Editor's Note: Dr. Frank Ochberg is Clinical Professor of Psychiatry at Michigan State University and former Associate Director of the National Institute of Mental Health.
By Frank Ochberg - Special to CNN
School shootings are far more frequent in America than in other countries, although terrible massacres have occurred in Russia, Israel, and several European nations. In the high-crime neighborhoods of inner cities, school turf is relatively safe. We have learned to harden the target and patrol with vigilance.
And even in those suburbs and small towns where spree killings have occurred, the rates, per capita, are lower now than in previous decades. School is a safe place - until, as in Chardon, Ohio, the unspeakable happens. Then, even though the risks are low, it is fair to ask, why does this still happen? Why here, in America?
Let's be clear. There is no single, certain answer to these questions. The possible factors include failure by classmates, parents and school officials to see the warning signs; bullying and revenge; serious mental illness; violent role models; drugs; access to guns, and a culture that condones extremism.
America has its share of these factors, but which are significant and which are more prevalent here than across the Atlantic?
Warning signs
Students do not become mass killers overnight. They nurse their fantasies and they leak evidence. Insults, threats and plans are posted on websites. Classmates often know when a student is ready to strike back. Parents hear rumblings and have accurate gut sensations.
Within our country there are communities and neighborhoods and school districts that are relatively cohesive, vigilant and able to discuss warning signs of danger. There are some communities that are not as well integrated. They must be coached and helped.
After Columbine and Virginia Tech and other notorious school shootings, new programs to share information were developed and several plots were nipped in the bud. This evolution of information sharing occurs in other countries, but it is difficult to measure, nation to nation, who is ahead and who is behind. I see no proof that America is losing this race to improve detection of warning signs.
Bullying and revenge
We have too many bullies and too many youngsters at the mercy of bullies. But we also have a growing system of anti-bullying school programs. Despite rumors to the contrary, the Columbine killers were not bullied. There is no evidence that America, compared to other nations, has more bullies, more bullying, more victimization, and more victims who are ticking time bombs, hatching plots of lethal vengeance. However, we certainly can and should promote school programs that protect all children from stalking, hazing, and the new, evolving forms of abuse: Ostracism and humiliation through electronic social networks.
When boys are bullied they may fantasize about revenge. To dream of turning the tables on a bully is common to all eras, most cultures, and the source of drama, film and literature from the Elizabethan stage to the spaghetti Western. But whether a slowly evolving fantasy of mass murder is a product of mental illness, of bullying or of other sources, there are usually signs along the way.
Major mental illness
We do not have more major mental illness than most other countries. But we may be less caring of our mentally ill. Back in the Kennedy era, we launched community mental health programs to care for people with schizophrenia and similarly severe disorders, including depression. We wanted treatment available close to home, with compassionate supervision and with proper medication. We tried to stop the revolving door to the asylum, and, in fact, we tore down the large state hospitals. Our best intentions failed.
The program was never fully funded and our American system of care leaves much to be desired. The most serious mental illnesses, schizophrenia and depression, often become overt in adolescence. A boy who is smart enough to get into a good college becomes deluded, obsessed, strange, scary - and he gets rejected, isolated and stuck in a fantasy world. Those fantasies can become lethal. These forms of mental illness are seldom the source of homicide (far more often they torment and demoralize the disturbed individual). But when they are dangerous to others, we need good answers.
We do not have a sophisticated system of care and protection. If we did, Mr. Cho would not have killed 32 students at Virginia Tech. But America is really no worse than other nations when it comes to the numbers of seriously mentally ill, of violently mentally ill, of insufficiently treated violent mentally ill school-age boys. (Yes, we are talking about boys and young men; by far, they are the school shooters).
Violent role models
Violent role models, on the street, in the cinema, in the news, have been with us for as long as I recall, and are not limited to America. Back in the '60s, an American counter culture leader said, "Violence is as American as cherry pie." But other parts of the world, such as Northern Ireland, the Balkans, the children's armies of Africa, the terrorist camps of the Middle East, have their violent role models. Machismo is not an American word, nor is Hooligan.
Drugs
We do have drugs and a drug culture and aspects of this problem are more severe here than in many other parts of the world. Crime is connected to the drug trade and this crime can spill into the school. But the type of school shooting that occurs in the suburb is seldom connected to this urban issue. There may be an indirect connection, since drug wars arm young soldiers of drug wars, and arms are a large issue in America.
Access to guns
Access to guns is a significant factor in American school shootings. If kids could not and did not bring guns to school, we wouldn't have Columbine, Virginia Tech or Chardon, Ohio. There have been crimes with knives and bats and fists. But school shootings are gun crimes. Kids with guns kill kids at school.
I do not think America is an extremist nation, compared to other nations with bloody histories and despotic leaders. True, we have polarized political speech, and some of that speech is about access to guns. But the reason we have an American school shooting problem that exceeds other nations has to do with access to loaded weapons by kids who should not have that access.
I'm not offering a gun control solution. But any serious attempt to prevent school shooting will have to attack the problem by determining who should not be armed, and preventing dangerous boys from bringing guns to school.
The views expressed in this article are solely those of Frank Ochberg. For more on the subject of school shootings, Dr. Ochberg recommends reading reports by the U.S. Secret Service and the FBI.
Cant outsource schooling...or can you? I will let the 1% decide that for us. After all, they are the job creators and this nations problem solvers. Heck, Mitt Romney works harder in one day than a well trained electrical engineer does in 1 full year!
Because guns are there for it, stupid!!!
Guns are the tool, we need to find the motive.
but if the tool wasn't available, they wouldn't have been shot
Iggy-Mean while lets lock up the tool room.
Bzaar, so to stop the what, maybe dozen's of deaths by crazy, gun weilding teens, you'd take firearms away from EVERYONE else? Leave firearms only with criminals, the ones who aren't afraid of jail and wouldn't comply with requirments to surrender a weapon?
If there is a way to kill someone, it will happen regardless of guns. Guns are part of our reality and they wont be going anywhere EVER. No such thing as getting rid of them. You take them from people, the criminals will find a way to get them... and if not that, they will find a way to make one.
Yeah, but you don't leave your table saw unsecured around children, do you.
@AceRyder – here we go again, the same old whine. "But Mom, theirs is bigger than mine, so I need a bigger one!" Did it ever occur to you that criminals (who will always be criminals BTW) may not find the need to "carry" if hand guns were banned and controlled. No one is talking about taking away ALL guns, just those that are as easy to get as drugs!
Guns are already illegal for kids to carry guns. Its already illegal to have a weapon on campus. Its Illegal in most cases to shoot some one.
It's not handguns as many shootings are done with rifles as well. In other countries people run amok with machetes, and of course there are suicide bombers as well. There is NO one answer.
Guns are a tool this is true but a tool with a very specific purpose, to kill. When that tool is left all around and is way too easy to acquire because of gun fanatics and the NRA those tools get misused like any tool does when it is not put in specific places and kept to where it is to be used. You want to end the school shooting and a great deal of the crime in America, where we have more people die from guns than anywhere else in the world, you need to limit the access to guns and control how they are stored, kept, and owned. Yes, I know, if we do not have guns only criminals will have guns. Criminals get guns easily because so many lame people own them and do not keep them safely locked up, no supply of guns. criminals do not have guns. And as far as protecting against government take over, your puny rifle is really going to defend against an armored personal carrier or tank filled with soldiers in body armor and weapons that will destroy anything you hide behind. Get real, the only people who go off about having guns are very paranoid individuals who have an inferiority complex in the jeans and feel that big ole gun will make up for it somehow.
Yes, apart from the easy access to guns, one also has to look at the social aspect of these tragedies. Very often we have youngsters who are neglected at home and excluded from the society. At school they feel discriminated not only by their shoolmates, also by the teachers. A twist of fate and the – irreparable – damage is done.
Lack of access is the key. As one poster stated (paraphrasing), one does not leave the table saw wide open and available to those who do not know how to operate it. Similarly, I make my firearms inaccessable to my children (and my table saw key as well).
True... USA is the only country where everyone have access to guns, including children. You have disagreement with somebody, go home and take a gun and shoot.. go and kill each other America until you learn..
@Jay – See Switzerland for more information on gun access. Here's a hint: The Swiss model was what our founding fathers based the Second Amendment upon. My opinion: The problem starts in the home. Not only with PARENTS who leave guns available for their children, but also with PARENTS who do not properly educate their children. We cannot rely on our public education to instill the moral fiber that we (You and I) hold dear. That must be done in the home.
Exactly! Marijuana is a "tool" to get high but it illegal because the government does not want us to get high. But, when it comes to guns, it's not the tool that is the problem according to gun nuts. Get real. If guns are easily available to high school students then they will acquire and use them. Well, at least the U.S. leads the world in some school-related endeavor!
Guns were even more available in the 60's. 70's and 80's. Has nothing to do with it at all. Look at the roll models and leadership these kids have. The television, X-box, greed, single parents that work 2 jobs, a suit happy society that takes no personal responsibility for anything. And a country with absolute wimps for leaders. Republican and Democrat alike.
Guns kill people but they also protect people. All cops have guns. Remember, If there is a gun in every house, criminals will think ten times if they want to brake into that house.
Lack of parenting. Period. Face facts. Know what your kids are going through, go through it with them not as a friend but as the mature guide on ALL Things. When will people wake up to this. Parenting is a full time, non stop, no topic off limits job.
A gun is a tool, and that is all it is. You can kill with a number of objects.
Why is it that random shootings like this receive so much national attention? Because in a country of 80 million gun owners, shootings like this are rare. Therefore, they are news-worthy.
There are more fatalities by automobile, so they are rarely reported nationally. I wonder that so few people want to take automobiles away from us, because fatalities happen so often. On the other hand, there are gun control advocates who text or use cell phones while driving, thus making it all the more likely that they will kill someone while irresponsibly wielding a 3,000 pound weapon. Do they ever think of their own irresponsible behavior?
I agree completely !
Tougher Gun laws USA.... you have to or this will keep happening.... take your pick...
Yup, as the article makes crystal clear, the major difference between America and other places is the ridiculously easy access to guns. Most everything else is equal. Probably the access to guns drives some of the other differences, such as the social and emotional distance we have between each other - one of the very worst things about our culture. The right of a few people to carry around instruments of destruction that make them feel more like the men they will never truly be hardly outweighs the right of us as a people to be safe and caring for each other, does it? One of the ironies is the gun nuts are exactly the kind of people the Bible's Book of Proverbs tries to educate into full adulthood, yet the same people act like they're the only ones who understand the Bible. America's journey to redemption will be a long one, I'm afraid.
the motive- raising the bar every year= stress
Vic, are you replying to jal?
Do you even realize that Switzerland is second in the world in gun ownership , close behind U.S. Yet you don't hear much about school shootings in Switzerland. Sorry, but you'll have to look for another reason other than simplistic scapegoating
More gun laws are needed so criminals and psychopaths can ignore them, too! Morons.
Guns have always been around, and bullying has always been around? So whats changed we must ask? Thats right, parents/lawyers infiltrating school issues trying to sue everyone over fights. So schools just call the cops and now kids get criminal records for a little fight. Fighting/conflict is inherant in our nature!!! Supress it, and rage builds, and mass killings ensue!! When you look at it in the contexts of whats changed the awnsers are usually staring you right in the face!!
Another great analogy is Forest fires...huge campaigns to prevent them and supress the little controllable fires...Then we got Super Fires that were uncontrollable...turns out a little fire is a necessary evil...and so is a little fist fighting now and then...black eyes/bloody noses heal(if it ever gets past pushing/pulling) gun shot wounds to the head don't!!
What we really need to do is bring back the duel. That way if someone insults you or provokes you to a murderous rage, you and that person can shoot at eachother respectably without involving the unnecessary deaths of innocent bystanders.
The tool room IS locked in a school area... some are just able to break the locks and get the tool while everyone else is left helpless.
Guns are more effective than knives. We need to allow students to carry guns in classrooms, just as they are allowed in public recreation centers,which is the way it is in Fairfax, the home of the NRA. Students have the right to defend themselves and to worship the second ammendment.
There no longer seems to be an out let for the simple childhood agression of pushing and shoving.
Every thing now calls for strict interaction with authority and anger builds to this type of action due to the lack of release of pressure at a lower non leathal level.
the issue is not guns. if you want to know the real issue i believe it is a fundamental problem with how our education system works. http://therollingmacaroon.tumblr.com/post/18002397589/rsa-animate-changing-education-paradigms-by check that video out. That is what's wrong with all of this.
Nearly every school shooting and other seemingly motiveless group shooting has two very distinct factors: The obvious one is guns are available but the key one is that the shooter is on or has recently been on mind controlling medications. Not street drugs. Something given to "help" the person. You will either see this info in the initial report or later on at the trial or something. It may even be "he was diagnosed as having ADD" which nearly always means he/she was put on meds. And no, I do not care that you think meds helped you or your best friend. These incidents mostly happen with drugs. FACT.
Because we are #1 in exporting terrorism and massacring other nations for their natural resources so our oil executive (Mafia) can screw us more and more!
Motive: 1st one: just for the sake of trying it... 2nd: because they liked it.
@Emmy, no, if the killers had no guns, the victims would have been stabbed or beaten to death. Besides, gun laws are there for the mostly honest people. If someone is going to kill someone, I have a hard time believing they'll flinch at breaking a gun law.
VMAN2003 – seriously, you make no sense in your argument about Switzerland vs America's shootings...
There are 8million people living in NEW YORK CITY!!!! there are 7 million living in Switzerland....Euros trying to compare statistics with the U.S. are really so lame. Canada who likes to compare themselves against the U.S. even has 50 miilion people....seriously?? we have 350+ miillion people and quite varying demographics...the U.S. is unique to the world, unique is all I am saying. (PS no, I don't proofread web blog entries, seriously?)
Anyone who blames this on the availability of guns is an idiot...Bad people find ways to do bad things....the gun wasn't pressuring that kid to shoot the kids that obviously made his life miserable enough to snap.
It's the guns. Here you go "responsible" gun owners. How about IF YOU DO NOT SECURE YOUR GUN AND IT GETS USED IN A CRIME, YOU DO THE TIME.
I am SICK AND TIRED of idiotic gun owners saying "I left it on the coffee table and it got stolen so I am not responsible". YOU ARE RESPONSIBLE! Keep your G.D. guns OUT OF THE HANDS OF CHILDREN AND CRIMINALS OR YOU ARE RESPONSIBLE.
I am all for RESPONSIBLE GUN OWNERSHIP, I just have NEVER SEEN IT!
all 350,000 of them and obviously our current laws prevent the wrong people from getting them. Its too bad these kids who got shot at didn't have guns because then maybe the killer would have thought twice about doing this...
Until you can guarantee that NO ONE (even the bad guys) then you cannot act like we can prevent the wrong people from having a gun. Also whether you like it or not; everyone benefits from the free access to guns. Criminals do not know who is armed and those that aren't and thus some portion of potential criminal activity has been prevented.
There are two problems: 1. Most people are stupid. 2. Guns are efficient high-powered killing machines. Put them together and it is pretty obvious why these things happen.
If you try to take my right to guns, heck, if you try to take my guns, i will shoot back.
Guns are not the problem, they are simply a means to an end. If you take away guns then they will grab a knife. Take away the knife, well how difficult is it to look on the internet and find ways to mix common household cleaning supplies into something that goes boom? Identify and treat the cause.
Gun control is a favorite target when politicions want to look like they are doing something but do not want to or cannot put forth the funds to treat the underlying issue. Most gun control regulations are knee jerk reactions because its easy for the government to be reactive than proactive and guns are an easy target to place the blame on.
As someone said before. Outlawing guns would only mean outlaws have the guns and what do they care for the laws of man?
Wut the F are you naive people talking about?
If a gun wasn't there, there would have been a knife or a f'n rock.
Kandi, total failure as an argument. That boy could never have killed three people and seriously injured two more with a knife, much less a rock. Only an id.iot would compare the effectiveness of a knife with a gun.
Feel free to bring a rock to a gunfight. dumb.
Why would you call someone stupid? It's people like you who talk down to others that cause a lot of the problems we're talking about right now.....
This was a tragic event, but do we all need to wear bubble wrap suites now and stay safe behind a protective shield. If we're getting rid of things that when improperly used cause tragic deaths. Then why save a few people a year when we can save millions. lets get rid of cars. yeah! LETS ILLEGALIZE AUTOMOBILES THERE RESPONSIBLE FOR A HELL OF A LOT MORE TRAGEDY AND HEART BREAK OUT THERE...
I am as liberal as they come and not a huge gun fan but I don't think banning guns is the way to go either. I have many safety concious, law-abiding gun owner friends. Criminals and nuts will find thier way around laws. There is something darker and deeper going on.
too many haters on this crazy blog...................
Nobody can control human behavior. It hasn't work for thousands of years and it will never work in future. But we can control guns distribution. Gun can kill tens of people in 5 seconds. How many people can get killed in 5 seconds by a knife?
Not too many people want to accept this simple fact. I guess protecting second amendment is more important than saving lives.
Why so much gun violence in school. Simply because you Yanks are wackos. Yes wackos. Well obviously not everyone, but enough that you have way too much senseless killing, not that there is sensiible killings. If you didn't have all those guns handy, you'd use something else.
You people are ridiculous. Whenever you outlaw something, you create problems. Look at drugs. Drug gangs are around because drugs are illegal. In Portugal, after they legalized the drugs, the gangs went away, because the black market went away and normal cops were there to take care of drug related crime (instead of thugs). In this case, it is a very isolated incident with a bat S#it crazy kid. There are many kids who grow up with guns who understand how to deal with them responsibly. Most of you pretentious yuppies just have no clue what i'm talking about because you spent you life in a smog-ridden city. Good for you.
Hey Emmy Skaddittle the 9/11 hijackers didn't use guns and they still killed a lot more people. They found a way, bad people always do.
Guns have been around for a couple hundred years and this phenom has really only become prevalent in the last decade or so. So what has changed? The internet for one. The ease with which one can slander, tease or bully another person is magnified to such an extent that, even with anonymity, you can cut a kid to shreds. Perhaps our children have thinner skin as well. They were raised by Mr. Rogers and Barney where no matter what – you were the most special person in the world – so it goes to reason that when reality dictates that not everyone likes you (justified or not) that your reaction might be more extreme than a person raised in another era. Just my 2 cents.
the real problem is firearm education!! too many people dont have it!! i believe every man woman and responsible teen should carry a gun. i also believe that before you buy a gun you must complete a firearms training course, paid for in part by the sale of the firearm. for those that get guns illegally always have and always will! it is important for the whole family to know the safety rules of a firearm. it is a tool, and that is what i teach my children. just like every other tool on this planet there is a right way to use it and a wrong way to use it. those that use it in the wrong way either are mentally disturbed or have not had the proper education with a firearm!
@Brian: "Guns were even more available in the 60's. 70's and 80's" - I doubt it. In the 50's criminals made zip-guns by hand because manufactured guns were hard to get. They often exploded when fired. The saturday-night-special changed all that. Cheap guns (even automatics) are so easy to get now that no one would make a zip-gun.
Because Americais a screwed up society. iPads as a brain but no manners, decency or culture. We are a bunch of barbarians uncivilized and f.....up. Produce kids but don't know whow to raise children.
If cars were not available we could save more lives than than if guns were not available.
You cannot blame guns in general as the root of the problem. You take away guns, then there will be knives. you take away knives then there will be hammers. Hand Axes, ice picks, the list can go on and on and on. As everything in this world is a "tool".
The problem reflects back to parents needing to be responsible for their children. They need to be there with an open ear and listen to their child talk to them about their problems. Communicate. The biggest problem that I have seen with children (being a parent myself) is that most parents do not listen to their children. They are so quick to send their kids to their rooms and remain.
Is it so hard to ask your child after school "How was your day?" and talk to them.
There are a lot of countries with guns..........and knives.... and bridges... and chemicals... and gasoline.... and all sorts of dangerous weapons. So who is stupid here?
technologically,america is an advanced country.socially,it is primitive.americans are half-civilized.
1. Other countries should not compare each other to the U.S.
2. Guns are not the problem
3. Bullying is the issue here
4. Jews are not the problem
5. Fix the God-Damn School System
When I was in high 35 years ago we didn't have all of these shootings and we had even easier access to guns.
There is something else going on and anyone thinking that getting rid of guns is the answer is dreaming.
Iggy C is correct. Guns are only a tool. If you take away all the guns then they will use something else. Remember that video from Fenger High School in Chicago Illinois where the kids were using their fists, feet, and a 2×4 to kill another student?
They need proper education not oppression.
Back in my day it was common to get stabbed to death & yet we all had guns. England got rid of all guns yet there are STILL people getting murdered by thugs with guns. There is STILL criminals preying on victims. Has England gotten safer? They still havce cameras in every nook & cranny don't they?
Back in my day it was common to get stabbed to death & yet we all had guns. England got rid of all guns yet there are STILL people getting murdered by thugs with guns. There is STILL criminals preying on victims. Has England gotten safer? They still have cameras in every nook & cranny don't they?
Guns are effectively banned in Ireland, yet a mentally ill ex-student was able to enter the Sullivan Upper School with a home-made flamethrower.
At least his victims were only coated with flaming gasoline and not shot. I'm sure they appreciated that.
guns dont kill people ...people kill people and if there where not guns there would have been something else like a knife ..if it was a knife would u be says the same thing ...if someones going to do something there going to do they will find away ....
The answer is simple: the lack of discipline in the American family: parents wanting to be buddies rather than role models, and the TV culture. The more you watch the dumber you become.
When I was twelve years old I owned a 410 shotgun and a 22 rifle. When I was sixteen years old I owned a 12 gage shotgun and a 30-06 semi-automatic rifle. Which you could find in the easy rider rifle rack of my Ford pick-up parked in the parking lot of my high school; just in case I wanted to go hunting after school. Most of the guys I went to school with did the same thing. You never heard of a school shooting back then. What's changed? PARENTING!!! You can't discipline your kids anymore, a lot of these idiots wouldn't even if they could. Way too many fools out there having children with no clue about how to raise a decent law abiding citizen. These kids are bringing the guns from home, where apparently the parents are not in control. The laws are on the books already, all we need to do is enforce them. If your child goes to school and shoots anyone the parent should be held as accountable as the student. Start locking up some of these parents and I bet you see a decrease in these types of incidents. Parents don't talk with their kids anymore. Communication is done through texting or e-mail. Parents don't even go in their kids rooms to actually get some insight into what their kid is into. You want to make more laws, make laws concerning parenting and the responsibilities that come with it.
Because 8 of 10 Children's FATHERS have been replaced with CHILD SUPPORT CHECKS!
Not to mention the culture of war & violence that is constantly in the face of the American TV viewer to keep them desensitized promotes wars & violence. And with no many guns on the streets with NRA working overtime, no wonder there is so much killings within US society.
Everyone–send them to a Catholic school–they will be safe!
Thoughtfully the second amendment is in our consittution. It protects its citizens from knee jerk soultions. Perhaps we should not have stopped all fist fights over the years? During my years in school many students carried knives, occasionally brought guns to school and never cut or shot anyone. Seems as though the more our nanny state and 'those who know better' influence our behavior the worse the outcome.
I like the quote from the movie, Shoot em up..."Ah come on, everybody knows that people kill people, not guns...but they sure make it a lot easier!"
Guns are illegal in Mexico.
11,000+ people were gunned down in Juarez Mexico last year.
That gun control law isn't working to well in Mexico is it.
Our housecleaning lady had her neighbors son house sitting for her in Juarez. She returned to Juarez and the boy was found murdered in her house.
Gun control laws in Mexico aren't working well are they.
Someone needs to teach these kids, ideally it would be their family and friends that MURDERING someone in not just agains the law but the bible teaches it as well.
Having 1st hand viewed the Columbine event, thank God their propane bombs didn't go off. Their propane bombs would have leveled the whole school. There'd be knee-jerk idiots wanting to ban propane grills.
The parents of columbine killers denied any knowledge but search warrants turned up drawings, plans and stolen guns in the boys rooms but the naive parents never knew about it. Maybe take some time and get involved w/ their kids and these things won't happen.
These kids have issues and their issues have to be dealt w/.
This fits Einstiens definition of insanity; which is ...doing the same thing over and over again and expecting a different outcome! This is another example of gun control laws that simply don't work! Perhaps, if the intellects put discipline back in the schools they'd have better results!
There are americans who say; "People kill, weapons don't". I think they're dead wrong.
If the gunman who attacked that Connecticut School hadn't held a gun in his hand, he'd never achieve to kill so many before being stopped.
It's not: "People kill, weapons don't"
Instead it's: "People WITH weapons kill, people WITHOUT don't".
There will always be someone with a motive... It's the availability of tools that makes the deadly combination (motives and tolls) possible.
For people who argue that gun is only tool, it is people who kill people not a gun, and stronger gun control will not solve the problem: " If so why don't this country legalize its people to have bomb or rocket? It is not about the tools right? So is it Ok to have any tools to kill including a nuke?
If no one have access to mass killing weapons, bad people have to make a great effort to kill a bunch of people. Save more life.
No, Mitt doesn't do more work in a day than an electrical engineer does in a year. In fact, our man Mitt doesn't do anything useful during the course of a day. Running for President creates no wealth and gains the country nothing. Our engineer, on the other hand, does.
joe engineer has a hard time with sarcasm.
I think "Jal" was being sarcastic. Of course, the average engineer will do tons more work in ONE HOUR and contribute to the innovations, output and profits of a company than mitt romney, snatorum and gingrich's "work" COMBINED over their lifetimes.
Electrical engineer OR computer scientist > born into riches republican
I think you mean 'irony' or 'ironic' not 'sarcasm' or 'sarcastic'.
Good Ole Mitt hasn't done an hours worth of work in his whole lifel most people do more getting the kids off to school in a morning than Mitt has done in the last 10 years.
What party do all those hard working welfare recipients belong to?
Yeah, I think he was being sarcastic. At least I hope so. I'm an electrical engineer, so I may know a thing or two about what an electrical engineer does, and well we all see what politicians do. I just wish I had their benefits. I don't have to work less, I just want their benefits.
Mitt is a useless bag of dirt. Self made man? OH PLEASE! Son of the GOVERNOR, WEASELED INTO AN IVY LEAGUE SCHOOL, got MILLIONS from his dad's friends to start a company. Pretty self made, huh?
DISGUSTING. EVERYTHING the OCCUPY movement is protesting. The rich get richer and we all get screwed. Job creators? GIVE ME A BREAK!
The only way Mitt would be a good choice is if the OTHER CHOICE were SANTOURM (Google it!) or GINGRICH!
To answer RobMichigan's question: "What party do all those hard working welfare recipients belong to?"
They belong to the Republican party. There are studies that actually show that. People who utilize the largest amounts of government funds and populations that use the most government funds are largely conservative and religious. The connection is obvious – they are uneducated, so they don't make any money and they're gullible. They believe in God, and they believe that the only reason THEY need government money is because the "liberal elite" put them in that position. A the same time, they believe that they're conservative neighbor next door who is also using government funds is actually liberal "welfare mother" using their tax dollars (not sure why they think they pay taxes) to sin against God. In fact, both of them probably believe that about each other. It's freaking crazy.
There are social and demographic studeis about this that say it much more nicely than I just did, but that's basically what they say. Start here: http://taxprof.typepad.com/taxprof_blog/2004/09/red_states_feed.html.
Blah blah blah, more of the typical and rather juvenile class warfare.
Way to whip out the GOP buzzword! Do you get special points for everytime you use one?
Notwithstanding, his statement is irrefutable.
Mark thinks he's rich!!!!! Too funny!!! Hey Mark, when the "real class warfare" starts, everyone posting here will be on the same side!!! The POOR side. It's just that most redneck GOP members are too stupid to realize it yet. Hahahahahaha
It is so pathetic anymore, say anything that counters the right wing thought process and points out obvious defects in their non thinkiing and they immediately go to the one line come back, "Class Warfare". Most of these morons do not even know what it means all they do know is how to say it and think it means anything and to be honest they really do not have a clue.
Lol. High School shootings are just 'juvenile class warfare'. I get it.
Um. Go back to your talking points manual, please. This story is not about class warfare. You're supposed to froth (I use that word on purpose with you people) at the mouth about freedom and protecting yourself from the criminals and terrorists and maybe how if Obama doesn't become even more republican than he already is you might need your guns for second amendment solutions. Got it?
The distinction may lie more with ones who take care of a situation by themselves or ones who wait on someone else to do it. Not being poor or rich.
they have rights to own guns. they are scared to take a punch from a fellow(every one is a coward.. they need a gun for protection). i still believe schools are way safer than some streets in the east coast though less attention is paid.
You are an idiot. Take a punch? Try being tormented and tortured for years and so how rational you are. SToP making excuses for the bullies.
Right wing nuts find *any* excuse to blame liberals and excuse the unimpeded NRA campaign to put guns into the hands of just about anyone. The fact is, easy access to any sort of weapon is possible here and the end result is an appalling amount of slaughters which get expalined away by the crazy right-wingers.
Fist fights and hand to hand fighting are actually more dangerous than many people think. A 10 yr old died after a fight that was in the news. (I'm not saying arm 10 yr olds). But people should understand that fists are still dangerous and a handgun could be used to protect one's self. I don't agree that law abiding people should go to jail if criminals break into their gun safes. Thats not fair to law abiders. I think many gun owners don't realize how they put their right to own guns in jeopardy by leaving them so accessible to their kids when these tragedies occur. There always some left wingers that then think the guns should be taken away from everyone except the agents of the governments they want to rule over their lives. We need to respect the fragility of life but also our rights and freedoms we have in this country. When we allow the government to infringe on the rights they are not delicate in how they restrict. They usually infringe in broad strokes and seldom slacken when overreached.
Why don't you look up the story about the 10 year old girl that died this week after getting in a fist fight with a classmate. 10 years old, 1 punch, 1 bloody nose, and she was dead before the end of the day. The other 10 year old girl is being charged with HOMICIDE. Your statement is ridiculous.
I agree with the comments about gun control and you will not help by taking guns away from law abiding citizens. Criminals will never now or in the future comply with gun laws. Its silly. I do believe that if you are a parent, and you own guns, that you NEED to be held accountable for those guns plain and simple. There will be be people who say "oh it was stolen or taken without my consent-its not my fault" Listen-if own a gun and know how to shoot-you KNOW how to secure your guns in a way that only YOU can get them. If you leave it covered up on the top shelf of your closet-YOU should be held accountable. PERIOD. Kids cant go into a gun store and buy a gun. Know your kids-if there is a problem you know of, or you dont like who your kids hang out with COME ON! Be a parent! Be responsible for helping your child. There are always signs of distress...always if you know your child. Its just so sad that this boy thought the only way to help himself was to harm others. What makes a child want to harm another person in such a horrific way...I feel for him and his demons...I have two girls and two boys, one boy of which is going into highschool. I have been a parent, and have established a trust with him, and actually KNOW him. Im tired of parents not parenting and this ends up happening....
If so many law abiding citizens did not have guns so easily available for criminals to steal there would not be so many guns in the criminals hands to commit crimes with. Also, if every gun owner was required to own a gun safe to own a gun and had to keep them locked up and was sent to prison for 10 years any time one of his guns got into the hands of a criminal there would be far fewer guns in criminla hands. This whole concept that criminals will not comply with gun control is true. But most of the guns criminals have are stolen from the so called law abiding citizens who do not know how to control a deadly weapon they insist upon owning. Trust, me, criminals do NOT go to the local gun store to purchase their guns. Why should they? Go into any trailer park in America and any 2 out of 3 trailers has more guns than you will ever need.
@Don-that is what I was trying to say. The people who dont lock up guns the correct way-just make it easier for crimminals to get a hold of these guns...This is why legislation stating that if you own a gun-you need a safe to go WITH the permit would help a bit like you said.
The safe is a good idea, but what about people who use their gun for protection? What about farmers who keep their .22 on the table to keep the varmints down? It isn't always best to keep every gun in the house locked up. I agree with you 100% that it is a gun owner's responsibility to store his gun properly (when not in use), and that a parent needs to step up and be a parent. As a hunter, I've found one of the best ways to keep my kids from thinking guns are cool toys is to let them see the animals I've shot. Video games and movies might be gory, but they're fantasy. A deer hanging in the garage waiting to be butchered is tangibly real.
I realize not everyone is a hunter, and that some hunters aren't comfortable sharing the experience with their kids. Parents are individuals, as are their kids. Like you said, lesawithane, the important thing is to know your child. Be aware of what happens at school and who your child's friends are. Sadly, parental involvement isn't going to prevent every tragedy, but it will go a long way toward getting a child help before he strikes out.
Don, how often do criminals steal the guns of law-abiding citizens?
This shooting is news because such a shooting is rare. Why don't you suggest that we control automobiles more stringently? Many more people are killed by automobile than by gun.
I agree that it is the PARENTS RESPONSIBILITY to teach their children right from wrong and proper gun handling procedures. My family has owned guns since before I was born and I can remember that even at 3 years old I could look at the weapons in the gun cabinet (not lockable) but not touch them unless an adult was present and gave me permission. We were all taught that guns are NOT toys. I NEVER took any of those weapons out of the cabinet or to school. My family would have figuratively killed me.
Law abiding citizens are only law abiding until they pick up a gun and shoot somebody for some stupid reason. The law abiding citizen argument is smoke screen propaganda by the NRA.
Funny how gun nut jobs go on and on about how gun laws or restrictions wont make a diff...
But .. when we look at it. The other countries like UK etc who are strict have WAY WAY WAY less gun violence then us.
So... how can u say it wont do a thing.. when its been proven OVER AND OVER it does..
I agree with a good portion of your comments but there comes with all these guns everywhere a kick-ass mentality all too often on the part of the parents who are the gun owners. Their parenting technique probably goes along the same lines. We also assume that they know enough about proper firearm use to keep them secure...I suspect in most cases they likely don't! I also wonder to what extent these gun owners are liable for the harm caused by their weapons; we may need to get something done to insure this. I also wonder if the school teachers and others are observing/evaluating, even informally, a kid's visible "mental stability" – the way they do about impropper dress, etc., this might help since often these kids have plenty of signals that there's potential problems brewing. Just some random thoughts. Another sad event.
Keep your guns in the safe while you are gone. Take them out when you get home. Simple. You make the CHOICE to own a gun, you keep it safe. If you lose it and someone uses it in a crime, YOU SHOULD DO THE TIME.
I am ALL for RESPONSIBLE gun ownership.
I have just NEVER seen it.
I mostly agree w/the anti-gun ban folks...mostly. Law abiding gun owners are not the problem (usually) BUT...there are an awful lot of guns floating around out there. There has to be a way to reduce that number and keep better track of things so they don't end up in the wrong hands. Guns are easy and make impulsive violence easy. Yes, the UK does not have much gun violence but they have an awful lot of knife (and boot) violence. Humans are violent and will use the tools at hand.
Law abiding citizens don't need guns. Guns for "self defence" are useless: more lifes are taken by guns bought for "self-defence" than saved. Do you really think a burglar, who always comes unexpected, will give you the time to go and get your gun? You could only get it quickly when you have it next to your bed, loaded. But then again, that is why so many "accidents" happen with guns. Almost every day, we read about children killing other children in the US with daddy's loaded gun. And a teenager who wants to cause a bloodbath in a school can only make lots of victims with a gun; with a knife, you could never make that much victims before being stopped. "Guns don't kill, people do" is a lame excue: many killings and murders would not happen if the killer didn't have a gun at his disposal.
You are right the 1% create jobs in foreign country's so they can build there already inflated bank accounts while ruining this country from the ground up!!! Mitt has never worked a real job in his pampered life. He doesn't compare with the working man.....he couldn't take it!!!
Companies would rather outsource than take initiative in creating a healthy work environment. The "job creators" are casting judgement on everyone, but themselves for creating a unhealthy work environment. What do they care, just find them "yes men" that will use violence in the middle of no-where. This way it wont make the headlines.
Let's face it–
The US is the number one producer of arms (weapons),
our children watch so much TV and video games (much of which is filled with violence),
and our legislators serve the interests of the lobbyists, who represent the arms industry,
rather than represent the interest s of the people they have sworn to serve and protect!
I've got two words for you....GUN CONTROL. Duh!!!! I am so lucky to live in Canada
Now, now, O'Canadian, don't forget about your serial murder the pig farmer and the Greyhound bus-riding decapitator, just to name a few.
Yes, so very lucky:
http://rt.com/usa/news/jail-sansone-gun-waterloo-333/
If guns are outlawed, only outlaws will have guns. Duh
Yes you are lucky to live in Canada. You don't have to pay for a military, and you can relax knowing that if a foreign country tries to invade you, then big brother USA will come to your rescue.
Gun control is not a ban. Just TAKE RESPONSIBILITY. You right-wing gun nuts are all about personal responsibility when it is SOMEBODY ELSE. Now YOU take responsibility. If your gun gets used in a crime, YOU DO THE TIME.
Kls817 – And if widgets are outlawed, only outlaws will have widgets. See how truly meaningless that old saying is?
"If guns are outlawed, only outlaws will have guns": true. But when they know you don't have a gun, they will be less eager to kill you with their gun. An armed criminal only gets really dangerous when he's facing an armed victim. So, when I hear a burglar come into our house, I try to call 911 and if that's not possible, hide under the sheets and pretend I'm sleeping. But NO WAY I would wave a gun in the face of an armed burglar! Remember: those who live by the sword, will perish by the sword. This is also true for guns, as we can read daily in articles about shootings in the US, where even little children kill each other with daddy's gun.
Your right Tammy, we are very lucky to live in a place where I don't have to worry about my children's friends shooting them with there parents gun. To reply to the pig farmer. We have a couple of serial killers where as you have hundreds. To the person who mentioned our military. The only reson why were in Afganistan is to help you. We have never had to ask anyone to fight our battles. We are a peaceful neighbourhood living next door to trailer trash.
To kis817 first of all Canada never needed the BigAmerica as you called it. US always asked Canada to support them in their war and invasion in other countries. We don't need US to help us but you need us. Since WWI. and secondly the reason for all those shooting in US is americans always had a problem to control their anger, you people will need to control your anger and also need yo know how to mind your own business. That would make a huge favor to a lot of Countries around the world. And don't come telling me that we didn't had any mass shooting in Canada, yes we had, in the last 100 years probably not more than 10. But in US just in the last 10 years you people had hundreds of them.
We also have a trade surplus with you Americans. Keep buying our oil.
WHY? Perhaps it's because of our wonderful christian evangelical NRA gun culture of hatred and bigotry and macho crap that's propagated by hypocritical politicians and greedy pastors.
so true.
Ditto.
THE FAMILY WITH VALUES HAS GONE SOUTH SINCE IN MY MEMORY AT A VERY EARLY AGE-10 MAYBE. AS I WENT THRU THAT TIME AND TO THIS DAY I HAVE SEEN THOSE VALUES ERODE. I MIGHT ADD THAT IT WAS NOT CLOSE TO HOME. FREINDS AND THOSE IN THE NEWS WERE LOSING ALL THAT A FAMILY SHOULD NEVER LOSE–A MOTHER,
A FATHER,SIS,.AND BROTHER. WE AS A NATION HAVE LOST THE BASIC'S OF A FAMILY THAT PRODUCES VALUES
THAT SUSTAIN A PRODUCTIVE SOCIETY. WE HAVE PROPOGATED A GOVERNMENT THAT IN THEIR WAY HAVE
TAKEN ADVANTAGE OF OUR WEAKNESS AND DECIDED THAT THEY IN A FEABLE WAY THAT THEY MUST DO TO US
A GREAT HARM. "THEY WILL DO FOR US THAT TIME HAS NOT. WE WILL MAKE YOU A SLAVE TO THEIR GOALS,GIVE TO US ALL THAT WE DO NOT HAVE NOW. WHETHER WE ASK OR NOT. THAT'S LIKE GIVING DRUGS TO
THE KIDS ON THE STREET. WE NEED TO RETURN TO THE BASICS–DO YOUR OWN RESEARCH–THE CLOCK IS TICKING. I WISH YOU ALL WELL AND A HAPPY FAMILY FOR THIS GRAT NATION.
Why do you have to shout to get your point across?
*** HUSBAND AND FATHER OF FIVE
THE FAMILY WITH VALUES HAS GONE SOUTH SINCE IN MY MEMORY AT A VERY EARLY AGE-10 MAYBE. AS I WENT THRU THAT TIME AND TO THIS DAY I HAVE SEEN THOSE VALUES ERODE. I MIGHT ADD THAT IT WAS NOT CLOSE TO HOME. FREINDS
Husband and father of five.....and you cant even spell "friend" ?
Why do i think you are 8 years old ?
Turn the Caps Lock off.
It's very telling that people would respond to this comment with criticism. This is one of the things that aggravates the problem highlighted in the article; people would rather condemn than try to understand. As a result we end up in confrontation. Our "role models" in life – teachers, parents, political leaders – are missing in action. The very people who should help us to understand one another and to build social skills, are guilty of derilection of duty. What are we left with? Hollywood, TV, video games, and socially-inept friends, relatives, neighbors, and classmates. Growing up in this cynical world has become very lonely and scary.
Listen to theoldcheif.....
if it wasnt guns , it be pipe bombs , or knifes , please egt off teh gun kick . Guns protect
I'm surprised you looked away from Fox news long enough to type that!
Rizzo – nice line, stopped shining your guns to type this while waiting for someone to trepass on your property to let them have it. Small minded people like yourself love guns, thus, America has a rate of violence more than 10 times that of any other developed civilized nation on earth.
I guess it's the Republican way of population control since contraceptives are so anti-religious.
Here's your new slogan "More guns and less pills and condoms" ! Is that mindless enough for you?
Here is my line:
If your gun is used in a crime, YOU GO TO PRISON.
Not GUN CONTROL, but GUN OWNER CONTROL!
BS. That is the biggest false logic. If the criminals have two guns ... then I need more .... etc. BS. If all guns had to be stored in a vault at the police station and then checked out to use for hunting, and then back in after hunting, maybe we could control gun use.
Something is deeply wrong in the USA soiciety. Kids, Dogs and drunk know it.
Time for somebody to listen or not
It's 21 century, it's not 19 century, It's not Wild West, need to be changed,
NO Sympathy
There is also the first grader that stabbed kids with a syringe. The kids that try to poison the teachers soda cans and tell the principal "yes we were trying to kill her." The kindergartner that stabbed class mates with scissors. The kid that exposed himself to the class in first grade, in second grade, in third grade... he's all grown up in jail now.
Teachers are alone in a classroom with 15 to 30 kids. ALONE
If a child gets stabbed with scissors, does the teacher provide immediate medical attention to the hurt child, try to physically disarm the attacker (with "appropriate force" of course), or run down the hall calling for help?
Kids are socially mandated to be separated from their parents, go to a government run facility that provides little to no security, put in a class room with juveniles who are not held accountable for any violence they commit. Special ed students cannot be expelled for fighting. NCLB. Just suspension, a day off to put those knuckles on ice and get ready for the next opportunity to pound someone.
That is why no one is shocked or confused when they see movies and TV shows depicting bullying or kids with guns in schools.
Its common. Its there every day. Like the socks your spouse won't put in the laundry hamper. You look away, sometimes get annoyed, but do nothing.
What's worse, that I learned recently, is that special ed kids can file for and get their expulsions expunged from their records. This means a kid has done something serious enough to get thrown out of a district, he gets only two weeks out, his record gets expunged, he goes into a new room, school and district. The teacher and kids have no right to know that he was expelled nor what he did so they can watch out for it. Do you know what it takes to get expelled these days? And we have no right to know? Not safe.
And 15-30 kids? I have between 26 (this is considered a 'remedial small group' ) and 39 depending on the time of day.
Many of the concerns that you express are due to unfortunate budgeting issues. If the school systems had more money then they would be able to have more manageable classroom sizes. Which would make it easier to control those rare (few and far between) kids who are behavior problems. You are not mandated to put your child in a government building, there is home schooling, or many private or charter options in most parts of the country. Finally, most of the kids who are offenders are NOT in special education, those are the kids who are getting some mental health support. It is the mainstream kids with the behavior problems and the chronic victims that do not get the mental health support that they need, likely because of lack of mental health availability in the schools or parents who have blinders on.
more guns
less prescription dugs
Fewer guns, total accountability of the permit holder and access to healthcare for those who need it.
I can smell the conservative stink coming right out of your post, bilderberg. I'm not a liberal either. I'm a rational.
Totally agree. Guns don't kill people. People on mind altering meds with guns kill people. Proven time and time again.
Please give me grenades and land mines. Why can't I have those too for protection???
It's cause there aint enough guns and there are too many laws.....TEAMERICA
Yep, just what we need... more guns. Everyone should own at least a dozen...
Don't blam guns, blame stupid inbred parents who don't keep their guns LOCKED.
Whoooo-hooooo! We're #1! We're #1! Ha ha ha, take THAT China! Looooooosers!
You never see a massacre at a gun show, do you? Columbines and Virginia Techs will continue to occur as long as responsible, sane adults are not allowed to carry guns on school grounds. One or two armed faculty or staff members could have saved dozens of lives at VT. We have let politicians decide that the Second Amendment doesn't apply at school, and as long as that is allowed to stand, criminals, terrorists, and crazy people will take advantage of "victim disarmament zones" to commit mayhem. Remember ... when seconds count, the police are only minutes away.
Bang, bang, bang! The Wild West lives yet!
Get real. More guns equals safer? You must be INSANE.
Yes, people (who have prob never taken a basic gun safety/target course) firing at will in enclosed public spaces is an excellent idea! How come you are not king of everything!!!
"Lyntoon" and "StevenR" are the onsane ones here.
There are more guns on American streets today than ever before. Millions of ordinary people are carrying concealed pistols every day thanks to "shall issue" permit laws in 40 states. And the violent crime rate is DOWN, not up.
The murder rate in the US is at its LOWEST in decades. DOWN over 52% since the 1990s, despite a roll-back of gun control laws at the Federal level and in almost all of the states.
Gun accidents are at an all time record LOW.
MORE guns and LESS crime. Not a theory: a FACT.
This was a very well written article. In response to all the people on this post, however, I wanted to add my two cents to the gun control issue. I agree that EASY access to guns is part of the problem, but someone already broke the law by allowing that kid to have a handgun as he was under 21. Unless the real issues are addressed, talking about gun control in this context is meaningless. The real tragedy here is the breakdown of the family (this child's in particular). If we need something to cry about, cry about the effect of post-modernism on our children. When children are brought into a world with no moral code and no hope, you end up with this. Before you go ranting on about how we need to eliminate guns in this country, look in the mirror and ask yourself what have you done to provide the next generation with a reason for living past perpetuating American capitalism.
I could not have said it better myself. There is little accountability in today's society. Kids run amuck with no respect for authority. Parents, on the other hand, are too busy keeping up with the Jones' to care about what bothers their children most of the time. They would rather buy them the latest gadget then to sit down and spend quality time. We are a society dominated by instant gratification, brand names and the superficial lives of celebrities. When you can't keep up with what society deems popular, you fall behind and end up being bullied and victimized. We need to go back to simpler times.
You idiots are babbling over gun laws and children are dying. Disgusting
FORCE YOUR SCHOOLS TO SUSPEND BULLIES.HIRE A HALLWAY MONITOR TO KEEP THEIR EYES ON BULLIES..BULLIES ARE EASY TO SPOT, THEY ARE ALWAYS RUNNING THEIR MOUTH.
AMEN!
Where is the mental health support for these kids, before they fall apart?
Lack of access to weapons is NOT the key, and gun control is NOT the answer. The "key" is responsilbility and accountability. As I said in an earlier post, our "role models" in life – teachers, parents, political leaders – are missing in action. The very people who should help us to understand one another and to build social skills, are guilty of derilection of duty. What are we left with? Hollywood, TV, video games, and socially-inept friends, relatives, neighbors, and classmates. Growing up in this cynical world has become very lonely and scary, and violence like this will continue until we ALL take responsibility as social animals that must coexist, and be held accountable to one another for the things we do here at the top of the food chain.
Great idea! Let's pass a law that requires people to be more responsible!! That would be a lot easier than regulating gun sellers.
It is interesting that a Psych wrote this article because his type are likely the cause of this: Nearly every school shooting and other seemingly motiveless group shooting has two very distinct factors: The obvious one is guns are available but the key one is that the shooter is on or has recently been on mind controlling medications. Not street drugs. Something given to "help" the person. You will either see this info in the initial report or later on at the trial or something. It may even be "he was diagnosed as having ADD" which nearly always means he/she was put on meds.
As to the argument that if we took guns away from citizens only the criminals would have them, what do the criminals in other countries with stricter gun laws use? I do not see any evidence that their citizens are being killed or put helplessly in harms way any more than we are here in America (and I am talking about countries with similar lifestyles and socio-economic status as the US, like the UK, not countries such as Afghanistan that are not truly comparable). The lack of guns in those countries hasn't resulted in their law-abiding citizens being sitting ducks, as the pro-gun argument would have you believe. I also find it somewhat ironic that people who might otherwise take any possible measure to ensure that a fetus doesn't get aborted won't take any possible measure to make sure a born child isn't shot to death.
Humans are violent monkeys and will use what is at hand so..in countries w/o guns it will be knives, machetes, sticks, etc...Guns however, do make it quick and effective (you can take out more at once that you can w/a knife). However, we have a "cat out of the bag" scenario in the US in that there are piles of existing weapons already deployed. Even if all gun manufacture and import ended tomorrow, there would still be plenty to go around for the forseeable future.
As a Russian with substantial US experience I'd say one word:
"GUNS."
Their availability also affect the "culture".
Not "violent computer games"...
Not "mental illnesses" etc...
It started with CULTURE some 200 years ago. But then GUNS' availability started affecting the culture. Now it's all intermixed.
Americans, DO SOMETHING ABOUT HANDGUNS!!!
No one needs a HANDGUN for "hunting" – it's USELESS against ducks and dears. People use RIFLES and SHOTGUNS (19th century style) for hunting in Russia and the rest of the world – those are more than adequate to take a dear or moose down. Not something you can conceal in your freaking pocket! Go figure...
The handgun was designed to kill PEOPLE. (Come on! How may "sudden bear or tiger attacks" does the average human have to sustain per year? Just common sense.)
Russia has a higher rate of violent crime and murder than the US.
The murder rate in Russia is 15 per 100,000 persons. More than THREE TIMES AS HIGH as the 4.7 per 100,000 in the US last year.
Whatever Russia is doing, it's not anything we want here.
Sirs: I believe the statement on "Why..." American schools lead in shooting crimes... etc. is very misleading. The Madras schools and the policies of Arab countries controlled by Muslim policies kill more students by far than the "nut cases" in America. If you wish to gather the statistics in Afganistan, and several remote areas in Pakistan, you'll find "official" slaughter of any progressive schools teaching in the "Western tradition". So, I don't believe you... PERIOD.
Did you even read the article? He's referring to school shootings that are carried out by psychologically disturbed teens not religious nut jobs.
@Dan: Same deal, just a different name for the same issue.
Hey, I wonder whether the fact that the US is number one in such shootings has anything to do with the fact that the US is the number one producer of arms (weapons), whether it has anything to do with the fact that our children watch so much TV (much of which is filled with violence), and whether , and whether it has anything to do with the fact that our legislators serve the interests of the lobbyists, who represent the arms industry, rather than represent the interest s of the people they have sworn to serve and protect!
because anglos have a gene in them that predisposes them to mass murders....
African-American males commit over half of the murders in the US.
Does that mean Blacks have a gene that predisposes a very great number of them to murder people? Is it better if they're only killing one or two people at a time?
America != Anglos
Wipe that thought out of your mind.
You can, but it would cost more.
Because we have too many guns and too many cowboys. No guns = No gun violence. It is mathematically perfect and factually correct. When are the 85% of the country not fascinated with guns going to reign the children (gunners and the NRA) in?
That's a conceited and narrow point of view. Actually, that's a disarming point of view. Whether you want it or not, the very reason for weaponry held by civilians is for protection. It wasn't until the 20th century that the concept of owning weapons only for hunting purposes even came into existence. (yes, I realize you didn't mention the hunting aspect, I figured I'd nip that in the bud before it became a conversation piece)
There is no "LOL OMG liek do xyz and it fixez everything!!!~@ duhh!~!~@" approach to this. In fact, it's so many miniscule things that have changed, and I nor you can put our hands on one aspect that controls it all.
That being said, since I can count the number of school shootings that have occurred in America in the last 20 years, and the fact that America's population count is 450 million, I'm thinking it's a fine tuning and not a crowed mass hysteria.
Blame the inanimate object, don't blame the parents who kept firearms somewhere that could be accessed without their knowledge by a mentally disturbed 15-year-old.
Your gun laws DUH!!!!! aw Americans...so dumb.
Remember. Guns don't kill people – the reported death of those children is a fabrication of the liberal news media. As the NRA crime lobby keeps telling us, the solution is not to remove the guns from the hands of children, it is to arm all children so they can defend themselves.
Yea just like the little 10 year old girl that was killed by her class mate using only her fists. D*m guns!
There is not a politician in the world who does as much for society as an engineer. All politicians provide is hot air and we already have enough global warming. BTW ... As much as I am disappointed with President Obama, the last administration thought it was good that our largest export is jobs. The economy was in collapse as they left because they ignored it.
The headline is almost as stupid is our nation's obsession with guns. The NRA will spin this like they always do...but they aren't sticking up for your liberties, it is all about money. How can anyone sleep – that supports the rabid proliferation of guns in this country – when there are literally thousands of victims who die because of this ridicuous situation. My heart goes out to those families and friends who have lost a loved one.
Swiss are 2nd in gun ownership. Yes. You forgot to mention the 2:1 ratio in ownership. We have more guns by a HUGE margin.
Simple Reason : Gun Gun Gun Gun Gun
mitt romney will ask his nascar team owner friends what to do... santorum will declare schools forced education against the bible and newt will push for more shootings so kids will quit school and get a job
because guns are availible and bullies are targets !!! i say survival of the fittest , and the bullies are the weak ones !!!!
The Truth About School Violence is a good book that talks about all the different components rather than blaming any one facet.
It all comes down to one thing – the moral decline of society.
Are you being sarcastic, or are you just plain looney?
PS, consider apostrophes...
You realize many politicians that are members of that 1% that are making decisions to rule your life are Democrats?
This is an answer to all the replies and not only to jal. Go to YouTube. Type "CARMAN" and listen to his song "AMERICA AGAIN". I hope that that song will answer many questions that are wirling around
As someone who lived through Columbine, I will tell you its not because of bullying, or guns. People will always kill each other. But America leads in this category for one reason: 0 tolerance policies. Kids are punished excessively for school fights; 30 years ago, you would have 2 kids throw down in the gymnasium, and after it was over, you would shake hands and disregard your differences. Now...kids feel helpless, because if they fight back, they are arrested. We have raised our kids to be a bunch of sissy's who cant stand up for themselves without government intervention. THE GOVERNMENT IS TO BLAME. PROZAC AND THE PHARMACEUTICAL COMPANIES WHO FUND DRUGS WHO DRIVE PEOPLE INSANE ARE TO BLAME.
seems like your traumatic experience left some permanent damage. I'd advice a psych consultation..
Now that right there folks, was an intelligent comment.^^^^^^Everyone look above^^^^ we have a true scholar right here. Grow up.
I've read this months ago, and this comment is the only thing that I can wholly agree with on WHY this keeps happening.
StevenR
It's the guns. Here you go "responsible" gun owners. How about IF YOU DO NOT SECURE YOUR GUN AND IT GETS USED IN A CRIME, YOU DO THE TIME.
I am SICK AND TIRED of idiotic gun owners saying "I left it on the coffee table and it got stolen so I am not responsible". YOU ARE RESPONSIBLE! Keep your G.D. guns OUT OF THE HANDS OF CHILDREN AND CRIMINALS OR YOU ARE RESPONSIBLE.
I am all for RESPONSIBLE GUN OWNERSHIP, I just have NEVER SEEN IT!
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How many of your friends that hang out with you at the Tofu bar are gun owners? Sounds like you know nothing of gun owners. Myself, I am a Liberal who owns guns. it is easy to hate what you fear and do not understand and use it as a scapegoat.
So by that token, if your car is stolen and used by a drunk driver to hit a bus full of school children killing half, you should be punish to the same extent as the driver since you did not do enough to secure your car. "But I locked it". Did you put a steering wheel locking device on it? Did you put a tire boot locking device on it? No? Then you could have done more. What if one of your kids take a kitchen knife and guts the bully at school? Should you be held responsible since you allow you child access to the deadly weapon? how about when your little Timmy snags the full bottle of ibuprofen since his little girlfriend has been having headaches and she take too many and her liver fails and she dies? The possibilities are endless. Raise your kids to have respect and have compassion or their fellow humans. Case closed not FO!
Since strawman analogies are abound I ask you this: if I hack into your computer and transfer money from another persons bank account into an offshore account with the use of said computer, are you responsible?
Yes, it has quite a bit of similarity, since you need to learn how to keep your computer safe and secure yet accessible.
I agree with that! Mitt's the pitt.
And given that we don't give teens permission to drive cars without a license, why not license teens before they can "drive" a gun to school or anywhere for that matter? See a kid with a gun, hey where's your license? Then duck.
another liberal hack who will never get it. Blame guns and everything else but failing to recognize the truth. CNN and their like (liberal democrats) have been for taking prayer and sound Biblical principles away from our kids for 40 years.. you now are reaping what you sow. you laugh all you want to but when Jesus comes back you will see the Son of God in all his glory.
whoa.. buddy.. what?
easy... we're talking about real world things here, let's not get all nutty. btw, liberal != anti-gun.
All of these issues can be found in other developed societies, except the access to guns. It is the single obvious reason this happens. I have lived in a number of countries and the US is unique in this respect. The parents of these kids take no responsibility; they are not accountable. The other day a 3rd grader in Texas brought a loaded gun to school. Nothing will happen to the parents. What is wrong with these people?
One more thing, Americans love their guns and are addicted to violence. Watch the boob tube, it's like the Roman games broadcast 24 hours a day. Look at the movie heroes, from singing cowboys to the latest gun toting macho men. The society is so steeped in it they can't see life without it, some posters here equate anti gun posters as being weak. Sad to stay but stupidity is going to keep America from any change anytime soon, we're just a step above those cultures who shoot machine guns into the air at birthdays and weddings and if there were no laws against that I'm sure it would be happening in every city.
@JP: it's obvious you aren't American, nor have been in America. You're basing American culture and living from mainstream entertainment/television broadcasts.
Love it.
The problem is gun legislation. The supreme court has deemed that God gave us the right to own guns, just as the founding fathers deemed God gave us the right to own human beings. Flawed reasoning, flawed results.
In civilized countries like Australia, when they have a single massacre, they outlaw guns, as they did in 1996. Problem solved.
Until we as a culture decide that we need to get rid of all guns that are not used actively for hunting purposes, we will be condemned to this sort of horror.
You can look for warning signs, do psychological analyses, you name it... until we take guns away, we will continue to see these headlines.
Obviously there are occurrences that can be singled out in other countries, but I would imagine that America has more gun violence than the rest of our allies put together.
Can we look at the involvement of parental units at home? Both Mom and Dad are working full time to pay bills and children have no guidance at home. This isnt a gun control problem. This is a problem with what is going on in America. Other countries dont have it this bad because other countries are there for their children. We just ignore them until something bad happens for the most part.
It's VERY simple.
We've outlawed corporal punishment and now our children have nothing to fear.
It can't get any simpler than that.
Ask yourself when all of this kind of insane behavior started.
President Obama is to blame.
Actually, it is because gas prices are rising.
Just kidding, it is because we don't have nationalized health care.
Wow, it is fun to make completely irrelevant news the culprit.
Enough blaming the 1%. After all, they're 1%. I bet you think the US would never have debt/deficit if it just had more money.
We are #1 because of 'ZERO Tolerance" These kids are so suppressed, this is the ONLY avenue left for them. DUH! Let them take it out back and settle the issues, like we did a few years ago. 9 out of 10 they will walk away renewed friends and the problem settled and no one is KILLED. Nothing will come of it but a few bumps and bruises. These idiot school officials are to BLAME for every child killed in schools, past, present and future.
OMG Sarah,
I don't even know if your pathetic narrative deserves a response. Should we have the schools schedule a specific time of the day for fights with those we can't get along with or should they just be allowed to leave the classroom whenever they want to and go beat the tar out of each other?
if anyone in school now days even gets bumped into or looked at the wrong way the parents are usually calling the principal before midnight demanding that the other kid be disciplined. Maybe our parenting and the examples that we set for our children in people skills and positive social interactions should be put under the microscope.
No we should not, they did not do this years ago. The students took it upon themselves to handle this. But know they are suppressed to a point of bringing a GUN to school and KILLING each other. Now what was your comment in regards to my pathetic narrative?
Why are there so many people who claim that knives are just as effective as guns? How do you kill somebody twenty feet away with a knife? This argument is always about "If you take away guns, they will use knives, or spatulas, or bats? So this 16 year old kid in Ohio and others like him are going to become expert knife throwers? Even if they could throw ten knives accurately in 20 seconds, they wouldn't do as much damage to skulls or torsos as a gun. Potential victims can hide behind a desk or even a window because the energy in a thrown knife is so much less than a bullet. Handheld knife attacks in a classroom could be easily defended by multiple people and running is an option too. Knives are nowhere near as effective as a gun unless you get the hand-held knife very close someone's body. It's a loosing argument, but gun lovers keep making it.
sigh.. knives are not the only choice. Actually, knives are better for close quarters combat than guns. There are a myriad of ways to kill large numbers of people at once. Handheld weapons are only one concept. Humans are weak, it's not hard... the problem is having the desire to do it. THAT is the problem.
there are other effective method beside using knife and you don't even need guns.
1.learned to drive your parent's car (in my city's car crashed record one SUV kill 15 people bystander)
2.Molotov grenade. (ingredients only need unleaded fuel +bottle+handkerchief which are plenty available)
3.Acid vial from the schools chemical lab (favorite weapon of some men in Mid East to destroy their wives' faces)
4.the last one is Gas leaked bomb just need lighter and big wrench find the gas source in the school broke their pipe and light them up (boom)
See no need guns and any fanciful weapon but can cause lot of victim and damage.
I just saying that if people want to kill someone he/she will always find a way to it even without guns.
Look at what is on TV and in the movies in this country. GUNS and violence.
Look at how depression is treated – anti-depressants that create as side effects, anger, suicidal tendencies and violent behavior.
These two factors say a lot about why America is on top for violence in and out of schools.
there number 1 in school shootings because...............duh america has to be the best at everything. Havnt you heard?
babababababababababbaabbaba bird bird bird is the word!!!
The swiss people all have automatic weapons in their home. The children there are not shooting up the schools. If you own a gun, lock it up. Trigger locks, gun safe, whatever works. Its your gun, and there is some amount of responsibility there. If your child takes your gun and shoots up a school, well how did they get the gun? You cannot help stolen property, but you can control what is yours.
Countries with more gun controls have fewer problems with school shootings. This may not be a popular thing to say , but the truth is the truth. My father had hunting rifles and I'm not anti guns – however, we as country apparently don't try hard enough to keep them out of the hands of our kids. The owner of the gun used in this and any other shooting involving juveniles should go on trial with the under age shooter.
Most of you are crazy. Guns are not the problem. If every honest American carried they would be less crime. If you look at states that have implemented carry permits, as the number of permits goes up, the crime rate goes down. More innocent people are killed by carless and drunk drivers then by guns. I don't see anyone trying to ban alchol or stop giving drivers licenses to idiots.
In America, everyone has the right to go to school no matter how many issues they have or how violent they are. If we kicked the bads kids out of school we would have less issues. If our schools focused on education instead of sports we would have less issues.
If it were not for Americans with guns, the whole world would be speaking German. Guns are not the issue, bad people are the issue. If it wasn't a gun, it would be a knife, or a stick, or something else.
Those of you from other countries that do not like us Americans, stop taking our money, military support, and stand on your own two feet. Maybe then we could we could afford more police offers and train out teaching staff better.
We don't take your money, you are selling your oil and gas to other countries to make money, you're the one who takes ours. We stand on our feet, we don't use your military, you are on a constant search to which country you will invade next, and then you asked other countries to help supporting you. Wake up. No one needs you but you need help.
All cases so far, children been on medication either ADD or Anti depression. do some research before you speak...
Why is America #1 in school murders? well they are terrible in all basic forms of education compared to the rest of the world, so they strove to reach the goal of being #1 at something, so they chose something they are good at-murder.
Since we seem to be of opinion that guns are the reason, although having had them in the house and around the house as children and with children, I have never seen seen one get up and threaten anyone. This leads me to belive it sits more in the education and personal accountability area. If we are signaling out things, more people are killed by cars than guns, fire kills many as well. We should outlaw matches and automobiles just to be sure. But why stop there....
I dunno...could it be that Jesus prefers having guns to revering young human lives? I mean, if santorum is right (pun) then young people should just be used for target practice since education is a "no-no". Haven't the catholic priests proved that point over and over?
we have training issues. both men and women, but it shows up as a problem earlier for boys.
http://mitworld.mit.edu/video/729
and we aren't giving kids a language to deal with trauma.
Anger, plain and simple. Everyone is mad about something. Look how polarized the country is getting. There is no middle ground anymore. DC is the best example, or worst, depending on how you look at it.
This has nothing to do with guns. It has to do with a kid who was bullied and cracked...If it wasn't a gun, it could have been a baseball bat, poison, kitchen knife, etc.
It shocked me that this article stated the boys that were involved in the Columbine shooting, Dylan and Eric, were NOT bullied. I am hoping (and praying) that this was a huge typo because I know first hand that those boys were tortured day in and day out at the hands of several other students. No bullying will ever exscuse the act of killing, HOWEVER, to dismiss what those two went through, and to say that they just woke up one day hating the world is not only false, but just straight APPALLING! I read CNN news on a daily basis and it disgusts me that such a well known and well accredited journalist news source would post such a thing. Bullying is REAL. And kids around the U.S. are affected daily by the abuse of bullies. It is our lack of understanding and articles like this that truly keep the world of bullying go round.
Metal detectors should be installed at all schools with limited entrances and many exits...like the airports. Kids are at school to learn and should not have to wonder if the wierd, depressed, emo screamo guy next to him/her is packin'.
But then I'm for school uniforms and school ending at 5pm. I know kids want to express themselves and all that crap but all it does is give better/cooler dressed kids more ammo to bully or tease. Plus the purple hair has to go...who can focus on a lecture with a guy wearing a purple mohawk sitting in front of you? Maybe I'm old fashioned or watched too much brady bunch or Ozzy and Harriet...but something needs to give. We are going backwards as a society...
Of the 10 worst, only 3 were in the U.S., and 3 were in Europe. You gave examples of Russia and Israel but those two incidents were perpetrated by external terrorists, while many of the U.S. incidents were perpetrated by students. This is a significant difference if you're asking why it happens.
Surely you jest. I mean, anyone with pea sized brain knows that Romney hasn't worked in years. His money works for him. He's living off his investments and stockpiling it under his wife's name and in non-taxable trust funds for his sons, who I might add look to be just about the right age to serve our country.
"Despite rumors to the contrary, the Columbine killers were not bullied."
-Are you serious? Have you no knowledge whatsoever of the shooting? Eric Harris and Dylan Klebold were both bullied that's why they targeted anyone wearing a white hat. Listen to the interviews given by the then-students of Columbine High School and you'll see very clearly that bullying/revenge was the motivating factor.
I agree with David. The whole world had learned after Columbine that those perpetrators were bullied. Bullying is found all over the world. Let's start there. He who says no, is a liar. I was bullied in Communist Poland after World War Two ... by members of the Hitlerjugend admitted to my school after the war ended. I speak from experience.There is ione cause for bullying in peace time (war or prison time is different), and that is: lack of swift exemplary punishment! The authorities in schools have self-castrated! They need to respons not with lectures and seminars on bullying, but with an instant whipping on the bare ass of the bully caught, in front of the entire school! End of the story of bullying! No other remedy is possible in the world because of the fouled human nature. All "other" remedies will be "too little too late"!!
Mitt Romney is a tool.
What's this about Mitt Romney working? Did not see any evidence of wages on his tax forms.
Perhaps you are referring to missionary, lobbying, or charitable activities?
Just another prime example of our famous "Gun-Free Zone". It happens to be a "Free Gun Zone" for those who choose to take advantage of the law. Why don't we get our heads out of the sand????? The law-abiding armed citizen is supposed to stand by and let this happen...where are the sheepdogs? I know where the sheople are...
Did any of the anti-gun nuts see the story about the 10 year old girl that died after getting into a fist fight with a classmate? 10 years old, 1 punch, 1 bloody nose, and she was dead before the day was thru. But guns are the problem, right? Where's your push to ban 10 year old kids?
my son was bullied today a bully got in his face and pushed him, the bully got punched in the stomach by my son. now my son is suspended and the bully gets no punishment cause the teachers didnt see nothing .how long can we make our children run to the teachers when being bullied and nothing be done about it, and when they finally get tired of it they defend there self and get suspended i think fighting back is the only way to prevent a biuld up over time of being bullied and then finally kids loose it and cant take it no more and lash out in a major way. im glad my son is defending his self cause the teachers arent doing enough. my son had fear of this boy but not anymore
The answer is easy. Because the majority of people in this country have no education and mis-interpret the second amendment (including the majority of the supreme farce). Individuals are NOT a militia for crap's sake. We still think it's the 1800's wild west.
Anti-gun commenters: if you had a gun, would you go shoot someone? Answer should be no, therefore the ownership of guns isn't the issue. If you didn't care about other people, desperately wanted to rob someone, had no fear of God, etc would you shoot someone? Probably yes, and so those are the reasons. But, how to the "non likey to shoot someone" people protect them selves from the other? I don't know. Did people go on shooting rampages in the 50's? How are we changing that this is becoming more common?
These students have mental problems & they need to be addressed before they act out & kill. We need to have guns less available to students.
What's wrong with our education system that we aren't made more aware of our students mental states????
What is with Americans and their guns? If your spineless politicians would stand up to the NRA and get some tough gun control laws passed, maybe kids wouldn't be killing each other at school. Also, your 2nd amendment uses the phrase " a well regulated militia" – to me that could be the National Guard. Nowhere does it say that its citizens need semi and full automatic weapons in their hall closets.
Go live in Iran.Hitler took away Germany's guns and look what happend.
It is simple in the USA groups like the NRA,armed militia's in every State and the Worship of the misguided Second amendment has lead to wholesale slaughter in our Rural, City, streets homes, schools etc. The death toll is higher than in any other Nation on Earth. Yet the "spineless legislators" in the states and congress are afraid to act in a responsible manner when it comes to the wholesale easy availability of firearms on every street corners. Sue the members of Congress and the NRA for the lose of loved ones.
We are a product of our environment which teaches kids that if it feels good, do it. Also, we teach our kids that we came from apes as you see so often by National Geographic on TV. What do you expect from kids when we show them all this violence on TV, and even a lot of games.
The moment we have taken our creator out of the equation of life and purpose in our lives in schools, morals and responsibility has gone down the tube.
Everyone-send your kids to Catholic school, if you want them to be safe. We are not Catholic, but our child is going to a Catholic school where he is protected. You don't have to be Catholic! Plus you get a great education.
Gun are not the first problem. I happens at schools !!!!
Apparently something is wrong in schools. Maybe 'Chrstian' limited scope of vision triggers individuals to feel outcast.
(so will all religion visions do by the way) Should teachers not teach to think and reflect/question youngsters and not tell them what they 'have' to accept ? I don't mean they are capable of seeing (whatever) truth. But shouldn't they as an individual have the right to think about it freely (not unlimited however; respect for the other is essential) ? Wasn't that something we did not like ourselves at the time ?
Today, teachers in Europa are increasingly telling how the world is functionning. First of all the don't know just the alpha of it, seccond they get alle easily from journalists who think Rome ias the capital fo Spain. I am a master-professor and I know that students don(t even know who Mao, Stali, Napoleon or others serials were ..
The problem with your silly analogy is that both Romney and the "electrical engineer" work harder in one day than ANY of your so-called occupy protestors. And, as someone who works 60 hours a week as he tries to get into the 1%, we are sick of your laziness and paying for your inactivity.
I am a firm believer in "TRAINING", the child should be trained not only at school, but also by the responsible parents-this is a MUST. The child or student must be made of all reprocutions of their actions but also those actions that DON'T require such force and how to impliment them into a situation.
Many factors responsible, as the article states. But I still believe that too many Americans believe the way to deal with a problem is violence, and the fastest problem-solving option is a firearm. Television and cinema too often promote the notion that, to deal with a problem, bring a weapon. And don't be afraid to use it. Ask questions later.
@Bocknobby: It's interesting that you perceive that movies and television present guns as "the fastest problem-solving option". My experience with movie and television storytelling is closer to the opposite. It seems to me that, whenever a dangerous situation might be quickly ended by the protagonist simply pulling the trigger on the gun in his hand, he chooses not to do so, is prevented from doing so or the weapon is otherwise shown to be ineffective. The story then proceeds with the antagonist eventually being dispatched by some complex innovation. It seems to me that movies and television more often attempt to show guns as useless.
You don't pay much attention to movies. While it's true that the primary antagonist in most movies gets away over and over again, there are always plenty of henchmen to sponge up the lead.
@InkMot Are you kidding me? What movies are you watching!?
Nonetheless, it still remains that people do not seem to know how to solve problems without violence AND they have typically resorted to firearms. We can debate this a hundred ways – it's still someone becoming unhinged, for whatever reasons, grabbing a gun, and killing innocent bystanders. Every time, all the time. THAT is the problem
"People don't know how to handle problems without violence and they typically resort to using guns?" You are aware of the reality that gun violence is incredibly rare, right? I live in a suburb of Dallas with 250,000 people, and in a typical year we have 3 murders and 20 assaults in our entire town. And Dallas is a pretty gun-happy place. You're utterly delusional if you believe the USA is a place where people resort to violence to deal with problems, and typically use a gun, shooting bystanders every time.
@drowlord You need to get out more. Gun violence in this country is something like 100x higher than in most other first world countries. Just because your neighborhood doesn't have a lot of gun violence doesn't mean other areas don't. I live in a major city and we have shooting DAILY.
I rent duplexes to college-aged kids. They don't pay rent, lie, destroy property and then, when called on the carpet and given the slightest consequence, redouble their destruction of property. The guns/shootings are merely a symptom. The problem is how these children and their parents were raised by the baby boomers.
I agree completely. And, we have waaaaayyyy too many guns in this country.
Jean Luc Picard for President! Diplomacy and teamwork win the day, not violence. It helps to have phasers and photon torpedoes if needed, however.
so according to you only americans watch movies..... do u think about things sentence by sentence as u write them?
You're on it.
Our government frequently and openly advocates the use of force in conflict resolution. When kids see that the politicians they admire have no trouble justifying the use of force on someone they dislike, they take note.
Kids don't admire politicians. Most kids can tell you who the President is, but I doubt many can tell you who their own state representatives are.
I don't think anyone admires any politician. But you're right about one thing. We have a lot of war mongers in the Republican party in Washington that want to bomb or invade every nation under the sun.
indeed, obama bombing libya, drone killing kids in pakistan, and now wanting to invade syria. God bless the peaceful obomber
Guns – The United States of America has a massive problem with guns. Violent crime in the USA is greater than that of almost the entire civilzed world. ALL other civilized nations on planet earth are completely puzzled by this love of guns in the USA.
A politician CANNOT get elected in the USA by advocating gun control. Until Americans step up and admit this bizarre RIGHT TO BEAR ARMS rules their country, expect more of the same.
Sad but true, ardeerd! Violent school shootings and attacks on innocent citizens continue to threaten society. Gun shows that sell guns and ammo are everywhere, about as popular as flea markets these days. My family does not own guns, but I do not condemn those families that do own guns and keep them properly locked up. I blame the ignorant people that do not responsibly lock up their guns and ammo to keep the weapons out of the hands of children and the mentally incapacitated. I also blame government for being too lax in selling guns to people of questionable sanity and morals. More in-depth background checks requiring longer wait periods to receive firearms must be enforced. I know how riled up pro-gun people get about stricter gun control, but as a parent with kids in school, I worry about some bullied, neurotic & fed-up kid storming into my children's school with a loaded firearm because he/she wants retaliation.
however fox news has no rating on it. so when a sponge minded kid sits in front of fox news and every 5 minutes gets drilled into their head that everyone against them is a nazi etc etc etc they leave the room thinking of ice cream and lollipops
Maybe America is No. 1 in School Shootings because America is No. 1 in allowing people to own and carry guns? Duh?
Clearly, this idea that guns make us safer is not working for school children.
Please check your facts.
Please let us know which facts are wrong. It does appear that there is a connection between our gun culture and the use of guns in shootings, especially if you compare this to our neighbor to the north, Canada, where guns are much harder to obtain and shootings are much more rare.
You are 100% right
We feel safer here in Canada BECAUSE of the fact that there are less guns
Ahh, I do find logic refreshing in the morning.
It's hard to disagree with sound reasoning. However, some of our more dense will succeed in finding a way.
As a law abiding citizen, I prefer to armed.. the fundamental issue that get left out by the anti-gun people is that criminals don’t obey the law. Only a fool would believe that “banning guns” would do anything other than disarm those who obey the law.
Lot of "fools" around then!
TIme to face reality, Nom. It's not like the criminals in other countries are wandering around killing with knives, poisons, golf clubs, or whatever. There are more deaths here because it's EASY to kill with guns, And though you may argue for arming for self defense, NO ONE needs an assault rifle to defend themselves, that's a false argument in the face of what Americans are armed with.
Diane, google "UK knife attack stats" and educate yourself.
Forget the tried dogma-
Children can not own and carry guns legally. The fact that some children have access to guns is undisputed as is some of these same children, for whatever reason, decide to act upon whatever's in their heads. Without both parts of this coming together there would be no school shootings. Children's access must be better controlled, especially those with problems-
Of course that is tough with parents today that do not pay attention to their kids, with their work or friends.
Agreed, Fair Taxes!
Just like the war on drugs has curbed drug addiction in the US.
Guns do make people safer, if used correctly. Having a gun for protection puts you on the same playing field as the criminals and oppressors that will have guns no mater what the laws say. The whole idea of having guns isn't to use it for violence but for the protection of peace. The more people who have and are educated in gun safety, the safer this country is.
Now for the argument that criminals won't have guns if there are more gun laws, is silly. For example, this child was breaking multiple gun laws bringing this gun to a school and he was breaking even more law shooting the gun. Obviously gun laws did not deter this child from attaining and using a gun illegally, so why would it deter anyone else with similar motives?
Please name a single state in the US where grade school or high school students are allowed to carry guns in public, carry guns to school, or even just obtain guns?
None such exists, of course, but don't let reality and factrs get in the way of your hysterial gun-phobic temper tantrum.
Bring back corporal punishment.
then the principal would have been the one shot, that is not the answer. the kids need counselling
You are so right. American kids are the parents at home. The so-called children right, privacy etc.
corporal punishment never left that is why we are an evil doer country also...... point fingers at other countries so they cant point at us
The VT killer was 23, well within the age of owning a gun legally. Kind of wrong to say if kids couldnt get a gun there wouldnt have been the VT massacre.
NRA is giving this young man a badge of honor. Will probably defend his right to bear arms in defense of liberty.
Victor, wrong again. Please stick to facts instead of spewing rhetoric.
You should go back to your caveman country. Such a stupid reply.
Victor, your NRA must be different from my NRA. My NRA is the National Rifle Association, they promote law abiding citizens lawfully owning firearms. Seventeen year olds do not legally own handguns. Nor is it legal to go shoot a bunch of kids in a school. What your NRA is, to me, is a mystery.
Victor is a lying piece of crap, like so many of the anti-gun nuts who blame law-abiding gun owners for the acts of criminals.
The NRA would prefer to see laws that allow adults-professors, teachers, staff and students like the tens of thousands of military veterans in university on the GI Bill-to carry guns for the defense of themselves and others.
The NRA recognizes the plain simple fact that gun control laws have never kept criminals from obtaining guns.
Campus gun bans have only resulted in campuses free of anyone who can fight back against a murderer.
That's what Victor actually wants: more unarmed victims.
Why is the U.S. lead the world in school shootings?
Two words: AMERICAN EXCEPTIONALISM.
it occurs to me that you are the one looking down your nose at Americans, not the other way around.
WE'RE #1 !!!! WE'RE #1 !!!!! WE'RE #1 !!!!! ........
USA! USA! USA!
Homer Simpson!
I am really curoius about how the NRA will respond.
Why is America No. 1 in school shootings, NRA? Because there aren't enough guns in schools?
They will probably say, only criminals use guns irresponsibly, and once an NRA member does something criminal, he's not an NRA reprentative anymore. Thus it's never their problem.
I am not much of a gun activist but what you are saying is that if all guns were banned there would no longer be gun crimes? Criminals wouldnt gain access to these weapons? Dream on dude
Well...I doubt there would be more gun crimes, and that's a start...
By this logic, countries with banned guns would have just as many gun deaths, since the "criminals" would still get guns. Doesn't happen, though, does it?
@Diane: Personal ownership of firearms is virtually illegal in Mexico, yet their gun homicide rate is twice that of the United States. There are an esitmated 80 million homes and 300 million firearms in the United States. However, there are only an estimated 30,000 gun deaths in the US per year (CDC). Of those, about 18,000 are suicides, 10,000 are murders, and 2,000 are accidental. Of the 10,000 murders, over 85% are committed by persons already having a felony conviction. In fact, firearms deaths are no longer in the CDC's top 15 causes of death. Since about 1990, over half of the states have implemented "shall-issue" concealed carry, yet gun deaths and violent crime have decreased significantly since that time and are now at their lowest level since the mid-1960s (FBI).
Dan, this whole "criminals will get guns" is a bogus argument.
America limits who can buy and use explosives, yet criminals don't go around blowing things up because they can get explosives.
Moreover, just because we can't or won't ban guns, doesn't mean America need to make it so easy for criminals and children to get guns. Background checks aren't even required at gun shows. How does that make any sense?
@Jim: Background checks are absolutely required at gun shows – just as they are required at gun shops. One completes the same form and waits the same amount of time while the licensed dealer calls in the background check.
criminals get guns by stealing them from morons that shouldn't have them in the first place
You might want to get your facts together before running your jaw. Background checks are required. Now if you want to be free of guns, move to Russia, Iran, or any other country but leave.
Wrong, criminals (or say I terrorist) have always obtained both legal and illegal explosives through thievery, over the counter, compromised and or corrupted officials; thus, it's the immoral character and or the root of the problem(s) that needs to be held in check, because if not then when you strip all guns away, those same maligned characters will resort to using vehicles, bats, knives, acids, and or simply their bare hands. To disarm the law abiding citizens -on the inverse, is to pro-arm criminals who are gonna obtain firearms illegally anyway.
@Emmy: So your solution to the rampant car theft problem is to outlaw cars and punish those who get their cars stolen instead of punishing those who do the stealing?
Yes. Like religious people do... "he did this horrible thing but he is not really part of our group".
ah... its nice to finaly find an atheist who claims Hilter, Stalin, Lenin, Pol Pot, Castro, Ho Chi Minh, Nehru, Mobutu and Honecker as their own.
In Ohio it is illegal to let a child have access to a gun without adult supervision. When the shooter showed up at school with a gun, an adult had already violated the law. The sad reality is that too few children understand the deadly power and force of firearms. Even in the interviews, the other children reported hearing "fireworks". How are our children ever going to respect firearms and the tragedy that they can cause if they are never taught gun safety? Luckily we have the right to defend ourselves in this country with personally owned firearms. Regardless or whether you like that right or not, it is everyone's responsibility to prevent children from misusing guns, cars, alcohol, or any of the other "adult" things that have a lawful place in our society.
JEREMY!!!!
TOTALLY AGREE WITH YOUR WHOLE STATEMENT! See this is smart people. I grew up with guns, my father taught me to duck hunt. Im now a 30 something professional, dont use guns any longer, but believe that children SHOULD learn about gun violence that could happen in school. I keep hearing kids say " thought it was fireworks" . I know this school had a great system put in place which probably saved lives. My sons school does the same-but they didnt really learn the gun part. I think it should be added...at this point we cannot guarantee someone will not bring a gun to school-but at least our children will be even more ready if someone does. So sad...
well in this country we are being bullied everywhere
school,work,social life etc etc
you add that a mentality base on violence and lack of respect of human life
and you have your answer to why school shooting happen ..!!
And then consider that the rest of the world sees OUR country as a big bully...
Jim, would it make you feel better if the kid brought a knife to school and stabbed the others?
Frank, with a knife the victims could have at least run away or defended themself.
Moreover, how many drive by stabbings have you heard about in the news lately? Or how about the kid in Florida killed by someone firing into the air? How many knives travel 1000s of feet and fall on unsuspecting victims in their back yard?
Frank – Jim is right. It's a lot harder psychologically – and more dangerous personally – to plunge a knife in and see the blood from arm's length than to point a gun at a body far away.
More people die in car accidents. Should we close the highways and outlaw cars?
Would it make you feel better if the kids were stabbed? So, they had a chance to defend themselves before dying from a stab wound? Would that make it better? Seriously?
@Frank – some ole, same ole 2A speel.. IF the kid had had a knife, I guarantee you there would NOT be 2 DEAD 17-yrs old at that school right now. The perp would have been jumped and disarmed. Many knife wounds are not life threatening – even when someone IS jumped by surprise. But in a school cafeteria, your going to see someone coming at you with a knife, and avoid it. With a gun.. .you are seeing the end result. No guns – the schools wouldn't need lock down policies and preparation would they. Your ill-formed logic as to the the "right to bear arms" is continually being spouted by the pro-gun lobby. I have no issues with guns. Used 'em. Have 'em. Hand guns sole purpose is to KILL. They should be banned or strictly controlled. And pls... don't retort with the "criminals will always have them" response. I'ts immature and asinine. Sure they will, but it's supply and demand. Cut the supply and the demand will go up. Kill the supply and they'll not have access to them.
@The REAL Truth...: You say this because prohibition worked so well in the 20s and 30s and because the "War on Drugs" is working so well today? The government spent a ton of money on both of these prohibitions and one could still get what they wanted with little trouble. All prohibitions do is set up a black market.
@Frank – That argument doesn't hold water, the intended purpose of a car is not to kill people. We should make safer cars and highways so that less people die in accidents. On the other hand, there's not much reason for guns to exist other than to kill things. Making a gun safer would render it useless.
it probably would not have happened that way. It was a concern of the founding fathers, that guns made it too easy to kill people. In their minds a knife/sword requires skill and then a closeness that makes it harder for someone to kill, to get their hands "dirty." They were probably right, so my guess is a knife would not have had the same consequences.
That's a nice "guess", but a wrong one.
You guys make it seem like killing others was invented at the same time as firearms. People have been donig it for as long as there have been people, and they never worried about getting their hands "dirty".
Uh no!! ...
The concern of the founding fathers was to protect the newly for state independence. The 2A states "A well regulated militia being necessary to the security of a free state, the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed."
It unfortunate the the pro-gun lobby hones in on the latter part of the amendment. There's nothing wrong with guns, but the "right" was to be able to quickly form a militia ("reserves") to defend life, limb, property and independence 200 yrs ago. That need for the "security of a free state" no longer exists in today's world. We have the military and the reserves to do that now.
@The REAL Truth...: The Supreme Court disagrees.
@rich7553 – "The Supreme Court disagrees."
you are correct, but that doesn't make it the right decision – they are known for rulings with unintended consequences such as the SuperPAC's and Corporations.
And back to your earlier response to an earlier comment of mine about gun control.. I NEVER said "prohibition". I said CONTROL. I'm not talking about Uncle Sam showing up at ur door and demand your guns. Prohibition does not work. That's stupid/crazy and will never happen. I'm talking about strict HAND GUN control. NOT about taking away all guns.
In all seriousness.. .have you ever been deer or hog hunting with a handgun? You might, but it's rare.
@The REAL Truth...: Nope, never been hunting with a handgun. Mine serves two purposes only. Self defense and sport shooting. What exactly is "real hangun control"? 30,000 laws aren't enough? Attempting to legislate criminal behavior is doomed to failure. It has never worked, it can never work. At some point, everyone will be a criminal for one reason or another and personal liberty will cease to exist. A handgun is the most efficient, effective means of protecting one's life in case of a violent attack. Instead of handgun control, you should be advocating criminal control. Why is it that over 85% of murders are committed by felons? Why are they out on the streets?
I really think a huge part of the problem is our lack of empathy. We are a selfish society – look out for number one. Read the responses to articles right here on CNN – people are cruel, blame victims, think boys who are bulled are "sissies" and make jokes about violence. We are removed from reality – desensitized to the pain of others. So many teens simply can't put themselves in another's position – can't comprehend that many lives are connected and that an act of violence has a ripple effect. Why is this the case? Maybe it is the violent video games, the movies and reality tv, broken homes and kids spending their childhoods in daycare. Maybe it's praising a kid for every little thing and building them up as superstars when they really are just like all others. All I know is that so many kids today lack respect for others and it comes at a cost.
Well said. You can treat the symptoms all you want, but if you don't treat the underlying problem, it won't go away and can get worse. As a mental health therapist that works largely in schools, I see the problem of our society's individualistic mindset get played out in full force. Despite the growing anti-bullying programs across the country, which is great, bullying still gets ignored time and time again in many schools, not just by fellow students who don't take it seriously because it's not happening to them, but by many teachers and school officials who have 'bigger problems" than a couple of kids who are calling someone names, afterall they are "just being kids". The teachers feel that they can't take their focus away from the tests they have to teach to, they can't take time out of the day to address bullying or provide a lesson on empathy and compassion to their students. That's not in the lesson plan. The students who come to me often tell me that their parents or their teachers just tell them to "ignore it" but of course that doesn't work. No one has been there to listen to them and by the time they get to me, which is hopefully sooner rather than later, all I can hope is that the ear I provide, the empathy I use, and the validation I give them is enough.
Regarding being bullied, teased etc., I myself had been there done that being in school in the 70's and 80's being told to ignore it business, but didn't help one bit. In High School someone almost ran me down with a motorcycle, of which my dad dragged the boy off the bike and into the Deans Office. Putting thumb tacks on my chair in one class, stealing things out of my gym locker or moving them to another in the locker room. In my case it was me being shorter then others as if I am inferior and also was not the aggressive type. I never was beaten up and am lucky there. In Elementary School from 4th to 7 grade I went to a privet school and was a lot stricter then public schools and had very little problems there. I agree we have problem with guns in this country. In European Countries such as Germany, owners are required to lockup their guns and children don't have as easy access to them. Nobody in our family owns guns but knew friends that owned guns.
Leigh-
yes you are so right. We are a selfish society to the core. The moral compass is leaving our children so fast. Im a 30 something mother boys and girls. I have tried so hard to instill good moral compasses in all of them-while trying to balance the reality of violence. I do NOT pull the wool over their eyes-but keep them focused. Its hard to balance...but you have to let them know that even though you are polite and respectuful-that not everyone is. My kid is popular, gets good grades, and was still mugged on the street by a thug while he was headed home. The kid who came up to him reached out to shake my sons hand and then punched him in the face, told him to empty his pockets and that if he didnt-he was going to shoot him. It was a horrible lesson-but one that knocked him into reality. I hated that but thankfully my kid still stands tall and knows now that he too can defend himself and be proud of who he is. Life is much more tough for our kids now...this never would have happened when I was a kid
Leigh,
Leigh, Absolutely fantastic post,
I totally agree with all you have said. We seem to have forgotten the art of human kindness and think it acceptable to trample on the weak and to take out the opponent, without consideration of human and other costs. The way we do politics is a prime example.
they need to teach kids a language to talk about trauma so they can explain what is happening to them. its just flat out missing.
they need to understand intrusive thoughts. what to do when they are getting pounded with intrusive thoughts. how to get help (they tend to disregard in some cases because they don't see themselves as the problem...in the case of rapists for example. they don't see how going to the therapist is going to help. it does, but they aren't that far along yet. and quite frankly neither are some therapists). we need to build a language so they recognize what they are doing...when they start avoiding. when they notice that they have anger. follow that back to the original abuse/r. when they can't resolve that...they tend to bring that forward to anything that triggers thoughts of the original abuse/r. They need a language to even recognize in their own selves...so they can self report.
they need to be able to recognize and redirect if they are avoiding (school, friends, work, places, etc) so they don't lose their educational life. THESE YEARS DO MATTER. its very expensive to make this time up if you have to pay for it in college (i know, i've been there). don't lose your path right here. it starts very subtle. you don't even realize you are doing it. it seems safe to you. and its hard to convince your brain that [going back to school for example] is safe. and your brain is pretty smart. it will protect you. but after years of this...you will realize you lost too much. that's what i'm worried about. Do everything in your power to stay on your educational paths right here. Try to get every question answered. That's the only way you are going to be able to file this stuff safely in the past where it belongs and not drag it forward to everything in life. If you have questions...ask them now. (This is going to be a lifetime pivot point.) Trauma is a bear. It can show up years later. Your best defense to protect yourself is to get answers to your questions.
Leigh,
i agree with your post, and then some. Our political leaders for the most part are not great role models for trying to get along with each other, divorce rates are through the roof, religions are intolerant of each other. What are kids to think. Most parents are working and have a tough time making quality time for their kids. Many parents do not want to think or acknowledge that their child may have an emotional or mental health issue. Its a hard pill to swallow. they often get defensive when it is suggested that their child may have an emotional or mental health problem. And yet these problems don't just pop up overnight. the problems have likely been brewing for many months or years. I work with these types of kids every day as a part of my job and often these kids have poor social skills and lack of empathy. They do not problem solve well, and they are impulsive. It is really hard to change this type of thinking unless they want to change it and there is parental support, often one of the two is lacking.
I do not feel that the primary problem is guns, that is just a means to an end for the troubled human. The main problem is lack of adequate mental health support in the schools. Which is often a result of diminishing budgets for public schools.
This never would have happened if America didn't infringe the victim's 2nd Amendment Rights and let every child in this school carry a loaded AK-47. (sarcasm)
Here is the Problem, Just look at it, all the kids who are doing the shooting in the SCHOOLs are those young white KIDS.
So what are their parents teaching them at home, or not teaching them at home. But o no I forgot Its in there genes, they came form Spain, Germany, France and ENGLAND, killing, Taking, Stilling and just plane doing EVEL,, So why are we all shocked today that something like this can happen again.!!!.
Yes, it is in their genes. This is why there are more school shootings in the US than Europe. It is because Europeans do not have European genes like those white Americans do... oh wait...
"stilling and just plane doing evel"? Seriously... did you come out of an Austin Powers movie?
I believe that while some groups have community and extended family support, white kids live in more individual,isolated settings requiring everyone to toughen up and fend for his/herself, which creates undue pressure.
We'd all be safer if all students 9th grade and above carried Glocks at school. Common sense.
Cannot wait for these idiots to bring the "Violent video games" argument to this.
That doom games is too violent and teaches kids to kill
Doesn't anyone think that maybe the media is a factor? Kids see the violence everyday on tv. They get mad someone and come up with this great copy cat idea. Just look at the headlines on this website. 90% of it is negative.
I keep hearing it is Bush's fault.
We live in a society that glorifies violence as a way to solve problems, and there are a lot of guns available.
I know from living south of the border that the countries that have the most problems with violence have armed populations. Often these are places like Guatemala which just went through civil wars where everybody ended up with a gun afterwards. Our own civil war may have played a role in arming our population.
And we justify violence with war and the death penalty. The message is clear. It is acceptable to kill to solve problems, if you think you have a good reason. From there it is a short leap for kids to start making up their own reasons.
I think the Bible is pretty clear on this. "Thou shalt not kill". But this is America. We kill people all over the world, and here in our own country, all the time. Are we really that surprised that these kids are doing this? It is what they have seen other people doing their whole lives.
dysfunctional family
dysfunctional society
dysfunctional country
it just about it
You have to look at the upbringing of todays kids. there is no adult supervision and a lot of parents don't care what happens to them. I could go on and on but just don't have the time.!!
We need to get rid of the brick-and-mortar schools and use the Internet to educate kids. It's faster, less expensive, and more efficient.
Now there is an intelligent statement; let's raise an entire generation of anti-social mal adjusted people that mommy and daddy have told their entire life that they are perfect with no outside influences.
Very very well thought out response.
You should post more musings for the rest of us to enjoy.
Why is the U.S. number 1 in school shootings? Does the question even need to be asked? We have a gun crazy culture that hides behind the Second Amendment and refuses to take responsible steps to make sure some people don't have access to guns. 34 people a day die from guns in this country. It is a fallacy that more guns will provide better protection. Clearly it doesn't work. Require permits, training and track the guns that are sold. The Gun Lobby controls the politicians. They don't care how many people die, nor do they care about the Second Amendment. It's all about the money.
Is this little timmy geitner?
GUNS DON'T KILL PEOPLE, PEOPLE KILL PEOPLE!!!!
One of the best comments I've read. But you have to think, what do we do with the small penis population? Big SUVs just don't do it for them. If we control gun access, we'd need to find something else to make them feel.... "big".
...because you folks in the media glorify them. If you would just report them as the sad losers they are, instead of showing their fantasy killer costumes and homemade videos, fewer would emulate them. Who wants to be known, post-violent outburst, as a sad loser?
The writer of the article cops out...the problem is guns in the hands of school children but he is not offering a gun control solution. What then?
What solution could the writer possibly offer that wouldn't offend the powerful and monied 2nd Amendment crowd.
the first step towards finding a solution is... to find the problem =)
Why? Because we have no discipline and the schools have basically become an indoctrination center for the left.
Idiotic comment. That's what's wrong with this country.
The left? Have ya seen who's running the schools these days? The left, that's so funny I don't know where to start. Been to a school board meeting lately? If they don't start with prayer they at least have some sort of biblical rant throughout the meeting. Rarely the realm of the left. The left. I still can't stop laughing. Contractors and architects are who are running our schools these days. Ha, sounds like our wars too. The left. Oh man, seriously!
You can spin it any way you want. The country with the most liberal gun laws and with th ebiggest gun lobby that fights any gun restrictions is also the westernized country with the most gun violence and deaths. Pure fact
Mexico?
Why?? Because we here in the US of A have become a land where personal wants have become much more important than family. We buy houses and cars that we can't afford; and which requires at least two incomes just to make the interest payments, let alone pay off the loan itself. IF we get married, it is with the preconceived idea that we'll just get divorced if it doesn't work out. We have no commitment to ourselves let alone to anyone else, including family. Yes, we are a screwed up, inward only concerned, Godless bunch of self indulgant people. How can we expect our children to be anything different?
Too many kids having kids. No father figure in the home. A lack of parental involvement in their children's life. Take your pick. These problems exist in a variety of socioeconomic levels, not just poverty. Get involved with your kid's life no matter how old you are or what your family background is. It will work wonders.
We are an angry people And asmany have stated, the use of ultimate violence is daily touted as an acceptable method to redress peeceived or realthreats and as a first resort. We have been at war pretty much for decades and a warrior society can expect violence as a perferred response on all levels. There was no mention of work place shootings but I would wager we are number one there too and I imagine we, among western countries, are also in the top of suicides. We have a death centered culture. Even christians focus on the death rather than the life of Jesus.
Come on down to Family Discount Gun City!!
Dead children are just the price of maintaining our rights under the 2nd Amendment, and exercising our "2nd Amendment Remedies."
(Sarcasm)
There is no school shootings problem! Just ask any NRA activist.
Possibly if the media ceased its glorification of these violent acts? Let's see, I'm an angry young man, I want to lash out - what gets me the most attention on CNN.com?
I think the answer to that question, "Why does America lead the world in school shootings?", is very obvious. They don't want Prayers in Schools, have taken God out of everything. When will they wake up? This is God's world, created by him. He is the Beginning and the End. We cannot live without him and until he is given the Praise he deserves, through Prayers or whatever, this Country is not going to get any better. They don't want any kind of recognition for him done, in public, whether it be at Schools or anything else. Think back to when this all started, when the Prayers stopped!
Finally someone nails the problem. Thanks Emily.
Right, because back when there was prayer in school there weren't lynchings or massacres of Indian villages or witch trials or children born into slavery. Have you read the Bible? God commands his followers to dash babies on the rocks if their parents don't believe in him. God is a violent and brutal force that advocates killing and taking from "others" at almost every possible advantage. This is not to say that other gods or ideologies are not also violent, but any one who says God is a pacifying force is ignoring the narrative of the Bible and the history of western civilization.
Most religions have followers who firmly believe theirs is the one true religion. Many, many thousands of people have lost their lives in the name of some religious act. We saw it with the crusades. We see it today.
The root cause of our challenge is the disintegration of a complacent world power. It has happened to every dominant civilization – bar none. Greeks, Romans, Genghis Khan, Britain, etc. It's happening to America. We are imploding. Being politically correct and allowing everything from gay marriage to removing prayer from school because some idiot atheist felt THEIR kids "rights" were being infringed by being subject to prayer. BS! Get over it.
Bullying is wrong. Hand guns and DEAD kids are wrong. If we don't do an about face and reverse direction in the USA, we will be completely defunct in 20 yrs.
That may be true on the urface but the new testament and Jesus Christ changed everything for believers in the Bible.
So Americaneedsrealfacts, are you saying that the crusades, the inquisition, the conquistadors, repressive colonization of most of the world by the Christian west, etc. were all pre Jesus Christ? I agree that Jesus said some great things, but It doesn't seem to me like the New Testament changed anything at all. Sure there is no longer animal blood sacrifice, but Christian followers of Abraham's God are still persistent advocates of violence when it furthers their interests.
Yes Emily, you have the right answer. We definitely have taken God out of the schools and this is the result.
Please keep your fairly tale stories out of this
1 in 5 Americans Suffers From Mental Illness
300 million of guns in US
do your math
So then 1 in 5 government officials have a mental illness? I'l keep my gun thank you
..and 1 in 5 cnn.com posters... Dave
The real reason is there is no disipline in the schools anymore. In the good old days when you could jerk someone up on the spot and wear them out this was unheard of.
This has happenned in the good old days as well. Don't be ridiculuous.
1) Guns are ubiquitous in the USA.
2) Our entertainment media is replete with conflict resolution via guns.
Doesn't seem that hard to figure out.
Let me be frank. My gut feeling is that gun license should be issued only on a real need basis and responsibility of the gun owner should be quiet high. This will resolve the issue to a large extent. Don't think everyone needs to own a gun.
I wouldn't be surprised if we led the world in shootings, period. MORE GUNS WE NEED MORE GUNS! HOW ABOUT REMINGTON SELLING "BABY'S 1st GUN"?
An eleven yr. old was beat to death in a school yesterday. Was that the NRA's fault to?
To Brit in US: The minimum age to own a long gun is 18, for a handgun it's 21. All purchases made through a dealer require a full background check before the gun can be taken. The law is not the problem; the illegal acquisition and use of firearms is. The illegal use of firearms simply can not be controlled by adding to the more than 30,000 gun laws currently on our books. If a simple law, that did not infringe on the second amendment, could resolve this issue, it would garner the support of everyone in this country. To date, I have never seen anything that could do that.
Stan, The US limits who can own, possess, and use explosives, and that has worked pretty well. You don't hear about criminals blowing things up because "criminal will get explosives anyway."
The entire "criminals will get guns anyway" is a totally bogus argument.
So Oklahoma City never happened right? Anthrax mailings? Drunk Drivers who kill people every day? Bad people can always get their hands on things to perpetrate bad acts against humans. Guns are just an easy target for people that do not want to fix the real problems. It is amazing to me just how many generalizations and mass stereotypes can be thrown around in one message board. Good thing most Americans feel gun ownership is a good thing.
Kids getting guns responsible for shooting at Virginia tech? The shooter was an adult.
Frank,
So now you're equating the right to carry a gun with the right to drive to work?
If you're a police officer, or otherwise need a firearm as part of a leglitmate job, I'll agree with you. Beyond that, you're just being ridiculous.
I am from india and see these kind of things is really not just horrifying but unheard for me. I m sure this incident will have deep mental impact on the children who went through this trauma. First of all i am not able to digest how are guns accessible to children. People who do posses guns for whatever reason should be blamed for the death of 2 innocent children. Are such parents sleeping ? If this is the case then the kids and their belongings should be screened for arms and weapons before they enter school bus or school premises. It should be like entering airport screening everyday. I feel scared to send my children to school.
In the third world country guns are hard to cone buy. Schools have fences so you can gave a metal detector for people who go in and out of school. Here campuses in high school are 10 times as big as in India and of course the buildings built on a rolling hills. So it will be a task to put a fence. Some campuses are of course like a town. First I went to the university here I have to walk pass a forest ( with chipmunk and squirrel along the way) before I can get to the engineering building.
The "third world" is armed to the teeth. Check out Afghanistan, Somalia, Mexico, Liberia, Gaza, etc.
There are tens of millions of AK-47's in developing nations around the world.
Its americas love affair with guns, gun violence and gun fantasy... its the cool, easy solution to problems in america. You see these clowns posing in their shades, hoodies and pistols. Now Discovery has a show about the extereme versions of these nutjobs and their I will shoot however isnt like me bunker mentality.
No need to use wits, judgement, or god forbid compromise to solve a problem. Whether its termites or someone you dont like... just get rid of them (or sue them) thats the amerikkkan way!
Duhhh..cause we are number 1 in handguns. Handguns are easily concealed and with an estimated 65,000,000 of them in US homes...readily available for whatever your pleasure.
same reason we are #1 in illegal drugs, #1 in drunk driving, #1 in % of population in jail....
This isn't about politics,but about some kid who brought a gun to school and used it in a horrible manner. It is just the most recent among many such shootings. Without having someone yell that I don't know the facts, why is it wrong to connect the dots between young people killing each other with firearms and the ready ability of firearms in the US? As I understand it, guns are much more attainable in the US than in any other western democracy and there are many more shootings in American schools than in those of other nations.
Why is it inaccurate to connect the two?
If this is
Becaue parents are neglectful, abusive, or not present.
We're number one because the NRA is full of number two.
This is easy! Guns don't kill people – bullets do! Ban bullets! Then you just have...er...clubs. I guess.
I believe America's culture is very self righteous and violence is the only solution to solve problems because society in a whole, including parents, ignore how someone truly feels. Bullies are cute, they show off in front of their peers when they hassle you, but one way to stop a bully in his tracks, get a few friends go to his house one night while he is having dinner with his parents and confront him alone or in front of his parents, let him know that in reality, he is reachable alone and you're not afraid to go to his house, it scares the crap out of them, they will start being nice in school, guarantee. When I was in school I had this friend who kept hitting me in the back , he and another guy would laugh about it, we were semi friends. I had enough so I hung out with a bad crowd and went to his house, he was scared and shocked that I was at his door. I asked him if he felt like hitting me in the back again, he almost cried, scared as hell, he started apologizing, i warned him to not make us come back here. His mother attended to him then and threatened to call the cops so we left. Next day at Gym, he was so nice, I could have had him do my homework if I wanted to. It's a psychological thing how you can turn events around without solving issues with a gun. Lets face it, American students are stupid. They did not learn from Columbine and other school shootings, it left a message despite how awful the crime was. I like the fact in the news articles it states the Columbine killers were not bullied. Where you get that info? From bullies who played victims on prime time TV during the after math? There is a common ground which leads to a break down and you can only be pushed so far to the limit, but there is other ways to solve things as I mentioned. You can talk to a counselor or whoever about being bullied, problem is they will talk to the bully and the problem will just escalate. You main objective is to make it through school if bullied is become fear itself to those who bully.
Joeker-let me ask you something on your comment about confronting the bully. Werent you afraid of backlash or being turned in for bullying? Im ALL about confrontation but it seems like if a kid does that these days-they just make it much harder. I agree with what you said-confront it when they least expect it and it should solve it. That is ONLY if the parents will follow through. I know a lot of parents who would instantly get on the defensive...
Not afraid, I would be honest if that was the case if I was turned in for bullying. Parents have nothing to do about how one thinks, it's society in a whole, the individuals. In my case, the idiot sucked up to me. I was never ever bullied, just he didn't realize who I was outside of school until he found out at his door step. Why make a stupid spectacle in murder at a school for 15 mins of fame on Nancy Grace when the main person who is the target just needs to be taught a lesson to change, a scare of reality works. School doesn't last forever.
VP Biden while in Pakistan said about killing of Punjab Governor Salman Taseer, Jan 13, 2011
”Societies that tolerate such actions end up being consumed by those actions.”
Which society was Biden refering to? When the US is responsible for 100s of 1000s of killings abroad, is it any wonder that the society will not be influenced by these actions? Bombs are dropped and then vidoes are shown to people and people smile and laugh because "others" are being killed. There is a cancer inside the body called "USA" and it will destroy it from the inside.
i love the way the author sort of settles on guns as though access is something we can affect. who knows, maybe in the case of children? but hard core criminals will always find ways to get their guns. so, if we limit access via legislation, what we'd end of having is armed hard-core criminals and unarmed regular people who just want to be able to better protect their homes.
We need to start putting these school mass shooting stories on the back page because these homicidal nutcakes are playing to the media. Figure it out and stop feeding these homicidal trolls.
Obviously, America loves its guns infinitely more than it loves its children – if it loves them at all. So let's just get used to it – let's get accustomed to this mindless violence because the mindless sociopathic gun-loving NRA-supporting imbeciles in this country own the politicians and they own Congress.
So let's get these stories on the back page – as just a typical, trivial routine incident that is typical of a routine day in the life of the pathologically violent nation of America – a nation that LOVES IT'S GUNS and pays handsome premium box office ticket fees to watch even more violence as a leisure activity which it describes as 'entertainment.'
Really a stupid question. We have the most guns.
Perhaps more guns would solve the problem.
Rather than blame guns why don't we take a look at the parents (or grandparents in this case). Behind every one of these nut jobs are parents who have ignored blatant warning signs or are just as nutty as their kids. You can try to make it a gun issue all you want, but all you are doing is shifting the blame away from the real problem.
Yeah, lets not worry about a 16yr old kid having easy access to a firearm ( and ammo). It's not the guns fault is it? It's always something/someone else's responsibility (other than the hand guns and easy access) with the pro-gun lobby.
>It's not the guns fault is it? It's always something/someone else's responsibility
Yea like the 16 year old who took the gun and shot someone….idiot.
@Patrick... yeah, he was an idiot. He will now pay the price for the rest of his life.
Hmmm...Now does it really surprise anyone when the father of Elián González proclaimed he wanted to take his son back to Cuba because he feared the US school system infrastructure for his son, Elián? I don't think you hear about school shootings in Cuba. I am not pro-communist, but I do sincerely feel the school shootings here in the USA rests with the parents. Whatever happened to, "sticks and stones may break my bones, but names will never harm me..." This nation is turning into one heckuva screwball country !! We are already the laughing stock of the world !!
Because we operate our schools like jails.
School use to teach the Word of God and love and respect for others. When the state got involved they removed the moral fabric, discipline, prayer, and the 10 Commandments and replaced it with acceptance of sin. Now that God has been removed from the school system what do you expect: Chaos. The problem is not with guns, it is with kids left to themselves and live according to what they feel is right. Post modernism and the lack of Truth(Christ) is our greatest failure to our legacy. Mr. President, if you want to lead our nation, lead it to repentance.
When did public schools ever teach this? Just so you know the answer is never.
Christ or not Christ, but I agreed with you. Any religion would teach kids morals and values, and give them a “compass” for life. We removed religions from schools and most of the time from our lives, and gave nothing in return for souls and left our kids and many adults confused and disoriented what is good, what is bad, what are morals, what are sins. Being raised in a communist country myself where religion was prohibited, I still come to that conclusion and found my own way to the religion, and I truly believe when a child young, teach him or her right things, they still will do not always what you approve, but at least the base would be good and that will leave hope.
It is gun – the scecond amendment allows not only help to secure US homes – but allows (illegally) to put guns in hands of ill and childrens....
It takes moms and dads to raise kid. It takes prayer in schools. Without a solid background from parents meaning a mom and a dad children fill the void from whatever. You were warned back in the 60s about the result of the liberal methods of doing things. This is the result so quit winning about it and fix it. And yes you all know how!!!
Academics belong in the classroom while prayer belongs in churches and homes.
Just a thought...
Fairly Tales do not belong in Public schools!!!
This list really fails to recognize the biggest reason, which is the breakdown of the family unit we've had over the past 30-40 years. A majority of violence starts in broken homes. The availability of guns, bullying, mental health...those things have all been the same over the past 50 years, heck my dad told me stories of when they used to bring guns to school in a rural school when he was a kid, so they could go hunting after class was done. Teachers, parents and other students were fine with it, yet we didn't have shootings back then at all.
But the number of kids growing up in broken or single family homes has risen dramatically over the past 30 years, and children do need that guidance from both parents. We've devalued the family structure more, and children are paying the consequences of it. Because all of the school programs, welfare money and social counselors cannot be a 2nd parent to them.
A social worker making just above minimum wage and handling the workload of the seven other social workers laid off 5 years ago gets fined and probation for the death of a child that hangs him self in the parents care. WHAT EVER!! A great singer DESTROYS her life spends several million dollars on drugs dies a pathetic failure and we LOWER THE FLAGS and morn her like a saint. This kid needed help AND YOU PEOPLE BLAIME THE GUN
Why all the violence?
Er, could it be the inevitable blowback from the pervasive culture of in-your-face confrontation, disrespect, argument, stress, and hyper competetive mentality? Not to mention the effect of escalating threats and counter threats involving just about everything?
If it wasn't a gun, it would be a shovel, a pick, or an axe.
What people here don't seem to realize is that kids stab and club each other so much that it is not even newsworthy anymore.
Right. Because we all know a middle school kid with a shovel can drop as many classmates and teachers just as fast as a middle school kid with a 15 round Glock.
Comments are polar, as I expected. If guns were outlawed, they wouldn't have been shot – right? Yes, but they would have been stabbed, poisoned, bombed, run over, or something else instead. You can argue having a gun handy makes it easier for kids to act out on their impulses. You'd be right. Responsible gun ownership includes protecting people from themselves and immature minds that have no self control. It's horrific this happened, but to start banging the drums for gun control is reactionary and won't solve a thing. From ggyC (in this post) Guns are the tool, we need to find the motive.
Remember the Va. Tech shootings a few years back? Do you really believe 30 people would have been killed if the same guy had gone in with a steak knife or a baseball bat?
Because we are a narcissistic culture.
.
Maybe if we weren't enslaved by the 1% "Job Creators" for a low wages, forcing us to work more and more as cost of living goes up and up. Families are more like acquaintances today, see each other in passing.
Plain and simple......guns are too readily available and the violence depicted in movies and on television shows surely does not help. The NRA's position that people kill people , and that guns do not kill people is absolute B.S. People kill because guns are easily available.
The schools are too big loosing connection between students, teachers and parents.
Then why cut school budgets, causing lower staff/student ratios, consolidation of small schools into big ones, etc.? It all comes home to roost.
Its called School Choice. More support for Charter Schools. Put education back in the hands of the parents and students. The schools need to get back to operating as a community and not a money making farm. There is something wrong with our schools. Teachers getting arrested everyday for abuses.
The U.S. is probably #1 in school shootings because we make heroes out of people who kill others on foreign soil, and because we make anyone who opposes personal gun ownership feel un-American. Wake up, people! Guns are dangerous, and lets face it- guns cause more problems than they solve.
I can tell everyone where it comes from. It comes from Hollywood they set the tone for the culture in America, which are run by some of the biggest liberals in the country. These kids today see all the movies that are made and they act out what they see. They make movies about "bullies" in school, they also make movies about "bullies" in the work place. But it's most "Prevalent" with children from the ages of 10 to 18. Hollywood dwells on this age culture. There was a story yesterday that two girls got into a fight and several hours one of the girls died. When children can't take it anymore they take action into their own hands and use deadly force. The parents are to busy to listen to their children because of all the pressures of work and what is going around them. It's the culture of today's society. The reporter who wrote this article also mentiond Russia and Israel as two of largest countries that have school shooting so the United States is not No.1. I don't want to hear that children have access to "guns" children can get "guns" as easy as anyone. Or they find their parent;s "guns". I can see that the liberal press has "not" reported how the shooter in Ohio got the "gun" he used to shoot all of his classmates. This is the new culture that is in the United States and there are no solutions to combat this as long as Hollywood keeps making movies about violence in today's soceity it will never end.
Right. "Liberal" mega-corporations like Disney, Tiime-Warner, etc.
Most school shooting happen in the US. The only school shootings that happened in both Israel and Russia (one in Russia, two in Israel) were terrorist acts done for nationalist reasons.
Because we have the most guns and the easiest access to them; also because we have poor access to mental health care ,making early intervention difficult.
I don't believe guns are to blame in any situation. The guns aren't the ones shooting and killing bystanders. All the reasons people are choosing to justify teenagers grabbing guns and killing students,teachers.etc isn't exactly correct. Yes i agree they do contribute to the reasons teenagers feel the need to hurt another person,but i dont believe adults should be searching for the reasons. it should be the kids who take action against the bullying and torment that goes on in schools all over America. you can debate this till your blue in the face and put laws and warning signs in schools everywhere,but it comes down to the fact that kids are generally mean to each other,and it has nothing to do with entertainment. Their are always going to be bullies for whatever reason,bad home life,illness,or maybe their just mean,but the only way bullying is going to stop is if you get the kids involved and educated them on the effects of their actions to other students,no school really understands the loss of their students due to another students actions till it happens,if you want to prevent them get the students involved.
-high school student.
As a non American (Canadian) and looking from the outside, all civilized western countries have all the same potential contributors as the USA other than the access to and love affair with guns. So in my opinion, that is the difference.
America has the most school shootings for two reasons 1) we have terrible parents in the country and 2) when dangerous students are identified they get special treatment rather than expelled.
Your ability to ignore the kids that have been expelled and then returned to shoot up the place is amazing.
Instead of those two poor kids who died in this incident, it should have been those kids whose parents supported the NRA's that die.
The NRA are the massacre of kids in this nation and all the violence that is happening in this country.
People like you that can't put a complete, coherent thought together; yet, have children are the problem.
No guns none of this hideous crime would have happen.
The NRA, main message is to teach it membership to know the weapon, and the damage it can cause. The NRA is not responsible for the fact that violence has become the way to respond to problems. Our permissive society is the problem.
The NRA has nothing but bloody hands on a day like today. Sorry, but it is the truth.
This violence against students, is not a new phenomenon, the only difference is that today, we have the "NEWS CREW" to report it ad nausem. If we really want to control the problem, we must attack it at the source. This idea that because the perpetrator is under a certain arbitrary age, therefore we must be willing to accept the damage they cause, needs to end. First we have to make the parents responsible for the action of their children, a parent winds up in JAIL, for the actions of their children will have a delitory affect on that child in future. If enough parents wind up with financial and jail judgements against them. We need to stop leaving the moral upbringing to the "SCHOOLS", many years ago, I wanted to be a teacher, due to the support of several teachers in my life. But by the time I was in college I found out that the role of teachers had changed. When I was growing up, if I miss behaved in school, and recieved punishment at school, by the time I arriaved home I could expect my parents to be ready to add to that punishment. Today, when a child miss behaves the parents blame the school and the teacher for their childs problem. We must change this so that our society can grow and leave this rat city mentality behind.
Excellent point!
Who is mentally sick? Is it just the kid who decides to pick up the gun? I think the bullies are also mentally sick. If you think about it, a bully acts stupid everyday due his/her mental sickness. So far, bullies seem to be lucky, because everytime such an incident occurs the sickness is attributed only to the kid who picks up the gun.
Okay. So the author outlines some of the factors, but is missing the three big ones. 1. Poor, permissive parenting. Lack of discipline leads to lack of self-discipline. Our kids are coddled and end up just as self-absorbed as their parents. 2. Lack of discipline in the schools. Teachers cannot overcome poor parenting, but they do reinforce the student's lack of discipline and lack of self-responsibility. Teachers and admins coddle the students because they are intimidated by the parents and their own fears. Yes, I have taught high school and I was appalled at what I saw. Good students being turned into self-absorbed monsters. 3. Hollywood morality and the glamor that Hollywood creates.
Now clearly these three "big" factors don't create bullies or killers. But they create a culture in which bullying is tolerated ( in spite of pretend anti-bullying programs ) and they create a culture where students lack discipline, lack self-discipline, and evade responsibility for their own actions. Perhaps I should add a fourth "big one" which is a horrible legal system that has no concern whatsoever with truth or justice. Our legal system is all about plea bargains and ego-centric prosecutions, publicity, and who has the most money to spend. We throw away evidence ( truth ) and then coddle the convicted. This kid, a killer, is messed up. But the legal system will only make it worse.
We never seem to hold anyone accountable for anything. No wonder then that our kids grow up to be me-firsters just like their parents. And woe be to anyone who dares to suggest that their kids may not be perfect.
End of rant ( maybe ) ( for now ).
The gun debate is such a difficult problem, it's too late to "take them away" that Pandoras box has been open too long now...but it's obvious that it'd be a lot harder to stab 5 people in such a short amount of time. It's the guns, but what to do about it is a problem we don't have answers for...
"Why does America lead the world in school shootings?"
Well duh!
Do we really have to ask?
USA is the most conflict-loving and violence-loving nation on the planet!
Witness the US addiction to:
1. Weapons of wars & murder
2. Seeing every instance of conflict anywhere in the world as a party that Americans should crash.
Libya, Egypt, Yemen, Syria, etc ring a bell?
3. Promoting warmongering to young children
4. And the list of Americans addiction to violence goes on and on and on ....!
You got that right.
The article makes no sense. What is the point? Is he comparing? Offering a solution? By stating who should be armed and preventing "boys" only from bringing a loaded gun to school you are advocating and anti-gun solution. Remember the motto "Guns don't kill people, people kill people, and if everyone person who wanted a gun in the school had access to a gun, this probably could have been avoided". Yeah right.
It's a pro-gun motto and completely flawed. It can be spun any way you like, but guns DO kill people. Quickly and efficiently.
How we resolve conflict without guns? Think about it.
The author "beat around the bush" with analysis of various possibilities- However the prime difference between our schools and those elsewhere is that we have removed the authority from the teachers and administrators to use their intuition and experience and then tke action. Parents, (and their lawyers), schools boards (catering to parents) and politicians have made it so taking early action is only questioned and not generally supported. Support the front line education professionals- even when there are some minor mistakes- and we all will get courageous detection and correction before there is a tragedy.
I totally agree with you, teachers need the training and the authority to deal with these issues, I sincerely believe teachers want to prevent bullying if given the power you will see a drop in rates of bullying
I absolutely agree with Tom. Seems that students in some schools no longer have to answer for bad behavior, or they are simply overlooked due to overcrowding. I do have one question, though. When I attended high school in the late seventies in a town in rural Montana, many of the students had gun racks in their pickups in the school parking lot. A fair number of the boys wore hunting knives on their belts. We never had even fistfights in the school itself and absolutely NEVER anything, anywhere with weapons. So no, I don't believe the guns alone are the source of the problem. Something else has been added to the formula, and I believe that it may be that many kids are no longer held morally responsible for even the least actions from the time they are small.
Why is the U.S. number one in school shootings?
Answer: because someone has to be
I think that we need better trained teachers who are capable of handling one of the greatest crimes known to man aka bullying, it is so easy to prevent and it does nothing to improve anyones mental state! No one knows better than a High School or Middle School student how badly teachers handle Bullying cases and scenarios!
agree .. but also, remove barriers & give teachers ability to handle bullying. Currently, teachers are crucified if they make a fuss over a kid's bullying. Parents threaten suit for slander, defamation, want proof, etc. I brought the issue to the central admin of my system and got laughed at, told to shut up.
We hear how far America is behind in education. Our teachers are barely able to teach Johnny to read or write, now they have to be bouncers as well?
hey – maybe easy access to guns is a reason? ANY effort to curb gun ownership is met by insane resistance by the Gun lobby/NRA who continue to shrug off incidents like this. "Oops, not our problem..." At least re-institute the assault weapons ban – unless you believe that's just for "hunting". yeah, right.
The problem does not lie with guns. A couple of comments on this blog from school professionals hit on the issue accurately. The problem is that no one is listening to kids. It is true that in public schools we are teaching CONTENT, encouraging rote memorization, and teaching to a standardized test so that the public will feel assured that teachers are doing their jobs. However, teachers are faced with very troubled kids. We see it DAILY. They are depressed, they are hungry, they are apathetic and care about nothing, they are angry and frustrated. How do we cope with it in a classroom of 30-35 students? Usually, we DON'T. If a student tunes himself out, teachers will try to motivate him/her to learn. But perhaps the underlying reasons for unwillingness to be engaged in school is something beyond our capacities to deal with.
Why so many shootings? Too many guns. Too much glorification of violence in vid games, sports, movies, TV. Too little parenting. Too much obsession with macho, anti-gay crap. And again, TOO LITTLE PARENTING!
I think that 37 million Black people in the U.S. has something to do with that statistic
censorship and bulling are similar irritants though this page is censoring comments that are answers rather than irritants
Because of our gun laws or the lack of them. Guns are everywhere and are a menace in our country. Nothing but pain and loss for everyone. So sad that America does not see that or does not care. I think it tells you a lot about our people, our society.
Because we have more schools than do those countries with lots of guns, and we have more guns than do those countries with lots of schools.
Allow the class to go unprotected (no open or concealed carry) on campus and you encourage the class to be just another flock of sheep ready for any wolflike gunman who wants to clear the field.
Allow the class to be protected and the people who use guns as a tool of destruction will be put off by those who would defend the class.
yee-haw Chris!! Fire 'em up dontcha! That is flawed logic. Heck, lets do a "Baby Gerber's first gun". Pink for girls, blue for boys so that by the time they are in 1st grade they are paid for and can all be packing on the playground. Oh yeah, that's the spirit. But MORE guns in the hands of CHILDREN! So sad that people even propose this type of solution.
Typical brain-dead gun-banners' "solution."
Banning guns on campus hasn't stopped a single mass murderer.
"No guns allowed" signs didn't stop this last shooting any more than they stopped the murders at Virginia Tech or Colombine HS or anywhere else.
Bans merely made sure that no teachers or staff or adult students-like the tens of thousands of veterans who have served in combat and are now using their GI Bill benefits-are able to legally carry a weapon and STOP the next murdering Cho or Klebold or Harris.
Calling you a fool would be a disservice to fools everywhere.
This is the price we pay for Real Americans' lame little gun fetish where people who have little if any control over their lives get to daydream about being powerful.
Problem leads to solution, in this analysis. The solution du jour seems to be to track "lone wolves" and to use social media. But anyone with half a brain can see that with a wide net like this, far more innocent people will be targeted. Sure, it would be hard to advertise your alienation this way in a totalitarian society. In that kind of place only the leaders get to act out.
America is country which was born in far more violence than we are willing to acknowledge. It continues as such. The shootings which occur here are part and parcel of how we see ourselves. We try to solve complex problems with force and violence. It's how we roll. Until we all do the necessary soul-searching, the shameful mess will continue. But don't bet on that happening any time soon.
Actually, Cho killed 32 students at Virginia Tech...CNN accuracy for you there.
Actually Cho killed 32 PEOPLE – a combination of students and faculty.
how many days till baseball?
I don't kow Matt, but if it's anything more than 3 weeks, I'm going for my gun !!!!
ha! maybe that will scare my Cubbies into actually winning..... oh wait... thats impossible, its just severely impossible. thanks Cubs. just ruined my day...
Another case of poor parenting where others pay the price.
We have two big problems in this country, guns and forks. If we ban them both, there would be no more gun violence and no more overweight people. Problem solved.
Kids are driven to drastic measures because they are forced into a system that does not respect the Children. Arbitrary rules and regulations that are not logical or defensible create a system of incarceration that we expect our children to learn in. When Teachers and Administrators respect the Children and their parents things will change until then nothing will change. Kids can't pass standardized test because they aren't being taught and that is the beginning of the problems.
This is really a tragedy but a problem that they DO NOT have in the Mexican schools. They may have a few other problems in certain parts of Mexico BUT the children are safe going to school and they all treasure the freedom to attend school. Maybe our school systems need to anaylze the education systems of the two countries and make adjustments. It's not just the Mexican schools either as other countries don't seem to have the problems that the United States schools have. Just a thought.
Don, are you saying that we need to scrap the American school system and become more like Mexico?
You have taken your first step towards non-credibility.
The american public school system is a joke, and its structure is what leads to these shootings. There aren't any JOB shootings by youth these days so clearly it has to do with schools. Possibly (likely) these mexican schools don't have problems with shootings because the kids are happy to be in school both because they might learn something tangible (unlike american schools) and it is not compulsory. If kids HAVE to be somewhere then they will reject it. Gun control is easy to blame for these problems, but thats like blaming all of Islam for the 9-11 attacks. Start with the source, illness depression and anxiety and we will curb the problem. Happy Kids don't shoot people.
If I wanted to kill someone, I hardly think the secondary charge of unlawful possession of a firearm would be a bigger deterrent than the electric chair. Guns aren't the problem. Broken homes, lack of parenting, and not spending time educating our children is the problem.
i agree , we are not raising our children right anymore. we blame everybody, soften our children by protecting them from consequences, not discipling them, spoling them,exposing them to horrible things in the media. raise them without fathers. we dont see how the home is what determines who are children will become.
When I was born, there were 3 billion people on Earth, now there are 7 billion. It is expected to hit 20 billion mid-century, and 50 billion by the end of this century. Now do the math...violence in 2012 is going to seem like a 1930's Disney movie compared to what's coming, and nobody sees the warning signs!!
Blaming violence on the existance of guns is avoiding the true issue, and using this example to call for gun control laws (read: de facto gun prohibition) is stating that the exceptions are the rule. School shootings are exceedingly rare, and often stem from the breakdown of the modern family unit and a healthcare system that doesn't properly address mental health issues. There has been no mention of how he obtained the gun, and it certainly was not through legal means as he isn't over 21 years of age. This young man was mentally ill (and the school was already aware of this fact as he was in an alternative school), and obtained a gun through illegal means to commit premeditated murder. While this is a tragedy, it should not be used as ammunition to take legally owned guns from citizens hands. Many more lives are saved yearly by defensive gun uses than are lost due to school shootings, and to limit the ability to protect oneself due to a minority of criminals is a mistake that would negatively impact thousands of people. Attack the real problem of poor parenting and lack of mental health coverage, not the guns.
There are so many school shootings in this country for a few reasons. First...there is no discipline for kids anymore. Second there is no personal responsibility...its not the kids fault..its not the parents fault..its a show on tv or a song..or someone looked at them the wrong way. And finally its the media...if coverage of these shootings was not plastered on the tv 24/7 and then if people stopped making movies about it a lot of it would die down. Kids see it on tv..see it in movies and it becomes glamorized...Hey..we can be famous if we do this.
Why are shootings more prevalent in the US schools? two reasons: easy access to guns and bullying.
It's pretty tacky to use this tragedy of these students and their families as fodder to advance a anti second amendment agenda, sadly it's expected .As a responsible gun-owner I realize there is nothing I can do to 100% guarantee my weapons will not be used in a crime . But there are multiple reasons I wish to keep mine .Just like there are multiple reasons school shootings occur. If you wish to address only the access to firearm side of the equation like gun safes or high capacity magazines be ready to rein in your own rabid anti gunners who will use this as a path to end all gun ownership
It is common knowledge that the U.S. has far more gun deaths than any other country in the world and also that we have greater availability of guns than any country. When will American stop the terrorism of the NRA and similar state organizations that worship guns? Hand guns are used only to HUNT and KILL people. Lets band together on this issue and defeat the NRA.
No Shane I didn't come form and Austin Power Movie, But i am sure you did with your simple way of thinking, let us just put the shoe on the other foot, your foot for example, let someone do something evel to you since you are so quick to judge other, let some still form you, or shot you in the ass, or cut your mouth off so you can't talk or voice your thoughts, What would you do about that? Like you are in an Austin Power Movie? You probly would like that because you are stupid, ugly, and last but not least EVEL, cuz it in your genes....
Guns don't kill people, people with guns kill people. Here's a clue; number of guns per 100 people, the top 25:
United States - 88.8
Serbia - 58.2
Yemen - 54.8
Switzerland - 45.7
Cyprus - 36.4
Saudi Arabia - 35
Iraq - 34.2
Finland - 32.0
Uruguay - 31.8
Sweden - 31.6
Norway - 31.3
France - 31.2
Canada - 30.8
Austria - 30.4
Iceland - 30.3
Germany - 30.3
New Zealand - 22.6
Greece - 22.5
Northern Ireland - 21.9
Angola - 17.3
Thailand - 15.6
Australia - 15.0
Mexico - 15.0
South Africa - 12.7
Turkey - 12.5
Italy - 11.9
Pakistan - 11.6
Spain - 10.4
Argentina - 10.2
Russia - 8.9
Iran - 7.3
England and Wales - 6.2
Scotland - 5.5
China - 4.9
India - 4.2
Tunisia - 0.1
What is the murder rate in Switzerland?
Read the list
Bart, you imbecile, the list is not the murder rate. Let me guess; you're a gun owner?
So I'm guessing you'd rather people kill eachother like they do in Iran? Because they bury women up to their necks in the dirt there and beat them to death with rocks. Now go sit in the corner.
Your comment is completely irrational.
We certainly don't hear about a problem with school shootings in Tunisia!
We , the US as a people, mostly ignore the rest of the world. I could drop several links of schools in Africa and South America that have been entirely wiped out in the last 5 years. They make what happened yesterday look like a day at chuck-e-cheese. (And I feel for the people yesterday)
Thanks for the information. I love statistics.
Didn't a Norwegian recently gun down 75 or so fellow Norwegians? Sweden has similarly not been immune to these types of events.
People with guns may kill people, but that doesn't mean we shouldn't enact laws that make it harder for the wrong people to get them in the first place. People with cars kill people too.
Yes and in China haven't we heard of mad men attacking school children with knives?
Does Bart Brown understand that this list is out of context. 88.8 americans out of 100 have guns? Huh? That is not true. Probably one of those americans have 50 guns in his collection bringing the number up. Dart Brown is not very smart to not realize that this list is completely out of context. How can you say that 9 or 10 americans have guns? How is that possible? Is Bart Brown dumb?
This will also be the ranking for how effectively countries will deal with the inevitable zombie apocalypse. With almost one gun per person in the U.S., we win! YES! Those fifth amendments smartasses saw this coming.
Playing evil video games where there is shooting and killing right and left, makes a deep impression on a young mind. Ban all evil video games.
GUNS.
Spare the rod, spoil the child!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Bullies were arouund when I was a kid, but I didn't go out and get a gun. People are too quick to jump to the media as the problem. Video games, arent the problem. Parents are too damn afraid to punish their kids now adays, and punishment is what is needed. When I was in middle school, If I acted up in school and picked on someone, sure enough my parents were going to hear about it, and you try kneeling on the kitchen floor with grout cutting up your knees while eating dinner, and see if that doesn't sway you decision to bully some kid.
Absentee parents, a school system that is more concerned with self esteem than education and people who are more and more isolated than ever before. Most of us hardly know our neighbors. If someone who didn't belong in the house down the street was walking in and out, I wouldn't have a clue. We've become more disengaged and it's starting to take its toll.
This may sound strange from a 30 yr. old. The problem is that every single kid in America is told by everyone that they are Special. Everyone grows up wanting to be rich and famous just for the sake of it even if they have nothing to offer the world. People watch shows about HOUSEWIVES, whose only achievement in life is marrying a rich man. Kids play sports and even the loosing team gets trophies to celebrate their mediocrity. How is anyone supposed to give their best in life when everyone is rewarded? It is important for younger generation to understand that things aren't going to be given to them in the future without hard work. You won't get that raise or promotion just for 'showing up', unless one of their parents is high up in the company.
America has become a nation which celebrates Mediocrity. Some shy kids get bullied by the morons who have grown up with parents that are more concerned about being their friends than their parents. The enormous Egos of the parent is passed down to the children. They grow up thinking they are untouchable. They disrespect their elders, even their teachers. The teachers can't do anything because the parents get mad if they discipline their children. 'How dare a teacher making $35k a year try and tell my son or daughter what to do.' Finally the kids who haven't grown up getting their behinds kissed come into school and start eliminating the root of their misery, these kids with inflated egos that have tormented them all through their short lives. They live life everyday 'untouchable'. These tormented kids see that and in their minds find no recourse accept death.
People need to start facing the facts in this country. Most people will never be rich or famous. Not everyone has the genetics or tools to succeed at such high levels. Unfortunately America has become a country where the blue collar worker is looked down upon. Everyone wants the 'glamorous' life.
Guns are not the problem. A minor should never be able to obtain access to any of their families weapons without supervision. This again is all a result of horrible parenting and disregard for children welfare. Timeout does not work. Fathers need to bring out their belts again.
Some good points – except the "belt" part. Father's presence and time is VERY important, unfortunately our society (morally) and government (economically) do not encourage the regular family structure.
You are right "Child worship" with everyone winning; 1+1= 4 (if you say so- lest we offend); putting their uniform #'s on cars etc. We parents organize and set the lax standards. The children of today have not had to organize a sandlot baseball game- and solve the inevitable differences that arrise THEMSELVES. We think we are doing them a favor when as little tykes we manage everything for them. Then when they get bigger, add hormones, ego etc. they get out of control. Big surprise, we didn't teach them in small things when they were young- we see the results.
while I strongly agree with both of you-there is one side that isnt talked about. In this day and age, both parents have to work, and if not educated sometimes HAVE to work double shifts and kids are home alone. Not because the parents DONT care-but are trying so hard to keep a roof over their head. At the end of their second shift-they dont have time to sit down and talk to their kids like they would love to or even get them to extra curricular activities. Im a 30 something educated parent who luckily is able to provide these things-but in Philly-I look around me and know that some parents just cant do it....because they arent able to provide that extra $100 bucks for an activity their child would like to do. It makes me sad thinking of those kids .... I wish there was a way more parents were able to spend time at home with their kids...
exactly! people have become so damn afraid of disciplining their children anymore, and then they cry and complain that their children are screw ups.
I don't think the author should be mentioning Russia in this article at all. It is simply an inapposite comparison, and does not have to be made merely to make the american reader feel somewhat better. The one instance Russia had was because of terrorism and had nothing to do with kids shooting other kids which happens at U.S. schools and colleges on a fairly regular basis.
Exactly. How many school shootings were in RUssia that were perpetrated by the students themselves? ZERO. Why? Because you just can't buy a gun there. Of course, criminals everywhere will find the ways. But don't equate criminals with immature kids. Criminals don't usually engage in random shootings because they are afraid to get caught. Of course, there are so many stupid people in the US that this distinction may get blurred. Regardless, there would be a lot less random killings, if people could not easily buy weapons.
Have you watch the kids TV shows these days? Camon people, don't u get it? It encourages making fun of other kids and every program has vulgarity. And regular TV is expodetially worse. Since when is the F word ok on TV?
What do think would happen? Such smart people in Hollywood.
I for one am not religious, actually an athest, but it is is clear that it is Liberal culture, which is a decay and would be the ultimate destruction of our country defined as The Enemy Within.
If you can't get along – then get it on!
Maybe because you haven't outlawed handguns. It's not rocket science.
So what do you suggest? That we round up all the handguns that are already out there? Ha, that will go over well.
Why was the "The media" paragraph left out in this article? Hmmm, I wonder. I'm sure CNN believes that all this media attention really helps the problem. I'm sure the pshyco teens never thought they would get all over the front pages of the news after this happened.
Start chraging parents for not securing their guns better. These kids get these guns mostly from their parents homes. However, it not unusal for them to go to the nearest corner and buy one. You can not even attempt to bring up any gun legislations becaseu the right wing will go "crazy"
.......Another NRA victory today. Let's increase gun availabilty to kintergarden next. We sure cant interfere with our 2ND AMENDMENT RIGHTS. WAY TO GO gop, keep thoses hand guns coming.
As long as the possessor of a handgun in public is not treated as a terrorist, the killing will continue.
Have you watched our TV, seen our movies, played our video games? The solution they offer to almost any problem involves some sort of violence, usually with a gun. Add to that the ease at which anyone can get a deadly weapon and you get this result.
Because we teach children that "Everyone's a Winner" from the time they are born. Then when they find out that isn't the case and that they've been lied to. Some of them snap because they can't handle it. Think about it. When did this kind of mass murder in schools start. Late 90s. Right about the time this kind of PC BS was in full swing.
The U.S. has the highest school murder rate out of developed countries and also some of the most relaxed gun laws. Wow, what a big coincidence.
god, guts and guns...
Guns don't kill people, people WITH guns kill people.. and all the laws in the world will NOT make things change, except unarm the people that can legally have guns, so that those who have guns illegally can easily steal/rob/kill them. Extra laws/exessive laws do NOT Help the lawlessness of those that dont care about the laws
All I can say is that Thank God he, or someone in his family, were allowed the God Given American Right to buy and own a firearm with out the Obama-Government stepping in and the Obama-nanny telling them how to live. As soon as we get a good solid NRA supporting Fundamentalist Christain Republica in office, then we can arm All the school kids and everyone will be safe once and for all.
I assume you're trying to be ironic.
You think inner city schools are safe, you should come to Memphis. We have elementary kids bring gun to schools here all the time. Just a few weeks ago a high school student was shot after a game and killed. You just don't ever hear about it in the national news , but believe me it is far from safe in the city.
Simple really, it is the huge amount of non-whites in America.
Ill tell you two problems one parents not being involved in their kids life. Second not able to fight back in school. There are so many harsh punishments for kids trying to fight back against bullys. It used to take a beat down to a bully to shut them up. Now the bully gets away being a jerk and the one being bullied gets suspended.
For all the heart, and love, and unity we say we have as a country, we don't. Our greed and fear keeps us apart. And then this happens in quiet little town where people say something like this isn't supposed to happen. Well, it does. And how many more need to die before we live up to who we say we are?
"But the reason we have an American school shooting problem that exceeds other nations has to do with access to loaded weapons by kids who should not have that access." And until we get serious with gun owners who do not have their firearms secured, the problem will continue. Reports say this boy stole the gun from his uncle. Was the gun loaded? Locked up? If it was just lying around loaded then this uncle needs to take responsibility.
Why? Because of degenerative American upbringing; one can feel it from some of the comments made on this thread.
Growing up, if one had a problem with another it was handled after school, in the park and it was done. If you were dumb enough to shoot your mouth off again after getting your butt whipped, you got it again. Today, kids can't do anything. The mere mention of a fight between kids these days brings in the local swat team, anger management counselors and instant suspensions. They have no outlet and have been brought up to think as a gun as a power symbol.
As kid we were taught to respect firearms in my family. The family gun cabinet was in my bedroom. I knew better than to play with guns....my dad would have whooped my butt if I took a gun out that cabinet if weren't for the purpose of hunting or target shooting. This incident is a result of poor parenting and a society that thinks that everything in this world should be painted with butterflies and unicorns.
bingo!
We haven't seen a report yet from the press on how the kid got the gun. The handgun should have been in a gun safe, with a security lock on it... not under a pillow somewhere, or in a drawer.
We're becoming #1 in all the worst ways and I'm uncertain if we have the will or vision to turn that trend around. We should be investing in education, providing for the health of all citizens, building up our infrastructure, etc, etc but most of our "representatives" simply play us against one another to stay in power.
I am in highschool right now as a senior and most of the comments i have just read talk about prevention and makeing sure everyone is caring about each other and all that hand holding crap. My school does all that stuff now and what most people dont see is our point of view. When we go through those anti-bullying lessons most take them as jokes and we just day dream till they are over,the lessons have no real effect and most people also say we need to control gun laws....bullcrap i firmly belive the right to bear arms but it is the neglagance of parents who dont keep their weapons properly secure and away from their children. Also recently in my area there have been a big amount of teen suicide, so everyone jumps on the band wagon of stopping teen suicide well we all know that within a month no one will care anymore until it happens again just like these school shootings. So in the end im just saying there is no real way to stop school shootings completely if someone wants to do it they will. People just need to be ready if they do happen and take action like tackle the crap out of the gunman instead of staying put waiting for them to walk around. It sounds cold but we just need to mourn those who have been lost and move on.
LMAO – you americans so funny. Here in Russia, if we have children that would take guns to school, they will be sent off to Siberia along with their parents for severe hard-labor conditions, very little food, and torture. You americans need to change your laws. In Russia there is no such thing as school shootings because of "bullying."
I see the anti gun people are out in force as usually so predictable. Never wanting to look at the real issue always blaming objects. Do you people want to ban cars too? Sigh, did you ever stop to think that its the absence of the guns that is doing this. OF course not cause you feel and react instead of using your head. Its the only thing children do NOT get an education on.
You can ignore the facts all you like but that doesn't make them go away. In similar countries the more guns you have in the public's hands the more gun deaths you have. Simple.
And yet the murder rate in the US has DROPPED 52% since the majority of US states passed "shall issue" concealed weapon laws that allow almost any adult citizen with a clean record to carry a loaded concealed gun almost anyplace they go.
Gun murders down.
Gun crimes down.
Gun accidents down.
Looks like your theory is full of fail.
Among technologically advanced countries
your all gay
It's more of a deeply ingrained culture where the gun is worshiped in America. The nonsense of the 2nd amendment is just that nonsense, as it relates to a very different time in our nation's history. Anyone who think's we need guns in the event we need to revolt against our own government is just ludicrious. The power people have will not come from the end of a gun, but from our ability to effect change with our vote, our knowledge, our abilities, and our desire to see such changes that benefit all of the people. Guns won't do that. Some will argue that "guns don't kill people, people kill people" is an argument that can be applied to everything in life. It is an argument that simply fails and fails miserably. If it had any merit, than all drugs for example should be legalized since "it's people that use drugs, drugs don't use people". Sad, but that is the state of America where guns and religion share an unholy alliance. Guns for legitimate hunting is one thing, handguns serve only to be used on other people. Simple as that.
Sounds like Jake wants to start another civil war buy having our government go door to door and taking away peoples guns. That will have a pleasant ending.
Indeed. People have the idea of guns and 'freedom' tied up in so much mythology that it's impossible to even have a real discussion about them.
bahahhaha tell that to Syria. What ever dude. Clinton: Arming Syrian rebels could help al Qaeda
'Simple as that'? Couldn't be farther from the truth. Responsibility and respect. Period. From the youngest to the oldest, proper responsibility for our actions, words, and thoughts as well as respect for ourselves and those around us will go much farther in preventing this type of tragedy than whining about it and pointing fingers.
As for my handguns, you may come get them if you think you can, it will not be effective. They are secured with fingerprint-identification security, trigger and mechanism locks where possible. I will prevent you from taking them, period.
Be responsible, be respectful. Don't ignore instances where someone is being mis-treated, look up from your phone and get involved with the world around you. Quit blaming everyone else.
Yes, simple as that. Your security is only as good as the technology is today. Tomorrow, that could change. We see the most elaborate and advance security systems get compromised. And yes, you are among the few that goes that extra mile to secure your handguns. Unfortunately, that doesn't apply in the majority of cases. Most handguns kept in homes are easily accessible to others as we see too often time and time again. The reality is that Americans more than any other group are hopelessly in love with guns. But as a former law enforcement officer, I have seen that love affair quickly change when it strikes home, a child losing their life playing with a gun, a relative "borrowing" it for "protection" or for a host of other reasons, some well intentioned, others not. Having seen the damage it can do to a human body or to a family never enters the mind of people when they are in love with guns. Regret and hate follows then. Trust me, it's not a pretty sight or one that you can forget. Having retired 10 years ago, I have yet to carry a firearm since then even though I can. Never used it then when working, nor need it now. And no...the government isn't coming to you door to take your guns, nor is the government going to abolish the rights and freedom of the people. Maybe 200 years ago, but not in this day and age. A rather childish argument for those that believe that.
Jake wants our guns.
Jake needs to be aware of the answer Americans will give him: "Molon Lave!"
"Come and try to take 'em!"
You'll get our bullets first.
Why does America lead the world in school shooting..well how about some psycho babble.. maybe too much babble..
Because own kids have easy access to weapons.weapons make anybody powerful,.but even without guns they would could still use knifes.(when I was growing up I remember a kid got knifed at one of our high school, and many fist fights in schools),.or other weapons..we are a society that glamorizes weapons...and fighting..
And because our schools are one of the few places where kids from many different backgrounds all come together in close contact on a day to day basis...the rich the poor...the popular the unpopular...the smart and the rest...many different cultural backgrounds, our schools have to deal with the many prejudices, that the students and staff.. carry with them, have learned from their parents, and the society all around them... and like all animals we have a natural pecking order, which try as we might to control, still have, and kids and staff, are not always kind, we are humans, we have faults, ...and kids go through a lot of changes in body, mind, and emotions, and different friends, from kinder garden to 12th grade or even in College...because people learn in different ways, and our schools are based on competing, grading, promoting success, and punishing failure..Some kids have a plan for after they graduate, talk about it a lot, some do not, and are a little afraid and worried...we don't always recognize each student gifts, and strengths, but point out they weaknesses, we don't always offer enough help, or offer too much, try to control to much...And our kids are using social media so much...which is a double sided technology like all technology is..it can help and hurt, it can make us stronger, or tear us down...And kids have reached the age where they no longer believe in Santa Clause and see the world for what it is, see their parents for what they are, or at least think they do... and wonder where they are going to go next..All through school things are planned for them...and after graduation they maybe on their own...and they see that coming too..
So where were all the school shootings, back before 1968 and the Gun Control Act?
Back in those days, anyone could buy a gun for under $20. Just tear the ad out of the back of Popular Mechanics and drop it in the mail with a money order, and a couple of weeks later it'd be delivered to your door by the mailman.
No ID required. No questions asked.
The US government would even sell you a semi-automatic rifle and all the ammo you wanted, for pennies a round.
Guns were sold at Sears, at JC Penney's, at K-Mart. Guns and ammunition were for sale in gas stations and hardware stores. You could buy a military semi-automatic rifle at Wollworths.
Yet no one was taking a gun to school and shooting as many of their classmates as they could.
Why is this more of a Problem in the US? More than anything, it boils down to parenting, or the lack thereof. From the parents of bullies not teaching their children how to properly treat and respect others, to the parents of the perpetrators who are completely oblivious to their childs issues, this is an issue of parenting. In every case where this has happend, the perpetrator was found to be an outcast, the child who did not fit in, and was picked on for it. The victims are most often those classmates who that child saw as their tormentors. As the facts of this story unfold, I am confident that this will yet again be the case.
I empathize with the parents of all of these children, victims and perpetrators alike. But they all could have taken steps to prevent things from reaching this point. If you teach your children the following things, these situations can be avoided.
1. Don't be a bully. Treat every other person the same way that you would want to be treated.
2. If you see bullying occurring, stand up against it. All it takes for evil to succeed is for good men to do nothing (I don't remember who said this, but it is eternally true.)
3. Know how to react if you are bullied. Learn strategies for evading these situations, but in every instance, report it to a person of authority. You are not a victim until you surrender your personal power to resist and protest.
4. If you are a person in authority, look out for this kind of behavior. Bullies know their behavior is not acceptable, and will avoid doing it in front of authority figures. If you do see it, and you do not act on it, it will only embolden the bully, and further alienate the victim. (see item 2 above).
5. If you are a parent, pay attention when the school calls with concerns. Teachers and Administrators do not have the time to call parents randomly over small things. Normally, by the time they make the decision to call home, the situation has become significant.
Folks it is time to address the real problem. It is a problem that has been creeping in our school system for years. It is the new age parent. These parents have no idea how to raise kids. Discipline is a thing of past. These new age parents control how our kids are taught. Even in high performing charter schools such as DSST. These new age parents wield the power to force teachers to be a child’s friend rather than to push and educate them. This has a trickle down affect with schools and how they view security. Schools don't take security seriously. Because parents all say my little Johnny would never hurt anyone. Well folks two things.
1) Your child may or may NOT be an angel
2) Teachers are not there to be your child's friend. They are there to teach and push them to have a chance in life. Not everyone is a winner. When you lose you need to get back up and work harder.. Where has this lesson gone?
It is time to take some decision power away from the new age parent. These new age parents are idiots and can't be trusted to make decisions that are beneficial for all of society. These shootings make me so mad because they are preventable. All it takes is one principle to stand up and look these new age parents in the eye and lay the law down on them. We need to start holding these new age parents accountable. period. I am talking jail time, prison. If you are too busy to know what your kid is doing and when. If you let your kid be the parent and decide everything for them self. If you can’t discipline your child. Then you don't deserve to be a parent and you need to be taken out of the equation. period.
Spare the rod, spoil the child. You hit it right on the head!!!!
Dan, excellent comment. The problem is that the school's hands are tied. You cannot discipline in public schools and the staff AND students know that. The Principal can do nothing when some kid has a parent who's an attorney that will take them [and the district] to court – based on some infringement on their rights. Isn't that how we lost prayer in school ?
I know of one kid in our school district whose Attorney "Mom" literally waits for ANY incident at school involving their child – no matter how frivolous – that can be used as the basis for such a lawsuit. They make $$ of it AND a name for themselves in the process. It sucks, but there's nothing that can be done.
Ask the NRA.
When you Take God out of the equation of anything these are the problems that occur. PRAYER is the key, and no prayer in schools/anywhere causes many problems.
How is prayer going to help? There were school shootings long before prayer was removed from school. And in terms of violence... Muslim terrorists likely pray several times a day.
What a well written article. Frank really worked at being objective and factual. He is a real accademic intellectual. As neutral as he was some glaring facts brought to light two real differences between the US and other countries. Poor health system and easy access to guns are the big differences. So as a liberal I beseech the conservatives to please stop killing Americans. Why do you hate us so?
Dr. Ochberg's factors all play into this event and many others in our society but he skirts around the issue possibly to offend no one..
We have come to the point where no one is responsible for his or her actions. All difficult situations can be blamed on someone or something else. Adults, parents and children have to be held responsible and accountable, no excuses. If we ever get back to responsibility and accountable being a core port of our day to day lives, I don't think we will see events like this happening.
(It is common knowledge that the U.S. has far more gun deaths than any other country in the world)
Interesting.... Syria has, in the last couple months, outdone the US for the entire year. I could add several other countries which far exceed the US.
OR, i could add several African countries that have machete deaths which exceed the gun deaths in the US.
US rates of violent crime involving guns are FAR below those of many countries with much stricter gun laws.
Mexico for one. "Oh, but that's because of smuggled American guns!"? Then let's look at Venezuela. Brazil. Guatemala. El Salvador.
Russia has a murder rate well above that of the US. Are US guns being smuggled into Russia?
South Africa seems to lack a border with the US, yet has a murder rate far above that of the US.
Of all the western countries, only America has a gun culture that sees nothing wrong in settling grievances, real or perceived, with a gun. We are also the only country where guns are everywhere and there are no limits to the type or capacity.
And yet our murder rate is well below that of Western nations such as Mexico, Venezuela and Brazil. The US rate is, in fact, lower than that of most countries in the Americas, in spite of most having much more restrictive gun laws.
The US murder rates-both with and without guns-are below those of a number of European countries as well.
Good breakdown of the problem. I agree, the gun issue is paramount to finding a solution. Lock the guns up, find a way to keep them away from children and young adults. Especially if they are showing signs of instability. Use common sense.
Kids here can be faced with some complicated situations from pretty early on. Here's a example. A 6 year old kid (1st year of elementary), comes home from school and enjoys drawing pictures of "best friends" and names them every now and then. Suddenly one day, the kid excludes several of these "best friends." Ask the kid why, and the answer that came back was...."they told me that I can only be their friend, not their best friend, because my skin color is *****".
I've got two words for you....GUN CONTROL. Duh!!!! I am so lucky to live in Canada
I disagree with this article. Is there more access today to guns than there was say, 30 years ago? No. I say the rise in violence corresponds with the prevalent use of violent video games. My son asked me the other day Can I get "Battlefield" like some of his friends have. I said "show me what it is"–so he looked up some kind of trailer on the computer and showed me. In this game, the player is a shooter in the army and is shooting people including injured people hiding behind cars trying to avoid getting shot. I said to him "No way. War's not a game. You're not getting it." He didn't accept the no–he kept badgering me about it. But I stood firm. He doesn't have the game and he won't get it. What message do these types of games teach our kids? That it is entertaining to shoot a wounded person who is hiding. Very sad. Pretty pathetic in this rich technologically advanced society that that is the best we can offer for entertainment. Pathetic. Parents need to put their foot down and tell their kids no, they can't play these types of games. Way too parents have become total pushovers and feel like little Johnny will be scarred for life if he doesn't get the latest video game all his friends have. Oh please. Be your kid's parent and not his best buddy and we wouldn't have all these problems. It starts with the parents not giving their kids' guidance.
Tanya, you think you are doing good as a parent by restricting your son from playing that game but guess what? ALL the other kids his age have that game. If you educated your child properly he would know the difference between video games and reality. Now hes just going to play that game at a friends house and rebel against you. good job... See it's behind the times thinkers like you that cause kids to be rebelious. You sound like a horrible mother for a young boy. Next your going to not allow him to play army outside with his friends using plastic guns. Do us all a favor and stop living in the past. Kids are smarter these days and your parenting technique is going to cause a backlash in the future.
Dan, thanks for your input, but I am confident about my decision not to let my son play "Battlefield". I am well aware he will play it at his friends' houses and I have told him he can do that. But I have put my foot down about him or me buying the game for him or him playing it in this house. I would rather have him rebel against me later (there is nothing wrong with rebelling against your parents to some degree) than encourage him to develop insensitivity towards other people's suffering, war, or shooting others. If he needs therapy for that later on, I'll pay for it. Something tells me that's not going to happen though–I don't think lots of psychologists offices are filled with people lamenting that their parents encouraged them not to be insensitive to war and suffering.
Because most parents fail and dont know how to properly raise their children.
WE GLORIFY THE ALL MIGHTY GUN! THE NRA, GUN SHOWS LAS THAT ALLOW SAME DAY PERCHASE WITHOUT BACKGROUND CHECK, VIDEO GAMES, SAD BUT TRUE..............................
Why does America lead the world in school shootings? Who's doing the shootings?
Maybe because elsewhere, like Homs, kids are too busy getting shot at to even make it to school.
Too many kids are growing up in a unhealthy environment and like animals are sadly considered 'disposable'! Guns are still easily available. You have a society in which too many people don't respect one another.
USA has the highest crimes in the world even more than in Mexico. Reason is guns are easy and almost free in this country.
Move to Juarez and preach about how good you are for not owning a gun.
Yes, we have a LOT to teach Mexico about gun deaths.
Total firearm-related death rate per 100,000 people by Country:
12. Mexico - 12.07
13. United States - 10.27
Maybe part of the reason these poor little rich white kids in the USA are more likely to shoot up their schools is because they don't have bigger issues to worry about – like, say, kids in Somalia, China, Russia, Mexico, etc.... No wars going on around them, no armies of children soldiers, no forced child labor, and so on.
How am I ever supposed to feel safe putting my child in any school system? He is only one, but with all of this happening, I am seriously thinking of turning towards home-schooling but that is completely impossible because the way the economy is, my boyfriend and I both have to work to keep our home and maintain the lifestyle we do for our son and my boyfriend's daughter. We need to stop fighting about the cause of how it happened (to protect our guns, and children that are bullies, or children that feel the need of violence and death as an answer to have their voices be heard). Maybe it's how were raising our children? Maybe it's parent's guns? Maybe it's our school systems? I don't know what it is, but it's about time we figure out the cause so we can fix this problem. I'm a very open mindedm person, but how are these kids getting the guns? Why are no kids standing up to bullies in their schools? Why hasn't our schoo systems worked to find an answer sooner or a solution, I realize it isn't them who is supposed to be looking for an answer, but someone needs to protect my child when it is his turn to go to school! There is no punishment that will fix this! The kids are crying out for help! SOMEONE LISTEN!
You know while schools have problems with violence the most likely place for a child to experience and witness violence is still the home.
I agree, I don't want to blame anyone in my post, but there are many factors that apply to these situations. I just hope someone finds an answer so this won't happen again.
Another win for the NRA, good job America, keep putting those guns out there! I wonder if your founding fathers ever envisioned that your second amendment would make it so easy for a child to obtain a gun and murder. This child killed children with a gun, what would of happened if he did not have such access to a gun? What would of been the outcome if all he had access to was a bat or a knife? With estimates between 200 and 350 million guns in America there is little doubt that these shootings will ever stop and if anything will increase because of the celebrity status these killers get. You talk about bullying, teachers not having the ability to discipline, warning signs on social media, all of this means noting when a child who lacks the maturity or cognitive ability to deal with life problems rationally has access to a gun. Good work USA, keep it up and you will keep the #1 in the world for school shootings for decades to come.
Simple answer: the fabric of society is shredding. Kids have violent role models, the media plays up violence every chance it can get; parents have to work two jobs thus not being home for family meals, easy access to guns, violent video games and politicians who paint targets on the backs of their opposition. When the fabric of society unravels all hell breaks lose in these conditions. We need more positive role models everywhere (politics; movies; media and especially in the home) regulations that make if difficult for kids to get easy access to guns and more parental involvement in kids lives.
It's getting worse by the generations it seems.
That is basically correct. Google Gabor Mate to read more about the destruction of American childhood.
It was question on Fox News, on 12.10.11. : “ Should student with gun permit be aloud to carry gun on Campus”????? In Virginia , Law said: if you are over 18. years old and you have gun permit, you should be aloud to carry gun everywhere???
1.Students go on school / Collage to study. There is NO one reason for them to carry gun on school / Campus ( Campus already have security). If young people want to carry gun, they should go to military or Law Enforcement.
2. As I know , is NOT that difficult to get Gun Permit in Virginia : take a class, go with instructor on ranch to shoot a gun, and apply for gun permit.
3.We are talking about better education in this country. When I send my son in school / or to study on Collage in Virginia, I expected him to focus ONLY on studding…I do NOT want to worry should he stay alive or NOT ??!
Federal Gov. and Attorney General should bring Law: NO guns on Campus or school in ALL States.
REALLY AMERICA??? REALLY??? You need to ask why you lead the world in school shootings?
I have been confused about somethig all my life. Why someone who talks to an imagined object insist that if I also talk to his imagined object that it will make my life better? Even more confusing is this person really believes if everyone talked to his imagined friend the world would be better. At 6 years I had an imagined friend, a six foot rabit named Harry. I got over it along with my blanket.
If you wish to make this debate purely about gun access I would like to ask a question .How come It is always boys that commit these horrors girls have just as much access to guns to me this suggest there is much more to it then access to guns. And while the parents and students involved need more than just prayers they have mine. And by the way I'm a gun-owner and a liberal who would like to ask Mr. Brown where he got his information because who knows how many guns are in Mexico or Pakistan.
And where do Mexico and Pakistan get their guns??? The good ole USA! Look at the export numbers, guns = big money, big money = rich politicians who are lobbied by gun advocates. The cycle will never stop as long as long as America continues with a dysfunctional political system that revolves around who can pay me the most money for my vote.
Why does the US have school shootings? The reason is because parents are terrible at there job. When I was a kid we had access to many firearms. They were never played with and nobody was ever killed or injured. Just don't shoot people. It really is that easy.
The truth is we are a large country with a diverse set of cultures and within those cultures are a subset of cultures. High School outside of the classroom is nothing short of Tribal Warfare. It has been since the first jock beat up the first geek. The difference between the 50's and 60's and now is what used to be settled in the parking lot with fists is now settled in the classrooms with guns. The weak can win with fists, they can win with guns.
The media also plays a role in all of this. Think about a rebel faction who gets notified that there is a way to level the playing field with the oppressive government. A gun levels the playing field.
If every day you came into work scared that somebody was going to punch you or pick on you and you didn't have the option to quit wouldn't you eventually break? Now what if you were especially different or socially awkward and it was an entire tribe of people who picked on you and made you feel worthless for being an individual. What if 5 days a week this happened multiple times through the day.
The gun is a means to an end of suffering, Much of this country is desensitized to violence through 24hour news, violent entertainment and glorification of war. A gun is the last refuge of the weak to fight back against the strong. there are two choices here.. EIther you have a wholesale change and collapse in culture like the Romans of old. OR you give as much protection to school children as you do prison inmates because you are forcing them into a prison of sorts anyway..
American works longer/harder hours than most other countries...we're so busy that we don't have the time to really connect w/our kids anymore, sad because this is what happens when you live in a society that lives to work. We need to spend some time w/the kids,find out what's going on in their lives and really talk. That also goes for those parents who notice that their kids are cruel to others or hear rude/horrible things coming out of their mouths all the time and do nothing about it. I hate to say it, but kids are cruel to each other and many (NOT all) have no respect or regard for what they say to their peers, and this is what happens. People can gripe about gun control all you want...the real question is WHERE did this kid learn that the best way to handle this was to shoot someone? A kid can make ANYTHING lying around the house a deadly weapon, so if they really want to kill they will do it, gun control isn't the problem. Should we ban steak knives because some kids can get hold of them and stab people? Anyone can get a gun if they really wanted to, whether obtained legally or not. My question is WHERE did he get the idea that shooting and killing a person was the only solution? You have to understand, teens are full of hormones, brain development is not totally complete so their thought processes aren't always rational like most adults. Maybe if the grandparents/friends/family had paid attention, talked to him, offered advice, gotten him help for depression, counseling, locked up their guns and talked to the school about any bullying instances, he would've felt like someone cared about his problems..but no one saw anything wrong so this was his solution. Very sad.....
The article was pretty pointless and failed to point out why America stands out as the capital of school shootings. The comparisons to other countries does not seem to be well researched. What bothers me most are the counterexamples offered to the reverence for violence in the US. Terrorism does not automatically mean that the people living near it or in it will revere and accept violence. Besides violence in African child armies, the Balkans, Ireland, and North African terrorist camps do not seem to be related specifically to school shootings so I don't quite understand why those were brought up as examples.
These punks should be fighting with their fist. Onlythe chickens use guns to fight. Please stop this bully talk oh boo-whooo they are picking on me.
No excuse.........
Children are expelled for fist fighting these days. Doesn't leave many options for the oppressed kids.....
This guy knows whats up.
It happens because we have no deterrents...
Why does the author not address parent responsibility?
Gun control is not the answer, neither is increased security at schools. The answer is fairly obvious, hold parents accountable for the actions of their children. As long as parents are able to avoid responsibility for how they raise their children, they will never give them the attention or discipline required. As long as the crime is committed by a minor, the parent or guardian should face the same penalty as the minor committing the crime. Then you will see adults pay attention to the kids because they must.
simple! The US is the angriest and most frustrated country on earth. Greed has spoiled this country!
It's because our kids are undisciplined and ignored. Plain and simple.
Hey people! Don't think to hard about it! It's not rocket science! What did kids do for entertainment in, say, the 1950's? Games like hopscotch, jacks, marbles, hide and seek. Ok–what about say, 30 years ago? Kids still played jump rope, hop scotch, hide and seek maybe played some pac man. Alright, what about nowadays? Kids play Halo, Battlefield, etc. etc. where, at least in Battlefield, one of the goals is to shoot a person hiding behind a car trying to escape being shot. Yeah, I know it's not a real feel-good thing to realize many of us parents have failed out kids by not being parents–I know that wouldn't make a good facebook status update–"Hey guess what I failed my kid by not being a parent!" but let's just cut the crap. Parents nowadays are the most selfish, self-absorbed people who no longer "parent" but merely try to be their kid's best friend. Try giving your kids some guidance parents. In the olden days, that's what parents did. Remember?!
well said
I grew up in the 50's. We played army, cowboys cops and PIs all day long. We drew/painted in school scenes of battles or gun fights. We pointed play guns at our friends and yelled "you're dead ... I just killed you" I know that some of my play mates would have used real guns at some point it they could have gotten them.
Keith–painting and playing cowboys and Indians is a world away from the video games these kids play nowadays. Try watching one sometime and see if your Mom and Dad would have let you play it back in the 1950's.
Remember when the U.S. was #1 in anything you could be proud of?
Because we have the right to have guns, no matter how much trouble they cause. Surprised we don't have the right to have high explosives, it just a tool, it's not the explosives that kills but the owner as the stupid arguments go
Thank you, article, for making a note that it has gotten better, NOT WORSE, over the years. At least that will cut down on doomsayers screaming the end is nigh in the comments.
As usual we focus on the spectacular and ignore the mundane. School shooting is about as common as getting hit by lightning, yet we act like it is epidemic. Instead of focusing on the exceptional, why dont we spend our time taking care off common issues like kids who refuse to wear seat belts, or kids who drive drunk, or kids who abuse drugs? We ignore a VASTLY larger cause of death and focus like a laser on the far more rare (but interesting) events. Maybe because we have discovered that there are no easy cures for the common issues, we hope to move onto the rare and have some impact there. Save a few and let the thousands die.
IMO, the article neglects one important factor. The perpetrators of mass shootings become instant celebrities with enduring fame. It would seem they crave the infamy. It makes them somebody important. I wonder if the notoriety were taken away, would it lessen the frequency of these tragedies. It sure worked at sporting events not to televise the nuts that run out onto the field. Within a single season, it almost became a non-issue.
Also, the anti-gunners miss a point. Why has school shootings become all too common? We've always had guns, but we haven't always had school shootings by deranged students. Heck, I'm old. I can remember bringing my shotgun to school for show and tell. It was kept safe, but teachers admired it and asked me how it handled in the field. So, what's changed since then? IMO, this is the important question no one wants to consider. To do so would make us question ourselves and our culture of selfishness. Our own immediate gratification is all important. Even when it means sacrificing the rights and well-being of others. Taken to the extreme, even other people’s lives are inconsequential.
People drown in swimming pools every year. We don't need swimming pools. Ban all swimming pools.
when was the last time a kid took a swimming pool to school and killed people ???
Because the Founding Fathers were Gods and absolutely nothing has changed since 1776.
I have a son with intermittent explosive disorder. When he explodes he becomes very irrational and at time talks about how he's going to kill any number of people that have been mean to him. If I had guns around the house, I don't doubt he would have used one to kill himself or someone else. We've found that marijuana is the most effective medication for helping his explosions happen less often and with less intensity. So, we keep lots of marijuana around the house for him and no guns. I think it is difficult for a teen to get a hold of a gun unless it is laying around their house. I think some parental education would go a long way. Maybe the gun companies need to put some money into advertising that educates parents; kind of like alcohol companies do for not drinking and driving.
USA! USA! We're number 1! How proud all of us should be! GUNS! GUNS! WE NEED MORE GUNS! And BIGGER guns! More guns please, so we may protect ourselves from the guns out there! Forget the fact that U.S. guns spur gun violence in Canada and Mexico. MORE GUNS!
GGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGGG
UUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUU
NNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNN
SSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS
!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
All you bleeding heart liberals are going to be happy that we have enough guns when the zombie apocalypse starts...
Why is the USA (not the other parts of north and south AMERICA) #1 in school shootings?
EASY answer: Because the USA believes that GUNS solve ALL arguments and disputes.
As Willie Horton might say ..."because that's where the guns are."
We have more schools. We have more students. We have more guns. We have more everything than everyone else.
You obviously have never heard of China or India? They have more pets than we have students.
NOBODY was shooting each other at School when I was Growing Up. Back then the Policeman wore BLUE and your Mom told you to Ask HIM for HELP – NOW the POLICE are dressed all in BLACK, like Darth Vader's Storm Troopers and Carry Machine guns and Arrive at your Door in a TANK carrying a Battering Ram and Tear Gas and Your HOUSE is BURNED to the GROUND. Your Mother WARNS you to stay OUT of Their SIGHT so they Don't Shoot You. Broadcast TV viewers are FORBIDDEN the Sight of Humans 'Loving' each others Bodies; but NIGHTLY see women DISEMBOWELED on a SLAB with Intense Fascination. When we wanted REVENGE for 19 Saudis and Pakistanis with Box Cutters Hijacking an Airplane on 911 – Bombing the DIRT in Afghanistan while the CIA Flew Bin Laden to a Hotel was not Good Enough – We had to DESTROY an Old Foe and KILL a MILLION Iraqis before our BLOODLUST was QUENCHED.
I want US to be numero uno in EVERYTHING including school shooting
QUESTION: Why is the US number 1 in school shootings ??
ANSWER: NRA
Please check your sources a little better. There were 32 killed at Virginia Tech and the shooter obtained his own gun from a reputable dealer. He was not a child but a sick adult.
Thank you for noting this. As a reputable news source, this information should be correct. There were 32 victims from the shooting at Virginia Tech, not including the gunman, who shot himself.
Face it. The gun nuts have won. There are so many guns out there that any kind of control is impossible. So we can took forward to having more gun murders, suicides, and accidents than any other developed nation. In fact, more than all the others combined.
The answer is pretty obvious – because we are number one in guns...
American leads in school shootings for the same reason America leads in nearly all other forms of violent crimes..We're a bunch of overfed, lazy, reckless idiots who lack personal accountability and responsbility. Lawyers and health care professionals tell us constantly that nothing is our fault and religious leaders tell us that God will forgive us our sins. We're over-medicated, under-educated and impulsive. Need more...
We are fast approaching a point where the only way to feel secure is to have to carry a gun. Is this what the founding fathers believed? Were Jefferson, Adams, Washington, and Madison packing at all times?
USA! Look at your media – where else on this planet would such stupidity as the TV 'program' SONS OF GUNS be rolled out as some bizarre form of national 'PRIDE'.
The featured gunshop owner is as whacked as they come. This is supposed to be a form of 'normal'. UNBELIEVABLE!!!
I think the article was good in stating all the symptoms that lead to a shooting, but it doesn't address the illness. Our children, our teens, have extended childhoods well beyond the high school years and spend too much time with other kids when they are in high school as opposed to being with adults and learning adult responsibilities. IT IS TIME FOR US TO CHANGE the high school format. The educational for today's kids are ancient and no longer work for this time and place. Teenagers don't need to spend time with other teenagers. They need to spend time with other adults and learn how and prepare for adulthood. High school does not prepare kids for adulthood as it stands. This is why we have school shootings. High school is like a form of prison where you are forced how to learn how to survive in an environment where you are trapped with a bunch of people your age, but not necessarily at your intelligence level... emotionally and otherwise.
Dawn says, "Our children, our teens, have extended childhoods well beyond the high school years and spend too much time with other kids when they are in high school as opposed to being with adults and learning adult responsibilities." You're on to something there, Dawn. Kids are isolating in their own subculture.
Too bad Rick Santurum wasn't speaking at the cafetaria and telling the kids why persuing a college education was worthless!
There are two reasons 1 most countries don't have near the number of schools that we have and 2 they don't report deaths at schools in other countries-do we count bombers who walk in blow everybody up? I will let my kids take their chances here in America versus any other country in the world.
Mike
Stop focusing only in the Middle East. The world consist of other countries you do know that right..
Because they took prayer out of schools!!! That's why we're #1 in school shootings!!
School fights used to be settled by fists. Robbers used to tie up victims. Suiciders used to go into the woods and shoot themselves alone. Now our respect for human life is so low people just kill anyone because they feel like it.
because this government is run by pansies
because religious leaders lie
because schools only teach to obtain federal funding
because greed is the standard for american values
because people only care about themselves
because as long as we act as individuals, we fail as a race
Can Newsweek come up with annual school shooting ratings as well ? The ranking doesnt matter. How does it matter if you cant even survive school. Junk the academic ratings and just come up with sick ratings, shooting ratings and rating as to how fast you can run from the school when shooting starts. Thats more important than the junk academic rating.
MEXICO is Becoming a Failed State like Somalia. Its DRUG GANGS have more and better Weapons than the ARMY. Where do the WEAPONS and MONEY come from? The Same Place MOST of the World's LAND MINES and BOMBS and MISSILES and DEATH come from – The Good Old People of the U.S.A.
1. we don't teach morals
2. we hold up athletes and celebrities as role models because of their money and skills even when they behave badly, are crude, immoral, etc.
3. we have very poor national leaders in politics, colleges, industry, labor unions ...
Lack of religion and prayer in schools. Look at the countries that allow religion in schools. Do you hear of this happening in those schools?
I disagree, Miss P. Most gun owners are Republicans, identify as Christian and include Christianity/prayer in their family lives, yet the actions of them or their children often defy the expected course. The only way to reduce gun crime is to reduce gun accessibility – something most die hard Christians would oppose.
While most legal gun owners are probably Republican indeed, I would wager that most gun crimes are committed by registered Democrats or people who favor the Democrat party. I spent many years working in a large jail and at least 75%(I'm being generous with that number) of the inmates would identify themselves as Democrats.
What countries allow religion in schools? As far as I know ONLY the USA yet most crimes by guns and by students and by every one else occurs.
Marta, with a name such as yours, you should know that Italians teach religion in school! And in most classrooms it's not uncommon to see a crucifix hanging on the wall behind the teacher's desk
Why is the US #1 in school shootings? Because a lot of parents and grandparents have guns that are accessible to their children, intended or not. By comparison, gun crime is virtually non-existent in less free countries such as China, North Korea, and almost every Muslim country in the world. Don't believe me? Look at Wikipedia's list of "List of countries by firearm-related death rate"
Yeah but what about "stone" related deaths? Or, the police took him and we've never seen him again deaths?
The article is about school shootings and their root cause. Your reply is not.
OK, but that doesn't make us right either. We can always improve. Otherwise let's take the society to the medieval period where "might was right". Oh, wait a sec, GOP does want s to get there.
The question why is America 1# in school shootings?
The answer is very simple, Because parents have decided to stay of parenting their children.
We as Americans beleive that is the goverment to teach our children and dont take our responsibility as parents.
Just looked at all the crime that have hit America most are from broken families or parents that dont spend time with their children. Our values have gone down the drain, our way to love have also die and the respect for other have disappear.
this issue has nothing to do with guns. THE ISSUE IS THE KIDS. growing up in a rich chicago suburb ive been surrounded by the evilest cretins in the world. i hated them so much i prolly should have shot them alll. but i chose the latter. cuz i know there is a society out there. and i am a part of it. We need to make it clear to the kids that each human is equally as important. make them work together... and i dont mean some stupid in class activity. i mean like put them in danger with their fellow comrades.... we will see how many of them will continue bullying when they are relying on each other to survive.
Wow!
> i hated them so much i prolly should have shot them alll
What generates so much hate?
You're a cretin. You "prolly" should have looked up "the latter" before you said you did it, because there is no first or latter in your sentence. If you don't have a gun, you can't shoot someone. Failure to make that simple leap of logic is what's wrong with you and all who think like you.
Oh, and also learn to punctuate, capitalize, and spell correctly before you put your opinions out there. Unless your purpose is to demonstrate exactly how ignorant you are.
Why are our schools #1 in shootings? Because they want to be #1 at *something*. This is *our* thing! Woot!
We're #1! We're #1!
I guess we have to ask the "White people " that one huh !!!
The law already prohibits everything that happened here, yet, it still happened.
So much for thinking more laws = more safe.
LOL SOMEONE ACTUALLY SAID BECAUSE WE DONT PRAY ENOUGH HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH THATS HALARIOUS
Same ole sh!t, different day. Get used to it, folks. These kids are simply using their "2nd Amendment Rights" to solve their problems.
Who can blame them when adults encourage doing the same? The only difference is that these kids actually stand by their convictions, as morally bankrupt as those convictions are.
without serious gun control like in other countries US will remain #1 in school shootings. it's only a question of time until the next incident...
"But guns do not kill ppl, other ppl do" NRA. The right wing just laps on this statement as gospel.
When we will have a general will in the country and politicians standing up to the gun toting individuals and adopt stricter legislation on gun access?
When you pry the gun from my dead fingers. And do you really think that those who want to commit gun violence will let their being illegal stop them from having them?
OK, then let's open it up so that I can get a bigger weapon than you. How ab't a tank, a nuclear weapon, a fighter jet? Where do we stop. Why are we allowing sale of guns openly at gun sows? Why are we allowing guns which can be easily converted to automatic. Yes, a sane and responsible person can have the right to own a gun but there should be some limits. This is a classic case where govt needs to step in and put limits and regulations on what you can possess.
When you get shot in the back of the head by the next gun lunatic walking the streets, then we will...
Murder is already illegal. That law didn't stop this guy.
Kids usually get guns from a relative. If the relative, who is often a law-abiding citizen, could not get their hands on a gun, then the child would also not likely get their hands on a gun.
Right now we don't know where the shooter got the gun. If it was from a family member who did not have it locked up and secured, then they should also be charged. Part of the responsibility of owning a gun is to make sure it does not get into unauthorized hands.
Guns are not the problem. Something else is going on here. In my day, many youngsters had access to guns, and they didn't go into their schools and randomly kill people.
Thanks to the Columbine shootings and other episodes like it, our schools now resemble prisons more than they do schools. Perhaps we shouldn't be surprised when youngsters act like prisoners. Police and security roaming the halls, drug- and gun-sniffing dogs, zero tolerance for children distributing Pez candy, or holding hands in the hall.... all of this, and it hasn't made schools one bit safer. Instead, it seems as if students want to do the very things that they are told they shouldn't do.
All this business about instilling self-esteem in students is BS. If you fail to teach students how to take criticism, or fail to teach them that self-respect requires respecting others, what else can you expect but a society filled with selfish, thoughtless, uncivil, and hateful people? At one time, I was told that most well-adjusted people think "I'm OK, you're OK," whereas criminals think "I'm OK, you're not OK." Are we raising hoods when we instill in them a sense of self-esteem without instilling an equal share of esteem for others?
Getting rid of ALL guns in the world would be like trying to get rid of all the mice in the world. Many drugs are illegal, yet look how the "war on drugs" just continues. The drugs aren't going away and neither will guns.
Because your society is dog eat dog. You have a ridiculous gun policy and your children are brats due to having been raised by brats with little or no concern for anyone but themself. Simple really, too bad it will never be fixed, what with the whole culture of...my ignorance is as valuable as your intelligence thing going on.
You are only partly right. Yes, we do have a dog-eat-dog society. That is evident by the hatred that we have of each other (Don't deny it, fellow Americans. I see it here in the comments every day. If you hate someone because his politics are different from yours, how much more will you hate him when you have a valid reason to?). And, yes, our children are brats who have been raised by brats. This is what happens when you pamper your children, side with them when they do something wrong, but otherwise ignore them because your own precious needs come first.
How about getting rid of guns.... very simple solution....
Not simple.
I see a kid got killed by a drunk driver today. Lets outlaw boose. and a knife, get those outlawed also. Its not a gun problem. its a parent problem becouse they drink instead od teaching thier kids. And guns will never be gone.
It IS a GUN PROBLEM !
Ease of access, availability. We're not back in 1776. No matter how many times the gun lobby repeats the old mantra of "guns don't kill people, people kill people", "pry it from my dead fingers", "the criminals will stil have the guns if you take away ours" it smacks of immaturity and toddler tantrums.
Bullying and retribution has been around since the year dot. The large majority survived it. Why is it that issues now get solved with guns and we are #1 – 'cus they are readily available and easy to get hold of. Heck, most 16 yr olds don't have a basic understanding of bodily functions, never mind the FINALITY of death! There is NO RESET button in life!
I am pretty sure the media should take a small piece of responsibility in these copy cat crimes....They are highly sensationalized and are boradcasted 24 hours a day. Don't get me wrong, they are horrific crimes but maybe if the media spent less time sensationalizing these stories the idea to do such a horrific thing wouldn't "pop" into the mind of troubled teens. We only really saw a surge in school shootings in the last 15-20 years. Interestingly right around the time networks began airing sensational news stories 24 hours a day.
You have a point.
I've been wondering lately if the problem might be cartoons. In the 'good old days' even young children could see that cartoons weren't real. The characters, and scenery, were 2-D with black outlines, etc. Today technology makes cartoons much more life-like, in appearance at least. Cartoons have always been violent and I don't think that will change-when you make non-violent cartoons children stop watching them. But cartoon violence is, or should be, distinctly different from real-world violence and I'm not sure that's true any more.
@Marcus – right – that will fix everything. Till the next kid stabs someone, and we get rid of knives. Then someone gets killed by a stone, so we get rid of them to....
Why is the U.S. number 1 in school shootings? Because ANYONE can buy a gun. Duh. This question reflects why U.S. students do so poorly in school, as perhaps the writer of this headline did.
I see alot of people saying guns did this. How many youth died becouse of cars and drunk drivers today. We dont talk about drunks becouse god forgive they loose there boose. Guns are not the problem. They are just a tool. Less people die from guns in US than many other ways.
Lane, you're really going to compare the overuse of guns here in America to traffic accidents. REALLY? You need your gun that badly? You need to have gun rights so badly that you plow over the real reason students kill each other? BECAUSE THEY HAVE ACCESS TO GUNS!!!!
We don't talk about it because it happens so often. This is news because it doesn't happen so often.
As a percentage of population, Israel probably has more guns than the US, but we don't hear of such violence there, and once must acknowledge that Israelis live under far greater day-to-day stress than we do here in the US.
That suggests there is more to the story than just guns. IMO, there are so many factors.
a. breakdown in families: Less parental involvement, perhaps because both parents are required to work these days. If we are able to go back to the days of single incomes (at least while the children are in their formative years) perhaps that could help. Note that in decades past, we had freer access to guns, but no such a degree of gun violence.
b. reality TV: we have become inured to "real life" drama played out in prime time TV, and we, as a culture, celebrate that stuff on TV. Kids are becoming desensitized to violence.
c. playtime for kids: almost doesn't exist anymore! Everything is highly organized from the time the child is born! Whatever happened to pick-up games invented by the kids? Of course, it ties back to parental involvement and easy access to violence (in video games, on TV, in movies, in books)
d. hardening of the right-wing/left-wing culture: few people in power preach compromise or looking for common solutions; all we hear and read has to do with demonizing, vilifying, putting down. No wonder what our kids learn from a very early age is that it's OK to hold extreme positions on anything.
e. dumbing down: there's a pervasive culture that denigrates intellectual achievement, that seems to worship not knowing, and to wear ignorance as a badge of honor
I grew up in Canada where guns aren't as readily available. As a kid (especially if you're a boy), you often feel the need to get even with the kid that troubles you. My only option was to punch the guy's face, gut or have a fist fight, like real men! We got detention or worst case scenario, expelled but that's the end of it. You got your revenge and the person never bothered you again and both of you went your own ways.
With guns readily available, these boys can never be real men. They will always be cowards who need the help of a tool to get even. Neither will they be fit mentally to deal with situations at a psychological level nor physically fit to kick someone's a$$. At the end of the day, there are just lives lost..nothing more.
Say what you will about gun accessibility. I say yes you should take them away from everyone because simple truth is that as humans we didn't get to where we are today by not making use of tools that are readily available to us. It's in our history, it's in our blood and when a tool is available, we make use of it. Look at any other first world country that doesn't have gun access readily avaialble. The violent crime rate is much lower. It's time to get off our high horse and learn from the rest of the world for once.
Take a walk sometime in Britain and tell me how safe it is. The yobs there don't need guns to kill or injure someone, or to vandalize property.
I find it terrifying that so many people are ASKING for their rights to be taken away because 1 person out of millions went off the deep end. If he didn't have a gun, it would have been a bomb, a knife, a car, poisoning the cafeteria food, etc. If someone is set on doing others harm, they'll find a way to do it. Taking away the rights of everyone else to try to prevent 1 person out of millions for doing a crime is unacceptable.
If someone threatens a high-ranking political official, do we take away freedom of speech? No. When someone drives drunk and kills someone, do we ban cars and alcohol? No.
But when it comes to firearms, people lose all common sense. People fear what they don't understand. All they see is "guns are scary! eeek!". Guess what? My grandma thinks the same about black people, because she is ignorant about them. I'd bet money that nearly 100% of people screaming "ban guns" have probably never even touched one, let alone learned how to safety handle and shoot it. It's an irrational fear of an inanimate object.
I think the people screaming for gun bans would be surprised to know how many people they com in contact, upstanding members of society, that are gun owners: doctors, nurses, lawyers, teachers, computer programmers, accountants, business owners, etc. Unfortunately people let the media dictate their thoughts, and the media says gun owners are either stupid rednecks or gang members.
You are wrong Abby.. I know some very respectable law-abiding gun owners. Myself included. However, there is absolutely no reason to won a hand gun – unless you are Police or Military. They are NOT designed for hunting. They are designed to KILL PEOPLE. Period. Simple. Ban them – except when required to do your job.
Personal protection is a very real reason to own a handgun. I can't very well carry a rifle or shotgun around. I'm a 115 pound, 20-something woman; you think I could fight off a man trying to do me harm? No, I am physically smaller and weaker, I would be overpowered. A firearm evens the odds.
And by the way, I legally carry my handgun. I have my CCW permit. CCW permit holders are statistically far less likely to commit a crime, even a misdemeanor, than the average American citizen. Taking away the rights and means for law-abiding citizens to protect themselves only hurts the "good guys", and it makes the job of the "bad guys" easier and less hazardous.
how about fixing society so that kids have a "future"? Identify the problem if you want a solution. Taking away the tool won't fix anything, because there are a MILLION ways to kill.
:3 how about we get rid of gu-SHUT THE F**** UP. how about you get rid of the guns and ill sit here and watch. you guys are all hopeless. but its ok cuz eventually the psychopaths u created will destroy all you bumbling idiots .
God bless America, bless us Lust, Gluttony, Greed, Laziness, Wrath, Envy, Pride, and certainly bless us with the firepower to carry out these sins. Amen.
To quote district judge Martin..."With rights come responsibilities. The more people abuse our rights, the more likely that we're going to lose them," he said. " We need to start policing up our own actions, using common sense, in how we deal with others."
A very sad time in our country. I pray for all the victims, their families, and all our young people. There is such a demand for separation of church and state, but after terrible tragedy, helping others with prayer may be permitted, that is until the atheists sue again. I guess praying, talking about God along with treating others with love and kindness is just too inflammatory, and offends some people. Could it be that permitting God and prayer in school might actually help our young people, encourage them to want to help others, and treat others with love, kindness, and respect?
Putting YOUR god in school prayers might work for you Ruiz, but not everybody in America believes in your god...that's why it's schools don't have prayer.
How do you know which God is my God, pastmorm? It is a sad time in our country when atheists can take away freedoms than those who believe in God. I will continue to pray for our country, how about you?
I'm sure that a tragety like this, students will be called together to pray, but after this tragety passes, "oh, no, don't pray! don't mention God!"....Most poeple in this country just become "faithful" & only pray when something goes bad. Pretty sad....Plus, kids aren't taught to respect life..They're just told to engage in gratification and have abortions.
The public schools educates nothing but the culture of life. If the child doesn't get the "correct" teachings from home, they are to be in big trouble.
Instead of pointing the finger at the "outcast" and the "bullies", maybe the parents and the teachers need to look at themselves for what they teach (or lack of what they teach) to the children in the USA?
We have more shootings here in American because of the gun laws. We have more shootings here in the US because of our school system (the one that Bush installed). We have more shootings here in the US because per capita, there are fewer intelligent people compared to other countries. We have more shootings in the US because we're a violent nation by nature.
Access to guns-plain and simple We've had some school shootings in Canada. A couple of big ones at the college level. We have far less access to guns but probably more than Europeans.
When the federal government stepped in long time ago and said you should not discipline your kids, they took over. Now you want an answer why kids do what they do. Very simple, the government said you can't touch them so they run rampant and do what ever the hell they want to do.
"You take them from people, the criminals will find a way to get them... and if not that, they will find a way to make one." criminals aren't smart enough to make guns. they are criminals because of inferior intellect and laziness to get legitimate employment. The guy whose life story inspired the movie "Goodfellas" summed it up: "Work is for suckers."
Why is no one talking about the parents being mostly responsible? Teach your kids to treat others with respect. Teach them about being bullied and being a bully, Talk to them, communicate all aspects of life. Teach them right from wrong. Put down your electronics and listen to them. Kids don't just up and shoot someone. They need their parents, parent, to teach them how to conduct themselves in the world. What happened to learning right from wrong? It needs to start at a very early age. Trust me, I know. I raised three amazing boys.
"coder" that was an interesting reply
Why is the USA #1 in school shootings? HHHmmmm, politically correct BS–cuasing favoratism to some groups and alienation of others, no prayer in schools (can't have the 10 commandments in the schools–wouldn't want to have kids learn to not kill, steal and to not be lustful!), no teaching of morals, the teachers worry more about teaching grade school kids to put condoms on bananas, Kids being brainwashed into being "liberals' (yet are the ones that spread the most hate and treat others in cruel and inhuman ways)!....History books filled with lies about our forefathers–resulting in a distortion and degrating vision of America. Educating a distortion of living a quality of life. Teachers not being tolerant of all students–and not reaching out to the "outcasts". Teachers looking the other way from trouble (but Kudos to the Coach who helped removing the suspect!), lack of anti-drug education....
I could go on but this kind of covers it!
"Lack of anti-drug education!" Did you ever hear of D.A.R.E? Did you ever hear of "zero-tolerance" policies? Did you ever hear of drug-testing students? Did you ever hear of drug-sniffing dogs in the school hallway? Where have you been for the last three decades?
We need to have a policy of sending kids that "need medication" to alternate facilities, so they are not a risk to "normal" kids. I'd like to see a lit of meds this shooter was on or supposed to be taking.
You get rid of the guns by controlling the manufacture of bullets. Stupid!
If we made it harder to get ahold of guns, people would just stab or bludgeon one another. But quite frankly, it's much harder to kill someone with a knife or blunt object than it is to kill them with a gun so it makes at least some sense.
The problem with guns comes down to two distinct factors. Bad parenting and the number of and projection of bullets. Many parents don't lock up their guns, usually bad parents do bad things and have guns around. Therefore the soon to be bad kid has access to something he shouldn't. Second, guns have bullets. If you have a knife, perhaps you get one or two or three before somebody tackles them and disarms him. (I don't know what happened on those planes on 911 so I won't comment. ) Maybe one or two kids get killed, but you don't get the carnage on the scale of Virginia Tech. Guns are also a very impersonal way to kill, you don't have to get close to look the victim in the eyes and you can get people from across the room. You don't run the risk of the victim actually wrestling with you and potentially kickin your ar se. This makes the "misused" gun the tool of a coward. (Not talking about cops or soldiers here obviously) I also agree with a previous poster that said that if there was a govt takeover, one or two or even ten lil rifles/pistols would do nothing. You'd be screwed just like the rest of us...it would just take a lil longer, maybe 30 minutes.
Oakland,California has more than 100 murders a year but the media never covers it. Why? It doesn't fit their narrative that strict gun control works.
WRONG, Ca is a anti gun state and look at allthe murders. Pro gun states have much less crime. Get real and get your facts straight.
Did you even read what it is you are commenting about, or more precise, did you understand what the writer was saying???
I can't believe that the author of this story didn't mention the media. Incessant coverage and glamorization of such evil plants the seed for the next mixed-up kid to repeat the cycle. Throw in all of the violent movies and the TV cop and murder shows shown constantly as acceptable and desired entertainment, and it's inevitable that someone will again get the idea to do such evil to other humans.
You're missing the elephant in the room. The US has twice the shootings as other countries, but prescribes twice as much Prozac and other antidepressants. These shooting didn't start until after the introduction of antidepressants. It started as the mail carrier "going postal" and once doctors started prescribing to children, we had the first school shooting. I firmly believe that there is a small percentage of the population majorly and adversly affected by antidepressants. In almost every school shooting, antidepressants are being used by the perpetrator. We didn't suddenly have a massive culture shift where shooting up a school became acceptable. We just decided to drug the problems instead of deal with them.
That's why we should all say NO to drugs.
bECAUSE THEY DID NOT COUNT BOMB VESTS
wow people. With the mentality of some people on here it is easy to see why we have so many problems in this country. Guns are not the problem. They are a tool. How many will die today becouse of drunks of knifes or beatings. should we get rid of the booze, knifes and fists. In the big picture very few people get killed by guns compared to other ways. If this happened with a baseball bat would we outlaw baseball. Get real people the awnser is to get parents to be responsable to there kids. If the parents had done the responsable thing thing mabee this would not have happened. and lets not forget the thousands of people that are saved with guns everydaY BY RESPONSABLE PEOPLE.
Banning guns is BS. More rural areas where poeple are known to own guns, I've read of studies, actually have lower killings and criminal activity. Why? Because poeple won't mess with other poeple's stuff and would be scared to get shot–For they know the community is gun packing.
If hoodlums or someone is desperate enough to buy a gun, it will be bought illegally....
Highest percentage of population or highest in terms of gross numbers?
The ACLU has had a major role in abolishing discipline in public schools by curbing corporal punishment.
We need to get discipline back in schools and prevent parents from suing schools that maintain order.
Further we need to get "problem" kids help or expel them.
“Why is U.S. No. 1 in school shootings”: Because mental healthcare isn’t taken seriously in this country, where society tacitly and openly accepts the occasional massacre rather than paying more money in taxes for additional preventative measures.
1) Past and Present Social Conservatives feeling priviledged while denying others of Life, Liberty & Pursuit of Happiness. (Meaning you're not one of us so you are'nt welcome to what we have.) 2) Similar to #1, and due to lack of education many children of Social Conservatives will stay segregated though famiy influence and harbor racism and prejudice toward other's. ( Ancestral Racism, past to present.) 3) America's promotion of created chaos control, through cause & effect to promote her Law & Order.) 4) In the Urban area's, it's more business oriented and includes 1-3. The N.R.A protect gun shops, gun shops a sell to a customer in a suburb with a gun permit, the said customer sell it for more than it was brought for to someone in the urban area. ( 7 out of 10 a criminal.) Police in turn arrest said criminal and there's the trickling down of the business and payments. ( Judges, Lawyers all included in the business of gun sales.)
take prayer out of schools and you invite alot of other issues in
Like truth and reality?
no, like disprespect for life, immorality and violence.
A fairy tale isn't required to respect life.
I just thought about this topic this morning. I grew up in the different country, and over there I don;t think I heard about student shooting ever...Instead they have different issues, like girls fighting, or students stealing... Those are worst scenario. Im just wondering are we in America having so much freedom on gun issue? I meant I saw my friend holding a gun the other day for hunting...
Fact Check: 32 students were killed at VT, not 37. 33 if you include him.
The right to bear arms comes with a cost that is not popular to talk about if you are pro 2nd Ammendment. The availability of hand guns does in fact mean that there will be more deaths by guns. This is a fact you can't argue away with ideology even if it would be convient to do so. The real question then is "do we as a society hold the right to bear arms and have those arms available as more important than the deaths we know having this policy will inadvertanly cause". Freedom is not free, and all rights have a cost associated with them. I am pro 2nd Ammendment and I accept the trade off. Those who are pro-2nd Ammendment like me and yet try and argue about knives and other silly things are either being simple or dishonest. It is a trade off – just accept it.
Having guns all over the place is part of the problem. The other part is putting them in the hands of emotionally unstable people. Teenagers are all emotionally unstable – they should not be taught how to use guns.
Kids are just acting out their video games. Do parents have any idea the kind of games their kids are playing?
Is there a video game called "grudge of the bullied?"
Wow maybe I can market that one for Facebook.
Maybe Facebook and all the social media is to blame.
If you are not on line you are not a "victim of on line bullying".
Think about that for a while.
All you have to do is live in Texas for a short while and it all become very clear
Since we don't – how 'bout you explain yourself?
Maybe it's just man's nature to torment the not so capable or those who are different. I am not sure if there is a solution. Incidents like this will cause the tormentors to think twice before making someone's life difficult.
School shootings are on the rise because these days kids are weak little things that are brought up in a world that's like a padded room. You can thank liberal dimwits for this. Hopefully people learn and stop coddling their children.
The owner of this gun should be held liable for the actions of this minor. Start holding owners responsible and owners will be more responsible.
I am pro-gun ownership, though I own none of my own.
Hear hear. I am anti-gun ownership, even though I do own one (my hunting rifle I used many years ago).
Hey here's a novel idea, how about the parents teaching their children right and wrong instead of sending them to school and hoping the teachers will do the job for them!!
How about we get all the PC studies out of the schools as well. Socialism is NOT conducive to a respectful society. Society doesn't owe you a free ride.
GUNS – not just getting them, but knowing how to use them. When I was in high school, I knew my father had a gun and where the bullets were, but I was too scared of it to think of using it to solve my problems. If I was experienced with guns, story could have been different. Teenagers emotional instability and ready access to guns is a very bad mix.
Also, check the federal statisics, no surprise the majority are christian republicans
A Rewrite of #2) Similar to #1, and due to lack of education and/or low IQ's. Many children of Social Conservatives will stay segregated through family influence and harbor racism and prejudice toward other's. ( Ancestral Racism, Past and Present.) Had to correct myself.
Ya, In NEW Braunfels, TX banners were posted at high school when Obama was elected "The Antichrist is here" wonder what parents gave these instructions?
And therein lies another perfect example of the current problem. The "other" guy isn't just a person with a difference of opinion, he's evil incarnate here to destroy your way of life.
@ JeramieH, #2 in my comment All day.
@David in TX, #1&2 in my comment, that's who.
Whoooo-hooooo!
We're #1! We're #1!
Ha ha ha, take THAT China!
Looooooosers!
This has nothing to do with television, hollywood or video games. You'll find that the owners of most firearms used in these atrocities were negligent in keeping these weapons safe and secure from intentional or unintentional misuse. Firearm safety starts with responsible ownership.
There is a simple answer, not a complicated answer. The reason for the extreme level of gun violence in the U.S. can be directly blamed on the National Rifle Association... the greatest enabler of gun crimes in history.
So we blame Ford for all drunk driver deaths?
No, of course not, and it's not an appropriate comparison. Is Ford demanding that there be no drunk driving laws?
Total nonsense, many countries have more access to guns with almost no crime.
Total nonsense all right.. Name one...
Maybe all teachers and students should be armed. Yeah, that's the ticket. More guns. Wake up, America! Oh, we wouldn't want to take away your right to bear arms. What a prehistoric notion! Wake up, America! The America of the future is a war zone!
Before the gun haters get in here it should be noted that there are many countries where there are more guns available but don't have this problem. The problem is that ethics are no longer taught at home or school. Secular humanism is no longer taught in school. See the problem?
this is easy. because we advocate quick solutions to all problems without thorough thought, we advocate that owning guns is practically our duty therefore making them very easy to obtain...those two things coupled with abysmally poor education lead to probably most of our problems, be it with crime or drugs. this is the crime part. Im not against guns by any means, but, I am against the lack of education. and now we have a potential nominee for president that actually says having an education is "snobbish" and a current president that when talks about Americans gaining more education, he is looked at as "elitist"...like being smart is a bad word. this is the easiest question ever asked by anyone in a news article...
> like being smart is a bad word
Unfortunately you hit the nail on the head with current America.
@aaron, #1&2 in my comment still apply. They fear that more Obama's will spring out of communities they're trying to stagnate and disrupt the America they so envision for themselve's.
There is no way in which our students are exceptional or deficient. There is bullying everywhere and in many places it is worse than here. Our kids are not particularly spoiled, resentful, neglected or anything else. In all and every of these things kids in other industrialized countries are about the same. The only thing that is different is the availability of weapons.
When was the last time one of these shooting rampages took place in a big city? Never. Why? Because we dont have goobers with guns.
I vote democratic but I don't blame an inanimate object for committing a crime. The people behind the gun are the ones at fault. This kid was probably mentally unstable or he was just bullied to the breaking point. Teenagers are very cruel to people that don't fit in and can make their life a living hell. I was bullied when I was in school but I never snapped and killed anyone. Taking guns away from law abiding citizens will not protect anyone. If its not a gun it will be another weapon ex. knife, hammer, hatchet, et cetera. Blame people for their actions not the tool they used.
Duh! Because it's incredibly easy to get a gun here. The rest of the first world thinks this is still the Wild West...and it is. Only here do we have huge lobbies and organizations that actually claim guns don't kill people...!
Impressed by Talibans! lol
Stupid hillbilly inbred parents don't keep their guns locked.
Take that rest of the world!! We rock!!
Whoooo-hooooo! Finally, we're better than China at something! We're #1! We're #1!
yes yes yes yes! we so did it this time, guy! o yes yes yes carl! wha wha yes yes carl i love u
Let's hear it for the National Rifle Association! yea....
...the use is #1 in gun violence because...we all have guns.
no guns = less gun violence.
Banning guns would only take them away from law-abiding citizens. It wouldn't eliminate violence. In fact, it would likely make more victims; especially women and the elderly.
We have become a nation (and society) of Professional Victims....everyone thinks someone did something to them, they don't have enough money, they have an illness, a disease, whatever excuse they find to say "I am a victim of (fill in the blank). And Becuase I am a victim, I can be mad at the world and take it out on (fill in the blank). NONSENSE! People need to buck up, sure things are tough, sometimes kids are bullied on the playground, sometimes our spouse leaves us, but wake up, you are still alive, and can choose to not be a victim any longer!
Because we are the most heavily drugged country. First we start with brain injuries and other illnesses gotten from the four dozen vaccines given starting at birth, then we pop every kind of over the counter and pharmaceutical drugs to "treat" those side effects, then we are given mind-altering anti-depressants. Read Harris Coulter's "Vaccination, Social Violence, and Criminality: The Medical Assault on the American Brain"–written years ago.
"I'm not offering a gun control solution. But any serious attempt to prevent school shooting will have to attack the problem by determining who should not be armed"
But that sounds EXACTLY like what you're offering. The scariest two things about all this are figuring out just HOW you determine who should not be armed, and figuring out just WHO gets to make that determination. Something tells me that Dr Ochberg will fall somewhere on the side of the more restrictive solutions.
@Brian said it right, guns have been available for a long time and yet the problem has literally exploded in recent years.
I see more of a mix, the tools (guns) being readily available (lax gun legislation) and what kids learn from home. There is always going to be an argument on what kids are exposed to, e.g., now=Internet and violent video games, then=violent movies and wars all over, so technically the exposure is somewhat the same; the bottom line is the continued loss of values in American homes.
SIMPLE!
Kids are growing up without "FATHERS" The states and the feds are under the impression that fathers are NOT NEEDED in society, all we need is HIS PAYCHECK! Take half of it for child support, which creates anger and hatred between the parents and alienates the dad from his child!
THESE SORRY AZZZ KIDS YOU SEE TODAY ARE THE RESULT OF DADS BEING REPLACED BY CHILD SUPPORT CHECKS!
NO FATHER FIGURES, Just the live in boyfriend who helps blow dads money and abuses his kids!
Everybody can buy guns in USA streets, in my country the police men don't carry guns.
Maybe it is because of the very liberal nature of a vast majority of people in this country that want to protect the poor murderers from harm and want them in nice facillities waaah waaah waaah...if we had harsher punishments for violent criminals...maybe these crimes would be a thing of the past.
Really smart – lets blame guns and ban them – that way the high school morons that become local cops are the only ones with access. Hmm aren't these the same cops that all of you liberals claim racially profile and illegally detain illegal immigrants. Can't have it both ways – take away guns from the cops and I'll be more than happy to hand mine in. Until that happens forget it.
yes moron.. limiting guns WILLl solve the problem.. go back to your hole and hibernate genious
I love being a gun owner, but . . .
1. If you are a parent, you need to secure your firearms and make them inaccessable to your children and teens.
2. If you need immediate home defense – a big dog, mace, a taser, or a realtor who can get you to a better neighborhood are good choices.
3. You need to monitor what you and your kids put in your brains – limit the mindlessly violent video games, violent movies, and violent TV. A steady stream of that stuff is not a good idea.
4. Take bullying and terroristic threats seriously. If your child is being bullied, confront it outside of the school environment in a place where a right to self-defense exists and get real law enforcement involved. The tactics of bullies like assault, battery, terroristic threats are all real crimes.
I agree with all but #2. Most dogs are wimps, don't rely on a dog for protection. And I'd much rather use the most effective and efficient tool to protect myself, tasers and mace only go so far. (If 2 guys break in, you can only tase 1. Mace you risk spraying yourself, or having someone hopped up on drugs that it doesn't phase them.) And even the best neighborhoods are not immune from crime; a lot of gang-bangers have started targeting the "good neighborhoods" because the homes have better stuff to steal.
The main thing is this – you can defend your home in layers and through alternatives to firearms, for example you can have:
- Curtains to ensure you don't show your big screen TV to bypassers.
- An alarm with panic button.
- A dog that sounds menacing.
- A taser or other non-lethal weapon.
- Good locks & secure windows.
You can deter thieves, burglars, and home invaders by appearing to be a harder target and a less lucrative target with than your neighbors. If you have a Chevy Malibu, drawn curtains, and a decent sized dog and your neighbor has a Mercedes, a 54-inch big screen, and wide open window treatments. You are less likely to be a target.
If you have children, an unsecured firearm is a serious liability. A toddler could find it and unknowingly discharge it. A kindergartner or grade schooler could use it to play cops and robbers. A junior high schooler or high schooler could use it to permanently resolve a temporary teen angst problem like bullying or lost love. It's a problem of young brains not being fully developed in terms of judgment, temperament, impulse control, and morality.
If you believe in firearms freedom, secure your firearms so that your kid doesn't become a statistic and so that your household doesn't fuel pro-gun control sentiment.
Dude, I agree with you.
In addition, I'd also say that parents should teach their kids about firearms. My kids will learn to shoot, take hunter's safety courses, etc. (at appropriate ages, of course); I don't want guns to be mysterious and exciting to them.
'
Most importantly, my kids will learn that guns are NOT TOYS and can only be touched under adult supervision. (I have a gun safe, but they may go to a friend's house where the parents are not as responsible, kids need to know what to do in that situation. Ignorance is not bliss.) More parents need to teach their young kids the Eddie Eagle approach to guns: "Stop. Don't touch. Leave the area. Tell an adult".
Does anyone here even KNOW how he got the gun? Did he steal it? Did his grandfather leave it on the nightstand? Did he buy it from a local drug dealer? This should not be a soapbox for arguement until we know all the facts.
For those that do not own guns, obtaining them legally is not as easy as said, however, like any other controlled item in this country whether it is drugs, alcohol, counterfiet merchandise, etc. – where there is a will, there is a way.
Maybe we should all agree that the child had issues within his life and he sought a release. The problem is NOT that he had access to a gun but rather that he chose to use it. There are many ways to kill ... so let's start by stopping the reasons versus taking away the "methods".
Psalms 119:9 this is what U.S schools are missing. Please note we have religious freedom in this country all should be respected equally and given similar oppurtunities.
We take something good out of schools so expect some evil to fill that gap. Hard to accept but if we need to train our children to love your neighbor like you would love yourself from young age, no cops or guns are needed.
There is one very important factor that was not mentioned.... the downfall of the family. Children who come from broken or disfunctional homes are often the students who commit these crimes. When looking at the families of children who commit these acts, rarely do you find a nuclear family with parents who are involved in their children's lives.
Yes, rather than blame this on the fact that nearly any child of an NRA member can stick dad's gun in his back pack and blow the school to hell, lets just blame broken families...
You've been snorting too much of Glenn Becks chalk dust...
Make all the gun laws you want, liberal retards. Criminals and psychopaths don't follow laws, in case you've been asleep for the past, oh, let's see......YOUR WHOLE LIFE?
Since we know you reactionary retards hate our government and want to live in total anarchy... what's your point?
Because we Love the Fetus but Hate the Child!
I'm sure the Republicans will find a way to blame it on Obama.
Nah....I am sure the Democrats will find a way to somehow blame it on Bush...
I blame it on Call of Duty.
Why? because too much influence from violence watching tv an playing video games with much violence!
@Jlook
That was debunked 10 years ago. Try again.
It's easy – people get picked on, don't have a moral compass to guide them, are full of testosterone and decide it's worth it. This isn't rocket science, violence in school is systemic of a larger issue – bullying. All of these kids who shoot up the place are victims of bullies. You get pushed around enough and eventually, it's either them or you, right?
We need to fundamentally redesign schools to ensure there is no place for bulling to occur. And, no, some cute sign on the wall outside the boys bathroom isn't going to do it.
What this article fails to bring up, and the Media in general fails to bring up when these events happen, is the use of Anti-depresents, Most of the kids who have gone on school shootings have bean on anti-depresents, these drugs suppress rational behavior.
Access to guns is a significant factor??? Access to guns is the only factor.
How can the most prosperous country in the world fail in such fundamental levels is something that will always amaze me.
Maybe as a Country ;;; We Love our Guns more then We Love our Kids!
I know that's right...
I must unfortunately concur. Just look at how education is budgeted.
Oh, come on. How naive can a professor be abt violence in our gun-culture? As long as guns are easy to get, even a teenager can wreak havoc with a 22 caliber gun? I was in Mexico in 1967 celebrating in a bar when the federales suddenly appeared and frisked everyone for guns. It was somewhat hilarious & I didnt see anyone being pulled out for having a gun but every Mexican knew that U didnt settle anything with a gun. Stick that in yor 2nd Amendment rights.
Apparently the Mexican Drug Cartels and the numerous street gangs that have AT LEAST one major shooting battle, which nearly always result in innocent, non-involved persons to be killed or seriously injured each and EVERY Single Day and night in Mexico missed that "memo", so to speak. Those facts prove that your point is not valid whatsoever. Sorry to disappoint you.
Our leaders/parents need to seek the solutions to these problems and apply them to our school system so that this doesn't happen. Then again our country's focus is on blowing up brown people rather than investing in our future through the education system so who knows when we'll even begin exploring possible answers.
Keep "broad brushing" all schools as if these crimes are committed in all schools and this problem will continue.
Because we teach no respect, do your own thing, no consquences, no God, coupled with viloent video games, movies, books. We have helped make these killers.
This is a stupid question. Duh! Because the US has the most guns. You want to solve the problem, grow the spine to take away the guns! Either guns or safety. You can't have both.
When the NRA stops controlling the agenda, you'd have safety.
In the vast majority of cases, guns do equal safety. I read numerous news stories about citizens that have protected themselves and their families because they had a firearm.
Your comment is like saying "take away cars to prevent drunk driving". And drunk driving is far more common than school shootings. 1 kid out of millions of high school kids goes off the deep end, and your answer is to ban guns for everyone.)
Kids need to understand Chirst like love and sense of belonging in family and community. We trying to figure how are missing the sign when someone is going to shoot someone. Parents are the one could find this out faster than gov't. It is easy to blame others but not ourselves.
It's feminism's fault for such promotions as 'sweet revenge', 'don't get mad, get even', 'pay back', and extreme anarchy. It's unreasonable to associate freedom with the young who are not fully responsible, and why parents should be supported
This would be funny is it wasn't so sick. Blame women!
As the author notes, students "leak evidence" and all sorts of indications.
the problem: as anyone around a group of teens would note. Thousands (perhaps even a majority of students) say, post, think things that could be construed as "key indicators" yet never have any intent to go beyond. Anyone who has been bullied as a teen will think and verbally lash out (on the internet or anywhere) at their tormenters or frustrations.
Yet. the overwhelming majority of these depressed teens NEVER move close to becoming any sort of real threat. We must be exceedingly careful of how we mine the vast majority of unhappy signs we see on the internet.
I heard of story of school administrators grilling a student for simply NOT having a Facebook account. He chose not to because he was afraid it would be a target of bullying. Yet the act of not having an account made him "reclusive","troubled", "withdrawn" and "different" and a perceived threat to society.
Lilly, I am sure of that too. I am wondering whether Mitt Romney will seize the moment somewhere and say how his experience will provide a solution for violence in schools. But, the GOP will ignore the big 'elephant in the room", aka, the easy accessibility of guns.
Switzerland has more guns per capita than any other nation in the world and one of the lowest crime rates. Most of those guns are assault weapons. Actual assault weapons, not what idiots here call semi-automatic weapons that look similar.
That fact places a considerable amount of doubt on any assertion that "access to weapons" is part of the root cause regarding school shootings.
Comparison is no good. Swiz is small. Not a melting pot and lot's of lame T.V.
You can't claim easy access to guns as a basis then ignore the fact that another country with even greater access has fewer issues. If accessibility to weapons is part of "the reason" then you have to look at availability everywhere.
Totally incorrect. Don't believe whatever the right wing media says. Find out for yourself.
Really? Switzerland is not a melting pot?! The country that has four official languages and four distinct cultures and about one-third of its people are first or second-generation immigrants? That is NOT a melting pot? Could you please then explain me just what is a melting pot?
Widespread gun ownership, coupled with the fact that all Swiss men undergo military training and know how to use them, has been exactly the thing that has helped a good deal to keep Switzerland independent and crime rates low. Any intruders, be it some bloodthirsty neighbouring country or just a common criminal, have always known that their attempts will be met with armed resistance.
And how Switzerland being small has anything to do with its low levels of gun crime? I don't quite follow that logic. Are you somehow suggesting that there's something about large countries that makes them violent and unsafe? Along the lines of "hey, there's still some 300+ million people out there, nothing happens if I shoot a few?"
Not true, Switzerland is actually a good example of gun regulations working... Per Capita Switzerland has 1/3 of the guns the United States has and they have a very low crime rate... the politicians there commonly use United States statics to call for more regulations...
Don't believe everything that your conservative friends email you...
Sorry, I did misspeak. Not highest number of guns per capita. High number of assault weapons is what I meant to type.
Once again. Small country in comparison. The Per Capita thing doesn't work. It's not the same friggin country! We are talking about America! Mark Twain was right. Statistics are a great way to push a lie. Wasn't in those words but pretty much.
@matty bones
Make up your mind bud. If it is the GUN that is the issue the country wouldn’t matter.
@Ed Jaeger
100% correct. But you can’t use facts and logic when arguing with a zealot.
The crux of the gun access issue is the failure to use existing laws to prosecute the adults who allow these children to have access to gun. Existing laws prohibit those under 18 from purchasing guns and ammunition and provide penalties for adults who negligently allow children unsupervised access to guns, so no new laws are needed. Virtually every single gun owner in the US supports prosecution of the negligent parents who facilitate school shootings and firearm accidents involving minors. Those with an anti-gun agenda do not want to see such prosecutions of the guilty parties since it would undermine their attempts to demonize an inanimate object and blame it for the actions of criminals.
Anytime a gun is used in a crime, I believe everyone involved should be punished, owners & users ( If the user isn't the owner.) Trace them to the gun shop where they were purchased, background check the purchaser and if said gun is at the scene of a crime and used by someone other than the owner and not reported stolen by the owner, all parties involved shall be punished at the same length of the law. Suspect and the owner should face the same jail time. ( Mainly those who are Pro 2nd amendment, Supremacist and Militia Men.) How do guns get in the hands of those without gun permits? "TRACK & TRACE AMERICA".
One way they get them are loopholes in teh laws- such as purchasing at auctions.
Because America loves guns, and has full access to them. Let's see how long it takes for people to post anti-Obama comments on how he is going to take our guns now.
easy answer is the easy availability of guns and our gun culture. Most American families who owned guns are typically uneducated and belligerent redneck types anyway on the 'white' side and inner city ghettos types on the 'black' side.. is there any surprise kids bringing guns to school and moving their classmates down? I'm not!
I pity your ignorance. You truly have no idea who the average gun owner is. (Hint: It's your doctor, your kid's teacher, your computer repair tech, the owner of your favorite restaurant, the person who cuts your hair, the employees at your grocery store, etc.)
You adults are so typical none of you ever understand what young men like us are going through. High school teens are like communism we support each other even if this means hurting others. Just like the other shootings, others will take up the cause. No matter what this nation does things like this will still happen, and always happen. This is the year 2012, look around you. Your not going to find a person who is mentally sane. Everyone has their opinions but mine is a true fact. As you read this it may be offending you, but as i said before these are the facts. Some die some live its life. No one can stop what is happening. I give those kids props because unlike me, they have the guts to go through with things. Now im not saying i would go around doing things like this, but people under estimate what teenagers are capable of.
Get your ass back to class and zip it.
Wow Christine thanks for proving my point, you were a perfect example, of how adults are ignorant.
there are more americans that believe that prayer in schools is not worth fighting for ....so there is no prayer allowed in school by school officials....after all prayer is for the more ignorant people .... and the Christians are too "cool" to mention Yeshua at every turn... that is just for sunday School....santa claus is cool though they are not ashamed of him.
@ Roberto Sierra
The difference is most people realize that Santa isn’t real by the time their 5.
Seperation of church and state, i think the last thing any student wants is going to church while in school. Its bad enough having school. Have any of you noticed how much teens use profanity, including using gods name in vein. That would just be asking to provoke a shooting in a school.
I wonder why we don't lead the world in slaughtering women by beheading or stoning? Oh I forgot Pakistan and other Arab countries have that under wraps. Pick your atrocity and I am sure you will find things are just as bad elsewhere. If we start stoning people , will we outlaw rocks? Just wondering???
That is just dumb. What a way to steer from the issue.
What a thinly veiled anti-gun rant. Nice how they gloss over the edge and blunt force crimes 9which have sky rocketed in countries that banned guns) and followed it up with a stupid statement like: Kids with guns kill kids. This is incorrect. Kids all over the country have access to guns and do not use them it kill other kids. I had access to guns as a kid and I knew better than go near it without a parent. So who is the exception me and the millions of others kids with this experience or the kid who actually commits this type of crime?
+1
Not a game jeffery d
@matty bones
When you don’t have an argument, argue anyway..woo.
If the method to kill was not with guns it would be with something else. While many are saying you have to have greater gun control you still will not be getting at the hear of the problem to which is "why are there thoughts about mass murder" and "what makes them act out on the thoughts" If those questions can't be answered you will still have killings by students against students rather its with a "gun" a "car" or any other means that can be used to take a life.
Had this child's problem been discovered and treated we would not have had the mass killings and we would not be talking about having more gun control.
These kids didn't get the snugs they needed.
It goes hand in hand with being #1 in Worst Parenting Skills.
Well, when so many American schools both look and feel like prisons, I don't know why we expect the inmates...I mean students...to behave otherwise.
Somewhere, Jack Thompson is sitting alone in a room watching the news and saying "I told them. They never listen. It is that Grand Theft Auto and that Mortal Kombat and the Rap music and the facebook and Howard Stern..." Meanwhile on the campaign trail, Santorum is saying, "How can I say that these bullets were a gift from God? This was a tragedy and we must praise it." Ron Paul is saying, "Well, if you would have taken America out of all these wars, we would not have a gun crazed culture." Obama is saying, "Ah S-, Not again. The Republicans are going to blame me for this too." The new head of the NRA is saying, "I think I found the location of our next conference."
As usual, blame it on the gun, drugs, car, whatever, just pick your instrument of death.
We are totally forgetting about personal responsibility. And not just the kids, but the parents. There are obviously lots of major problems for a situation to come to this.
If guns were not available at all or ever even invented, this would still happen, just with a different implement. We should be thankful kids are not using fire bombs in school like in other countries. The casualties and horror would be even worse.
Bottom line, two youg boys are dead and lots of families are forever changed. We should pray for them.
Maybe we can end childhood obesity by banning forks, too.
Because the US has the highest concentration of little focks.
Face it, we have a dog eat dog society which produces a lot of bullies. When the weak kids finaly snap, somebody gets hurt.
Guns are enshrined in the national myth of America. No one will ever be able to diminish their presence and their criminal use.
until a greater device is devised for my personal defense and for me to defend myself and my community against a tyrannical government a gun will have to do. lets pass more gun laws, that has sure worked with drugs, alcohol, etc....
Emily said get prayers in school..news, not everyone is Christian, There are Muslims, Jews, and a ton other religions. And religion is the most common reason for violence in the world today. And the last time there was prayer in public schools was 50 years ago.. I know I went to a catholic school and public schools. Access to guns is the reason, and the Republican agenda that allows that.
Thought it's easy to say that gun access doesn't lead to gun crimes, it makes you wonder, at what point would evidence change that assumption? If there were 100 school shootings per year, would that even lend a slight amount of evidence to that notion? 50? 25? What is the cut off point?
Perhaps rather than fretting over why we have the highest instance of gun violence in our schools we should be thankful that we have such low rates of our school children engaged in guerrilla warfare and the building of IEDs.
Parents raise your children with prayer and cont. to pray for their future.
Really? This is a question? We lead the world in school shootings because we also led the world in adults who fail to lock up their guns and separate them from ammunition, we lead the world in owning them in the first place, and we lead the world in gun-culture that encourages shoot first-ask later. Since we have the "right" to own a gun, we also should perservere in our "right" to be responsible in that ownership. Teaching respect at every turn should be our goal; knowing the difference between respect and fear would be an excellent place to begin.
simple; because of your very lax gun laws and regulations, even a retard could walk into a supermarket and buy a gun in U.S , you just want to call it freedom, I call it crazy and suicidal and the result is this. Helloooo ...? its not candy.
That’s odd, I have read several articles that say the Columbine kids were in fact bullied. I would bet ALL kids are bullied in some form. I think this onset of school shootings is easily explained. Kids are bullied at school, relentlessly. The home life of these children are also in ways unfit. They are made to feel badly about themselves at home, then forced to go to school where they are also mocked... add a household with a gun and neglectful parents not really watching the kids, and they hit a breaking point. Kids are harsh. Kids in school endure things from each other that are horrible, things that if it happened to us as adults at our workplace would file lawsuits against each other. We all have a breaking point. You take the bullying at school, the bad economic home life, a gun left out and it’s not rocket science why this happens. We all know WHY this happens, we need to focus on how we are going to stop it. How are we going to change our youth into being nicer and have more patience with each other. Not writing numerous articles trying to dissect why this happens. We all know why. I am sure our teenage suicide rate is also higher than any other Country. ALSO due to bullying.
The fact is, our country glorifies violence to solve problems and there is too easy access to guns. I am not an anti-gun nut, but I think people who own personal handguns should absolutely be required to attend gun safety classes, along with other members of their households. To those people who say people who want to kill people will do so whether they have a gun or not are being disingenuous. How many mass school killings have been done with knives or rocks.
Only if parents paid attention to their kids rather than waste time getting drunk , we would have better kids in the society.. every weekend starting friday evening i see these kids on the street running wild and acting stupid when in reality they should be spending time studying and preparing for their future.. if parents do not enforce discipline in their own homes so how are we going to have a better society ?
This question is being asked seriously? Buying a firearm in the US is easier than buying a loaf of bread. Americans think having a gun protects them from break-ins – but reality is when everyone is carrying a gun – it just means you're more likely to be caught in a shootout. Let the police carry guns.
Have you ever bought a gun? You have to get a background check. When's the last time you got a background check for buying a loaf of bread?
And when seconds count, the police are minutes away.
Because that is how you solve you problems in the Wild West with a gun. It's in all the movies and is a long standing American tradition.
OMG, you gun haters are out of your minds, the gun was simply a means to the end for this disturbed child. The gun did not "speak to the child" come on!
I can bet there is a nation that leads the world in "school machete killings" somewhere....
It's not the tool used to commit the act.. It's the deranged mind of the PERSON committing the act...
another moron speaks
There's a pretty simple answer for this. American kids are ***holes. They are raised by ***hole parents. They then go to school, and bully kids, specifically because their ***hole parents never taught them how to be a decent human being. Then the bullied kid, who likely has some psychological problems, probably greatly enhanced by the bullying, snaps. If kids weren't such spoiled ***holes because of their parents, these problems would diminish. This doesn't apply for all Americans, obviously. But certainly more than in any other country, since we're the country who thinks our s**t doesn't stink.
My personal three reasons here:
1- "Everyone's a winner" philosophy–kids and young adults cannot handle when they do fail and are told "no"
2- Generation Y (actually should be WHY) cannot cope with anything unless they are told "yes" and question everything they are to do
3- Generation Why and some older generation types are clueless of how to conflict-resolve unless it is vetted through Facebook (and similar means) as ranting, bullying or just plain trash-talking instead of actual dialogue
Notice I do not blame an inanimate object or politics in my reasons for why the US is #1 for school shootings. I rest the blame where it truly belongs... Squarely on the shoulders of the most immature, selfish, disrespectful and incompetent generation ever raised in the United States.
Yep, one of the smart few in here today.
Perhaps blame it on Dr. Spock and Political Correctness? Society tells us we cannot discipline our children without doing psychological harm to the little darlings. We aren't supposed to tell them when they've done something wrong without praising them for their "innovativeness." Teachers are terrified of disciplining their students, or giving them failing (or nearly-failing) grades because "little Johnny or Susie" will be crushed or Mom and Dad will get angry. People are afraid to identify others who appear to be disturbed for fear they'll be sued by someone.
Dave – I could not agree with you more. I was going to go on this same rant until I read your post! We can't tell kids they are wrong, no negativity – "everyone is a winner"! We've gone too soft as a society, kids no longer no how to lose, or do so gracefully in a society where everyone is king. I could go on and on, but it saddens me really, to watch what things have become.
I wonder whether the fact that the US is number one in such shootings has anything to do with the fact that the US is the number one producer of arms (weapons), whether it has anything to do with the fact that our children watch so much TV (much of which is filled with violence), and whether , and whether it has anything to do with the fact that our legislators serve the interests of the lobbyists, who represent the arms industry, rather than represent the interest s of the people they have sworn to serve and protect!
A gun or any other weapon is a means to an end for a weak-minded soul... It takes a person to acquire, load and fire a weapon...
To follow your inane and insipid reasoning and to use your jargon, there are many, many weak-minded souls in this world.
Such individuals have no business possessing or coming anywhere near weapons, of any kind!
Unfortunately weapons are abundant in this country, thanks to the arms dealers, their lobbyiests, and our leaders who take their money and support them.
The NRA and the arms dealers who lobby our senators and representatives, in order to have a free-hand to sell as many arms as possible, regardless of whether they end up in the hands of weak-minded souls.
Think!
The problem is that in the US, every weak-minded soul CAN have a gun! Isn't that asking for trouble?
Finding where they get the guns is the problem they should not have access to them at home anyone who has a license to carry a firearm should have a safe that they keep their guns in unless they have them on their person. I am very pro gun and second amendment but it is asinine for someone who owns guns to not keep the weapons locked in a safe if they are not using them. The owners of the weapons should be the only ones who know the combination to the safe. Guns don't kill people ignorance by gun owners is what kills people.
@Ben Ferry
Funny thing, I used to keep my guns locked up and then my house was broken into in 2001 (this happened in the middle of the day, as I worked nights at the time) by two black males with guns. One had a pistol the other a shotgun. I had no time to unlock my safe and retrieve my weapon. I began shouting at them and grabbed a baseball bat I had in the hallway. Thankfully they ran without firing a shot. When the police arrived he said I was very lucky and encouraged me to keep my gun loaded and accessible at all times. To this day I do. A may whatever god you worship pity you if you break into my home again.
(I have no children in the house)
Guns are not the issue if he didn't shoot them then he would have stabbed them, poisoned them, bombed them or ran them over with a car
Uh...maybe because there are a lot more A. people, and B. guns here?
Guns ONLY cause death. Even in the USA more killings are done by cops towards innocent citizens than any other nation including China, North Korea or Cuba.
With citizens is the same. Guns only kill and they learn it from those violent tv shows and the way cops act in society with the free license to kill.
The USA is also the leading country in invading other nations for not reason at all and in the process killing 100s of thousands of innocent folks and spending billion each week in a war that has no merit. Main while USA citizens suffer in dealing with an economic bordering to a 3rd world nation. WHY? MY god use that $$$ to help each other instead of messing around the world and destroying countries and lives and family values.
Other nations, specially Europeans and many South American and Asian nations, invest their wealth in helping each other, making sure that they get free health care and free education which both are much better than the expensive medical care and education that folks in the USA get.
Our children are growing up as dumb as they come and are way below most industrialized nation or below many Latin American nations. Why is that?
ALso our children in the USA are growing with too much protection. THis is the ONLY NATION that has to apologized 10 times and give thanks and welcome 10 more times. WE even say thank you when there isnt any need for it Boys and girls can't fend for themselves for parents are there to guard them. IF little Johnny falls or small Lisa has to be taken to the dentist we are hugging them or apologizing. HEY WAKE up that is part of life and they need to learn to get tough. When those children keep crying for the room is too dark and they want mommy or daddy in bed with them or when they miss behave yet 10 minutes later you come to hug them, NONE of that is helping them.
WE must STOP rewarding bad and poor children's behavior. Stop appeasing to their wills. Bet tough and be firm so they can respect you, their elders and their peers. Smack their rear if you must same as the old generations of the 30s-60s That generation knew about respect and the Golden Rule and NOBODY was running around getting even with guns or knives.
Guns are not the issue here, guns don't kill people, a person can just as easily be killed with a knife or a bow, or a rock or a car and far more people die in car accidents and swimming pools then by gun, but people are not trying to take away pools or cars, they try to teach people to be more careful with them, and with students teach them to settle things in a less violent way, if anyone ever made fun of me at school, I would go fight them I might not win but even if you only get one punch in they will have more respect for you next time then if you go run to a teacher or run away, we need to teach kids to deal with there problems and face up to bullies not run and tattle or hide like we seem to be advocating.
Ted Kennedy's car killed far more people than any of my weapons (which I've had access to and used used since grade school) ever did.
Of course I also had involved parents who took the time to actually BE parents.
RE: "If the method to kill was not with guns it would be with something else" – this is an old and silly argument. You can not hope to kill a lot of people with any hope of success with any other weapon than a gun. People survive multiple stab wounds all the time. Do you think many of those purps would have had the guts to attack multiple persons with a knife? The ease of the weapons use is totally ignored by your silly argument. Lots of guns in a society is a contributing factor (especially with American culture) to the misuse of guns and the murder rate. To state otherwise is silly. The best defense of the 2nd ammendment is not to argue that they do not affect murder rates (since they do) it is to accept that this is a trade off for the right to bear arms. Crime stats do no trump rights even in the face of the misuse of those rights by some. It's that simple.
2009 (latest year available) murder rates per 100,000. You assertions that more gun control = fewer homicides isn't supported by the data.
California (Hi Gun Control) 5.4
Illinois (Hi Gun Control) 8.4
New York (Hi Gun Control) 4.0
Maryland (Hi Gun Control) 7.7
Michigan (Hi Gun Control) 6.3
Utah (Low Gun Control) 1.4
Alaska ((Low Gun Control) 3.2
Arizona (Low Gun Control) 5.5
North Dakota (Low Gun Control) 2.0
Montana (Low Gun Control) 3.2
Sources are the US Census Bureau http://www.census.gov/compendia/statab/2012/tables/12s0308.pdf and the Brady Campaign http://www.bradycampaign.org/xshare/stateleg/scorecard/2011/2011_Brady_Campaign_State_Scorecard_Rankings.pdf.
America is also the leader in Paxil prescriptions. hmm... wonder if there's a link?
Guns are not the issue here, guns don't kill people, a person can just as easily be killed with a knife or a bow, or a rock or a car and far more people die in car accidents and swimming pools then by gun, but people are not trying to take away pools or cars, they try to teach people to be more careful with them, and with students teach them to settle things in a less violent way, if anyone ever made fun of me at school, I would go fight them I might not win but even if you only get one punch in they will have more respect for you next time then if you go run to a teacher or run away, we need to teach kids to deal with there problems and face up to bullies not run and tattle or hide like we seem to be advocating.................................
"Guns are not the issue here, guns don't kill people, a person can just as easily be killed with a knife or a bow, or a rock"
Please..... when was the last time you heard of someone killing multiple people with a rock. If you want to defend the Second Ammendment – stop using BS arguments like that. The factors are simply culture, economics, and gun availability. Posting silly arguments about rocks and knives does nothing to support the cause of gun rights.
Why Does America Lead the World in School Shootings?
Maybe because we're one of the world's largest countries?
Violent past as well. Country hasn't been around that long. Well I mean as far as calling it USA. Country was built on gun.
Gun laws are the problem. It's too easy for people to get guns legally here. Plus parenting, bullying and revenge and other points stated here although not all the statics are right.
By that logic, China should dominate Gold, Silver and Bronze in every event, at every Olympics... They have more people, right?
Send these kids to snuggle camp. A place where they are forced to give hugs and snugs. :B
That is the whole problem... Too many hugs and the like and not enough discipline and accountability lessons.
Makes me wonder if the killer would of tried it if he thought the victims were carrying guns too. Back to the wild west we go..
What scares me is that NRA is something not a single politician, senator or congressman, dares to challenge, but all comply by default, because otherwise your career is doomed.
...because guns are so readily available in the US.
Ask the NRA. If there were fewer guns available to kids there would be fewer guns used to kill people by kids. When I was a kid nobody had a gun and disputes were settled using in other ways and on occasion with fists. Now a kid just gets a gun and shoots up the other person or people.
Maybe a creative solution is to arm the good guys at school; the teachers. Students may be less apt to attempt a school shooting if they know teachers are allowed to carry concealed at school.
The answer is simple as to why these tragedies are occurring. Our children grow up with a video game mentality combined with very lax gun laws. Most of these kids can't distinguish between fantasy versus the real deal until of course it's too late. I think it's time parents take responsibility for what's going into these young brains and the NRA step up to take responsibility for the social impact of their misguided beliefs. I am a hunter and a gun owner but I will never accept the notion that guns must always be freely available to all people in order for the rights of the responsible to be protected. Nonsense!
Bullying is the reason that the 'Majority' of these things happen. It is not the sole reason but it is the major reason and until you can stop people from being bullied endlessly in school this is going to happen. The problem is that the media, the police, the schools, and parents don't want to talk about this issue because it points the finger back at the victim.
i believe the only solution is "affordable online" college and/or high school courses LAW. College courses online are more expensivle than if you attend live at campus. Parents of childrens and teens that would like their children homeschooled (which is the less riskiest), cannot afford to stay home and supervise their homeschooled children. However, make it affordable (a choice) for parents to have their children/teens to finish school online!!!
AMEN! And until we are strong enough to do that, this is going to continue and do nothing but get worse. I would bet anything that almost every school shooting and most teen suicides are a result of bullying. People that say bullying is a part of growing up, or that we are weakening our children by making a fuss over bullying are full of crap. If you were treated by co-workers the way these kids treat each other, NOT ONLY would the bully be fired, but you would sue them. We have to start being honest about the problem and face it head on, or this will only get worse.
Why? Three words: Access to guns. Duh.
Easy access to guns doesn't help the situation, but it's not the root of the problem and it shouldn't be the focus, either. The destruction of American childhood, closely followed by our violent and uncaring culture, is why the kids are starting to go nuts. Google Canadian addiction psychologist Gabor Mate and read all about it.
Americans have shown their desire to rule the world. Colonizing, invading, occupying, bullying, enforcing lopsided policies using force if necessary, etc. No one should be surprised at the school shooting statistics because by default, violence is embedded into American culture since the first day of its 200+ years history.
An excellent article, but please try to be more accurate with your facts. If you do not count the shooter himself, 32 professors and students were killed at Virginia Tech, not 37. Also, the Tech shooter was not a "kid" as you imply. He was around 23.
The VA Tech shooter, was another Generation Y (WHY???) P.O.S.
Why? Guns are more common in the United States than any non-Third World country except Israel. Gun culture thrives in the United States. Children are bombarded from an early age with the idea that guns are the best answer to protection issues. Why? Go figure.
Who is the %$^@ idiot AceRyder at the top? Haven't I heard his rant since the fifties? It's a joke, this gun-ho rant, on anyone who can recite the alphabet and chew gum simultaneously. Let's do this kids. Let's give a gun to EVERYONE, including ol' granny, and we'll have one big last shoot out on the green. Last man standing, heh? Or, God forbid, woman. Wouldn't want that to happen in Texas. As far as this beleaguered bacchanal harbinger is concerned, you can bury yourself in guns. It won't make any difference if someone lights you up with a nuclear bomb.
America is a gun crazy NRA country thier r gun nuts who love their gunS more than their family.
Sometimes it is bad parenting but you have to remember that some people are just born crazy. Like Sociopath's.
The "bad parenting" excuse is valid to some degree but it implies that society itself is totally off the hook, which it's not.
I agree with that. I was raised in a messed up violent, drug dealing household. I don't wanna kill anyone. I got lucky and met good people.
Please, state, federal legislators, pass a law to make it "affordable" for high school students to complete their high school (online) if their parents have a need to work fulltime. Unfortunately, many parents cannot afford to homeschool their children. Also, "affordable online" college degrees. Please help our teens and our college students. AFFORDABLE virtual education now!!!
Simple lack of parenting.
How do you know it wasn't that in combo with maybe a mental disorder that he was born with. Never assume. Unless you llive that life you just never really know. I had a bad life and I don't wanna kill anyone.
Gloria: Do you know that sixty percent of all deaths in America are caused by guns?
Archie Bunker: Would it make you feel any better, little girl, if they was pushed out of windows?
hey, at least the us ranked internationally #1 in something! first time in quite a while!
Come on NRA, why don't you host a convention in this town??
It happens because there is no honor left in mainstream America !
There weren't any to begin with. Since first day of their history, "Americans", as we know it, have gotten where they are through violence. More specifically, they have taken by force of what didn't belong to them from other countries.
why does the author of the article claim that Columbine killers weren't bullied? it's obviously not true – they were bullied and one of the killers admit it himself in one of the videos.. please, get facts straight.
I grew up with loaded guns in my house including a gun rack in the living room with 3 loaded shotguns. Never once did I feel the need to take one and aim at someone let alone want to kill someone. Most kids in rural America have access to guns and probably hunt unsupervised and they don't kill people. Access to weapons is not the cause. Parenting is part of it. This kid has a violent parent. Our culture of violent video games and movies and lack of overall respect for life has to play some part as well. We're no longer allowed to punish kids for bad behavior at school or teach morality. The list goes on, but it's easier to blame the guns.
Bullies and access to guns. What do they mean these individuals were not bullied? It's displayed ll over their computers, diaries, and the few friends they have. Also, we will never know, because they usually kill themselves and I'm sure they'll paint a different story than their classmates will on TV. I know bullying is part of growing up, but it can drive a person mad. I was bullied everyday and had to move to different city. I never thought about shooting up a school, but I always wished and hoped that my bus driver would pass out and drive off a cliff with all of us on board killing everyone. I was just a kid and of course do not think that way now, but at the time it did. Kids can be just so cruel.
Another day, another dead kid. Thank you NRA.
What garbage written by a liberal . There are so many causes for these shootings the least of which we should blame on guns. How about the Godlessness of our society? Bad parenting?
Maybe it is the fantasy land of god based bull crap that you people will fight to the end to keep going. It's just a dream. Time to wake up Viki. Liberals don't kill people. Repubs Do. This just in.
There are guns everywhere. Parents are 'too' busy to see what is happening in their child's lives and be part of it . . . . And the 'war' and 'crime' games are now part of everyday of every child's life. There is also have a court system that will benefit the criminal and not the victim. . .
"Violent role models
"Violent role models, on the street, in the cinema, in the news, have been with us for as long as I recall, and are not limited to America. Back in the '60s, an American counter culture leader said, "Violence is as American as cherry pie." But other parts of the world, such as Northern Ireland, the Balkans, the children's armies of Africa, the terrorist camps of the Middle East, have their violent role models. Machismo is not an American word, nor is Hooligan."
You are clearly white-washing America's reputation. Why not put teeth in your nebulous approximations with facts. Show us a table that plots US school crimes against other 'industrialized nations' ?
What ?!? Why is US #1 in school shootings? Simple – we're #1 in guns. It's hard to shoot somebody if you don't have a gun.
you dont see this stuff happening nearly as much in countries where gun control is stricter. Coincidence? I think not.
So stricter gun control = fewer homicides? Nice theory but it isn't supported out by the info.
Homicides per 100k people:
California (Hi Gun Control) 5.4
Illinois (Hi Gun Control) 8.4
New York (Hi Gun Control) 4.0
Maryland (Hi Gun Control) 7.7
Michigan (Hi Gun Control) 6.3
Utah (Low Gun Control) 1.4
Alaska ((Low Gun Control) 3.2
Arizona (Low Gun Control) 5.5
North Dakota (Low Gun Control) 2.0
Montana (Low Gun Control) 3.2
Sources are the US Census Bureau http://www.census.gov/compendia/statab/2012/tables/12s0308.pdf and the Brady Campaign http://www.bradycampaign.org/xshare/stateleg/scorecard/2011/2011_Brady_Campaign_State_Scorecard_Rankings.pdf.
Interesting statistics – but you have cherry picked. Even though the numbers are per capita, you do not take into account population density or demographics (young people commit more crimes). Comparing a cow patch with New York is silly. The Greater New York Area alone has more people than some entire states you quote. Try comparing similar sized towns and small cities in both states and see what your numbers give you.
Two words: metal detector.
Then my head would go off everytime.
why USA is no.1 in school shootings???, are u guys blind, guns are sold like candys in stores, I really think freedom to posses ammunitions is the worst things that USA has ever did. lets ask ourself a honest questions, does is it safe if there are no guns at all in streets or every one has guns in their hands, lest answer it yourself. I dont believe safty with arms at everyone hand.
Wait, I'm confused....guns are not allowed at schools so how in the world was there a shooting at a school again? Didn't the school have signs up saying "no guns". The bad guys should have seen the signs and not entered with a gun.
i believe it is the discipline. The United States of America has became so soft that parents are not allowed to discipline their kids without someone yelling abuse. Well as long as kids can do as they please we are going to have issues in schools and in public we can't even get these kids to pull up their pants no one wants to see the butts or even their underwear but then again these kids are the ones following after their parents. The ones who are or have been in prisons. Disicipline needs to be given and given swift not 20 to 30 years after the crime they commetted. death row inmates have and are setting there for this long we need to correct this issue and start excuting them faster so people see there is justice being done for wrong doings.
That's simple–it's #1 in bullying. It's still as rampant as every in schools as kids tease and abuse other kids.
Maybe it has to do with the fact that it is so easy for the whole country to get guns. Oh no, not according to the NRA, it's not the guns fault...
Because you can buy a gun as easy as a pack of gum. Because the NRA sleeps with DC.
The U.S. claim to have a sane gun culture but nowadays when people can get their hands on fully automated guns or assault rifles at gun shows, one can see how the big gun makers have perverted that culture of responsibility that goes hand in hand with a gun.
These school shootings could have been prevented in a number of ways but the tool by which thay happened should have been locked and every member of the household told about the danger and responsibility of handling guns.
Guns are a right but lax regulations about them only invites to tragedies like this. Want to keep your gun? Behave like an adult with them or else accept them being taken away.
We legalize guns but wonder why we have the highest $ of school shootings?? idiots.
That's not really true (and you probably know this). There are many countries which have legalized guns that don't have near the same level of gun violence. It's not about guns it's about culture. And America is a very very very large country with some very aggressive people. It's what makes America great! We have literally hundreds of millions of steroid-filled, aggressive, physically fit teenage boys who can't wait to go invade other countries. All we have to do is give them a uniform and tell them to go to England and shoot anything in sight! Then you'll see why AMERICA is the greatest!!! We are the greatest most magnificent more terrifying country on the FACE OF THE EARTH!
Did someone miss their Lithium dosage today??
Answer: because America is the largest white country in the world.
Last time I checked Africa had daily shootouts and the most recent genocide attempts between tribes.
But who cares?
Be proud of who you are America! Never give up, never surrender! The answer is simple: The U.S. is a very very very large country! It is 500 times larger than France, Germany, Spain, and England combined. There are over 50 cities in the U.S. that are 10 times larger than London or Paris. Considering the vast size of the U.S. it's a miracle we don't see this more often! So, stop worrying America is the greatest country in so many ways but we are also the largest so of course you'll see things like this. It's simple probability and has nothing to do with being American.
HOw can you say that the USA is 500 times larger than all those nations? When was the last time you saw a map?
The USA is only better in guns and killing people and invading other lands for not reason at all.
Better education and free=Europe
Better medical care and free= Europe
Better life style= Europe
Better food and less fat folks= Europe
Less crime and safety=Europe
Better cars=Europe
Better Mass transportation= Europe
I love the USA but we can learn so much from Europe!!
Man, you just spout to spout don't you?!?! London and Paris have over 22 million combined alone... What US cities are you referring too?!?!
I really dont understand even after hundreds of thousands of peoplebeing killed each year, theres still no motion in law makers to ban the guns on streets. lets face it if the children who supposed to goto school are shooting like a bunch of gangsters on streets who to blame, shame on the law makers. and the worst part is we always have a gun show some where around like a animal show in zoo.
The only one true difference between the U.S. and other countries is access to guns. We have the loosest gun control laws of any other sovereign state. If we want to continue to have this "right", then we must live with the consequences. Plain and simple. Better parenting, bullying prevention programs, limiting access to drugs, combating mental illness and better roll models are all things that other countries face as well. While we should be doing these things anyway, the only way to stop gun violence is to ban guns.
Maybe because we're #1 in guns? Perchance? Hmmm?
USA is #1! U-S-A! U-S-A!
Weapons have been around forever. Decline of religion,morals,and discipline is the proplem.
Ummm...you lead the world in school shootings because you lead the world in every kind of shooting. Shooting each other is what Americans do, and they do it better than anyone else.
Once again CNN puts an anti-gun spin on an article and everyone jumps on the "lets get rid of guns" train. Lets consider two points real quick.
One -Damn near everyone has a gun in Israel and they are very accessible but they have almost no gun violence.
Two – England has ban all guns, and their an island, so even a lot easier to control importation of such things, and there still have a problem of guns in the criminals hands.
Explain that is getting rid of guns with solve our problem?
If ridding the world of all weapons was really possible, we humans would have already done it. But it is not possible.
Options involve:
Retreating to locations which have lower (but not complete freedom from ) weapons abuse and violence. Those may be tough to find in the USA.
Stop prepetuating the myth that "if they have a gun, I need one too". Mutual Assured Destruction didn't work, nor will localized militia albeit specfically addressed in the Second Amendment. (When was the last time you read a story about a local militia actually doing some good?)
Newt's moon colony. Provided Dick Cheney doesn't hunt there.
This is one of the main reasons my wife and I decided to have our children attend an American school outside of the USA. Without going into all the positive reasons for our decision, it is sufficent to say that the academics are better, the school year longer, the school grounds more secure, the parents much more involved and the school has a "no nonsense policy". Mess up and you are out!
Our family is not disloyal to the USA. In fact, one of my distance relatives arrived in the USA pre-Revolutionary War. But just as he came to the colonies seeking a better and securer life, we are seeking the same. At least for our children. My wife and I may never leave the USA, but we are encouraging our children to open their minds and talents to the world. The new immigrates!
Because knives aren't as efficient as guns.
Boy am I glad Mr. Fareed Zakamakaflakagakka wrote this article. I think I'll print it, I need to use the bathroom.
I just did a quick google of "death by baseball bat" and counted 10 on the first page all in the last year. One in which a couple was killed. I don't see an outcry to eliminate the Louisville Slugger!
It is when humanity realizes that we know nothing about anything, is when we will truly learn to appreciate our own existence in the universe. Until then, we will continue to kill each other (or ourselves) in order to prove our knowledge of something, we know nothing about.
Exactly, why aren't we number 1! We are letting someone beat us.
you knowwhy the people who are against guns will never succeed?
because the people who are for guns, HAVE GUNS.
Access to firearms?
The ready availability of guns, legal or not, to crazed teens is obviously a major factor in school shootings. But banning guns, while an obvious solution as clearly shown in Great Britain, is not possible in America. There are simply too many of them in the hands of citizens. You might as well try to ban toothbrushes. The next best solution is one based on enforcible laws designed to keep guns out of the hands of criminals and children combined with the kind of peer pressure that makes inappropriate gun-toting socially unacceptable and something nobody would be afraid or otherwise reluctant to report.
If the child got the guns from their parents, or whoever.... they should be charged as accessories to the fact. If you going to own guns, keep them out of your kids hands, or face the music as though you did the killings yourself.
America needs true Christian Values, not the Social Conservative view of Christian Values. Since America's founding, "how many of the TEN COMMANDMENTS" did America obey or follow? The 1st, NO, 2nd, NO 3rd NO, 4th NO, 5th NO, 6th NO, 7th NO, 8th NO, 9th NO, 10th NO. Oh well lets continue with the CHANGE we received from the 44th and pay no mind to those who pay us no mind. He believe like Whitney, bless her soul, the CHILDREN ARE OUR FUTURE. "TEACH THEM WELL AND LET THEM LEAD THE WAY. Jesus never carried the gun (Death's Tool) and the BIBLE (THE RIGHTEOUS WORD.) His WORD was met with DEEDS. Wisdom is given to act wisely, not to speak wisely, that's what the master of deception & father of lies does and his children.
That's it...teach our children that the sky is green when it's obviously blue. Yeah, that's it. Hey, 1st....it's hypocritical and psychotic views as yours that gets our children into trouble in the first place. I'll give you the real solution: hey parents, how about you start parenting!?!? Because the very second your 1st child is born, it's no longer about you; it's now ALL about your children from then, on. Anything less...and you have what happened in Ohio.
@Ronny, Please explain your position on where and what I was wrong about. Thanks, no hard feelings LOVE IS LOVE ALWAYS.
Why is the US #1 in school shootings? Really??? Easy...in the land of the NRA and gun-loving macho thugs who tout the long-irrelevant and archaic right to own guns, it's this hateful mentality that continues to put guns into the hands of criminals. After all, compare how many times guns are used for self defense compared to guns used for criminal offenses? I rest my case, you scared frightened little conservatives.
Guns save a hell of alot more lives then they take. It is proven time and time again. Pull your head out of your butt and stop reading liberal lies on CNN and do some real research on the Facts.
It is clearly CNN's fault. We have had the right to bear arms for well over 2 centuries, yet we didnt have a problem with school shootings until the last few decades. What changed? CNN came on the air. Surely that is not a coincidence?
Its's more frequent in the US because the teachers and the school systems don't care about these kids and bullying and don't do anything about it until their precious schools get shot up. My son has been bullied for 3 years now even attacked coming home and he's only 11 do you think his school has done anything???" HEll NO!!! he's on medication for ulcers and stomach issues but if I don't send him to school to help him I go to jail!!! You want your kids to stay safe at school then the schools are going to actually have to care.. How many times do you think his parents tried to complain to the school and finally had to say alright but once he snaps dont call me.. I fight at least once a week with my son's school they don't care!!!!!
Teach your son to stand up the bullies. Sure he'll take a few whippings but running and hiding makes it worse.
i just wanted to point out how ridiculous it is that the writer of this piece insists the columbine killers were not bullied. they were social outcasts and frequent targets of bullying. just because it's not as apparent in high school or because they seemed to have other motivations doesn't negate the build up of resentment and hate from ostracization by your peers. certainly they had other issues at well but minimizing the impact of bullying is dangerous. "there is no evidence" of american youths bullying each other more than any other country? we are one of the most diverse countries in the world and this diversity manifests itself in our schools; often students subtly bully or tease each other because of cultural or socioeconomic differences, and this bullying and teasing is often ignored by adults or teachers as "part of high school". by ignoring approaches which allow kids to understand and accept differences in lifestyle and culture and instead attributing the problems more to gun control, mental illnesses, etc., we're putting a band-aid on a gaping wound.
If you don't know the answer to this question, you haven't looked at American culture today. If you don't see it, you're not looking.
Because times are tough, people are taking it out on their kids when they get home from work and in turn, their kids are unloading it elsewhere. Sad but true!
For those people touting increased control as the answer, I ask how that will solve anything.
In all states except Vermont, it is illegal for a minor under the age of 18 to possess a handgun or rifle. (VT allows ages 16 and up.) Therefore, existing gun law already prohibits these kids from owning the weapons that they're using.
This means that either they're acquiring the weapons illegally (in which case increased gun control will automatically fail to resolve the problem) or they're using a weapon owned by someone else (in which case the owner of the weapon should be held criminally negligent for not securing the gun adequately).
Prohibition didn't work to remove alcohol from home. It did strengthen the mafia. The "war on drugs" didn't stop the use of drugs, but did strengthen gangs. The war on guns with only strengthen a new class of criminals.
The problem is the school is disease of the brain. In America, we treat mental illness like demonic possession or a will power problem "just think happy thought and you will think that way." We know that isn't based on fact. But, we allow health insurance companies to limit "mental health" treatment while they would never be allowed to limit strep throat treatment or any other illness save illness of the brain.
Until we acknowledge that the brain can get sick, we will remain victims of this sort of crime.
David,
This is not an either/or situation. Mental health is a problem AND so is access to guns. I come from a country where citizens cannot own guns. The criminals have to pay hefty prices for guns, and yes gun deaths do occur; but only in the crimninal element. Here in the U.S. gun deaths occur every day in situations raging from accidental to crimes of passion. The amount of shootings simply would not be as many if guns were not so easily accessible.
How many warning signs and cries for help did this young man exhibit before picking up the firearm? But, conveniently the firearm gets the blame while those that chose not to confront the problem are not.
Blaming the firearm for killing is akin to blaming the shovel when the handle breaks.
This makes no sense. Check you analogies please.
What doesn't make sense about it. The firearm didn't fire itself any more than the shovel broke its own handle. But, there was a reason why the firearm was fired and why the handle to the shovel was broken and in neither case was it the tool's doing.
Is this what our forefathers really wanted...everybody owning an AK-47 and killing eachother? I'm fine with muskets and hunting rifles but do we really need to keep semi-automatics, etc. legal? As smart as our forefathers were, I don't think they ever dreamed that guns would evolve into the mass-killing machines they are today. It's amazing how strong the gun lobby is. The fact that this debate never even occurred after Congresswoman Gabrielle Giffords shooting is proof.
In the Gifford's shooting the young man exhibited many signs of problems long before he picked up the handgun. Society failed him by not providing help when it was obvious it was needed.
Blaming the firearm is lazy.
This just in "Cars kill more people thAn guns!!!" LETS BAN ALL CARS THEY ARE TO DANGEROUS!!!!!!
Get a grip people...a gun is a tool period! It's not the guns faul. Making a personal fire arm illegal will do nothing, but make a bunch of law abiding citizens criminals. Sound familiar?!?! It's pretty much what we are dong with drugs.
This was a sad incident...my money is on the 4 boys bullying the shooter and he finally snapped. For some reason our society thinks it's OK marginalize and put down others. Well this is what happens when we loose respect for our fellow man. Everybody deserves a certain amount of respect and kindness.
Why?? All of the reasons mentioned in the article PLUS easy access to the easiest weapon to use that provides instant satisfaction. I wonder how many people shoot and then realize "uh-oh" but by then it's too late. Guns make killers out of people who would normally not have the courage to take it that far. Guns make it tooooooo easy. Kids unfortunately do not understand the finality of death.
Too bad it isnt China.. The question could be Why are Cleaver attacked number 1 in Chinese schools?
Its simple we are Monkeys and enjoy violence
Even in China that is RARE.
Way too much violence on TV and video games. Violence breeds Violence.
Guns have been part of the American scene for as long as this nation has existed. School shootings are a recent phenomena, a generation ago they were unheard of. What we have here is a People problem, not a weapon problem, and so long as the focus is on guns, the people problem will remain unsolved.
No Dorothy.. your not in Kansas anymore. We HAVE a GUN PROBLEM. I'm not talking responsible gun owners, I'm talking an over-abundance of easily accessible KILLING machines – HAND GUNS.
By all means take the NRA approach and mantra, but fact is fact. You do not go hunting with a hand gun. They are designed to kill people and should be controlled just like access/ownership of explosives.
There is a gun problem and this coupled with irresponsible parenting and a myriad of other contributory factors, we will continue to have this problem in our schools and other places!
Most humans are narcissistic people who view themselves as victims and believe violence is an option for being wronged. The difference in the US is smaller families without the close family and community ties which often leaves people to suffer alone and many go nuts. In other countries, there are plenty of siblings, cousins and other people in the community who are a support system.
i think it always comes back to parenting. Where are parents priorities these days? Be involved with your children. Put down the laptop, iphone all the distractions and do your job.
Not saying bullying is a reason to kill- but the Columbine killers were indeed bullied. Maybe it wasn't to a horrible extent, but they were definitely looked down upon, pushed around, and treated as outcasts because of their taste in clothes, music, etc. Please don't read Dave Cullen's Columbine books–it's completely full of crap.
Nothing could make me more anxious to read this book than your request for me NOT to read it. Are you Mr. Cullen's publisher?
Guns ONLY cause death. Even in the USA more killings are done by cops towards innocent citizens than any other nation including China, North Korea or Cuba.
With citizens is the same. Guns only kill and they learn it from those violent tv shows and the way cops act in society with the free license to kill and the poor education they are getting at home. Hugging little Billy and small Susie 20 times a day and telling the how special they are and rewarding them over and over for bad behavior isn't doing the trick. Use that belt if you must instead of apologizing or hugging those kids so much. Make them respect you , the elders and peers. TEll the teachers to be tough on them too and kind when it must.
The USA is also the leading country in invading other nations for not reason at all and in the process killing 100s of thousands of innocent folks and spending billion each week in a war that has no merit. Main while USA citizens suffer in dealing with an economic bordering to a 3rd world nation. WHY? MY gosh use that $$$ to help each other instead of messing around the world and destroying countries and lives and families.
Other nations, specially Europeans and many South American and Asian nations, invest their wealth in helping each other, making sure that they get free health care and free education which both are much better than the expensive medical care and education that folks in the USA get.
Our children are growing up as dumb as they come and are way below most industrialized nation or below many Latin American nations.When I was 8 yrs old growing up in Europe I knew 3 languages and knew all the capitals in the world and where each nation was. Same way with many children there today. Why is that?
ALso our children in the USA are growing with too much protection. THis is the ONLY NATION that has to apologized 10 times and give thanks and welcome 10 more times. WE even say thank you when there isnt any need for it.
Boys and girls can't fend for themselves for parents are there to guard them. IF little Johnny falls or small Lisa has to be taken to the dentist we are hugging or apologizing to them. HEY WAKE up that is part of life and they need to learn to get tough. When those children keep crying for the room is too dark and they want mommy or daddy in bed with them or when they miss behave yet 10 minutes later you come to hug them, NONE of that is helping them. A small cut on the finger is just that so dont treat it like a broken arm. IF they fall down let them get up, trust me they will do so. By helping them 100% we are making them weak and wont have the tools to be strong when facing a bully at school or at work.
WE must STOP rewarding bad and poor children's behavior. Stop appeasing to their wills. Bet tough and be firm so they can respect you, their elders and their peers. Smack their rear if you must same as the old generations of the 30s-60s That generation knew about respect and the Golden Rule and NOBODY was running around getting even with guns or knives.
I am offering an observation, not an opinion: Nearly every school shooting and other seemingly motiveless group shooting has two very distinct factors: The obvious one is guns are available but the key one is that the shooter is on or has recently been on mind controlling medications. Not street drugs. Something given to "help" the person. You will either see this info in the initial report or later on at the trial or something. It may even be "he was diagnosed as having ADD" which nearly always means he/she was put on meds. And no, I do not care that you think meds helped you or your best friend. These incidents mostly happen with drugs. FACT.
Lots of ADD children in Europe and LAtin America and Asia yet they dont go around shooting and killing ala OK CORRAL!!
The amount of drugs prescribed to US kids is significantly higher (and there is access to guns).
My father had guns in our home while I was growing up. There were bullies in those days just as there are today. I got bullied several times during school. Did I get a gun? No! I told my father about the problem and he showed me a few boxing moves. The next time the guy picked on me, he got his butt beat by me. I was never bothered again.