pakistan was made when India was divided........so it means..........India........is a the Whore's mother...................a Bigger Whore.........I miust say
Yoooo. You are an Indiot and indiots are pi$s drinking smelly whores. .
@Taimur:
Wrong choice of words dear....India is a bitch and therefore Pakistan is the "Son of a Bitch" L.O.L.
facts are facts and boy, do some of these despicable pakis find it hard to swallow.. the same as we find it hard to swallow that the GOP and its puny defenceless army did not know OBL was in their neighbourhood...
What ever you say about Pakistan may be what ever you mentioned but con you please give an explanation for your obsession with animal urine?
http://www.cowurine.com
There is a question that has been burning in the back of my mind. Does the strategy of deterrence not apply to Pakistan? If they decide to attack others with nuclear weapons, don't they (or we) know that other great powers like the US or China or Russia or Germany will nuke them back? Clearly, the biggest danger from Pakistan's nuclear program is the selling of nuclear weapons to terrorists. It makes you wonder, since terrorist networks need some sort of state sponsorship to fund its operations, whether or not Pakistan is willing to freely give nuclear weapons to terrorists. The US should form closer ties to other countries around South and Central Asia to provide valuable intelligence on as well as a counterweight to Pakistan. No country should sit idly by and twiddle its thumbs while Pakistan decides to sell nuclear weapons to terrorists.
We read that Pakistan scrambled their F-16s to engage US Forces that attacked Osama!!
How ironic – F-16s sold and funded by USA scrambled to engage U S Forces??
Germany isn't a nuclear power. India is. If (and I'm afraid it is more likely "When") a terrorist organization sets off a nuclear weapon, the isotope signature (basically a bomb's DNA) will finger Pakistan or Russia as the weapon's source. I doubt that "we didn't know" will be enough to protect the responsible nation. If the attack is from a Pakistani weapon, Pakistan will cease to exist. The U.S. might use conventional weapons to eliminate the remainder of the Pakistani nuclear weapons, India or Israel will use nuclear weapons.
Thanks for this excellent post and many thanks to your guest. I have few comments:
1. While we are celebrating the death of OBL, I think its little premature. Honestly we should have showed some patience/restraint while disclosing this news. Keep in mind that there may be many many more key AQ leaders including No. 2 Aymen Zawahari that might be hiding in that country (due to availability of abundant hostile places). We don't want to wait for another 10 years. They may be hiding very close by, but the problem is, it might be too late now.
2. Pakistan have been claiming to be a strong ally in war against terror. But they have some tough questions to answer and they have been engaging in same old rhetoric....that they have mastered so well.
Well, if they really want to be serious, they need to prove it now, more than ever. There is a simple way to earn that trust (with US, India and other countries):
a) find No. 2 leader of AQ and many others that may be there and provide them to US, b) find Dawood Ibrahim, arrest him and extradite him to India, c) Disengage with terror outfits that have been harbored by parts of ISI and previous administrations.
Remember PM, some of them were responsible for assassination of one of the most important, honest and able leader in the form of PM Benezir Bhutto. Rather than appearing in media and talking same old stories/rhetoric, do the job. Earn your own respect instead of begging for it.
3. For US and other world leaders, if we want Pakistan, Afghanistan and Iraq to succeed in near future and help them stand on their own two feet, there is only one way....promote
EDUCATION...EDUCATION....EDUCATION.
If you pump 400 to 700 million US aid every year directly in ensuring effective education for the country's younger generation, establishing newer institutions, you can generate a new and vibrant nation from these stone age societies.
The key is in direct engagement, that is, instead of handing any money/penny to any element in the government (as 99% chance that it would be misused or would never reach due to chronic corruption problem), involve NGOs, local municipal government to create an environment for institution building (and take help of international construction contractors to build these institutions) instead of finding local corrupt contractors.
All these sounds very good to read or hear, isn't it?
But the fact may be that it will never happen and the entire world (not just US or India) will suffer from these. If we neglect these societies now, they sure will be our problems to deal with in future (and also for next generations to come). Because unstable societies can never remain a local problem anymore in twenty-first century.
Evil can never know who they are......until you tell/make them stand near few good. Evil ideologies can only be defeated by educating people and promoting rational thinking. bye bye !!
There may well be more key leaders, but I think what Fareed said is right here. The truth is, to potential recruits, OBL was the legendary, Saudi, Robin Hood figure who fought the Soviets and landed a major attack on the Americans. Do you see any of that in the other leaders? Without him, as well as because of the Arab Spring, people will be much less likely to sign on to AQ ideology. Don't get me wrong as I am sure a charismatic figure similar to OBL will eventually show up at an indeterminate point in the futre, (Haass's analogy to disease rings true here; something that cannot be eliminated but can be managed) but as they say, one should not look a gift horse in the mouth.
The critical question here is whether or not they even want to. We already see Pakistan telling its people to push its propaganda to foreign media just yesterday on CNN. We also see them trying to smear US with photos of three dead men near the compound.
I don't think picking out Al Zawahiri etc will prove anything because Pakistan picks between "good" and "bad" terrorists. They catch somebody and show him to the Americans while secretly helping another group so they look like they are helping. On the other hand, providing Dawood Ibrahim would be more significant as an olive branch toward India. The Pakistani army needs to relinquish more of its power to civilians as well as moderates.
This I think is a critical point because most of the aid the US has given to Pakistan is arms and weapons parts. Educating Pakistani youngsters would go a long way toward making it a safer place. Just need to make sure jihadi/terror elements dont take control of those schools like they did in Iraq.
Very informative post! Thank you!
I beginning to think that dawood Ibrahim isn't even real as I have not seen any videos of him and there are very few photos I have seen.
Amrullah Yousafzai, Mingora,Swat, Pakiland
Do you work for Paksitani Govt. By any chance? You statement is no different that your Govt. Issues one. Search Google you will find him. May be you can have his picture and pray daily.
Rational thinking,
Just don't be a close minded person and listen to independent media. There are some tough questions, USA needs to answer them too. USA knew OBL's hiding place for a long time. Why did they choose to kill him now? Besides this is not the first time they killed OBL. We should have withdrawn our troops long time ago and perhaps stopped aid to Pakistan also. Both these things have only helped Al-Qaida by recruiting more people. OBL is an ideology which has become widespread because of this war. USA should close this chapter now and if we can't help Pakistan deal with their conflicts, we should at least not become of part of their problem. Our existence in that region, our taking their help and using their route to Afghanistan has only aggravated their problems. India should resolve its problems with Pakistan on its own and not impose it on USA. We have got our hands in too many things already. We need to get out from that region and focus on our own problems.
stop pretending to be me
why pakistan is still important after all bin laden death and giving money because they provide very low cost, fastest route of logistics supplies to USA and nato troops. low cost, fast and easy route for our logistic supplies to our troops in afg is a key to win a war or any war. None of you know where afg is in ASIA. it is located between iran and pakistan and have no sea port. you think iran will help?? not at all.. pakistan has a deep sea port and closer to afg. If we find alternative routes for supplies they will be much more expensive and far from afg and will many more billions. we give them 2 billions but if they close that route our transportation cost will jump to 5-10 billions a year..good enough??
"None of you know where afg is in ASIA". To be exact Pakistan is in the north of the Indian sub-continent, in south Asia. "pakistan has a deep sea port and closer to afg". Well this seaport is KARACHI on the Arabian Sea!
If we didn't have troops and bases in Afghanistan, we wouldn't need supplies. Just a handfull of Seals with enough supplies for 40 minutes of action would do it
I agree with jone. There is simply no other route to get into Afghanistan. We can't win this war without Pakistan's help.But now that we have killed OBL, and won this war, there is no need to stay in that region and it is good opportunity to get out. Lets close this chapter. Focus on our problems in USA.
Hey Bro...Pakistan is just eagerly waiting for that day...as soon as you leave , they are gonna grab Afghanistan. Hand it over to the Maulana Azhar masood/ Taliban and Afghanistan will slip back to the era of Late 1990s/ early 2000s. All the Infrastructure development work being done by Indians will be forced to stop. Those contracts will be given to the Pakistanis to sifon -off the aid money. Indian Engineers and workers will be kidnapped and killed. There will be full freedom to develop new terrorist training camps across Afghanistan. The Opium business will be a good source of money for the Pakistanis. Al-quaida will get an ideal breeding ground.
Of course US has taken revenge of the 9/11 by killing OBL, it would not want it boys to remain away from their homes too long.
Don't be foolish and use that "logistics route". It is full of traps & people who will kill you for a few bucks!!
Brothers and Sisters of America,
Wake up. After a few generations of living the good, clean way, you seem to have forgotten how dirty works. Don't believe all that you are told. They can be lies. People do take you for a ride, though you are the most powerful nation in the world.
Also, like some other commentors here pointed, it's always time to be brave and positive. If the route through Pakistan is closed, there will be another way to solve the entire problem.
Routing NATO supplies through Pakistan is probably the first solution that comes to mind. However it works only as long as Pakistan's doesn't frequently hold up the lines and torch the supply trucks. Certainly, though, there will be other ways of solving the entire problem without all those risks.
Aid needs to go to zero and they need to be told that we are removing all troops but will return as required.
Our Aid has not helped them at all. It only goes to their corrupt leaders. lets close this chapter. Leave that region and never go back.
Pakistan is not fooling anyone. Reason I am saying this is that everytime there is a conflict in their country it seems to be convenient to say that they are apprehending or killed a terrorist. But, everything else seems to contradict the fact that they are actively "pursuing" these people. Once in a while to make a statement does not mean it is actively being done. They also were mad when we acted alone with drones. Well, if Al Queda was at war with them they might be acting different but Al Quaeda's leader was living in their country. Time to pull back our aid and money and call it a day. Prove us wrong and show us more than we see now and the money will return. Please wake up congress!!!
Obama praised their president for nothing? Pakistan gave them permission to use their territory for nothing? So many Pakistanii troops gave their lives because of war on terror for nothing? Pakistan has killed so many Al-Qaida members for nothing? Their civilians got killed in the cross fire for nothing? The fact is Pakistan has been our ally in this war every step of the way. They are in conflict within themselves. There are supporters of Al-Qaida but there are people who don't support Al-Qaida. So we should not just dump them here. We should use our high intelligence to help them in this war. Instead of giving dollars to their president, we can use just a fraction of it to win their hearts.
here's my bit as a Pakistani.......I hope and pray the United States stops aid to the Pakistani army. If it were not for the aid money we would not be involved in this war and 30,000 plus pakistani people would not have died in terrorist attacks over the past decade. The money lines the pockets of the army and corrupt politicians and the militants take vengence on the innocent. Im tired of Pakistan being used as the battleground for american wars. This is the environment that my generation has grown up in. It was so in the eighties and now once more.But the current situation is far worse than the one during the cold war. Pakistan is being battered from every corner and frankly I'm just tired.
I agree with you googi.
Dear Yankees, the war is not over, it will only end when all Afghan girls dress up and dance badly like her:
that is all...well....for now anyway.
Here is my questions:
Why is it that they had no problem going in and assassinating OBL, but still felt the need to dump his body into the Arabic Sea? I know the media has noted that its to fulfill tradition and also to not have a grave people can visit or worship. To me this just seems fishy that they would dump his body to give a KILLER honor. Makes me think that the US is hiding something or there is more to the story. What do you think?
The US needs to arm India to the hilt and have them take out Pakistan for us, then we would have more rock farms to conquer.
india supports every one who tries to set peace in the world but this is not happening through war. india would never support war period.
ITS IRONIC BECAUSE THEY (TERRIORST) KILLED BHUTTO AND HUNDREDS OF PAKISTANIES
I pity your ignorance. Benazir Bhutto was killed by her own family. Read Muslim history, please.
Is that true? I wondered about that, but never actually heard who/why she was killed (sounds extreme). They should update the documentary, Benazir Bhutto: Daughter of Power. Pakistan seems to have problems. The people are very nice, but the government seems to have issues...not sure why.
USA should take next step by declaring Pakistan as a "Terrorist State". Then they should pass a UN resolution for economic embargo and travel ban to the country.
Absolutely.
If Al Queda wins that prize it comes with a surprise gift–total destruction by USA nukes.
The Osama compund and those who were shot appears to be Pakistani nationals. It is possible thier(Pakistan) government may have been infeltrated or a number of thier intel may have been in cahoots with the insurgents. It is impossible they don't know where Osama was when he have a residence there for 5 years according to Osama wife, with the residence power, water,, telephone and internet link. UN intel also confirm Pakistan Intel are hiding and protecting Osama when he was alive.
Corrections :Osama wife said they live there for 5 years. NATO intel and not UN intel confirms Pakistan Intel are hiding and protecting Osama on past months.
@ONTHELENS
The facts are slightly different.
Pakistani government, army and intelligence agency ISI are not simply infiltrated by extremists. They have been strategically recruited and nurtured since 1978 when Zia-Ul-Haq murdered Prime MInister ZA Bhutto. Zia started islamizing the pakistani society. Extremists from Punjab were given total control of the Army and the ISI. To ensure that the islamization was total and complete, history books used to teach their kids were changed to inculcate and promote radical ideas amongst children. Imagine teachings like 'Jews are monkeys', 'Christians are pigs'.
Here's a link with the details : http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zia-ul-Haq's_Islamization
Pakistani society started to retrogress and is on a very divergent path from not just their neighbors but also the entire world. now that it's more than a generation, and there has been a very rapid population growth, there are a huge majority of radical elements vs a springling of moderates in their country.
The result is there for you to see. Pakistan is now the home and nesting ground for radical terrorists from Saudi Arabia to Indonesia. In their own country, they kill Shias, Ahmediyyas, Christians and Hindus.
Re: Bin Landen's capture.
Pardon if I'm posting on the wrong site or forum but I truly perturbed at the USA's decision to not show the post mort pics. of Bin Laden. I think and want them shown. As a former R.N. I've seen lots worse things.
I watched he attacked on tv from start to finish that horrible day/night
As a skeptic, I will not believe it until I see the unaltered photos. We showed Hussein's sons. Why not Bin Landen. '
Possibly I'm being pragmatic as to the ramifications of showing them but as a mere, single person, they should be shown.
Thank you,
Lee
What is it about that so called "mansion" he had that is supposedly valued at a million bucks ? It looks like a dilapidated cross between a juvenile detention center and a Juarez house of ill repute.
I recently read Matthieu Aikins’s shocking article in Harper’s Magazine (Dec., 2009), about the multi-billion dollar opium trade in Afghanistan and Pakistan, and how the governments and militaries of these two countries tolerate, condone, assist, protect, and work for and with the opium traffickers.
Sadly the US has supported those who are directly involved in this multi-billion dollar opium trafficking industry.
Politics sure does make strange bedfellows.
Evidently politics can also cloud and impair the judgment of otherwise intelligent and moral people.
In 2009, 6,900 tons of opium was trafficked and smuggled out of Afghanistan.
Opium, as we all know, is converted to heroin, and this destroys countless lives and causes much trouble and suffering on the streets of our cities.
i have link that will reveal bin laden was murdered long time ago by a pakistani for partnering with the CIA for the chaos over the muslin word.you be the judge http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UnychOXj9Tg
i bet you history will repeat it self but this time it will be a nuclear attack over U.S.A and once again dummies will go over seas for another bull$$$$#IT WAR..But dont get it twisted Pakistan aint a soft country where any dog can walk in and out, it will fight back HARD!!
@ali
You are a twisted mind. Also, very certainly, you're hallucinating. If you had even an iota of gratitude, you wouldn't threaten to chop off the very hand that is now feeding you.
USA is keeping pakistan alive by providing direct aid and also by leaning on the financial institusions like the IMF to lend you money. Your economy would have sunk in a downward spiral 15 years back if President Bill Clinton had not come to your rescue.
Even today, if the USA chooses to cut off your life line, I am sure you Ali, will be the first one to leave Pakistan seek asylum. Many of your neighbors, already are here in the USA, Canada and UK. Just like you, they don't change their ways. They don't integrate well. Further, they rail and rant against America in private gatherings. They eulogize Osama and his thugs.
I must confess it's fun to listen to their very imaginative but ludicrous conspiracy theories. You fellas deserve the prize for twisted paranoid creativity.
I just heard on the Situation room with Wolf.B that Pakistan has not, and does not want the United States to Interrogate anyone in Pakistan. We have to submit our questions to the Paklistanis, and they will relay the answer to us...Thats pure crap...There is a reason for that I'm sure...they dont want us to know the extent of their freindship and co-oporation with Al Quida and with Osama bin Laden! Why else?
Actually the ISI, Army, and terrorists need time together to get their story straight. The basic rule in any crime with multiple suspects is to question each separately and compare the answers. The ISI and the terrorists are smart enough to know that. Given Bin Laden lived next door to the Army's "West Point", I'm not so sure about the Army.
Mr Jay...The US can bomb Bombay tomorrow if it pleases..............the US is far superior than any other third world country including India..............Pakistan is no better than Bangla Desh or Sri Lanka........but India is also no better...........People should open there eyes..........India......is still India.....a rat hole..............
What USA CAN do to India (possibility) and IS DOING to Pakistan (reality) – understand the difference – take the blinders off Taimur.
There is a difference between all out WAR and hitting a specific target..............Read the definition.....Jay
Temur, you fucking asshole Paki, time to nuke your terrorist asshole country
ranger..........if you are indian disguised in a western name...............go fu– your sister.....If not go nuke your own house
India is an independant soverign country which depends on itself to survive and pay its bills... The US respects India and does not consider its armed forces as pushovers like the pakis... why else do you think they use their drones with impunity over pakistans soverign terroritory???? While the paki armed forces sit and twiddle their thumbs???
Wake Up ! Wake Up!
The world has grown around you and you are still the same.
Careful Taimur , the more you Pakistanis hide terrorists ,the more drone attacks you will face and civilians are being put to risk by Pakistan
and as Non resident Pakistanis plot attacks on West and India , Hillary Clinton has warned Pakistan of "SEVERE CONSEQUENCES"
President of Pak warning USA
http://www.pkaffairs.com/Play_Show_Our_Warnings_to_Indians_and_Americans_Zionists_Zaid_Hamid_14549
@Mark
This loon isn't even funny. His weird expressions and put up anger. Yuck!
He could get popular only in a country like Pakistan where conspiracy theories are the favorite pasttime.
Most Pakistanis will attribute every sectarian killing of Shias by Sunnis to the USA, Israel or India. Each atrocity on their christian and hindu minorities is attributed to a foreign hand. Basically anything shameful has to be attributed to a conspiring 'enemy' country or enemies of Islam.
Until last Sunday, they took a lot of pride in their army and the ISI. Now those two organizations have been found out to be either inept or conniving with terrorists. Neither of the options is openly palatable to the average Pakistani.
So, they are resorting to what they do best. Create more conspiracy theories.
No, Al Queda's prize is hell.
This is all dog and pony show, There is no way Pakistan did not know where Bin Laden was or has no part in his capture and death. He was living literally within two miles of fortified military compound and the whole firefight went on for good 40 minute with helicopter crash flames visible from ten mile radius which you dont need radar to see. I bet Pakistani leadership begged US not to implicate them in any way in the operation or else their leadership will be wiped out by Alqeda.
The only part Pakistan played during the actual operation was staying out of the way. Once the U.S. told them the grid square our forces were going to, the Pakistanis knew their best course of action was inaction. They took the least bad of a number of bad options open to them as well as the option they have the most experience with – all talk and no action.
The more you read the arguements of the paki's here the more stupid and ignorant they look.
No wonder they keep blowing themselves up everywhere.
too much inbreeding , stop marrying your cousin sisters dumbasses.
Nuke Pakistan, bastards took our money and hid Osama Fuck Laden
I don't anyone who says "let's nuke em" is being serious but if you are.....
if you nuke us we'll nuke you back.
but fortunately that won't happen since idiotic hicks like you aren't in power.
I do not see anything more of significant strategic value that is achievable in Afghanistan, so why risk the lives of our troops needlessly? Our main mission is accomplished. Pakistan is a quagmire that we should watch carefully, but try not to get mired in. Let them fight each other if they must, don't give them reason to unite against us.
Given enough rope..the inept governmental idiot's in the Pakistani regime will hang the Goose that lay's the Golden Eggs (American Aid ) I really think that the Golden Goose should visit India and start laying some eggs for the Indian Military. They will take care of the Pakistani governmental crooks. When will the Pakistani people stand up and do the right thing, and not by supporting terrorism.
I am currently watching Michael Moore on Piers Morgan and they are discussing the billions of dollars that has been given to Pakistan over the last 10 years. Many journalists have commented on this as well, so it should not come to a suprise to most that our tax dollars were going to fund a country who was supposed to bring Osama Bin Laden to justice. I have huge concerns with this. I think most would agree that it is infathomable that Pakistand did not know that Osama was residing in their version of West Point. That being said, considering the billions that have been given to them, what have they been doing with all of that money. That being said, should Americans be concerned that we have been giving billions to a country that is slowly looking less like an ally and more like an enemy. Lets not forget again, that Osama Bin Laden was killed by Americans,secretly in Pakistan, who were hiding a man that commited the largest terrorist act in history on American soil. That being said with the billions of dollars that was given to Pakistan, what concerns should we as American have, that our tax dollars have gone to funding a contries defense department that could potentioally be used in arms against us? I would love some help here....
This is an EDITORIAL, not news! Please give us news, not opinions!
They exchange money all the time.
What Americans want is unknown to me?
People who think that pakistan going to fight terrorism are day dreaming. Any pakistani be it well educated or illeterate or religious freak would never support US war on terror. Over a period of their brief history, they always sided with extremist. Best example is that Pakistan is one of the only two countries to recognize taliban rule in Afganistan. The other being Soudi arabia. All the claims of being an ally in the war on terror are just empty words. How can a country which supported a mob rule over night can turn around and fight against them? Any sane person or an entity would not have supported taliban rule. But pakistan is different. They have been harbouring all criminals around world in the name of religion. This is a reality.
They took 20 billions of dollars over 10 years and generous aid during flooding and earth quake. In return they hide OBL in their country for over 5 years. Cann't u see their true colors.
Pak Army and ISI Chief and corrupt Pak President are hand picked by Americans...if US can take another trip and shoot these bastards it will be a great service to all Pakistan and Americans who are voicing their concern here on this forum
Remember they did not support US war on terror volunterily. They were force to do so by GWB. Their fight all these years are nothing but fake..
Anyone want to see the real face of the true Muslim then look at Somalia, the entire world would look look the same way if the could take it. When not busy killing someone else they kill themselves all the while lying to themselves and everyone else about it. They are nothing but a death cult and if they are not stopped will take the world into a thermonuclear hell.
Really? So you love to pick and choose as you see fit, eh? Somalia is the "face of the true Muslim" just like the KKK and the Mexican drug gangs are the true faces of Christianity. What you described ("when not busy killing someone else they kill themselves") fits just about every single group on this planet either presently or in the not-so-distant past. You don't have to look far either: Europe just a few decades ago were the best at killing others and themselves. Ooo...I'm so scared of the big bad Muslim!
No religion is bad and there should be no war linked to any specific religion. The goal of all religions is the same. Islam is a great religion and so are the others. But the problem with Islam is that it has been hijacked by the pseudo-religious hardliners who interpret and preach it to their favor. The biggest victim of this hijack are those muslim who are really religious in true sense. I recall one Arabic gentleman in a hotel in Paris last year, who narrated me why he doesn't want to go back to his mother land and how he managed to escape from the hardliners in Morocco.
India is not some distant cousin of Pakistan, Bangladesh or Sri Lanka. That is like saying the US and the world are distant cousins since the world migrated to the US in the 1800s... Ridiculous... India, Bangladesh, SriLanka are responsible nations who work for the betterment and upliftment of their peoples and are streeking into the 21st century alongwith the world.... however, Pakistan is basket case of all the rotten apples and inviting and accommadating all rotten apples from other nations to make themselves a volatille nation of liars, terrorists, criminals, conmen, blackmailers and beggers who work towards taking their people back into the 6th century
Let me just say this. Pakistan has doubled their nuclear arsenal in just 2011. Where in the hell are they getting money to build nuclear weapons and why in the hell is a country that unstable allowed to have nuclear weapons? First of all, we are giving these people billions of dollars a year. We are basically buying nuclear weapons for terrorists. Believe this and listen good. These terrorists WILL get a hold of some of these nuclear weapons before its over. There's just no doubt. Most of the country is radical anti American terrorist supporters. What in the hell makes you think that these people are not crazy enough to sell some to, or just simply give these terrorists nuclear weapons. This is the beginning of the end. There is a 100% chance that we will be thrown into a nuclear war by these type of countries. Judging by how rapidly things are spiraling downward, it probably wont be long. Who's fault is it? It's the United State's fault for giving them billions of dollars to make weapons of mass destruction.
Despite India's stance of being non-aligned America's suspicion about Nehru's policies forced India to get Inclined towards the USSR. This lead USA to choose a wrong friend in South Asia.
Pakistan has never been a peaceful country right from its inception. They butchered thousands of Hindus and Sikhs at the time of partition. The population of non-Muslims have reduced drastically in Pakistan due to elimination and forceful conversions, and till date, Pakistan has not been able to digest the fact that India, though being a Hindu majority nation has more Muslims in it than in Pakistan In 1948 their disguised army attempted to grab Kashmir and succeeded partially. Again in 1965 they were at war with India and had to bite the dust. They made life of east Pakistanis hell by looting, murders, mass rape of girls in schools and colleges, just because though they were Muslims but they spoke Bangla, not their language Urdu. Millions of refugees from East Pakistan became a headache for India and in 1971 India had to intervene militarily to liberate East Pakistan (now Bangladesh). It was a great moment of embarrassment for the Pakistanis when their General Niyazi signed the surrender document in Dhaka.
President Z.A. Bhutto, the Father-in-law of the current Pakistani president Zardari vowed to inflict thousand cuts to bleed India at that time. The creation and harboring of so many terrorist organizations by the ISI is part of this very strategy. Since the time when the US-Pak tie gave birth to Taliban to oust Soviets from Afghanistan, Pakistan has been eyeing to take hold of Afghanistan. Any effort by US to have a stable government ( and so to say an Army) in Afghanistan will be sabotaged by Pakistan unless that government is a puppet of Pakistani hands. A puppet government might still be good for a short term objective, but looking at the jihadist culture of Pakistan, it would neither be good for the region nor for the world.
Sanjay, while I don't disagree with what you wrote overall, you have to admit, that part of the world has so much historical "baggage." It keeps giving the world never ending conflicts and huge headaches, as we can see today. I'm not talking about the Middle East. I'm talking about India's part of the world - the entire South Asia region (including Pakistan, Bangladesh and Sri Lanka). I consider it all the same since you were all "Indian" kingdoms that shared the same general culture and history (i.e. everybody's ancestor was Hindu and/or Buddhist at some point). To me it's just one continuous civil war between cousins, castes, religions, tribes, etc. It's just getting ridiculous! When will there be peace and stability? I don't know if it was the fact that you were colonized by the British, or that you all had some very egotistical and short-sighted founding fathers (excluding Gandhi, of course). South Asia, it's the gift that keeps on giving!
You are true when you term all south asians to be colonial cousins and you are also true when you mention the short-sightedness. But while India and India's other neighbors have become mature enough to put off this baggage and move ahead as nations, not as religious conclaves, unluckily the same is not true for Pakistan, which is too negatively obsessed towards India. If they focus their energy and the money (Huge amount that they receive as grant) towards the betterment for their society instead of directing them towards India via LET, JeM, HUJI through ISI, it will be good for themselves. India has a broader view of the whole affair and has always extended her hands of friendship, but in absence of reciprocity a handshake is not possible.
@k4k1k4k1
It has been 60+ years since Pakistan separated. India and Pakistan have been on divergent paths ever since.
1. Pakistan chose theocracy while India choose secularism.
2. Pakistan oscillated between dictatorship and intermittent spurts of democracy. India conducts successful free and democratic elections for the largest population in the world.
3. Pakistan embraced extremism and India chose economic development.
It's a 2,3 generations now. Enough time to have acquired different identities. You can't lump it all together. The differences be even more obvious in the coming years.
All this swearing on this forum doesn't make anyone superior or less important..arguments are good but swearing is not...
Yes...Pakistan has to answer lots of questions..like CIA who missed all clues about 9/11
Indian don't need to get excited.....they are looking forward to make most out of May 2nd Attack but will they succeed??
Sadly US education system doesn't produce minds who can think Independently...they need CNN or ABC or CBS to think for them and tell them. worse then communist Russians who relied on State Media.....
Don't forget Pak Army Chief and ISI Chief are appointed by US Ambassador and US Commander in region...both reports to American rather then their own Govt...every high official in Pakistan is hand picked by US..Don't Blame anyone...only US Commander in region needs to be blamed.
To All Indians on this forum – you need to worry about your sis in India consumed by Foreigners for 5 cents
Looks like you are not aware, your mom comes free along with your sis in just 4 cents.
@Greetings,
"Sadly US education system doesn't produce minds who can think Independently"
Please do continue to make that sweeping generalization / assumption. It will serve your enemies well and keep you in everlasting ignorance. Take care, because the day may come when one of those who can't "think independently" bests you because you have underestimated them.
...and yes..everyone on this earth know how they succeded in going nuclear..and how they proliferted this know how to others..
Communists Nukes for India failed then Americans gifted one to India..... Do you remember it????????
I bet you learnt it from a pakistani text book. The Pakistani text books also mention that India was a part of Pakistan LOL.
If you want to discuss things here you should have some basic knowledge of the topic. Read this in your free time to know about India's Nuclear Program
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/India_and_weapons_of_mass_destruction
US attack on Laden's hiding place isn't a passport to Indian troops starting attack on other terrorists on Pakistan! I even strongly doubt India's ability to do so. At the same time, I think the news of Laden's hiding in Pakistan were known to Paki Officials, then there was a chance of knowing the same to Indian Intelligence. They came up with such comments but either failed to locate exact place or didn't take much interest in doing so.
India is going through the worst phase despite all these high growth self-propaganda. Corruption Dracula is taking out lots of blood every single day (and of course night) from Indian blood vessels.. No one has left out– GOV, Military, Bureaucratic, rich, poor everybody! Even foreigners have to learn the same way of life once they reach that shitty land
USA understands it's interest in both of them. Pakistan's strategic location and India's abundant cheap and hardworking (i mean "Donkey-Style" ) labor! After all there is an old saying.. third guy wins in the bitter fight of two!
If you feel US is great, let it be so. If your land is not shitty, let it be so. Enjoy what you have. Arrogance stinks worse than shit, you know. If you understand you will appreciate. Barking out of intolerance will help no body. Learn to love. It takes quite long to be a human. All the best.
This is the reality
http://www.facebook.com/video/video.php?v=181229445259688&oid=193096367388361&comments
@milli
Whooa! What a find! This moron on the forum blames his morning constipation and what else not on a foreign conspiracy too. LMAO.
'we all knew this is going to happen , things happening now a days which include no electricity , gas loadshedding , foor prices ,jobs issue , killings ,strikes n all ,so that the whole nation gets busy in these issues'
We can declare that Al Qaida is dead. If they wish to prove the contrary, let them try. Their failure will be the final proof of their irrelevance.
Why are we giving PAKISTAN , 1.5 billion dollars, or any other country money? We are having to make cuts in our own country but we are still paying every nation on the planet... Its time to stop, say no more and put all that money towards our national debt......... This is nuts, Republicans and the Tea Party want to cut everything that helps poor Americans, children, healthcare and education but theyre not raising he!! about us giving all these nations money???? They should refocus their attention, even I and Im sure many Americans would back that, STOP SENDING ALL NATIONS MONEY UNTIL OUR NATIONAL DEBT IS UNDER CONTROL .........
to JAL: Pakistan was a peaceful country before!!! always attacking India, murdering members of the Indian Parliament, having the sharia courts in NW Pakistan hand down sentences off rape to a boy and girl!! I'm old enough to remember when the Iranians took the US Embassy hostage in 1988. Back then the members of the US embassy in Pakistan had to be rescued off the roof by helicopter because the pakistani radicals had stormed the embassy and threatened everyone with death. Pakistan from its inception has been a violent Jihadi country based on its version of Islam. You lie to blame usa.
I just found this online...More than 150 countries get financial assistance from the U.S.... How much are we giving these people ??? And why isnt it stopped until our DEBT is lowered or zero would be best........150 countries get financial assistance from the U.S. thats just CRAZYYYYYYYYY ...............
Al Queda would love to have Pakistan with their nuclear weapons. They would use them for sure. I would hope that the U.S. and Pakistan kiss and make up. It is in everyone's best interest!
I request all the Indians and POIs to post anything against Pakistan or Pakistanis. I think it's absolutely waste of everybody's time. Let Karma take its own course. When everyone in the world is trying to make Pakistan realize the truth, they are further going away from the truth. Therefore, we should leave them and also us to the working of Karma. Don't forget the saying, "Silence is golden."
Please read my comment above as "not to post anything."
We are going to see a lot of big changes in the Middle East now that Bin Laden is dead!!! Either the leaders will start treating Their People right are They will be out of there all together... I just hope the Palestine now will make PEACE with Israel!!! That will really help wit things over there...
And I would hope that Israel would make peace with Palistine...
Larry & Randy:
Plz. check out my resp. to you both below: date/time stamp: May 6, 2011 at 12:45 pm
Aid has nothing to do with common Pakistani nor it reach them neither it would be agenda less.we will not die at least because of food but from the reaction blast only.why not anybody here brings truth
Indians utilizing these times for there prosperity and dreaming to link central Asia.they cant bulldoze us.come and be a friend.
99% people thinking in Pakistan that USA has other interests,that is bulldozing our sovereignty ultimately.but that will not happen also.
In Afghanistan after 11 year there is hardly anything change for common person.its difficult for life to persist.
Until these own's interests and exploitation posses "how we can achieve a better world"
TO me this world is now more unsafe and that because of our evil wishes on each other rights.
"respect you will be respected"
Bin Laden and much of Pakistan share some serious defect in common, the belief that the Koran is legit. But can it be if it violates the tenets of superior subordinate relationships where a subordinate is to retain responsibility for his or her actions? The Koran draws down acceptable behavior to too narrow a range of action where hundreds of other options might be available. In order for an individual not to be as a puppet to a superior he/she must manage to use their own reason and choice of action. The Koran fails when implied directives concerning behavior subvert an individuals choice over available acceptable alternatives. This is indicative of someone wanting others to believe a God had something to do with the Koran but the complexity of retained responsibility was not something the writers understood at all how to do. Interestingly one defect we see in Bin Laden is one where he is inclined to take control over the thinking of others through terrorist acts. He failed to recognize his acting as puppeteer over people is a primitive concept. The people who follow him need to realize that acting as puppeteer over people is a primitive concept and that people learn from great leaders only by example, not force.
…”forty mon, or two metric tons, of opium once a month from the Afghan border town of Spin Boldak. The drugs were carried by a convoy…into Iran. Although the police in Afghanistan and Pakistan were bribed to give the convoy safe passage, the Iranian police were not….Sikander…was making $125,000 to $250,000 in profits each trip.”
(6,900 tons of opium were being trafficked from Afghanistan in 2009)
(From Matthieu Aikins, The Master of Spin Boldak, Harper’s Magazine, Dec., 2009, p. 53)
CHECK OUT THIS MUST WATCH VIDEO BY IMRAN KHAN-A SELF STYLED WESTERN EDUCTATED MODERATE MUSLIM –
IF THIS IS THE FACE OF MODERATE ISLAM-WE CAN SAFELY FORGET ANY PEACE: Muslims (Like Mr. ZAKARIA) forget that Americans can't be fooled by SELF-STYLED MUSLIM MODERATES JUST B'COZ they (notionally!) condemn Islamic Terror, (but in the same breath dilute it with US actions!), boast of having large # of non-Muslim friends, watch Hollywood movies, wear western attire, date, dance, even occasionally drink, and don't force their women to wear the Burqa, or beat them. None of that changes the fact that they believe in MONOTHEISM, SUPREMACY OF ISLAM over all other religions, dilute Muslim terror with US & western actions all over the world, discrimination (some real & most perceived), deny the existence of hateful verses in their Koran or dilute them by pointing to other compassionate verses knowing fully well those are EXPLICITLY made null & void as applied to Non-believers, or even diverting attention by referencing intolerant preachings in holy texts of other religions knowing fully well OTHERS DON’T LIVE BY THEM!!!). etc. YouTube Title: "Islam & America Through the Eyes of Imran Khan Pakistan"
Amit-Atlanta-USA
We love you Imran Khan................!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
It's amazing that we rely on TERRORIST PAK to interrogate the detainees. It's like OSAMA INTERROGATING KSM!!! They will only TUTOR them what to say & what not to say. How long will allow ourselves be fooled??? Typically it's the first few hours/days that are crucial in interrogations b4 anyone makes up their mind on what they could say & what they shouldn't.
Amit-Atlanta-USA
1% of Pakistanis pay taxes, & less than 10% of GDP comes from Taxes (MUCH LESS THAN Sub-Saharn Africa!!). Many rich Pakistanis who don't pay taxes are FAR MORE AFFLUENT than hard hit AMERICANS WHO WORK MORE THAN 3 MONTHS IN A YEAR JUST TO PAY TAXES.
Ami-Atlanta-USA
To end ISLAMIC TERROR & NUCLEAR BLACKMAIL- Declare PAK a TERRORIST STATE, DISMEMBER IT, & SEIZE THEIR NUCLEAR WEAPONS:
ARE OUR LEADERS PLAIN STUPID or NAÏVE? – EU,US & Chinese leaders urge even greater support to Pakistan now.
TRULY the greatest benefactor & the SMARTEST GUYS in this terror war today are PAKISTANIS. They get paid either way- Saudis and Islamists world over to hide Bin laden, and US, Europe to find him. No wonder Iran, N.Korea are well on their way to arm themselves with WMDs, not to be invaded like Iraq, Afghanistan, and for Nuclear blackmail. Wait for the next 9/11, 26/11, 7/7 and yet another BIN LADEN once again sponsored by Pakistan!
Amit-Atlanta-USA
As Bin Laden was caught living in the sublime quarters neat the Pakistani military,we can infer he was being served chicken curry by the Pakistani Generals as a guest for 5 years and we can infer the following conclusions about the Pakistani state.
The Present:
Satire can be vivdly drawn from the fact that it has created a professional satanic intelligence service,army that hold the state to ransom and has a facade of democracy as veil .It has managed to be labeled as the 'international migraine'.It has succeeded in fermenting hate and laments against India and mastered the art of counterfeit Indian currency.Above all it seems to flaunt the identity of being a global hub of terror.It blackmails stakeholders in return for cooperation in terror fight against aid, has exacerbated the Afghan conflict by poking a noxious anti-India strategic angle to the problem.
The Future:
From the Baloch unrest to the holocaust of Bengali citizens in the bereaved East Pakistan, the break away state has shown no respect for its people.The Pakistani ambassador to Bangladesh said "Let Bygones be Bygones" wanting to bury the Bengali holocaust in 1971 war chronicles.Such a blemished history with cycles of coups and political upheavals sets stage for the break up.A monumental time when Balochistan gains independence from a state that discriminates on resources and rights to governance.A time when the so called 'Azad Kashmir' realizes that 'azad' is a misnomer for a future of a career in terror camps than one with opportunity and hope in the Indian Union.
We are fed with this garbage by ISLAMIC SYMPATHIZERS liek Mr. Zakaria everyday that the root cause of Islamic terror is poverty ONLY to rob already HARD HIT AMERICAN TAX PAYERS & ULTIMATELY BRING AMERICA DOWn (which is the well stated objective of the Islamists).
ISLAMIC TERROR IS DRIVEB BY IDEOLOGY & HATE-NOT poverty.We don't see terror in Haiti, & much of sub Saharan black Africa..............................Do we?
SO, IF POVERTY IS THE ROOT CAUSE OF ALL TERROR – LET's START WITH HAITI, SUB-SAHARAN AFRICA, NEPAL & several other countries that are far far POORER THAN PAKISTAN, who have their rich COUSINS in oil rich countries to take care of.
......................DOES THAT SOUND REASONABLE?
Amit-Atlanta-USA
Sorry about the typos. I mistakenly posted it w/o doing a spell check.
Paid Indian Bloggers. No healthy discussion to eliminate the problem. Sorry to say the problem wont be addressed like this way.
Ahh I see.You paid Pakistani NRI's have been caught in so many terror plots from Tiem square plot to the Mumbai attacks to Sept 11.You and your cult have been proved to be evil by the amount of trouble you are giving to this world.Pakistan will be liquidated fro world peace.It should be balkanized.India does not want Pakistan as it knows managing a society with this much hatred is of no use to us.We will watch you fail as your society,your sham puppet government and your satanic ISI has been exposed
IF WE REFUSE TO DESIGNATE PAKISTAN A TERRORIST STATE, THEN IT's ABSURD TO CALL N.KOREA or EVEN IRAN, SYRIA SUCH.
IT JUST DEFIES ALL LOGIC. ONLY b'coz they happen to be our ally (ALL-LIE!!!).
Amit-Atlanta-USA
This video is not to insult Pakistan but to bring forth some facts that Salman Rushie states to elucidate the nature of society in Pakistan that breeds terrorism,religious hatred and intolerance.
a bunch of lies........that's what it is
@ayesha
Too bad you can't appreciate a point of view that's different from yours. The world is not Pakistan's backyard. Freedom of speech, which ironically you want to enjoy out here in the west, is equally available for others too.
CHECK OUT SEVERAL OF MY COMMENTS I MADE ON CNN Y'DAY – Here's the link and what I said – I believe they are most relevant here to understand the entire Pakistani & Muslim double game.
http://www.cnn.com/2011/WORLD/asiapcf/05/04/bin.laden.main/index.html?hpt=T1
a) The GREATEST AUDACITY of hiding OBL right under their noses by Pak ISI is a clear indicator of the extent to which they would go to protect him. The easiest thing they could have done was to hide him somewhere far away, so that they could wash their hands off, if ever he was found. Even from OBL's perspective it's utterly FOOLHARDY to live right under the Pak army's nose if he did not have that assured protection! I am perplexed that not many people seem to make that connection to NAIL Pakistan without a SHRED OF DOUBT W/O ASKING FOR ANY EXPLANATION….THERE IS NO NEED TO LISTEN TO THEIR LIES ALL OVER AGAIN!!!!!
b) Will Pakistan now VOLUNTARILY give up AYMAN AL-ZAWEHRI & MULLAH OMAR and prove that they are with us in this war! I am sure they will NOT do that, but will wait to SHED CROCODILE TEARS all over again!
c) Hamas on OBL's death (FAREED ZAKARIA calls them moderates!): "We regard this as a continuation of the American policy based on oppression and the shedding of Muslim and Arab blood .. we condemn the assassination and the killing of an Arab holy warrior. We ask God to offer him mercy with the true believers and the martyrs".
d) When asked about OBL's death "NOT A DAY TO REJOICE" -VA Imam Johar on CNN. Forget about body language, HE DOES NOT EVEN EXPRESS RELIEF THAT HE'S GONE!!!!!!!
e) BTW, a question many Americans are asking.....How many of us have seen ("moderate!") Muslims joining fellow Americans in celebrating Osama's death at GZ, WH, Murfeesboro,TN or Dearborn, MI????
f) Once again, asking Pakistanis for explanation is a WORTHLESS EXERCISE. They will ONLY continue to lie, cheat, mislead, fool, cover-up or call what you want, BUT NEVER ADMIT to their CRIME (NOT Guilt!).
g) Also, it's NOT only that the Pakistani army is involved in legitimate business like Airlines etc, but MORE IMPORTANTLY they are into all kinds of ILLEGITIMATE liasonships such as counterfeiting ($,Euros, Indian Rupees), drug (cultivation & distribution), Kidnappings for ransom, extra-judicial killings etc.etc. you name it...they are in it. Something that Indian intelligence agencies have documented records of for long and shared with the US also....which is unfortunately doing nothing about them!
Amit-Atlanta-USA
CHECK OUT THESE GREATEST VIDEOS:
a) The predominant role of the ISI, and Pakistani military and in turn by the Pakistani Govt, and the Pakistani people in perpetuating ISLAMIC TERROR & NUCLEAR BLACMAIL all over the world.
b) Where Pakistan is headed
Amit-Atlanta-USA
I can sum it up in two words...Islam sucks...PERIOD!! Where do these a$h-holes get off telling the rest of the free world how to live? What a bunch of ignorant low-grade misinformed towel-headed beard-wearing cave-dwelling goat-fack-ers.
Go ahead....jihad me you bunch of dumb-bells....how wonderful life could be without these gun-toting date-eaters....oh and....your late great leader is going green.....this chunk of human trash in now fishfood !! Allah-hu-akbar my dick!
Thank you very much, for letting me spew my vitriol....ah....feel better now!
I wonder why all terror plots have a Pakistani connection..
Larry & Randy:
On the Isareli-Palestinian peace, I truly wish that was the case.
Plz. check out these responses I posted on CNN recently & let me know if I am NOT seeing it right!
a) ARAB SPRING THIS??? Fateh-Hamas sign deal, Egyptians COVERTLY being urged by our Islamic Sympathizer Fareed Zakaria to abrogate the peace deal-praises Hamas and Brotherhood as moderates, Egypt opens Gaza crossing to start smuggling arms/rockets, Militants blow up gas pipeline from Sinai into Israel, Palestinians prepare to declare independence unilaterally....... do we GULLIBLE AMERICANS SEE ANY PATTERN HERE?
b) We GULLIBLE Americans need to remember just this. Either way America loses. We side on behalf of the rebels whom we don't know, what they stand for, & we lose our trusted friends-US is NOT trusted as a reliable friend anymore. We sit back idly Muslims blame us for being insensitive to their cries. EITHER WE CAN'T MAKE THEM HAPPY...PERIOD!
c) Here comes Arab Spring, combine that with Mr.ZAKARIA's & other Islamic Sympathizer's calls for building greater bridges between the Muslim world and the west, open the doors for Muslim Turkey into EU-ultimate result greater Islamization of America & Europe, and our ULTIMATE DEMISE as great Judo-Christian, free, tolerant nations!!
Incidentally, Mr. Zakaria cast the first stone at the Israeli-Egyptian peace deal by stating
"The peace between Egypt and Israel was never between two peoples but between their regimes. Israel might have to ask itself what policies it will have to pursue to create stability with a democratic Egypt. It would hardly be a cure-all, but were Israel to offer a deal that Palestinians accepted, it would surely help persuade Egyptians that Israel does not seek to oppress the Palestinian people."
http://www.time.com/time/world/article/0,8599,2045888-4,00.html
He also NEVER EVER sees the need for TERRORIST HAMAS to accept ISRAEL's RIGHT TO EVEN EXIST, b4 talking peace with them.
Also check out the following excerpts from FAREED ZAKARIA GPS where he trashes America, Israel, & Europe (his favorite COVERT past time!) on the Gaza flotilla raid, and their cautious approach towards admitting Muslim Turkey into the EU (so that the FLOODGATES for large scale Muslim migration into US & Europe, and rapid ISLAMIZATION can begin!!!!
http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/1006/06/fzgps.01.html
Amit-Atlanta-USA
http://www.cnn.com/2011/WORLD/asiapcf/05/05/osama.many.wives/index.html?hpt=Sbin
Here are some notable quotes from teh story & my response
a) "Bin Laden's second wife was Khadijah Sharif, nine years older than him, a HIGLY EDUCATED Woman and a DIRECT DESCENDANT OF THE PROPHET."
................DOES THAT MAKE THE TERROR CIRCUIT COMPLETE, OR WAS SHE JUST KEEPING UP WITH THE LEGACY????????????
b) "Khairiah Sabar, She was another HIGHLY EDUCATED and held a DOCTORATE IN ISLAMIC SHARIA":
............DO WE STILL BELIEVE TERRORISTS ARE IGNORANT, UNEDUCATED RELIGIOUS ZEALOTS & KNOW NOTHING ABOUT ISLAM????
Amit-Atlanta-USA
The Pakistani's can't and should never be trusted as it is a lost country founded by losers who couldn't make it in a real country (basically they all got kicked out of India). Look at how India (although alluring to still high poverty levels) has begun to pull itself out of the poverty rut that Pakistan seems to be digging deeper and deeper all by itself and blames on everyone else in the world. We unfortunately have to befriend this intensely corrupt country because if we don't it will eventually become Al-Qeida the country and they have "NUKES" and you can bet they'll use them eventually. Take notes from the only country that gave nuke building secrets to a crazed rouge country like North Korea. If you think they can be trusted than you must be living there already. NUFF SAID!
Pakistan is a nation of split personalities that makes it a dangerous nuclear weapons rich nation that should be seen as a threat to the indigenous population with spill overs into neighboring nations. I don't trust Pakistan, they are more dangerous than N. Korea because Pakistan is immersed with radical zealots who speak of God, and mass murder all in the same message. Most of these people don't even believe in God, they use it because it is a tool of control.
Osama was bad guy no doubt about it. What makes everyone think that Pakistan knew where Osama bi Laden was hiding and concealed the fact. If that's the case then the US must have known where every Nazi war criminal found in the United States was hiding and concealed that information. The US government in fact did knowingly bring Nazi war criminals to US after World War 2 and intentionally concealed that fact. So nothing like the pot calling the kettle black. Who's blacker here?
Pakistan is an international migraine as told aptly by Madeline Albright(Former US Secretary of State) .Today the world faces threat from Pakistan and India says we have been facing this for decades.Pakistani innuendos against India stem from extremism, hate and an offshoot is terror inflicted by Jamat Ud Dawa, Laskar e Tayyaba and Hizbul Mujahideen on India.Satanic Intelligence service, the ISI ,which virtually runs Pakistan.ISI and Pakistaniarmy are a pain in the neck to the world.They have has supported the Taliban for years to fight the Soviets.It now covertly supports the Afghan Taliban to harm the Afgani people(who are my brothers and Muslims )
To radicalized Pakistanis,I can say this.Not only has your insidious Army perpetrated human crimes in Indian Kashmir by training militants and attacking innocent Kashmiri Pandits(Hindus) and Kashmiri Indian Muslims,but also discriminated against your own people by not allocating funds in yearly budgets for Balochistan and break away East Pakistan.Your country had imposed Urdu as the only official language in East Pakistan contemptuously ignoring the feelings of the Bengali section.Did not the Bengali Genocide in East Pakistan happen with the acquiescence of the Pakistani Army.Did not fanatics like Aurangazeb impose jaziya on Hindus?Did he not forcefully build mosques in Hindu holy sites to sow the seeds of conflict?.Is not Jinnah the epitomy of greed for power by going to the extent of Dividing India and insisting on partition with religion as basis .If Religion was the basis for partition or to claim Kashmir my hideous friend, let me tell you that Hindu sacred texts mention Kashmir as one the holy places where Hindu gods reside in the himalayan mountains.Indian ancient history and culture revolves around Kashmir I know verses in Sanskrit that mention them.
It is known that a Kashmiri Muslim's culture has some distinct Hindu flavor as many were proselytized from Hinduism as Islam entered India.We know, that an Indian Muslim is far better off in India than Muslims in your country and he is as patriotic to India like any other Hindu or Sikh
Pakistan is the HUB of terror in the world today and world must fight back and respond like it did in Serbia /Yugoslavia or like it did in Kuwait when Saddam attacked or like Libya where where NATO is fighting Gaddhafi.
I have got my facts right, Pakistanis better know that your country does not treat minority Hindu's and Sikhs well.The only way to deal with Pakistan is to liquidate it.Secularism is the key to ending religious extremism.Afghan intelligence head had also spoken the truth about Pakistan
and Afghan President Blames Pakistan
then the British PM blames Pakistan
and Hamid Karzai blames ISI for the Indian embassy attack
and then Hillary Clinton after the TIME SQUARE BOMB PLOT warns Pakistan of severe consequences
the list is endless
“Razik was the most powerful Afghan Border Police officer in the southern part of the country—a former child refugee who scrabbled to power during the post-9/11 chaos, his rise abetted by a ring of crooked officials in Kabul and Kandahar as well as by overstretched NATO commanders who found his control over a key border town useful in their war against the Taliban. With his prodigious wealth, loyal soldiers, and connections to top government officials, Razik was seen as a ruthless, charismatic figure, a man who brooked no opposition to his will.”
(Matthieu Aikins, “The Master of Spin Boldak”, in Harper’s Magazine, Dec., 2009, pp. 52-53)
we already know that India rely on there bollywood.you propaganda is quite sound and pick some more like these videos.it dont till you the reality.you are weaping behind India money that you used against Pakistan.there will be tit for tat let me assure you.RAW is involved in Baluchistan.dont aspect from us any thing good.
So the Khan started defending Pakistan,yes we were not involved in Balochistan before, but since you train militants in Kashmir, we will liberate Baluchistan as we liberated Bangladesh.Don't bring up Bollywood..you are a piracy nation there too, you will watch Bollywood movies with pirated CD's and not allow our films to show in Pakistan..TRUE BIGOTRY AND HYPOCRISY
Bunch of fu_king Rats
India is, the cradle of the human race, the birthplace of human speech, the mother of history, the grandmother of legend, and the great grand mother of tradition. Our most valuable and most instructive materials in the history of man are treasured up in India only.
- Mark Twain
and Pakistan is the CRADLE OF TERRORISM
We need to break up Pakistan into multiple regions and give to neighboring countries. Pakistan had independence over 50 years and was never independent! They can’t govern themselves and meet the new world order. It is time break up the break up country…otherwise the world will have same problems dealing with Pakistan 10 – 25 years from now.
From the descriptions, it appears Osama had an open mind at the end. Oh well his son can take over, he looked pretty holey.
India and Pakistan need to: 1 Get along. 2 Settle their border dispute in a boardroom and sign the paper already. 3 Grow up and become part of civilization. (Ditto for Isreal and Palistine.)
Appreciate your point,But if Pakistan can't get along with US that has so far provided 28 billion $ in aid,how can it get along with India.How can this happen when attackers of Mumbai roam freely in Pakistan and ISI has been implicated on this attack by a Pakistan American and a Pakistani Canadian who have been arrested by the FBI
@Dale
You have to look at this more closely. India and Pakistan getting along is possible only if the latter is willing even consider that option. If you are current with the happenings out there, you will understand how tough ( I don't want to say impossible) it is to deal with lies, deception and blatant terrorism.
Major attacks by Pak based terrorists on India in the last decade alone have been on :
1. The Indian Parliament
2. Mumbai the financial hub
3. Akshardham – A very famous temple
4. Indian Institute of Science – a top research institute.
They are what frustrates India.
In 1999, the Pakistani Army unilaterally waged a war at Kargil : http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kargil_War
President Clinton weighed on India to not retaliate, else history would have been different. He also summoned Pak's Prime Minister Nawaz Sharif and threatened to cut the aid off if they don't call their army back. Guess who was heading the Pak army at that time? The sweet talking, media savvy Musharraf.
Now, do you understand that 'getting along' with Pak needs reciprocation from Pakistan ? A closer look would make it amply clear.
I am no expert on our relations with Pakistan or India, and I was honestly hoping to gain a better understanding of the situation by reading the comments, but all I gained was feeling offended when I read the comments about America... I believe most all Americans want to help other countries when there are people starving or a country has a natural disaster, as a people we want to help those in need, but make no mistake... We would like our jobs back... We would like our government to not give a single penny to your corrupt governments...and we are far from being barbarians, but we are proud of our President and our Navy Seals who were able to get justice and remove a lunatic who thinks killing 3000 innocent people, many from around the globe, in a pair of towers, was necessary to his agenda... So please ...I don't care weather you pretend to be Indian or Pakistani...Just don't pretend to know the heart of an American!
@Dave
To ensure that there is no misunderstanding, let me put forth the below points; all in peace.
I am an Indian who lives in America and definitely have a lot of affection for the country. You will find that this is true with almost all Indians in general. India and Indians have always been open to different cultures. The openness over millenia is what moulded the complexity that is India today. Different thoughts and expressions are common and co-exist. We do want to grow to ensure that the millions in poverty and hunger get a shot at a respectably life. Certainly we don't aim to maim, mutilate or kill people.
Indians have a very high opinion of America and are all for peace. Here is a quote from earlier.
"Ram Sekhar
Brothers and Sisters of America,
Wake up. After a few generations of living the good, clean way, you seem to have forgotten how dirty works. Don't believe all that you are told. They can be lies. People do take you for a ride, though you are the most powerful nation in the world."
The salutation I used is not something is more than 100 years old. It was uttered by a very great soul in Chicago in 1893. You can find the text of the speech here : http://en.wikisource.org/wiki/The_Complete_Works_of_Swami_Vivekananda/Volume_1/Addresses_at_The_Parliament_of_Religions/Response_to_Welcome
Pakis are scumbags!
Al-Aqsa Mosque Imam threatening death to GWB & Obama
US Intelligence has announced the PARTITION OF PAKISTAN – Webster Tarpley – RT News
Wow!! hello...what a nuisance for the world. A country that the whole world hates.. a country on top of every nasty list, a sanctuary for terror, backward to the hoot, beggers asking for american money and holding donors conferences all over the world, no political stability after all these years and where violent extremism is the order of the day. Who gives a **** how many soldiers you lost ...its your citizens killing their own , the world's problem is that they step out into our countries and target us. Wow the # 1 of all wanted people is found in your evil land...and then these backward porki fools spew their sense of false braggadocio on these forums. The world hates you mother f****** and its time UN and other countries get together and break em up. I mean a backward violent dangerous place with nukes...WOW!!. Your moment of reckoning is here now .....all this will end with the end of your wackystan. ...and yea...all the bearded fools and burka clad bit**s ...get outta our countries and go back to your wackystan...the worlds had it with ya!
Exactly Cheri...and then these violent beggers compare themselves to india...its the be all and end all of their existance...I mean yes we may be curry eating, weird accented simpletons but we are not backward, ill reputed and violent thugs like you who go arounf begging the world for money and then claim to be this powerful self sufficient country. Most of you muslims who live in america plot or pray for its downfall, dont integrate no where because everything is a sin in your backward religon. ..still living in stone ages. I am totally gobsmacked at your ignorance, lack of tolerance and backwardness. You beggers should not be allowed in any country. I agree with Cheri..your moment of reckoning is here and the whole world that you held hostage to your terror tactics is comin after you crazy mullahs.
If any of you hate the USA so much why do you live here? Shut up or leave!!!!!!
Pakistan should put its mouth where the money is. Pakistan has been always the command and control center of state sponsored terrorism across the planet. If they are really sincere then hand over:
1. Dawood Ibrahim: Perpretator of the 1996 mumbai blasts living in Karachi under government protection.
2. Hijackers of Indian Airlines flight which was taken to Afghanistan by pakistani terrorists still roaming freely in the shithole of a coutry.
3. ISI handlers of the terrorists who conducted the 2008 mumbai massacres.
Pakistan is a state sponsorer of terrorism and uses jihadis for polititical purposes. This is not a normal country. Their dog president Zia Hul Haq had publically stated the Afghanistan is to be totally controlled and used as a strategic depth against india. If they are really serious then they can hand over all and much more terrorists to International Criminal Court to stand trials against humanity.
Good points. The few moderates in Pak are slowly evaporating.
http://politicsdisgust.blogspot.com
God I never thought I would agree with anything Bush said BUT: He said ANY country that allows, trains, harbors or conceals ANY terrorist will be considered our ENEMY. It is only a matter of time and IT IS time to TELL Pakistan that if you do any of these we are coming after you.
They knew he was there, come on now......the " guessing game" is total BS. We need to start dropping more bombs over in PAK. Get our soliders home safe and lets turn it into a parking lot already!
America's biggest objective has been achieved in this region after Osama's death and the longer American troops stay there the more hatred will be created in this region for America. Pakistan is one of the most modern and educated nation in the Islamic world. US needs to realize that Pakistan was and is fighting this war for America and America has to help them get out of it. Since this operation the civilian casualties have reached close to 40,000 in Pakistan. The American troops need to be given a break and we all want peace on this earth after what happened in Vietnam, Japan, Iraq, Afghanistan, Libya and now Pakistan. Peace can never be raised through arms!
Indian have no rights to weight Pakistan and USA relations.Here some Indian show only that face which they like.Indian have least knowledge of pashtuns which live on both side of border of Afghanistan and Pakistan.they suffered from this war most.Being so close they still don't know what afghans wants to watch on TV.Keep Indian culture within India your soft power has no roots in Afghanistan.broadcast somewhere else .Before commenting here read wikileaks about India.we did not leave USA till now.is there any signs of friendship of India to USSR from which they got few guns.India is still India.stop dreaming.Everybody knows that Indian is using afghan soil against Pakistan.they exploiting the situation.build own opportunities if have some talent.
If don't know any thing then stop acting like a moron. India's relationship with USSR has not ruined. We still have good economic and military ties. Cold war is over. India supports non-aligned movement and hence it only expected from us to build relationship with every country including pakistan. However, we failed in your case. Without a friendly hand from pakistan there is not way India can built good ties with pakistan. One and only way to show this change of heart is to return all criminals, who committed crimes in India, ur country is harbouring to India.. Until then, India has every right to weaken pakistan to an extent it can not put evil eye on India.
After all these events and their well established terrorist culture, they demand similar nuclear deal as India. They even went further demanding UN permenent seat. I do not understand what they think about the world. Wake up, first learn to live with others harmoniously on this planet. I think they should be tied along with n.korea and iran for creating troubles around the world.
If Pakistan wants to restore their relationship with the U.S. then they will surrender the other Al Qaeda leaders and save their people from any more "collateral damage" resulting from U.S. missile strikes or Special Op's forces. Let's face it, Pakistan has a convenient relationship with the United States but to call them an ally is a stretch.
http://politicsdisgust.blogspot.com
For God sake every one, can we just live in PEACE!!
You reap what you sow, Pakistan is now learning that lesson. My fellow Indians, lets please show some class.
Raja, that is the most intelligent comment to date. A breath of fresh air. As an American I am surprised by the amount of hatred that is expressed, mostly by Pakistanis toward Indians. Peace would be nice.
Pakistan is dangerously close to being a failed state. It certainly is a state where the central government doesn't have authority over all its territory.
Let em have it...then we'll have a solid reason to turn the sh%thole to glass.
If religious fanatics take control of Pakistan, you can be sure there will be some serious activity happening from the west.
So bring on the drones. Hundreds of them. If the Pakistani government does not want us on our soil, fine, we will stay in the air above 24-7 and destroy every terrorist that dares move around on the ground day or night even if that means targeting the corrupt generals that have taken Bin Ladens bribes for the last ten years.
Poor Osama, He is not secured (in most secured country for terrorist) in Pakistan ! I think now its time for every terrorist to move to India, where they will be 100% safe, as Congress will take Guarantee for them, they will be long live ! Because Congress Need votes from Muslims so they not gonna do anything to them, look at Afzal Guru, Kasaab...they will wait until someone will Hijack the plane or tourist and ask for Afzal in pakistan.., so my message to terrorist in pakistan call Sonia Gandhi to get shelter, or contact pakistani ISI to transfer them to Congress-India or call lalu yadav.
Oh yeah, Dawood call Sonia...Please,
osama for Pakistan is not important. he is killed or what ever. only thing concern Pakistan or Pakistani ppl is why without permission any outside country's forces came in Pakistan or violate its territory. And I think now countries need to be mature and understand that India, Pakistan or America are nuclear armed countries and they all got nuclear capable missiles inter continental and missile defence systems. Their politicians needs to under stand that this kind of actions can take many human life’s.
Priority should be saving human life’s not wining election, or diverting public attention from economy and problems like basic needs. That applies to all these three countries.
No hard feelings for any body. Just my point of view.
Check this out! Could you prove this wrong?
http://www.familysecuritymatters.org/publications/id.520/pub_detail.asp
s long as the Muslim population remains around 1% of any given country it will be regarded as a peace-loving minority and not as a threat to anyone...."
Here is where it becomes interesting. Note throughout the exponential scale of Islamic influence as the percentage of Muslim population per country increases. Comments in square brackets are my corrective interjections.
United States: 1.0
Australia: 1.5
Canada: 1.9
China: 1.0-2.0
Italy: 1.5
Norway: 1.8
"At 2% and 3% they [Muslims] begin to proselytize from other ethnic minorities and disaffected groups with major recruiting from the jails and among street gangs."
Denmark: 2.0
Germany: 3.7
United Kingdom: 2.7
Spain: 4.0
Italy: 4.6
"From 5% on they [Muslims] exercise an inordinate influence in proportion to their percentage of the population. They will push for the introduction of halal ("clean" by Islamic standards) food, thereby securing food preparation jobs for Muslims. They will increase pressure on supermarket chains to feature it on their shelves – along with threats for failure to comply (United States)."
France: 8.0
Philippines: 5.0
Sweden: 5.0
Switzerland: 4.3
The Netherlands: 5.5
Trinidad & Tobago: 5.8
"At this point, they [Muslims] will work to get the ruling government to allow them to rule themselves under Sharia, or Islamic law. The ultimate goal of Islam is not to convert the world but to establish Sharia law over the entire world.
"When Muslims reach 10% of the population, they will increase lawlessness as a means of complaint about their conditions (Paris – car burning). Any non-Muslim action that offends Islam will result in uprisings and threats (Amsterdam, Denmark – Mohammed cartoons, murder of Theo van Gogh)."
Guyana: 10.0
India: 13.4
Israel: 16.0
Kenya: 10.0
Russia: 10.0-15.0
The one anomaly in this set of statistics is Israel, which has not experienced uprisings and threats of violence. Its Arab or Muslim population enjoys equal political rights with Jewish Israelis. The suicide bombings and rocket attacks that have killed hundreds have been perpetrated by outsiders.
"After reaching 20% [of a population] expect hair-trigger rioting, Jihad militia formations, sporadic killings and church and synagogue burning:
Ethiopia: 32.8
"After 40% you will find widespread massacres, chronic terror attacks and ongoing militia warfare:"
Bosnia: 40.0
Chad: 53.1
Lebanon: 59.7
"From 60% you may expect unfettered persecution of non-believers and other religions, sporadic ethnic cleansing (genocide), use of Sharia Law as a weapon and jizya, the tax placed on [conquered] infidels:"
Albania: 70.0
Malaysia: 60.4
Qatar: 77.5
Sudan: 70.0
"After 80%, expect state-run ethnic cleansing and genocide:"
Bangladesh: 83.0
Egypt: 90.0
Gaza: 98.7
Indonesia: 86.1
Iran: 98.0
Iraq: 97.0
Jordan: 92.0
Morocco: 98.7
Pakistan: 97.0
Palestine: 99.0
Syria: 90.0
Tajikistan: 90.0
Turkey: 99.8
United Arab Emirates: 96.0
I question the inclusion of "Palestine" in this set. "Palestine" simply means space occupied by stateless "Palestinians" in Gaza and the West Bank, and is the name of the state which Islamists wish to replace Israel, once it is destroyed. Turkey, after decades of having a secular, non-religious government, is beginning to turn "religious," and seems to be yearning for the kind of Muslim government that cleansed the country in 1915 of non-Muslim Armenians in a genocide that predates the Holocaust.
"100% will usher in the peace of ‘Dar-es-Salaam' – the Islamic House of Peace' [more correctly, dar-al-Islam, or Land of Islam]. There is supposed to be peace because everybody is a Muslim."
Afghanistan: 100.0
Saudi Arabia: 100.0
Somalia: 100.0
Yemen: 99.9
"Of course, that's not the case. To satisfy their blood lust, Muslims then start killing each other for a variety of reasons.
"'Before I was nine I had learned the basic canon of Arab life. It was me against my brother; me and my brother against our father; my family against my cousins and the clan; the clan against the tribe; and the tribe against the world and all of us against the infidel.' Leon Uris, The Haj.
"It is good to remember that in many, many countries, such as France, the Muslim populations are centered around ghettos based on their ethnicity. Muslims do not integrate into the community at large. Therefore, they exercise more power than their national average[s] would indicate.
"Adapted from Dr. Peter Hammond's book, Slavery, Terrorism and Islam: The Historical Roots and Contemporary Threat."
Everybody's opinion must be heard but some show emotions more than reason. Hateful arguments do not win the rational minds but only incite more bitterness.
I wish to see a picture of the DEAD Osama Bin Laden, not because I'm some sort of pervert but I just want to see that SOB with that horrible smile wiped off his face.
If you're an impoverished guy in a backward village and someone offers you TWICE the salary a policeman or soldier gets in your country to join a "religious" crusade, it doesn't take too much to sway your allegiance. We'll be stuck with al-Qaeda and the Taliban and the imitators as long as we allow the wealthy Saudi sheiks to keep funding these organizations.
"Pakistan is a country severely stressed by the militancy within it and it’s the country with the world’s fastest growing nuclear arsenal." It's only a matter of time before the muslim thugs get their finger on the red button and push it just because they are suicidal and would love to take a few countries with them.
Why did the British create this country?
Some of these comments make me wish the Mayans are right about 2012.
Learn to swim – Aenima, Tool
Jal... Well I guess the USA should leave the world be. Let everyone destroy themselves and the rest of the world rot. If they want our aid BILLIONS of DOLLARS than they should adhere to our standards. The US is the balance of the world, and like local cops everyone hates them for doing what's right.
It is false to assume that disposing his body in the sea would kill his very small erratic movement. Bin Laden became important not because of his magnetism ( he had none ) but because of his potent ideology espoused at a very critical time in his culture which is suffering from corruption and a sick economy , to some extent sponsored by us. That ideology would continue to create followers. We need to understand the philosophy and deal with it on that turf . It is a cause and effect relationship ignoring which has been very costly to us.
i think Osama is alive and he is in united states custody . world wide people don't understand that Obama only wants to win the election that s way he is playing game with Pakistan. its all politics.
There are more Indians spewing hatred towards Pakistanis then anything else on these posts. Making such comments does not solve any problems that Indians have with their neighbors in Pakistan. India has instigated a lot of problems for Pakistan supporting a civil war in splitting the country with Bangladesh in the past. Pakistan does not trust India for it's future and existence. Pakistan is a complex country with all sorts of people and interests. Similar to India or any other nation. The extremists are losing so they are threatening by terror and killings, they exist among the population. Eliminating will take a long time and effort.
The objective of US is just to retain the hold of the gas reserves and control the gas prices, nothing else. All their policies finally converge to this objective only. They are not going to pressurize Pakistan for anything that doesn't matter to them.
India should not daydream and expect any help from US on eradicating that section of terrorism that affects just India and not US. Just like the US has classified Talibans into good taliban and bad taliban, there might be classification of terrorism too. The Bad Terrorism and the Good Terrorism. The Bad Terrorism is the one that affects US and the Good Terrorism is the one that doesn't.
The US has been fighting and will continue to fight the War on Bad Terror.
What do you do when a part of your body become cancerous? You destroy the cancerous cells with radioactive radiation. The neighboring good cells also get affected but if you want to live you have to take some risks. Pakistan is the Cancer of this world that US is unwilling to treat. India is capable of treating this cancer with radioactivity…and I think the message is very clear.
Unless this bold step is taken, the illness will continue through the life.
How easy it is for the world to blame Pakistan for everything that is happening in this world. Sick and tired of listening that Pakistan being the terrorist state, Pakistan has links with AL qaeda, Jihadist and all the terror factories in the world.
If Pakistan is that bad then why were 30000 Pakistanis were killed in Pakistan in this bloody and so called war against terror. If america were that advanced how could this that it took bloooody 10 years to find osama?? Either they themself were backing obama thru CIA or they were just incompetent since pakistan have no such luxurary to high-tec satellite system. You blooody killed millions of muslims to find one man and after killing him you want number 2, then u want number 3, then the list goes on and on... is there a stop to it?? USA the champion of peace?? USA Kills humans like flies..
Pakistan did not invaded VIETNAM, Pakistan didn't Invaded IRAQ, Pakistan didn't invaded Afghanistan, Pakistan didn't invaded and made bases in every 3rd country in the world, Pakistan didn't killed 1 million muslims like USA have..
LOOK INTO YOUR PERSONAL SELVES, ITS EASY TO BLAME BUT HARD TO CLAIM THAT WE HAVE SHOWN MORE THEN ANY BLOODY USA OR NATO COULD SHOW. THEY EVEN LACK BALLS TO FIGHT FEW TALIBAN, IF YOU KNOW 1400 TALIBAN COST THE SAME AS 1 COWARD US SOLDIER STILL USA IS ON THE LOSING.. THEY ARE LOSING IN EVERY SENSE OF THE WORD. KILL MORE AND FIND PEACE? WOULD YOU FIND PEACE THAT WAY THEN GO AHEAD LAUCH A NUCLEAR MISSLE AS YOU DID IN JAPAN AND KILL ALL THE PEOPLE THAT YOU DON'T LIKE AND IF IN FACT ON OF THE PEOPLE SURVIVED HE WOULD JUST KNOW THE WORD REVENGE! IT MAY NOT STOP!
***AMERICA HAS BLOOD ON ITS HAND OF MILLIONS OF PEOPLE !! TIME WILL TELL ONLY.
There you go again trying to avoid blame by pointing fingers.
U all talking for non I tell u Unless THEY DISARMED PAKI NUKE THE are not able to do any sanctions, threaths or Missadvanture cuz thats the only SECURITY for pakis having –and all parties know very well including PAKARMY–
PAKISTAN ZNIDA BAD–
When people have nothing to say or the intellect to analyze the situation, insinuating words are being used. For everyone's info "curry" is not an Indian word. It was coined by the British. So get educated before you use these words. I am not even sure why these Indians even respond when these words are used or even talk about it as curry. I have no idea what that is and I dont use this word ever. So stop using imaginary words to simplify something that you dont understand.
Location of Pakistan is not the problem, but Pakistani society built for only MUSLIMS is the problem.It breeds religious divide,conflict with India, inspires causes for terrorism, fosters divide with the west;
Liquidation of an ISLAMIC STATE of PAKISTAN in south asia and making it secular will bring PEACE and Muslims should learn to live in secular societies
MUST WATCH VIDEO
CNN's Wolf Blitzer REPEATEDLY GRILLS Pak PM Gilani on Osama Bin Laden's whereabouts. Gilani CATEGORICALLY states that OBL is NOT in Pak as the Pakistan military is on top of things and would have easily found out!
Check out their exchange here:
Amit-Atlanta-USA
Pakistan"s nukes will be used by the talebanis against india, the usa , eu etc- the world should pre-empt this possibility
Yes there should realize the opportunity to RSS commentary, quite simply, CMS is another on the blog.
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