Editor's Note: Tune in this Sunday at 10am or 1pm EST for Fareed Zakaria GPS.
By Fareed Zakaria, CNN
Something caught my eye the other day: Pat Robertson, the high priest of the religious right, had some startling things to say about drugs.
"I really believe we should treat marijuana the way we treat beverage alcohol," Mr. Robertson said in a recent interview. "I've never used marijuana and I don't intend to, but it's just one of those things that I think. This war on drugs just hasn't succeeded."
The reason Robertson is for legalizing marijuana is that it has created a prison problem in America that is well beyond what most Americans imagine.
"It's completely out of control," Mr. Robertson said. "Prisons are being overcrowded with juvenile offenders having to do with drugs. And the penalties - the maximums - some of them could get 10 years for possession of a joint of marijuana. It makes no sense at all."
Read: America needs a 2-page tax code.
He’s right. Here are the numbers: The total number of Americans under correctional supervision (prison, parole, etc.) is 7.1 million, more than the entire state of Massachusetts. Adam Gopnik writes in the New Yorker, "Over all, there are now more people under 'correctional supervision' in America...than were in the Gulag Archipelago under Stalin at its height."
No other country comes even close to our rates of incarceration. We have 760 prisoners per 100,000 people. Most European countries have one seventh that number (per capita, so it's adjusted for population). Even those on the high end of the global spectrum - Brazil and Poland - have only a quarter the number we do.
If you say this is some kind of enduring aspect of America's "Wild West" culture, you would be wrong. In 1980, our rates of incarceration were a quarter what they are now. What changed was the war on drugs and the mindless proliferation of laws that created criminal penalties for anything and everything. If you don’t believe me, listen to Pat Roberston again. Here's a quote:
"We here in America make up 5% of the world's population, but we make up 25% of jailed prisoners....We have now over 3,000 - the number must be might higher than that - but over 3,000 federal crimes, and every time the liberals pass a bill - I don't care what it involves - they stick criminal sanctions on it. They don't feel there is any way people are going to keep a law unless they can put them in jail.... So we have the jails filled with people who are white collar criminals.
In the past two decades, the money that states spend on prisons has risen at six times the rate of spending on higher education. In 2011, California spent $9.6 billion on prisons, versus $5.7 billion on higher education. Since 1980, California has built one college campus; it's built 21 prisons. The state spends $8,667 per student per year. It spends about $50,000 per inmate per year.
Read: Deterring Iran is the best option.
Why is this happening? Prisons are a big business. Most are privately run. They have powerful lobbyists and they have bought most state politicians. Meanwhile, we are bankrupting out states and creating a vast underclass of prisoners who will never be equipped for productive lives.
I never thought I'd say this, but God bless you, Pat Robertson.
This is not a scientific poll.
Tune in this Sunday at 10am or 1pm EST for Fareed Zakaria GPS. For more of Fareed's Takes, click here.
 |
Post by: |
Me, too. I will make a slight modification of what I thought I would never say: Regarding your view that the war on drugs has not worked and your view that we treat marijuana like liquor: God Bless You, Pat Robertson.
I never thought I would say this either but Pat Robertson is to be commended for taking this stand.
In many European countries, drug offenses would only justify a prison sentence if the offenders sell, smuggle or deal with drugs. Consumption is not an offense. Any one caught possessing a small amount might get away with a fine.
j. von
Unlike many European countries, most SA countries will lock you up for 3 – 5 for possession of pot.
I live in Ecuador. There are a few places along the beach where the cops turn their heads. Most all Ecuadorians find it to be taboo!
Prohibition ended when the mob wars came to America's streets and the bloody price of keeping booze illegal became clear.
The reason the same thing hasn't happened with marijuana is because almost all the dead bodies are in Mexico.
Out of sight, out of mind.
@Jack
You are so right! A sad but true statement...AND pot being illegal creates more prisoners and prison is BIG BUSINESS!
You are 100% Correct.
The United States has never had a war against drugs. They have declared a war against it's citizens. The sheer number of our friends and family behind bars proves this fact.
Well then, if you have had enough, go back to Syria, Libia, Iran, Lebanon...
Mr. Mandrake,
I dont need to go to Syria, Libia, Iran or Lebanon, when I can have a coherent drug law in Netherlands, Germany, Swenden or Spain... Those countrys you mentioned have the opposite politicall point of view about alcohol – Its illegal only for social reasons. Even so, its absurd the difference bettwen alcohol and marijuana laws in US, when alcohol cause so much social and health problems. But this war on drugs is such a big business....
The first time I've ever agreed with Pat Robertson.
WHEN MEETING MY BLIND DATE I NOTICED A FLOCK OF FLIES CONGREGATING AROUND THE EDGES OF HER DRESS. I KNEW THEN THAT I DID NOT WANT TO GO TO DINNER.
Marijuana should be decriminalized but not legalized. There are presently no practical tests like there are for alcohol which would be able to determine if a person was impaired or merely had residual THC in the blood as a result of use during a concert a week previously if an accident happened in the workplace or while driving. This is not only an issue of excessive punishment for a "victim-less" crime. It also bleeds over into workplace safety, driver safely, PILOT safety, etc ad infinitum.
I agree with Zack, we have all the inmates and Mexico has a the dead civilians. We can either keep our citizens alive but in jail and Mexicans can keep getting killed in the drug trade OR, we can legalize pot, allow OUR farmers to grow it, OUR government to tax it, and OUR citizens to consume it. With the tax revenue taken in and the money saved from inmates, maybe we can start producing math and science literate children once again. And maybe, just maybe pay teachers what they deserve.
joe – if you ever get another date, leave your fly's at home.
And you should hang yourself to free up some tax dollars
Thank you Mr. Zakaria for expanding upon the conversation which is growing within our society, regarding the inhumane and draconian "War on Drugs". It is clear that our country is controlled by lobbyists at the expense of the citizenry. The time is now, to further this discussion and to advocate for serious change within our incarceration nation. End the "War on Drugs" it has been a complete and utter waste of our tax dollars and destroyed untold thousands possibly millions of lives.
Do you have any kind of reference for your statements.
Can you back anything you said?
Do we need reference that Bush was president of USA, or crow is black, or there is water in sea, or sunrises in the east.
The war on drugs has failed ... in more ways than we can imagine. Here is a link to an article that says global leaders agree this war is a failure.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-13624303
Well said.
Yes the war on drugs is a failure!
Even South America is kicking the US Military out of their countries for chasing pot smugglers. Google Ecudador US Military drugs
The primary reference to the US Military in EC was to cocaine. Not all true! I live in Ecuador and I totally agree with El Presidente Correa. And I am an American Citizen.
If the incarceration was a real one then maybe would have worked but since incarceration it's treaded as business then will never work,there are no concequence,it's more of a break from all the responsability, i.e. work/insurance bill /medical bill/utility bill/ taxes/ etc.etc.etc.it is a matter of fact every one else in the free sociaty pays that vacation like (incarceration)the way the law work is ,the enforcer want you to break it ,so they can keep the job.it's that simple.and the jail house have every amenity you may like and plus, and it's all for free.. THE BIGEST INSULT HERE IS THAT THE LAW INFORCER THAT ARE ON PATROL ACT LIKE SCAVENGERS WITH THE ONES THAT OBEIDE THE LAW....
References? just how much medication are you on to see the war on drugs has been a miserable failure – likewise I too cannot imagine agreeing (ever) with Robertson, but i must, his words are correct.
Tahir, for a liar like you, you need to reference everything.
Amuzing that your islamist rhetoric is in every discussion.
You spew poison about America and expect to be believed.
Buth then, as a moslem, Allah has given you permission to lie and cheat:
Ishaq:519 "Hajjaj said to the Apostle, 'I have money scattered among the Meccan merchants, so give me permission to go and get it.' Having got Muhammad's permission, he said, 'I must tell lies.' The Apostle said, 'Tell them.'"
Qur'an 8:58 "If you apprehend treachery from a people with whom you have a treaty, retaliate by breaking off relations with them."
Qur'an 47:24 "Do they not understand the Qur'an? Nay, on the hearts there are locks preventing them from understanding."
Ishaq:548 "By Allah, the black mass has spread. Abu Bakr said, 'There is not much honesty among people nowadays.'"
Qur'an 5:41 "Whomever Allah wants to deceive you cannot help. Allah does not want them to know the truth because he intends to disgrace them and then torture them."
Qur'an 5:101 "Believers! Do not ask questions about things which if made plain and declared to you, may vex you, causing you trouble."
Qur'an 5:102 "Some people before you did ask such questions, and on that account they lost their faith and became disbelievers."
Ishaq:567 "Muhammad informed Umar [the second Caliph], and he called the Prophet a liar."
Tahir didn't say anything bad. He was being sarcastic. I pity you for being so full of hate.
Frankly Habibi.... this is for commentary and Andrew does NOT need to give your snobby butt a reference. Please kill yourself.
Yeah! Ok-sure thing!
hehehehehehehehehehehehehehe...
If I'm not mistaken, some areas of the world have a low rate of imprisonment for drug related crimes because they execute offenders.
Eumir, habibji, are you pregnant again, you know you get cranky when you are pregnant.
hehehe
RC8888, you are mistaken. Some countries have a low rate of imprisonment because they are DICATORSHIPS.
@Lionel Mandrake
Like other Abrahamic Religions, Islam emphasizes the virtue of honesty.
You have not quoted any verse from the Quran that orders Muslims to lie?
Any examples of Muhammad asking any of his followers to lie are ALL related to situations involving an enemy combatant in a state of conflict. Lying during war is totally acceptable everywhere in the world, because its better to save a life, save YOUR life! then to put yourself or someone else in harm's way just for the sake of being truthful. Such lying even has a technical name in the Islamic religion, Taqiya, "lying under duress (of war)".
A direct quote where the Prophet (or the Quran) encouraged his followers to lie in business, or in their personal affairs or in public affairs of everyday life would be convincing than the mumbo jumbo you have obviously cut and past off some far-right christian website.
Lionel Mandrake
You have bombed Iraq and killed millions and still claim that you did that in love of Iraqi people for benefit of Iraq. if I wrote something against your will then you say that I hate America. Is this American way of justice?
I love the smell of BS in the morning.
Boo Hoo Hooo Hoooooo
Start by telling the truth, stop the hate against Jews, Christians, Shias...
I agree with you, it is time for a change. Our human rights have been taken away in this county. It now appears to only be about the politians money and corruption. It certainaly has nothing to do with morals, and human kindness. The goverment is destroying our young people it must come to a stop.
Yes, I agree. I will go further just as I already wrote when I posted this video to my group to share, and i quote:
'The subject of this message is a question that gets in my mind after watching this show, "How to stop our prison population to getting ever larger?" I voted yes, to legalize marijuana and put a stop to a reason for incarcerating Americans from inhaling this addicting drugs. Treat it like a cigarette, the allure of which is now dying since a generations of users are now losing their lives in asthma, lung emphesyma, cancer, heart attacks and other hosts of ailness. If what will take is for these drug users to die in similar fashion before they stop inhaling marijuan, like free market, so let it be. USERS BEWARE! SHOULD BE THE RULE AND NOT GETTING IN JAIL. Someone has to support the jail system and it is us, the tax payers. Private profit takers have seen the potential for them....and they are now paying lobbyists to protect and enlarge their interest if Congress will continue with criminalizing the use of drugs. This is my position: to put drug lords out of business and free our prison cells of drug offenders.'sc
I support legalization but from a different point of view. This is America, remember the Free Nation what you consume in your body is your business, it is okay to have laws on how you behave, but if you can smoke pot in your home and behave yourself who am I to tell you you can't.
I don't know why they come up with fancy names "lobbyists" why don't call it "Legal corruption/bribery"
I think if they legalize "marijuana" then big corporations that sell fancy liquor will go out of business. marijuana is natural drug and may be it is less harmful than regular alcohol being sold. Guys, at the end of the day it is pure business decision/deal.
I did ten years in prison. I went in as a person who shot someone who beat me up for ten years and then tried to strangle our daughter two times. That happened in 1985. I have never had one moment where I feel guilty of a crime. I'm still alive. My children are still alive. It was worth the ten years in prison. But here are the consequences to our society. I will never pay another penny of taxes to our society. I will not work to pay taxes that pay the correction officers that treated me so badly. I just exist until my parole is over (getting there!!!) and then I'll move to another country. I think this probably happens to all incarcerated people. You get to hate the society that locked you up. I'm actually going to write a book telling it like it really is in prison.
So what are we gonna do about it? These bought and paid for law makers are never gonna legalize it. Its not even a topic that will come up in the presidential elections. Think of all the money the government could make taxing it? Hell, let the government monopolize it and sell it out of state run stores like some states do with liquor. Do you think more than a handful of people in Washington don't know that? They don't care.
The article may be about the prison system, but that's not the lobby that keeps pot illegal, it's the big pharmacuetical companies that pay the out to lawmakers. If pot is legal who needs Valium? Or Xanax? Most Americans run off uber exspensive anti-depressants or anti-anxiety meds. Legalize marijuana and a huge percentage will make the swap, leaving companies to be forced into producing and researching treatments that are geared towards treatment of REAL ailments, not imaginary ones.
Show me ONE person who has been arrested for killing someone stoned on marijuana! People who are stoned sit and stare and run to the fridge.
Stoned on marijuana, maybe not. However, stoned on Heroin, Meth, PCP, Cocaine, etc... YES! I think "War on Drugs" is a ridiculous term, because as long as there are users, there will be manufacturors, distributors, and retailers. And guess what, legal drugs (i.e. Oxycontin, Percocet, Vicodin) are just as lethal, addictive and destructive as their street-level counterparts. People have this misconception that since they are produced in a regulated and legit lab, they are safe to consume. For those who scream "legalize everything", google oxycontin and read some of the stories regarding its abuse, particularly among young adults. And for those who think that by making everything legal, the users will simply kill themselves off faster, that's easy to say until they become someone you know and love, i.e. your wife, husband, mother, father, son, daughter!!
Considering that 100's of millions of people smoke weed then i would say chances are many people "Stoned" on marijuana have killed someone. Marijuana isnt just some innocent drug. IT causes many psychologial problems and phyusical problems. Intead of reading High Times read actual research.
"Considering that 100's of millions of people smoke weed then i would say chances are many people "Stoned" on marijuana have killed someone."
Good god, another half-wit heard from. Aside from the fact that you can cite no such case, you admit yourself that you only feel that way because of the huge number of people who have done it. You might as well ban coffee, because somebody has killed someone high on caffeine. Or milk because someone surely has killed someone after having some.
Seriously, are you so spectacularly stupid that you actual reason that way?
I love your comment. right on!!!!
ewrgdfgdf
Considering that 100's of millions of people smoke weed then i would say chances are many people "Stoned" on marijuana have killed someone. Marijuana isnt just some innocent drug. IT causes many psychologial problems and phyusical problems. Intead of reading High Times read actual research.
How about you try smoking a joint or two or five and research it yourself instead of relying on a biased study.
According to the logic that you and your kind use about Marijuana (see: gateway drug).. the same argument can be used about drinking water.
Eventually you want to drink something more like juice.. which leads to drinking coffee or caffeinated sodas.. and that leads to beer and liquor... and eventually it goes to smoking weed because it's cheaper and safer than liquor. Wait.. from there you might do coke or meth or heroine or LSD. All because you dared to drink water in the first place.
And before the trolls start.. that last paragraph was sarcasm.
Right on I am a southern Baptist Preacher and have never been called by a church member regarding a spouse being high. On the other hand the abuse and incidents involving alcohol and other more harsh drugs takes more of my time than any other aspect of my time in the ministry.
Most people in this country that kill someone else, or themselves, or both, are messed up on PRESCRIPTION drugs.
The real war on drugs should be directed against the pharmaceutical companies.
I don't believe marijuana is not being legalized because it can physically harm people. Marijuana is in its own separate class similar to alcohol. I am sure if statistically see who uses the drug are typically those who have currently have no motivation to their education or their career. This is another side to look at here. I think it is already an issue among too many teenagers. I have wondered though, is the drug causing this effect or is the effect causing the usage of the drug. I think marijuana is just a stage in life most kids go through and grow out of it. Its obviously not physically harmful, but socially it can still have an effect. It is a risk.
ewrgdfgdf
Have you ever even tried pot??? It does not cause all the things you say it just turns you into a couch potato and gives you the munchies.. I smoked a lot for years in my adolecence and I have no lingering problems, nor have I ever regularly used any other drugs.. It is not AT ALL physically adictive (I decided one day to quit and succeded from that day on I haven't touched it).. I don't know where you get your information but it's flat out WRONG. Alcohol which is legal, is FAR worse than marijuana.
The day we open the door to legalizing pot is the day other drugs will redesign themselves to fit the same criteria, so they may also enter. You can't say 'just this one' – 'and this one only'. You have to predefine, and allow all that echo that, to enter also. My life, was destroyed by two persons that either were high on pot, or drunk. And day after day, I sat there, hungry, cold – sufffering, and they blamed their habits – not themselves. They blamed their stress, their lack of funds, they blamed ... everyone. Me? I blamed – them. Then I stupidly married a pot head, who also boozed it up. And I started wondering, is there anyone left that does not? I do not. I do not because, the thought of causing my children the same amount of pain I was caused, so I could indulge, so I could have fun, so I could do what I want... yeah what I want... I just cannot hurt them like that. That type of pain, lasts... and lives alongside the so very few good memories I had. So sure, go do what you want – get high, get boozed up – but if you do, please, aleast have the guts to see the truth in how it makes your children feel.
I supposed there have been many killed who were stoned on marijuana. It's those who are stoned on marijuana that have no motivation to kill anyone. Sounds like you might need to light up another one:-)
I guess my question is how if its legalized will we address the stoned people driver and having accidents? You know that will go up as usage goes up because of its easy availability. You may save money on drug enforcement. But you will just spend it on regulations for it. Distribution, passing additional DUI laws addressing it. People think this will be far easier done then it actually will be and not without risks.
@ewrgdfgdf PLEASE provide a single source proving ANYTHING you just mentioned.
Get: You, like a lot of people have failed to really think through legalization. You say people have a misconception about legal drugs being safe. This is completely false. No one thinks that a drug is safe simply because it's legal. Everyone and their mother knows that prescription drugs can be dangerous. Secondly, you say the people calling for the legalization of everything say something along the .lines of, "Let the users OD". You, and anyone who thinks that are under the false assumption that keeping drugs illegal prevents people from getting them. NEWS FLASH: Anyone who wants to do drugs ALREADY DOES THEM! They aren't hard to get! Prohibition has almost NO EFFECT on availability. All having them illegal does is ensure that unscrupulous people sell drugs of unknown quality and content to anyone who asks, including children. If everything were legal, these drugs would be much safer as they would be manufactured to quality standards. The users would know the potency, as it wouldn't change between batches, and many lives would be saved. Also, if drugs were legal it would be much easier to reach out to the addicts and offer help and legal outlets would not sell to kids.
John, DWI covers more than alcohol. We might need another test to determine acceptable levels, but the existing laws cover it.
@OVIDIOGARZA
THIS IS A COMMENT FROM INSIDE THE US. . . there are many countries that have "enlightened" drug policies http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Legality_of_cannabis_by_country save the money you spend fighting the "pot war" and do something with it that actually benefits someone. there is not one single person who's life is made better by marijuana prohibitions.
if marijuana were legalized and regulated (taxed), us citizens would benefit from the sale and profits. now, it's cartels, mafia and dealers.
The Mafia went "legit" once Prohibition was over. You actually think that people who aren't already in control of the politics and control of illegal drugs won't be if we make consuming them legal? How naive are you?
There are other big problems with marijuana legalization, such as quality control, problems with fungus infestations, and an huge legal cost that will come with legalization, FDA costs, etc. Just so some people can get high and waste their time.
there is no way that the government can put a tax on marijuana because it is to readily available. If you think about it, a person can grow all they want because seeds are everywhere. How many of you have ever seen a Tobacco seed? anyone? Nope, thats why they tax it, because its not easy to grow and you cant just go get a seed.
meemee could you possibly be a bigger imbecile? The mafia went legit? Seriously, you are one remarkably stupid individual. As for all these made-up "problems" with legalization, you have no clue what you're babbling about. They simply don't exist. Not in countries where pot is legal. Not in the parts of the country where it is effectively legal now. You really are a gaseous dolt.
@meemee, even if the gangs, cartels, dealers, and whoever else who currently control the drug trade WERE to continue to be the ones controlling the drug trade after marijuana were legalized, they'd be subject to laws and regulations. They also wouldn't be killing each other because they can simply call the police instead of having to police themselves if someone tries to rob or kill them. As for the "cost" that you mention, you could say that about any product being sold, and fungal infestations? Again, you could say that about any vegetation being sold.
The fact is this; it's a highly sought after product and it's a big business. If it weren't a big business then people wouldn't be risking incarceration and/or death to sell it. This business needs to be in the hands of legitimate organizations, not gun touting dealers, gangs, and whoever else. The consumer is buying something that is considerably less harmful than alcohol and shouldn't be subject to having to buy from sketchy people or potentially getting a fine, jail time, or any punishment what so ever. It's BS, everyone knows that, and we need to get on the right side of history sooner than later.
@dave/Texas You could say that right now there is no reason for drug dealers to sell marijuana because everyone can just grow it, yet here we sit in a nation where weed is sold eeevvvveerrrryyywwhhheeerreee. Even people who can legally grow marijuana for their own personal use as a medicine still go to dispensaries where they are available. It's quite obvious that marijuana can indeed be taxed, without question.
Not only that, Ryan, the price would go down. Tobacco companies, beer and liquor manufacturers, and the pharmaceutical industry control our legal poisons. The reason marijuana isnt legal is because big business hasnt found out a way to control its manufacture and distribution. If they can, then marijuana will become legal.
The only reason prison can be profitable is when it's filled with pot-heads then yon staff with min-wage babysitters, Incarceration of professional criminals takes professional staff.
dave/texas – google 'tobacco seeds' before you make some unsupported statement that you cannot buy them – they're available, and from some sites they're even free.
JaimeIRL- actually no, its not obvious. Your forgetting that if it is legalized, then all these people who grow there own will double, triple, and quadruple in number. The black market for it will increase tenfold and the only thing the government will be able to do about it is to make there product bigger and badder, which will cause growers to do the same and so on. Instead of seeing huge corn and wheat fields, there will be nothing but vast fields of marijuana across the country grown by good ole boys that have a green thumb and a bachelors in science AKA the dispensories. The black market would put them to shame with there own at cheaper prices. Im not saying that we should not legalize it, Im saying that the government will never allow because they know they will not make all the money that people claim they would. So many high up people would lose all the money they make and give to the government. It would be nice though to go to the gas station and bye a 12 pack and pack of joints.
Any treatment of mj that is different from alcohol (a drug) or tobacco (many drugs) is purely hypocritical and/or the result of greedy bribery (mostly to the politicians)
This country has gone through the same conversations with alcohol in the past, and many spent time in prison when now you can get it at 7-11, the only reason they don't legalize it is because they make more money from enforcement and incarceration, also they don't have a way to test and see if you are impaired to drive...
THIS IS A COMMENT FROM OUTSIDE THE US IMAGINE WHAT THE WORLD WOULD THINK IF THE COUNTRY IN THE GLOBE WITH THE MOST POWE, INDUSTRY, COLLEGE EDUCATION, IS THE FIRST TO LEGALIZE DRUGS TO ITS YOUTH..............SHAMEFULL, SHAMEFULL, THE WORLD WILL MAKE FUN ABOUT THE US. THE NATION THAT PLACED THE MAN ON THE MOON, THE LEADER IN DEMOCRACY, POISONOING ITS OWN KIDS WITH LEGALIZED DRUGS. THINK BEFORE YOU ACT
meemee: So what you're saying is it's better to leave cannabis illegal where these same problems exist, but there is no control whatsoever over them? Everyone who wants to use drugs already does! I can't reiterate this enough. Prohibition has NO EFFECT on availability! Why wouldn't you want the FDA to make sure there isn't fungus and other adulterants in the drugs people use? It would make them safer.
OVIDIOGARZA: We should be the first to legalize as we were the ones who pushed prohibition on the other countries of the world. Fact: Anyone who wants to use drugs already does. Prohibition has NO EFFECT on availability. Why can't you people see this?
People need to be educated on the many uses of the cannibis plant, every single part of it can be turned into something useful, from the buds to the leaf to the stalk.Our forefathers in America grew it on their farms,they would keep some of the buds for their leisure,and the rest was sold to make commercial goods,from rope to paper to textiles. You can find out these facts for yourself by doing an online search;ielook up George Washington and hemp and see what YOU find. I have a companion who has used this as medication for many years, it helped him to overcome Hep-c,and allowed him to live years longer than docs expected,because of the Hep-c, which was he got while being a guinea pig for Uncle Sam,he cannot processes any pharmacuetical drugs due to the damage done to his liver.,Medical MJ has been a godsend.You all should read the book, Marijuana is Safer so why are we driving people to drink.
I HAD NO IDEA WHAT THAT SMELL WAS UNTIL SHE TOOK HER PANTYS OFF.
Thanks, Joe. I needed a laugh!
smell like canned tuna
Joe, do you get stinky when you get excited? Take a shower first. She will then find you tolerable. Nobody goes down on a dirty dude.
Joe, is that a maggot crawling out your nose?
We are a nation of Psyciatrists that think that everybody can be "fixed". "The Shrinking of a Nation" book written several years ago.
We are a nation of Psyciatrists that think everybody can be "fixed".
including your spelling lol.
Yeah, like wow, the two cool old men, Pat Robertson and Ron Paul. They know a doped up populace is easier to control.
We already have a "doped up" populace. It's just most of it is legally pushed on us by pharmaceutical companies. How many people are on meds these days. Plus, almost all of these legal drugs are far worse than marijuana. Big pharma can't control marijuana, and would have to compete with it, so they fight its legalization.
Just because we have a problem with legal drugs doesn't mean we ought to have more and with dubious and very limited benefits in a few medical conditions. I find it very interesting, the sort of people who claim to need pot medically and the people who think they don't need anything but a GED to dispense it at "clinics." It is well established that pot causes psychological disorders. I already posted about the cost of regulating marijuana legally and all the problems with quality control, etc. All this because some people want to get high and stare into space, and binge feed.
I could care less if its sold retail, but if I'm at my house, I should be able to grow as much weed as a I want. Alcohol is so much more destructive than weed. You obviously haven't smoked it otherwise you wouldn't make such ridiculous statements. I'd like to see ALLL the research that shows the prevailing psychological effects that weed has on people. What is it one article? Yea that proves it.
meemee, you're a total m o r o n.
Just sayin'.
.
You are retarded
@meemee - And just what do you think the cost of alcohol is to society in lost productivity, deaths and injuries, broken families, and alcoholism. Alcohol is a far more dangerous 'drug' than weed.
if even a broken clock is right twice a day, I guess Robertson has one coming.
memme you are a moron there is no evidence anywhere that marijuana has any bad side effects. Whatever you have read is government propganda. the only effect marijuana has on an individual is occasional bouts of laziness. but statistically speaking that is the number one cause of heart disease amongst middle aged women who wont get off there butts and do anything. instead crying about a gender nutrual society that still insists that men do all the hard work and get yelled at by moron momen like you who one dont study and two argue to cover up your obvious lack of ability to get beyond the lies this government sells all in the name of making more money not for me but for them
Dustin – it is very difficult to accept you as the self-professed "pot-head" because of your irrational agression towards women.
Didi you at least respect your mother?
I agree we should legalize marijuana and also believe one of the big differences between the US and other nations mentioned is the ability to obtain and use firearms as well as a lack of proper investment in early childhood and lifelong education for all in terms of some major systemic issues leading to a high rate of inmates.
If access to firearms caused crime then all of Switzerland would be in prison
No, the laws are deliberately targeting certain demographics (not racial demographics) to sustain incarceration.
There are 2 problems.
1: More law and order rhetoric during election campaigns results in more unnecessary criminal laws
2: Privatized jail system: Always need more product to maintain profits, and the product is people in jail
The fact that we know incarceration does nothing to prevent crime, yet social programs are proven to prevent crime should be the first indication that this is about money.
Private ownership of guns is completely banned in Mexico so of course there is no crime in Mexico.
Let me guess! ...you would trust the governmet to do this? NOT!!! ...LOL
Unlike alcohol, I have never heard of a single instance of "marijuana poisoning" or "binge smoking."
That's because its physically impossible for anyone to smoke/ingest the amount of "pot" it would take to kill a human. It simply CAN'T happen. As for "binge smoking"? Anyone who has spent any time at all in their lives smoking will know, once you smoke a certain amount, you stop getting high.. you reach your peak which usually leads to the smoker getting sleepy.
Pat Robertson blames liberals for this problem, both sides of Congress are responsible. Here in Arizona, illegal aliens are thrown into a private prison at $200 a night. Why not just drive them back across the border immediately and save the taxpayer $200? Governor Jan Brewer's election supervisor is a lobbyist for private prisons. Many private prison owners are staunch conservatives, Robertson doesn't mention that.
Can you reference your statement?
Or did you pull it out of your hiney?
While I agree the war on drugs is a failure, the article cherry picks Robertson's comments. The last quote is the crux of his position. It is the liberals sending white collar criminals to jail that are to blame for the out of control prison system. His comments are a thinly veiled plea for deregulation and decriminalization of the financial and corporate sector. Make no mistake, he could care less that the prison population is overwhelmingly minorities. His concern is with his white collar corporate backers who might end up in jail for embezzling money, committing fraud or destroying the environment.
While reading others comments, I did not see anyone pointing out what I too saw Brian.
Wrong again, Brian!!! Republican DA Rudy Giuliani sent white collar criminal Leona Helmsley to jail. The Republican DA of New York put Martha Stewart in jail. Both Republicans and Democrats have created this mess. Do your research before u post.
As a Christian I have always said God Bless Pat Robertson, but I am glad to see that he understands and is taking this position because I have always felt that pot is actually safer than alcohol, and the war on drugs as well as the prison system is big business, we are sending people to prison that shouldn't be there, legalize it and regulate it just like alcohol. I don't use it but I don't want our citizens in prison for using it either.
When people identify themselves as belonging to one religion or race or nationality, they usually are lying.
Are you lying Glenn?
Lionel,
I don't know if what you say is true, but I know that what I said is true. I don't usually express my feelings in a public forum but I do feel there is a problem in this country and something needs to change...
unbelievable.
This is really interesting how Mr. Robertson started by criticizing the system for criminalizing the drug users, yet somehow he ended up attacking the liberals for passing laws that involves the white color criminal. People that their acts has a dire effect on all of us. The beauty of this is that only a religious right winger can change the rule of cause and effect.
I agree on the white color crime issue. I think too many people go to jail for white color crime. I think they should be stripped financially, but I don't see how putting low level white crime offenders in jail with violent offenders is justice. I believe that some white color criminals (like Madoff) belong in jail – I just think some shouldn't. Our whole criminal system needs to be revamped.
Did I miss the part where he described the "big business" mentioned in the headline?
As to Pat Robertson I only allude to the fact that he says pot should be legalized, the rest is my opinion.
5% of the world's population yet 25% of those imprisoned... Hmmm, if we use the World Bank's figure (2010) of 6,840,507,003 then that translates into approximately 1.7 billion prisoners. Nope, we don't have that many people in our entire country. If we use the U.S. population in mid-2011 of 311,800,000, 25% of that translates into approximately 78 million prisoners. Nope, we don't have that many either. So where does this 25% come from? We do make up slightly less than 5% of the world's population so Roberts got at least one thing right... Wait, is it new math? If we use 2.3 million prisoners (corrections.com), that translates into approximately .007% of the US population. I guess sensationalism and inaccurate data makes for better press.
moron – he's saying we have 5% of the world's population, yet we have 25% of the world's total imprisoned population. Try to use the grey matter between your ears.
Wow, reading comprehension impaired from the bong??
There are roughly 10 million people imprisoned worldwide and the US has approx 2.5 million prisoners...
read again, it is not that 25% of the country is incarcerated, is that the US makes up 25% of the total number of people in prision around the world and yet the total population of the US is only 5% of the worlds population.
Oh Hawk, it's 25% of the world's incarcerated population. I don't know what you are missing here.
You gotta be stoned!
When you straighten up, think thru those numbers again!
ROFLMOA!
You could benefit from more careful reading: the figure is 25% of the PRISON population. To reiterate, not 25% of anything but the world's PRISON population, i.e., all prisoners in the world. Awesome job; feel free to get back to your half-educated googling.
Moron
Hawk? You ever do a bit part in a Cheech and Chong movie? Stop toking so much and maybe you'll be able to read what's actually being said.
I didn't really expect to agree with Zakaria on anything, but on this subject I do, wholeheartedly. Not just the war on drugs, but all the 'law and order' folks are nothing more than mouth-pieces for the prisons industry.
THANK YOU for bringing attention to this national emergency Fareed. People are completely clueless as to how horrible a crisis this is.
Oh Matt, are you saying that Americans are stupid and that you are the smartest thing on the block?
how is thanking someone for bringing something to everyone's attention claiming you are smarter? Why are you so defensive??
I thought I'd never say this either: God bless Fareed Zakaria and Pat Robertson. I usually do not agree with either of them. Today, I do and I appreciate their taking this stand. I don't use drugs and I never intend to, but legalizing marijuana makes sense to me. But also I should add that I think that there should be severe penalties for those who drink and drive.
Good for Pat and Fareed.
zakaria is an open terrorist, look at his past. imagine the increase in welfare, auto deaths, over doses and dopped up us citizens...........execute drug dealers and watch the side effects of drugs go down......usa will soon be a bunch of dope heads. talk about a decline in society
This is America, not Syria or Iran or Lebanon...
really??? Execute everyone?? Sounds familiar as a "final solution", right? well...China did that when the commies took over to get rid of all of their opium addicts. I guess you're found of Communism, eh?
Here is something I thought I would never be saying. Spot on Fareed. I guess even a broken clock is right two times a day.
Congratulations Pat Robertson for seeing the obvious and talking about it. Something politicians are incapable of.
the article is not just about illegal drugs; it is also about the amount of people in prison; many crimes need to be punished differently, like someone's car is sold when driving drunk or their house is sold when committing a white-collar crime; plus big fines and immediately cashing these in (don't wait till they are willing to pay) etc; only crimes like violence against an other person needs to go to prison
I believe that pot should be legal. But living in California where "Medical Marijuana" was legal for the price of the $100 card from the Kush Doctor , where you could grow it or buy it at either expos or in stores, it still made little to no difference on the number of Cartel killings south of the border and the number of drug convictions north.
Unless we are going to legalize All drugs, marijuana is just a drop in the bucket....Good luck with the legal Meth, PCP and Heroin...you might as well outlaw "Laws" at that point.
this is the first time I would agree with Pat
Quite right.
When Government is in session nearly the full length of every calender year. This long winded practice allow far too much time and effort to create additional laws many interfering in the lives of private citizens. I've often wondered why two weeks of in-session government worked in other large nations and America finds reasons to be in session for months on end. A total waste of so much time spent in long winded arguments,dreaming up more ways for Americans to gain prison records simply for being in possession of a weed. It's nothing more than cronyism in action and a huge protector of the beer, wine and liquor industry. If that group of lobbyist wasn't in Washington, we might have more common sense concerning marijuana.
In addition, any drunk is far more of a public hazard than a person using marijuana. It's refreshing to see some national voices finally speaking in a reasonable way on this subject.
Agree completely..
the whole problem with this scenario is that we are trying to stop some influential people from making profit off of the prison system, and for THAT REASON we want to legalize Marijuana. So we think they are so dumb that they won't find any other bill to put more people in prisions! if we all want to leagalize Marijuana then fine, do it but not for this stupid reason! because they will still find a way to keep people in jails. we are not striking at the root cause which really is lobbyists and corrupt politicians who support them. so after you legalize this now you have two more problems – one citizens who could have contributed to the country's GDP and not just claim unemplyment benefits will be too stoned to be productive (procrastination is a blessing!) and number two we still have too many people in prisons because the lobbyists would find something else to keep people in jails! If we as a nation are making so stupid decisions is it any surprise that China and Indai are kicking our ass in terms of economic growth?
Follow the money.Prisons run by private companys,inmates are profit centers.Law enforcement,lawers,judges,and the list goes on of of people who make money off ths war on drugs.Thats why it will not change,to much money at stake,not to mention control.
Where are the "smaller goverment" people when you need em.
Francis
Robertson may be getting senile. The war on drugs has not been met with success, so we should declare its end. The war on poverty has also not met with success, should we declare its end? So far as drugs are concerned, I am of the opinion all drugs should be legal. If there are those who want to destroy their lives they should have that opportunity..
If a course of action is tossing resources at a problem and making no progress, that course of action should be reevaluated. The War on Drugs has about as much success as The War on Poverty. In that, it's only making rich people richer, while pushing down on those nearer to the bottom of the societal ladder. Which is pretty ironic in the Poverty case. You can't just 'declare war' on a problem and attack it as if it were a breathing enemy.
You will never make people stop doign what they want. You are NOT GOD.. It's exactly like prohibition. Your kidding yourself if you think anything else. If all drugs were legal, less people would do them, because it's not as fun anymore.. Sounds odd, I know. But you have to put yourself into a highschool mentality. What the cool kids do, isn't usually legal, that's why it's cool.
Making it illegal, just makes it more appealing.. Like underaged drinking. Once I hit 21, I pretty much stopped drinking all together..lol It's about letting us make mature decisions for ourselves, not being our parents. We don't need the government to be our parents, we have our own..
This article is really off base, and Pat Robinson is very wrong! First of all “No one in the United States goes to jail for one day, let alone for ten years over the simple possession of Marijuana (i.e. one joint)-Come on people wake up-If that were case, we would have millions in the US prison system daily. Also, no one goes to jail for drug consumption-period. Stop listing to hype and do some independent research! The war on drugs is much larger than simply Marijuana-stop trying to tie the “war on drugs” to only pertaining to Marijuana-it’s not!!! In almost the entire Nation, Marijuana IS considered a Criminal offense (and rightfully so) and possession of it at the user level is usually charged as a very minor Misdemeanor (fine only-Hello, what does that sound like everybody!!!) or violation, a civil infraction. We have more important issues to deal with than passing more legislation on something that we don’t need to be legislated! I seriously doubt that America’s bulging prison population is due to the incarceration of Marijuana users-more likely those trafficking in very large amounts of it, (i.e as in several hundreds of pounds of it at a time!) or trafficking in Cocaine, Heroin or some other illegal drug. Lastly, be careful of attempting to legalize a societal problem away just because you (Society) do not want to deal with it-that is a dangerous precedent to set, and I resent this course of action-it opens the door for other problems that we as a society do not want to deal with! Here is an idea-let’s figure out a solution to our overly alcohol and drug dependent, addled population. (Facing a problem head on is usually the best course of action-I am sure I read this somewhere once!) Shame on Pat Robinson for being gulled into this logic-this just reassures my idea of him as a goof; Shame on Fareed Zakaria for suggesting that America’s growing prison population is due to simple Marijuana use or possession-I thought he was brighter than that; and Shame on CCN for posting this ridiculous, ill researched, and utterly unsubstantiated article-the research cited is so non-specific to the topic it’s laughable, and the inference it suggests is an insult to the non-drug addled population, whom by the way, can form independent conclusions! BTW-I purposely used capital “S” to denote Shame!
Not a single one of your points is actually true. People DO go to prison for only a single joint, the largest percent of prisioners is mj users – not dealers. Our current drug laws concerning mj CAUSE much more damage to society than any amount of lazy stoners ever will. Unless you are completely deluding yourself, please spend some time researching the actual numbers, costs and lives ruined by unfair mj laws and then comment. Just because you 'feel' that the laws are correct does not make them correct. 'Shame' should be dealt to those who fail to see the errors. Or do you own stock in Prisions?
I totally agree.........the 'old man' has finally said something I can agree with and shown his mettle in the process. When a country such as ours surpasses even Russia and China with incarceration rates.........and for menial garbage, something has got to change. True, we are a nation of laws. But we need to apply what we have with some semblance of equality and sensibility.
No one goes to jail for the simple possession of a joint-NO ONE-IT DOES NOT HAPPEN! Trust me when I tell you that the police can't even get those in possession of Cocaine to go to jail on repeated offenses! In every State I have lived simple possession of Marijuana has been a very minor offense! However, possession of large amounts of it CAN lead you to prison, most likely not on a first offense. I think all of you who say otherwise don't know what you are talking about, and you are clearly disseminating dis-information in order to ram home a point which is utterly false to support your own drug addled paranoid conclusion.
I agree it should be legalized i dont see the relationship to crime and why it is illegal. We are creating more prisons in the effort to get enough to lock up everyone who is not part of they political / injustice system we have.
Our government is against us...
We are waiting for them to come to our doors next to strip search our houses and take our weapons. this is the new prison purpose to jail disadants.
This war against the american people is not based on color its based on money how much you got is the issue vs. how much they in the control of the corrupted political system want all of it.
Why are our prisons full?
Too many bad parents.
Too many teen parents.
Too many who don't know their right hand from their left.
Too few good role mokels.
Too many bad role models.
Too much expectaion of privilege and too little sense of responsibility.
Did I mention leaders, who love to take money from lobbyists, in exchange for favors?
I WANT TO SMELL JUSTIN'S THING.
Many reasons to make weed legal.
1.) it was prohibit/made illegal in the late 1930's not for being a drug but socialized with Black American's
2.) The government use it to fight cancer in the lungs/pain relief
3.) explain in the above story.
4.) If tax correctly would make the federal government make /save money from prisons
5.) medical drugs would become cheaper in some areas
Reason not to legallize it
1.) prison bussiness would go down
2.) medical drugs would take a dive in sales due to weed being cheaper for pain relief/combat some illness
3.) sales for cig./achol would go down in sales
what PPL are scared of
1.) young ppl might have more ways to get it(they already get it illegally now it would be harder due to ID checks)
2.)ppl get dumb from it. that is a myth the person was already dumb achol does the same thing but more harmful to the body.
Is it too many laws or is it Americans do not want to follow them. If you don't like the laws then quit voting for those legislating them. America is the only country that idolizes bad boys & makes fun of geeks and over achievers. We tighten drunk driving laws, texting, etc and then propose to allow another impaired substance legal. Talk about mixed signals but then what did you except from ever centralized federal government system.
And legal Pain meds cause 1000% more problems in life...
PRESCRIPTION PAINKILLERS: drugs like oxycodone and hydrocodone, the main ingredients in Oxycontin and Vicodin, landed 305,885 Americans in emergency rooms in 2008 - more than double the 144,644 visits in 2004, (2010 study by Samsha and the CDC)
Overdose deaths involving these opioid pain relievers (oxycodone and hydrocodone; and synthetic narcotics such as fentanyl and propoxyphene) now exceed deaths from heroin and cocaine combined (Centers for Disease Control and Prevention)
Prescription drug overdoses have been increasing in the United States over the last decade, and by 2008 had reached 36,450 deaths – almost as many as from motor vehicle crashes (39,973).
http://www.acep.org/MobileArticle.aspx? ... rentid=740
* VIOXX: On January 24, 2005, the medical journal The Lancet published on its website a report on Vioxx risks that was previously blocked by the FDA. The study found that Vioxx may have caused as many as 140,000 cases of heart disease in the United States and as many as 56,000 deaths during the five years that it was on the market. The newly published study of 1.4 million patients shows that that low doses of Vioxx increased the risk of heart disease by about 50%, and higher doses increased it by 358%.
http://www.vioxxnews.com/
* ACETAMINOPHEN: ( found in more than 300 products with sales in the billions of dollars annually) Acetaminophen overdoses are the leading cause of acute liver failure (ALF) in the United States, Great Britain and most of Europe. Acetaminophen toxicity accounts for approximately 50% of all cases of ALF in the United States and carries a 30% mortality. -More than 100,000 calls to Poison Control Centers, 56,000 emergency room visits, 2,600 hospitalizations and nearly 500 deaths are attributed to acetaminophen in the United States annually.
http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1 ... .21926/pdf
* ANTIDEPRESSANTS: The respected journal, PLoS ONE, published a study in June 2010, showing that men who are depressed and take trycyclic, SSRI, or any other antidepressants die at a significantly greater rate than those who don't. – Performed in Australia, the study followed 5,276 men aged 68-88.
"The results of this study indicate that the 6-year adjusted mortality hazard is twice as high for men with depression compared with non-depressed men and that the use of antidepressants is associated with an independent rise in mortality of 30%. .. We found that antidepressant treatment increases the mortality hazard of men by 30%, and this association is independent of the presence of clinically significant depression. .. It is also important to consider that the use of antidepressants has been associated with numerous potentially harmful effects, some of which may increase morbidity and mortality. For example, antidepressant treatment has been linked to increased risk of injurious and non-injurious falls in cross-sectional and longitudinal studies, and there is some evidence that the use of common antidepressants increases the risk bleeding in various body systems, including the central nervous system, as well as the risk of incident diabetes. In addition, recently published findings from the Nurses' Health Study showed an increase in the number of sudden cardiac deaths associated with the use of antidepressants, a result that is consistent with our observation of an excess of cardiovascular deaths amongst men using antidepressants."
http://www.plosone.org/article/info%3Ad ... ne.0011266
Postmenopausal Women on antidepressants are 45% more likely than those not on such medication to have a stroke, and 32% more likely to die of any cause. – There is an increased likelihood of Hemorrhagic strokes (bleeding in the brain) which is possibly the result of the anti-clotting effect of selective serotonin reuptake inhibitors (SSRIs) which are most frequently prescribed for depression. The authors of the study noted that since post-menopausal women make up the largest segment of patients in the United States on antidepressants, the resulting increases in strokes and deaths across the country could be significant.
http://archinte.ama-assn.org/cgi/conten ... /2128?home
A study published in 2009 found that SSRIs interfered with the breast cancer medication tamoxifen, with tumors more than twice as likely to return after two years in women taking antidepressants compared with those taking tamoxifen alone.
Children whose mothers take Zoloft, Prozac, or similar antidepressants during pregnancy are twice as likely as other children to have a diagnosis of autism or a related disorder.
Marijuana should be be legalized for medical purposes only. Otherwise, marijuana as a gateway drug tends to lead to the use of hader drugs in some people like methamphetamines, cocain and ever heroin. The war on drugs is failing primarily because of the demand for them and as long as there is a demand out there, it will be met!!!
What is the evidence that marijuana is a gateway drug?
There is none. That is why he cannot give you a reference.
What is the evidence that sun rises in the east or a crow is black, or there is water in the sea.
Not all Hard drug abusers started off with Marijuana (True Statement)
Some Marijuana users will never abuse hard drugs (True Statement)
HOWEVER,
ALL hard drug users will drink water before abusing hard drugs (True Statement)
THEREFOR
Water is a bigger "gateway drug" than Marijuana (Inferred Conclusion)
Isn't logic fun?
Yes, logic IS fun. But there's no reflexivity in Implication statements, only in equivalence statements. So while I commend your challenging the "gateway drug" thing, you're going about it the wrong way.
Cheers
Just a small fact you all can research, less then 3% of MJ users do other drugs and less then 15% do booze. MJ isn't a gateway drug unlike the formentioned booze. Not forgetting to mention Tobacco and suger(aka does the same in your body and cokecain). So called gateway have been legal for years and that lame agrument the pot leads to other drugs is just false and missleading. Sotra like politics.
Just because ALL heroin addicts have had water to drink does not mean water was the "gateway" to the drug. This is basic algebra. as A is to B, and B is to C, does not make C related to A at all. It just seems that way.
Not quite. You're attempting to explain the Law of Syllogism (which is not a concept of algebra, but of Logic.) If A has a causal relationship with B, and B has a causal relationship with C, then A does actually have a causal relationship to C.
Actually, he got the logic wrong, but his earlier point is correct. Not a worthy opponent. I have to intervene.
If all heroin addicts drink (say, alcohol (since we're on the topic of drugs)), then it is NOT true that alcohol is the gateway drug to heroin.
Here the logic goes something like this: If A leads to B, B does not necessary lead to A. You could from the above statement say that Heroin is the gateway drug to alcohol, but not the other way round.
Nice try!!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Legal_history_of_cannabis_in_the_United_States
In 1970 the United States Congress repealed mandatory penalties for cannabis offenses and The Comprehensive Drug Abuse Prevention and Control Act separated cannabis from other illicit narcotics and removed mandatory sentences for possession of small amounts of cannabis.
In 1973 Oregon decriminalized cannabis.[79] Laws changed again in 1995 that reduced penalties. Possession of one ounce or less became legally defined as a "violation" (a crime that is considered a lesser offence than a misdemeanor) and now is punishable by a $500 to $1,000 fine that can be, in some jurisdictions, paid off by means of community service.
Colorado, Alaska, Ohio, and California followed suit in 1975. By 1978 Mississippi, North Carolina,[81] New York, and Nebraska had some form of cannabis decriminalization. In 2001 Nevada reduced cannabis possession from a felony offense to a misdemeanor, but only for adults age 21 and older, with other restrictions.
Starting in the 1970s multiple states, counties, and cities decriminalized cannabis for non-medical purposes. While many states, counties, and cities have partially decriminalized cannabis on November 3, 2004, Oakland passed Proposition Z, and became the first place to fully decriminalize cannabis to allow the licensing, taxing, and regulation of cannabis sales if California law is amended to allow so.[85] In 2008 Massachusetts passed a voter initiative that decriminalized simple possession of up to one ounce of marijuana, instead making it a civil infraction punishable by a $100 fine. Criminal penalties for cultivation and distribution remain in place.[86]
A vote in 2005 of 54% to 46% in Denver, Colorado, made the possession of up to an ounce of cannabis legal, although it does not overrule state laws and one may still be arrested for it—it also only applies to people age 21 and older. In 2006 Denver City Council voted to make arrests and tickets for possession of marijuana the lowest priority for law enforcement.
Then why is it only the the US is locking up such a high percentage of its population? I don't think we are uniquely attracted to drugs. It is because as the article puts forward the war on drugs is a failure. It has caused much more harm than it has prevented. It is time for a fresh look at how we deal with the issue of drugs including alcohol and tobacco.
Because politicians receive campaign contributions from corporations that run prisons, and because rural communities that host those prisons become dependent on them and their representatives insist on criminalizing everything in order to keep those prisons running and prison officers employed.
Putting people in jail gets u elected. Why do you think Leona Helmsley and Martha Stewart went to jail? Politicians dont care if they are locking up illegal aliens, dope smokers, or home improvement matrons. If it gets them elected, they will put Jesus Christ in jail.
dog or tree
blasphemy==shock value?
How is marijuana anymore of a "gateway drug" than alcohol? In fact, studies show that marijuana is more of an "exit drug" than anything else. When people choose THC, they tend to reduce their consumption of other addictive and deadly drugs, such as prescription pills (which are actually a gateway to heroine) and legal intoxicants such as alcohol and nicotine (which has the tobacco and alcohol companies freaked out and lobbying against it).
But think about the issue on a more grassroots level: like it or not, people love getting trashed, especially after a long day/week of work. Since many people want to follow the law and are afraid of the consequences of breaking it (usually they are afraid they will lose their job), they choose legal intoxicants, namely alcohol.
Now how does alcohol make you feel? It makes you feel tough, aggressive, invincible: It makes you do and say things you normally wouldn't; it helps you make mistakes. People drive when they shouldn't, people fight when they shouldn't, people do things they later regret with alcohol.
If marijuana were legal, more people would choose to get intoxicated on it rather than alcohol. Instead of going out driving while inebriated, more people would just stay home, order a pizza, and watch cartoons. Instead of acting aggressively, saying things they shouldn't, fighting, etc., more people would just kick back, listen to music and talk about how much they love everything.
If marijuana were legal, I guarantee you that drunk driving deaths would decrease, as well as the rates of violent crimes and domestic disturbances. The police's job would be so much easier if the lower classes were all stoned instead of drunk.
If someone consumes and/or supports the legality of alcohol and tobacco (which cause ~75,000 and 440,000 Deaths in the US annually), but are against the legality of marijuana (~0 deaths in the US annually), then they are a fool and a hypocrite.
This is an excellent post brother; preach on!!
"If marijuana were legal, I guarantee you that drunk driving deaths would decrease, as well as the rates of violent crimes and domestic disturbances. The police's job would be so much easier if the lower classes were all stoned instead of drunk."
Forgot to mention this. I read about a study recently conducted that is investigating this very issue; the impact of higher marijuana use with the decrease in consumption of alcohol and alcohol related traffic accidents. For the study, they used communities from states with liberal medical marijuana laws that have high medical, and probably recreational, use of marijuana. According to local police and DMV records, it did find a trend that supports the theory that as the overall population use of marijuana increases, the use of other mind altering substances, such as alcohol, tends to decrease by the same proportion; and not surprisingly, so do rates of alcohol related accidents.
Agreed 100 percent. I wish there was some data on the subject but that sounds right based on what I have seen.
@Ivan – Yay ! Then its settled – I'm gonna pack a bowl....
Hypocrite or very convenient to them...
I encourage everyone to watch this video and educate themselves on the facts and history around marajuana in the United States as presented by some of the country's formost doctors.
http://www.facebook.com/l.php?u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.youtube.com%2Fwatch%3Fv%3D9x4sBnEGcmo&h=yAQF2y5lJ
One of the biggest liars in this country is the Surgeon Genera, so why should we pay any attention to those other 'foremost Doctors' in the governments pocket?
One of the biggest liars in this country is the Surgeon General, so why should we pay any attention to those other 'foremost Doctors' in the governments pocket?
if you repeat it 5 more times, we will believe it?
hehehe...
Bull crap, that is a lame excuse. If marijuana is a gateway drug, then alcohol should be classified as a gateway drug as well. Your stance against marijuana is null and void unless you have the same stance against alcohol. If that is the case, then excuse me.
The "gateway drug" theory is patently junk science and has been definitely proven as such. There is no "magical substance" in marijuana that causes cravings for other substances that happen to be illegal at this point in time in human history. Marijuana use is a reliable indicator that the likelihood of experimentation with other drugs is higher than with non-smokers simply because it is illegal and thus found in the pockets of dealers who sell other substances along with it. Make marijuana legal and it will be no more a "gateway drug" than beer and cigarettes, which are also associated with a higher likelihood of experimentation of illegal substances.
There's a private prison here in Oklahoma full of state prisoners from California. Corporate corrections is HUGE!!
are you able to provide a name?
so that we can all know what you are talking about.
Gateway? Hahaha. Actually, a pothead that could smoke weed LEGALLY would have a much smaller probability of trying a MORE addictive, ILLEGAL substance.
You really are an gaseous idiot.
If it's a "gateway drug," (if it is one, which is unproven) is that it's sold by people who are by definition criminals. And once you start dealing with criminals for pot, you might just as well try some pills or some coke too.
Gatewat drug is a ridiculous and unprovable buzz word. Correlation =/= Causation. Why is alcohol not considered a gateway drug to hard drugs, or even violence and murder?
Stop living in the 80s, "Just Say No' was an abysmal failure.... need proof? CRACK COCAINE.
I smoked a joint at the entrance of a sports stadium, before a concert! So there, it is a gateway drug!!
hehehe...
I listened to a science report on NPR yesterday where a study was done that showed that cigarettes and alcohol are the actual gateway drugs to the usual illegal ones. In fact, they showed that people who smoked cigarettes were the ones who would become addicted to cocaine. I have always wondered about that as the standing explanations didn't quite satisfy. Every person I have ever know that had a cocaine problem were smokers or smoked when they drank or did other drugs. Nicotine seems to work with these other agents physiologically. That's what a couple long term studies have shown.
Just as many people in fact more in this country are addicted to fast food is that also a gateway to use of cocaine? If so maybe the fact that I am addicted to the love of my wife and family is also a gateway drug. Or perhaps the fact that I enjoy to fish and hunt or hunt is agateway maybe because I will willingly cut down a tree without thoughts of government proganda concerning global warming is a gateway quit reading reports and do some real study into your observsions.
Research on the relation between personality and the etiology of alcohol and drug abuse has revealed a single consistent finding: a correlation between antisocial behavior in childhood and adolescence and alcoholism in adulthood. It is antisocial behavior, however, and not antisocial personality, that most observers identify as a precursor of alcoholism. Unfortunately, the high rates of antisocial behavior in our society render it an inefficient predictor of alcohol and drug abuse. Research on the link between personality and the course of alcohol and drug abuse has suggested that substantial numbers of abusers meet Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of Mental Disorders criteria for antisocial personality disorder and that depression also frequently accompanies alcohol and drug dependence. No personality factors and no other behaviors have reliably differentiated abusers from others: Antisocial behavior and depression are behaviors that are symptomatic, respectively, of disregard for society's rules and of clinical dysphoria. Moreover, the depressed behavior of alcoholics appears largely to be consequent rather than antecedent to their alcoholism. (PsycINFO Database Record (c) 2010 APA
I was busted for marijuana in 1968. I had a good lawyer, so I beat the rap. I am now a federal retiree who never became a heroin addict.. Marijuana is not a gateway drug.
This is actually what is scary.
Imagine you got jail time instead, and lost your job... which is now more likely?
a) You are retired with a federal pension after leading a normal life or
b) You were found in a back alley ODed on heroine with a criminal history of theft to pay for your addiction because your criminal record prevented you from finding meaningful employment, so you turned further to drugs to escape reality.
The 'gateway' drug thing is a myth – A total myth –
It's like saying that someone who has a glass of wine is going to end up downing a 40 of vodka every day –
It is intentionally an obtuse argument being so ludicrous in nature that it is difficult to argue against. I might as well debate the color of the sky – blue or orange – How can one argue with someone that chooses orange??
Even if that was true, and I don't know of any evidence to say it is, what difference does it make? Are we going to ban everything that might lead to criminal behavior? Alcohol is extremely dangerous and causes tens of thousands of deaths every year in the US alone and kills almost twice as many people as guns do. If we're going to ban drugs, then we should also ban alcohol, guns, knives, politics, religion and anything else that might lead to violence.
I consider Alcohol to be a drug as well, and of course it could lead to harder drugs, but I would say that marijuana could never hold a candle to the damage to society that alcohol has caused, I don't think people feel much like killing each other after smoking, I have never heard of the police being called out to a domestic disturbance where pot was the drug of choice, or drive insanely fast after smoking, and yet alcohol is the legal drug...
idiot
Ice cream would be a gateway drug if made illegal. Why? Because there would be no place to get the ice cream except through a dealer. Rocky Road, or Chocolate Chip? Oh, I have some great Heroine too.......
hehehehehehe...
i have smoked for a good part of my life.. and it has never lead me to try other drugs it is no way a gateway drug.
Gateway – just as beer is the gateway to wine and whiskey? The reason it's called that is generally the pot dealer has other things also. IF it were legal, that would not be the case.
Does that mean coffee is the gateway to meth?
hehehe...
You are good!
You do realize you have BS coming out your mouth?
If there is any truth to the gateway drug argument, it comes from the fact that marijuana is illegal, not due to marijauna itself. If you want to get marijuana where do you go? a drug dealer, guess what else drug dealers have? Other drugs and knowing that crack, pcp, herion etc are addicting they push them on you. But guess what, if you can buy pot at 7-11 and 7-11 doesn't carry crack, your not going to start doing crack.
Marijuana is not a gateway drug... how can it be if cocaine was my first drug?
Find out why more and more cops, judges, and prosecutors who have fought on the front lines of the "war on drugs" are standing up and saying we need to legalize and regulate all drugs to help solve our economic, crime, and public health problems: http://www.CopsSayLegalizeDrugs.com
If anything, it is the production and trade of marijuana that is still very much illegal in most places, which in turn could make it a gateway to worse things. Allowing people to grow their own plants for personal and private use would certainly have a positive overall effect. You wouldn't need guns, nor any significant amounts of cash, nor have to conduct business with any unsavory sales agents, etc., etc
What a silly little girl, this is already happening.
Do some research before attempting to sound brilliant habibi.
also, Mayo Clinic and other medical researchers seem to conclude that cannabis are no more harmful than alcohol though both are terrible if consumed heavily.
I think medicinal marijuana usage in some states like california and federal fair sentencing act are a good start.
if those states allow some to smoke them or treating smokers instead of putting them in jails will prove that this does not raise rate of drug abuse in real life, a lot more skeptics will rethink about decriminalizing.
Another dumb liberal idea from Fareed the Screed. People who do drugs can't hold a job, but they need their drugs whether they're legal or not.
So when some hoodie wearing thug busts into your house or sticks a gun in your ribs because he needs what you've got to pay for his fix, does it matter if the drugs he's going to buy are legal or illegal? He's still going to threaten your life - maybe even kill you - to get the money he needs.
Liberalism is a mental disorder. Fareed Zakaria is the poster child.
Nice job! When you have nothing to contribute just insult the other guy. Strange to find myself in agreement with Pat Robertson. Also strange that so many folks that talk about reducing the role of government don't trust folks to manage their own bodies. The war on drugs has been a complete failure and has contributed greatly to the growth of organized crime just like prohibition before it. Legalize, regulate and tax drugs and you will deprive organized crime of one of its most reliable sources of money while generating money for the good guys.
Really? Someone is going to bust in my house and hold me up for my pot if its legal? How often does this happen with alcohol? How many times are people holding you up in your home for your 6 pack of bud light? And people who smoke pot can't hold jobs? Would you say the same for everyone that drinks on weekends and after work? NO This is the most ridiculous post I have read yet. Get a clue!
It seems that you have an isue with fear! If someone breaks into my home they will have to fight for what little i have drugs or no drugs I will devend mine
Yes, and there is a big difference between a drug USER and a drug ABUSER.
The so-called 'War on drugs' cannot succeed. The cops are so proud when they make a big bust but the amount they cost the dealers is chump change compared to their overall profits.
The biggest investors in privately run prisons in this country were the Bush family who began investing millions soon after their little boy George was elected. It was part of their plan to incarcerate for profit and their profits have been nearly as massive as their partners in the endeavor, the dug dealers/cartels.
Again with your favorite saying "so-called'–every conversation with you leads to something being called so-called.
It is or it is not buddy.
Get it!
A mental disorder, huh? The teapot calling the kettle black, don't ya think?
"The teapot calling the kettle black"
hehehehehehehehehehehehehe...
The expression you are trying to steal is "The pot calling the kettle black"
Now go and have a cup of tea.
hehehe...
Just like Kuato Lives, I am confused by your statement:
"Liberalism is a mental disorder"
Although, I realize I am talking to a dot.
Pretty arrogant (as usual) coming from someone who can't even offer their name as a screen name.
You said yourself: " ...does it matter if the drugs he's going to buy are legal or illegal...". Exactly – it doesn't...
Really, half-wit? I enjoy a joint now and then and hold down a six-figure job without any problem. As do most of my friends in technology companies in Seattle and Silicon Valley. It's trailer trash like you who have problems holding down jobs. It has nothing to do with pot.
Dead on!
I'm liberal on some subjects, I do drugs, and I probably paid several times more in taxes last year than you made.
Probably one of the dumbest comments I've ever read on here. Congrats on lowering the bar so far that even bacteria couldn't pass under it.
Mental disorders can be treated, conservatives cannot.
You are not a conservative or a liberal, you are a trouble maker, plain and simple.
Fareed Zakaria fails to mention that conservatives like William Buckley called for the legalization of drugs over twenty years ago. These were highly educated, respected intellectuals, not mongrels like Pat Robertson.
Again . is a retard
It is very hard to take a dot seriously.
"Gateway drug" is the only argument churches have left against marijuana. Other poisons are more destructive. Some are more expensive. Once the pharmaceutical industry, or a clever entrepreneur, develops a safe, non-habit forming drug with extreme highs but no effects, will the problem be solved. People will always have a need to get high. Finding a safe, and profitable way to do it is the capitalist solution.
Wow! You are really out there. I personally know may regular mairjuana users; all of them are fully employed. The trick is – don't go to work high. Works well with marijuana; not so well with meth or heroin. I challenge you to select the marijuan users out of a crowd simply by appearance.
Dumb dumb liberals.
Brainwashed, brainwashed conservatives.
Liberals know where they come from, know where they are and know where they want to go........conservatives haven't a clue except to say no and everything is bad unless it is a conservative's idea or conservatives benefit from it.
Liberal = having an open mind, open to different perspectives, open to progress
Conservative = stuck in the past, having a closed egotistical mind
Wow, you really demonstrated your intellectual firepower there "." We're all very impressed.
If liberals are so dumb, who elected George W. Bush as president?
Dumb and dumber republicans. George W. Bush, Rick Sanitorium, Sarah Palin.
The Democrat Obama has been great your saying??? Wow, wake up
Screw liberals and conservatives. They're the reason for all the mess the country is in right now
I recommend The New Jim Crow by Michelle Alexander if you want to get a handle on what has happened and why. She places a lot of the blame on the plea bargaining system.
Mandatory minimum sentences imposed at the state and federal level, and privatized prisons are also part of the problem. As long as there is a financial incentive to keep people locked up, this will be an uphill battle.
why didn't you give Michelle Alexander a shout out? Her book is part of the reason why more and more people are beginning to discuss this . Instead you nod your head to a piece of trash like Pat Robertson? Why?
I would like to see evidence for Robertson's assertion that "...every time the liberals [as opposed to conservatives] pass a bill – I don't care what it involves, they stick criminal sanctions on it. "
It's Pat Robertson. Once in a very long while he has a good point, but you can't expect him to go more than a few sentences without saying something really stupid too.
what?????
what..........are............ you............. talking......... about?
Are you even American?
Milton Friedman said this exact thing 30 years ago. Our government needs to wake up and really look at this from an economic point of view and not a moral point of view. Regulation might seem like the best answer but in the long run its a massive waste on money and ruins more live.
Okay, let's empty the jails.
Now what?
After you empty the jails, they will find Jesus and turn into Republicans. Problem solved.
Allah will tell them to lie.
hehehe...
The application of power is destructive, the application of knowledge is constructive.
If the european understand it so they should fight with ignorance rather than to invest in war.
terorism is the reaction not action.
Arif, you said:
If the european understand it so they should fight with ignorance rather than to invest in war.
terorism is the reaction not action.
We are trying to understand your statement that Europe is ignorant and who is propagating terrorism?
Terrorism is propagated by supporting common people to take guns in their hands, just like USA gave guns to common people in Afghanistan to fight Russian during cold war.This resulted in emergence of Taliban and Osama.Now you people are repeating the same thing in Syria and have already done that in Libya. So prepare yourself for more 9/11. Reap what you sow.
Tahir==slime bucket
"Prisons are a big business. Most are privately run." Herein lays the problem. Somewhere along the way we've sold the farm how is it in a time when violent crime is declining our prison population is expanding? I wager that at $50,000 an inmate not a penny is going toward education, reformation or reentry as productive citizen into society. We as the "customer" need look at the service and sets standards for achieving profit: it need be profitable for society as well. In this case it is clear that it is not.
It would be nice to know how many people in the system are there solely because of pot crimes.
Delia, when you say "solely because of pot crimes", are you including everyone from those charged with personal possession to those who were caught importing tons of marijuana?
Why are you making miniscule criticisms and countering with absurd overreactions to everyone's thoughts? What a troll.
(Bonus points for replying to this with "Well why are you (insert witty comment) )
Whoa!!!
Go smoke some pot and relax habibi.
Slightly less than half. It is an outrage.
If the country wants to continue the War on Drugs, it would be significantly easier to do what California did, and reduce most marijuana crimes to the infraction level. Levy stiff fines against users and small time dealers. Serves a dual purpose. Increases state and local revenues, and reduces the burden on the court and prison system.
Why don't we levy stiff fines against people for wearing yellow? That would also generate revenue, and it would be about as fair. Wake-up call: Smoking marijuana is not a crime.
I guess the problem arises when the users and small time dealers prefer to go to jail instead of paying the fine.
Make it legal and I will become a legal grower.
why? are you an illegal grower now?
whether illigal or legal grower does not matter fact is many government jobs depends on the "war" my brother in-law is border control withour war on marijuana he would have no job. but you know what he is a moron racist and sadistic in his actions. you want to fight crime make it ilegal to except bribes on the government level
In Colorado I am a legal grower. I am also an RN for Kettering in Denver! The director of the hospital knows I grow it and most of the other employees.
The Denver VA knows I grow it! I provide it to some of their vets free! And there are some on this website that will say I lie....but they are to lazy to google it! Yes, the government does allow the VA to recommend pot but they lock up locals for providing it.
Although I'm yet to be convinced that legalizing marijuana is the best solution ,I do feel that prison or jail terms is excessive and costly. I think fines for posession would be a better solution. We spend way too much keeping 7 million people incarcerated.
Then what, exactly, is keeping you from endorsing the legalization of a plant know to have medical benefits and only passing, non-addictive intoxicating qualities. Perhaps you may be alarmed to know that one can get high from huffing oxygen, as offered in bars all over the world. Perhaps we should outlaw oxygen as it's a gateway to huffing paint.
Stop believing the propaganda. Educate yourself. The only thing legal marijuana might be a gateway to is questioning just how many other lies have been pushed on you by your government and the media.
50 TRUCKS A DAY CROSSING FROM SYRIA TO HIZBOALLAH ECEVRY DAY SINCE MARCH 1 , ALL THE WEAPONS . CASH COME FROM IRAN AND SHIIA IRAQI GOVERNEMENT, AND THE HEAVY WEAPONS FROM RUSSIA SALE TO SYRIA , SYRIAN SENDING THE WEAPONS TO HIZBOALLAH AS A BACK UP PLAN TO BASHAR AL ASAD RUN, WHERE IS USA , UN AND NATO FROM THIS, THOSE WAR CRIMINALS KILLED MORE THAN 14,000 CIVILIANS TO DATE, WHY IS THE SILENT ....SYRIANS ARE STILL KILLING CIVILIANS DAILY, WHY THEY SEND WEAPONS TO HIZBOALLAH ALONG WITH CHEMICAL WEPAONS WE SEE IT ON THE GROUND EYES WITNESS SEE THAT THE TRUCKS GO AL BEQAA VALY AND SOUTH LEBANON , AND ANY BODY STOP THOSE TRUCKS WILL BE SHOT DEAD....SOME OF THE WEAPONS INCLUDE KATIOSHA ROCKETS, K47, HEAVY GUNS. ANTIAIRCRAFT WEAPONS, ANTI TANKS, MINES, LAND MINES , POISON GAS, AND SMALL UNMAN AIRCRAFTS. SCUDS ETC.....SYRIA MUST BE STOPED AND HIZBOALLAH MUST BE DEALT WITH , IRAN PREPARING THEM JUST INCASE THEY GET ATTACKED.
Bad news, bro. The Russians are supplying Syria with weapons, too. Long before Hezbollah and Iran got into the business.
Marijuana, Syria, Hezbollah, Iran, Iraq, Chemical weapon, Russia, Israel???????????????????? How much pot did you smoke?
Pound those war drums. Our troops are tan rested and ready. BS
Who cares? I don't, I hope they kill everybody so we don't have to hear about it any more
Marijuana Legalized? That's real humor. I mean...should we allow a menace (with an increasing nuisance-value) in an effort to deal with a another social problem? I think not. Just as sending people to jail is not the only way to deal with a crime; legalizing marijuana may not be the only way to deal with the real issues Pat Robertson has identified. Whether it is needful to accomodate a "weaker evil" to establish a greater good will be a symposium discussion in future. But for today, if we task ourselves enough, we can always find the kind of solutions that does not create another problem nor leave us with the sobering idea that we may have to accept the oppressive content of a social menace (marijuana) simply because we have underrated the blessing of the human spirit to discern noble and meaninful options with great balance.
Menace? What menace.
The evils you reference are fictions that have been used to produce propaganda that has been repeated ad infinitum for 80 years. Marijuana is illegal due to racism and corporate lobbying–nothing more.
What social problems does marijuana ACTUALLY cause? do you have an unbiased source you can reference? How about an older study that directly counters your claim, as produced at the direction of Fierello LaGuardia? (http://www.druglibrary.net/schaffer/Library/studies/lag/lagmenu.htm). Your post REEKS of ignorance.
Here's the deal, you cannot hold libertarian views on other issues and still demand that governments control people's social behaviors. Marijuana is benign–it's not an evil of any sort. If you're going to crow about how "evil" marijuana is, you'd better be beating the drum of making alcohol, nicotine, caffeine, energy drinks, and vitamins illegal as well. Otherwise you're just a foolish hypocrite.
Your "argument" overlooks the crux of the matter, which is not whether marijuana is a virtue or a vice but whether possessing it and using it warrants sending people to jail and giving them criminal records. Spitting on the sidewalk may not be good for society. That doesn't mean we should kill people for it. In the case of marijuana, the punishment does not fit the crime.
Google – Veterans Administration marijuana
If the gov says it is okay to recommend and treat patients with pot, why do they put people in jail for using it?
Educate yourself
ORGANIZED RELIGION IS THE NUMBER ONE ENEMY OF MARIJUANA LEGALIZATION. IF POT WERE LEGAL, POOR PEOPLE WOULD SKIP CHURCH, STAY HOME SUNDAYS AND SMOKE DOPE. PAT ROBERTSON FAILS TO MENTION THAT.
It is interesting to how uniformed you are. Marijuana is only illegal becuase the government knows we would grow it ourselves mmaking taxes not available. It is not a lesser evil I am a Sothern Baptist Preacher and belive that alcohol which you seem to drink to much of is the more evil Iknow mmany that smoke go to work and love there families if you wish to comment do it with intelligance and not judgment that is the key problem judge not lest you be judged in my world it is the survival of the fittest my guess is you have a sit on your ass office job and are controlled by your wife all of which are not of the bible if you dont believe then you are greatly missinformed and would do well to take a week and come to see me I can prove by science math geology and historical record the existant of god
i'm stunned. ol' Pat dealing in reality? now i have to quantify any critical talk about him
It's plain ol logic – stop trying to run other people's lives. Gateway drug? doesn't matter, it's not your job to tell others what to do. If people want to light up, then let em.
One day will come when people in USA will get up to legalize all drugs.Once alcohol was also not legal in USA.Long live USA.
This is a big reason why we need Ron Paul!
A person who shows reality does not have any chance in USA. Persons who can make people fool as Bush made people fool on weapons of mass destruction of Iraq, can only become presidents.
People can "start a conversation" on this all day long, but as long as it's a business it will not go away. In fact it will keep getting worse. Any industry will want to grow, and the prison industry is no different. Let's just stop pretending that America is the "land of the free" and recognize it for what it is, the land of the gulag.
Why are we listening to an Indian about what America must do?
Clearly you must be a native American. What tribe are you from?
How about we put the prisoners to work...free labor? No free rides in Prison!!! How about we get something out of that potential labor force?
Yeah, forced labor i.e.slavery, that's the ticket. How did that turn out the last time?
Are you suggesting we turn inmates into slaves? The article was on how immoral and unjust it is to have such high incarceration rates and what you got out of it was let's make them work for us. If you truly think you are so much better than someone whose committed a crime that you somehow have the right to make them work for you, well you need to check your wicked self. If we had less people in jail then we would have more people working in our society. That is a moral way to put prisoners to work, not enslave them and force them to work for us, especially for non-violent crimes.
Guess what, Trina? Private companies ARE putting prisoners to work. And some of them are getting filthy rich doing it!!!
This is the biggest fraud. Greedy corporations who benefit from running prisons on tax dollars. The purpose of sending people to prison is to change their ways. But infact prisons are breeding grounds of organized crime and the ones who go in come out as hardened criminals. Hire a big lobbyist company, give them a bunch of dollars, they will influence the politicians so that my fellow Americans can languish in Jail. This is a shame and no one cares about it. Do you think this will change sooner? I doubt it.
Hmmm.... incarcerating human beings for profit... sounds like a reinvented version of slavery to me
"Americans make up just 5 percent of the world's population but account for 25 percent of the population behind bars. Why?"
Because it's the only First World country (for now, at least) to have tens of millions of blacks and hispanics, with the expectation that those blacks and hispanics behave like civilized human beings. They seldom do, so into prison they go.
Yet, whites are arrested at twice the rate that black people are, according to the FBI: http://www2.fbi.gov/ucr/cius2009/data/table_43.html
Wrong - the only reason whites outnumber blacks in prison is because they make up 65+% of the population, and hispanics are lumped together with them in federal statistics.
Do not legalize marijuana. De-criminalize marijuana. Treat it like tobacco products (No advertisement allowed). Tax it.
If you want it treated like tobacco then you want it legalized? Tell me this. Why do we need to be punished for using a plant that God himself gave to us?
One of the reasons we have a large prision population is that we believe in rehabilitation, and giving second chances even when the odds of success don't look very good. In some (but not all) other countries, there are social norms that help keep the crime rate in tow; and at the other end of the spectrum there are some countries where offenders of relatively minor statutes are simply and routinely executed. Mr. Zarkaria, unfortunately, seems to always make America look like the bad guy on the world's block. I suppose they pay him for taking that kind of stand, because it does create the kind of angst among readers that keeps them coming back to see just how outrageous his next statement will be. It's actually just a variation on what was once called "yellow journalism". Very unfortunate that this kind of "reporting" actually is profitable.
You must be kidding. There are no rehabilitation programs in prisons. If anything, it's a place where people learn to become more hardened criminals in order to survive. And with a record and no chance of a meaningful when they get out, they're more likely to commit crimes again. The recidivism rate in America is sky high compared to other countries. Read a little about prison life in America.
Pgawk, you've probably never been inside a prison of a major city, have you? You should. Rehabilitation is something that you read in a text book.
Most people would support marijuana becoming legal. It ought to be. The only ones that want to keep it illegal are people with hidden agendas or paranoia's.
Not getting the connection here. First it's implied the US has five times as many inmates because of marijuana laws (no mention about how other nations with similar laws fare), then there's a complaint about "liberals" passing laws that put more white collar criminals in jail. What exactly is the point of the article – there are too many white collar marijuana criminals?
That was Pat's argument - that single paragraph copy-pasted from somewhere. I guess Fareed is more interested in the fact that we have a huge prison system with a strong lobby because of which the states pay lots of money and in return get their societies negatively affected.
we imprison based on the fact that prison are private companies making money and have lobbyist doing there job what can you not connect it is for profit i kive in oklahoma where nearly all the prisons are run by private and the penalty for personal use of marijuna is the most stiff make the connection its about money
Why does no one ever bring up that most of the problems with the War on Drugs failing began when "God" aka Reagan was in office in the 80s? Why does he get credit for the fall of the SU while failings with the War on Drugs and allies we made to defeat the Russians (like bin Laden) are ignored? This is important, we must know our history.
Making money by keeping folks behind bars. Sure sign of a decaying society.
There are many ways to punishment other than expensive, life destroying prison. I think caining is a great punishment that leaves a very good impression that is not expensive and life destroying. Get caught for minor offenses and get a good caining. Get caught again and get a few more additional wacks.
Other countries learned long ago that physical pain is a good deterant without costing taxpayers hugh sums and taking peoples lives away for years.
I have never understood how it is more humane to throw someone in prison for years when some very harsh physical punishment can be adminstered and over with quickly. It might leave a mark but you have taken your punishment and can get on with your life after a few weeks or month.
BAD NEWS, FALL GUY!!! Most violent criminals were abused as children. You beat the living tar out of a kid, and they grow up to be a low life just like you!!!
"and every time the liberals pass a bill"
While this issue is about the only thing Pat Robertson has commented on that I agree with it is however subject to the same revisionist history the entire right wing is guilty of. We "liberals" would not place laws on marijuana. In fact all drugs should be sold at state stores to anyone over the age of 18 who wants to pay for them and simply handed over with a warning. The government should tax the drugs and allow anyone with a license (after paying a license fee) to grow them. The only penalties (which should be financial) for growing without a license would be the confiscation of land and property
it is because americans have more blacks. if the prison system was better in african nations, then some african country would have the majority of the incarcerated.
From your name I know that you know about SA, Zim and other African nations. We don't get that news here but lies about how great Nelson Mandela and SA must be now. You must have read, "Into the Cannibal Pot," or have lived in SA. Sadly true is that blacks ruin everything everywhere they are or go, and Christianity makes whites believe they can fix it if they only take more blows "in his name."
Tax production, tax distribution, and tax consumption. It would be better if people were perfect, but they are not.
More touchy-feely liberal blather from the mental midgets at cnn. Theres more crap spewing from cnn shills than at a manure sales convention.
One issue that has to be addressed in any legalization is to protect LEGAL USERS from their employers or potential employers.
But look who is filling the prisons. BLACK MALES. Many are behind bars on false convictions and can't get them overturned. I guess we need
Gov. Hallery, he will release them. At least the killers, the worst offenders.
You go in for MJ possession. You join a gang and learn to be tough in order to survive. With a record, you can't find a decent job when you get out. You become a hardened criminal. And the cycle repeats itself.
I agree...
Classic example of the concept of freedom in excess. True freedom is actually the freedom to have self control to NOT do everything you wish to. This interior order creates a society with exterior order that will follow morals, laws and live for the betterment of your fellow man. Freedom to do everything you wish creates slaves to yourself.
Most of you probably won't want to hear this but the only basis for this moral code is a consciousness of God, otherwise there is no basis for following any moral laws. If you are just an animal then by all means behave like one. It's saddening to watch the dilution of our society where freedom "rules" and everyone is a slave.
"Freedom is slavery."
Gee, where have we heard that before?
Yay, another "how bad America is" story and lecture from a foreigner.
This land of the free and home of the brave has gone nuts. NO one should be incarcerated with the exception of VIOLENT CRIMES– period. It serves NO purpose for someone to do time for a property or petty drug crime. Put them to work and set them straight. Three hots and a cot does nothing for society other than bankrupting it.
It does make sense to have a separate penal system and laws for drug offenders. Creating a system of lies about the harmlessness of "victimless" drugs like marijuana is not the answer however. Likely, it would be run privately, but it could work. I am from a family of doctors. My uncle once ran half way homes for alcoholics in California during the 60s and 70s until Regan and others cut the programs. I was around it a great deal because my father was involved in it also, as a business partner. It seemed to work well from my memories of the operation. Most people dried up and got their life together. Now these are called "rehab" centers, but they are for wealthy people. Most people with these problems aren't wealthy. These are the ones the end up in jail.
Our high numbers of jailed people include many minorities, most of them from dysfunctional families and neighborhoods. We have to fix those problems, not legalize drugs.
Where have you been? We've been fixing those problems for 50 years, but the more we fix, the worse the problems gets and the more it costs in dollars and socially. Maybe some people should look at the sort of cultures we embrace, the sort of people we make popular and our role models? And since we import the worst people from the worst societies, it stands to reason that we will have increased problems and more people in jail. More "Diversity" = More Crime." The proof is in our history.
You want to know why we have the most population behind bars... Because people in America and that come to America think that they can do anything they want even though it is illegal. Parents do not teach kids anymore the TV, Internet and their Friends do. As a country we have lost our morals. Prior to the early 60's maybe 70's people respected others yes there were bad people but it was not a rampant problem like it is today. Until we get back to a core moral value America is going to become the next China with the Government controlling all the cards, sneeze wrong and welcome to the forced labor camps.
You are correct; As a foreigner I can see America changed a lot over the past decades. I was in US during the 70's as a student , American back then were different; they were the " traditional " American; people with lots of self respect law abiding citizens , therefor much less crimes then nowadays, to say the least. Today, not any more.This has nothing to do with China or Russia, it is owing to the fact the core value of America has changed.
The last scene of Planet of Apes would have told you where America stands now; it is FINISHED !
Never used drugs, including Marijuana, and never will.
I recognize that the chemical properties of Marijuana make it considerably less harmful than other drugs....but my first-hand witness of users of marijuana shows that it clearly had dangers. I've seen good, promising people my own age (I'm a college student) start using it...and start using it more...and start paying less attention to school...and sure enough, they blow their future because they start spending too much time sitting around getting high. That isn't to say that Marijuana can't be used responsibly – only that far too many people use it irresponsibly to make it legal.
If I could legalize marijuana for people, so long as they were able to maintain steady jobs and clean criminal records, so long as it didn't come between them and others...then I would. But we can't do that. And until we can, which is likely to say "never", then it should remain illegal.
So ten years in a prison with murderers and thieves hasn't worked well at preventing people from using drugs. Ok. So why not establish special drug prisons? You put them out somewhere isolated, you keep the drug users away from the truly violent criminals, and after a debt to society has been paid (and using drugs DOES create a debt to society), then you can require mandatory treatment...all this on top of hard labor or other undesirable things that truly keep people off drugs.
If a kid gets caught with drugs, require him to spend his entire next summer vacation in one of these drug prisons. He does the labor, misses out on the fun of summer, and hopefully learns his lesson.
That fact that we haven't eliminated a problem entirely isn't a reason to throw up our hands and walk away from who knows how large a chunk of our population.
The problem is that, as a business, the prison industry doesn't want to reduce the number of incarcerated. In fact, they logically want more "customers" in their system. They have no interest in keeping the non-violent away from the violent, or in rehabilitating people. That would be detrimental to their business.
How are your criticisms against pot any different than criticisms that could be applied to alcohol which is legal? Would you put alcohol users in these same jails with the pot smokers? if not, why not? The only big difference I see is that drugs are illegal so buying pot unless it is grown somewhere locally could be giving money to drug lords, something to avoid doing–look at Mexico now thanks to our drug laws. We have helped create a horrible situation there and it is spreading here. I don't know the answer but prison time for possessing a joint isn't it. That's sickening to know people are in jail so long for something so minor.
I see your argument but the bigger picture is that it should be our choice to make. If we want to smoke pot that should be our choice just like if someone wants to light a cigarette or drink alcohol. If alcohol is legal it damn sure should be.
Prison are full and America leads the world in this statistic because America is a country of laws and consequences for law breakers. those of you haven't traveled or lived outside the borders of America don't understand that in other countries being a victim of a crime multiple times is a common occurrence as many crimes go unsolved and criminals unpunished and become career offenders.
Why does the US spend as much on "defense" as the rest of the world combined? Why do we spend the most money on health care (by 51%) than any other country, yet our heathcare system is ranked #34 worldwide?
Once you begin to peel the layers of capitalism back, you find one commanality....Greed! Fueled by an ignorant, misinformed public and abetted by a rotten to the core political system.
The real tragedy here is that the US citizenry, is for the most part, are decent, hard working, honest people. We deserve a government that represents us, not the corporate interests that have sucked the life out of this once great country.
The U.S. has more people in prisons than other countries and other societies because other countries and other societies haven't maintained country club prisons for their criminals to lounge around in. They simply execute them. Does Pat Robertson have any idea how many people Stalin executed? That's why there was no overcrouding in Stalin's Gulag.
if this is news to anyone...you're a noobie
Hipster.
The "gateway drug" theory is patently junk science and has been definitely proven as such. There is no "magical substance" in marijuana that causes cravings for other substances that happen to be illegal at this point in time in human history. Marijuana use is a reliable indicator that the likelihood of experimentation with other drugs is higher than with non-smokers simply because it is illegal and thus found in the pockets of dealers who sell other substances along with it. Make marijuana legal and it will be no more a "gateway drug" than beer and cigarettes, which are also associated with a higher likelihood of experimentation.
I'm not surprised by these statistics. American culture is not one of professionalism, morals, and making decisions that are beneficial to society and its citizens. The failed liberal belief that "people are inherently good" and should be free to do what they want, and abuse the freedoms provided, is part of the cause. Kids are not raised in a manner that instills good values, work ethic, because their parents don't possess either anymore. They expect everything to be given to them by those that do the right thing, blame their problems on everyone else, and feel that they are above the law. They and their supporters will use these statistics to wrongly cry that we should relax our laws (e.g. drugs, illegal immigrations, traffic, etc.) instead of instill a culture that improves quality of life (so you won't need to escape reality with drugs) and respect for authority (including the law).
The reason we have such a large prison population is because the other countries execute their felons.
What countries do that on a larger scale then America?
This is a stupid argument and, if it were true, proponents of the death penalty would be loudly promoting it. The fact is, America executes a larger proportion of its citizens than any other country in the world, even China. China executes more people, but it has a much larger population. Proportionately, America is the #1 state-killer of its own citizens.
The reason we have such a large prison population is because the more people you throw in prison, the more you get elected. Rudy Guiliani, Sheriff Joe Arpaio, George W. Bush
It is time to decriminilize all drugs and stop jailing dead broke fathers for the crime of just being poor.
Sure it'll create a temporary void to make some prison space for the Wall Street crooks. Don't count on the bed bugs in the extra bunks to be lonely for too long. The higher the capitalism, the higher the crimes, the higher the incarceration.
The majority of US prisons are not privately run and those that are privately run house fewer than 20% of all prisoners in the US. Moreover, private prisons are a response to not a cause of mass incarceration. You are correct to think that our incarceration rate is shameful but your claim that prisons as big business has caused mass incarceration is only slightly less ridiculous than Robertson's claims that liberals and white collar criminals are central to the mass incarceration story. You have found an important issue but failed to understand it.
Those are a lot of spectacular claims of journalistic malfeasance coming from someone who conveniently offers no independent sources to back them up.
This prison bill is coming out of our taxes, and it is another reason we are in debt up to our ears. "Over all, there are now more people under 'correctional supervision' in America...than were in the Gulag Archipelago under Stalin at its height." America has become a fascist corporate plutocracy. Not only do they want to control their own population, they interfere in every other country in the world. A society should reward good behavior more than punish, but American society depends to much on punishment, and sooner or later we are going to end up like Argentina in the 1970's, and finally . . . . a revolution.
When the Revolution comes, I'm betting that Capitalism will still be part of the new order. Therefore I'm investing in Pitchforks and Torches.
Our prisons are over populated because Reagan created a false fear of "street crime." Tough on crime Criminal justice policies are still being implemented today even though crime rates have been slowly declining! Lets save the tough on crime policies for the people that actually are harming our society on a massive scale, WHITE COLLAR CRIMINALS......... The crime is in the suites, not the streets!
"every time the liberals pass a bill – I don't care what it involves – they stick criminal sanctions on it. They don't feel there is any way people are going to keep a law unless they can put them in jail.... "
What happens when you pass a law and there are no penalties specified for breaking that law? Answer: it becomes unenforceable. Does Robertson really think that only Liberals pass laws with penalties attached? This guy is delusional.
I ran a massage parlor & was sentenced to 3 years for pimping. Becuz mine was a non-violent crime I served 50% of my sentence. The girls float about going fr one massage parlor to another. They could come & go whenever they wanted. I served time @ San Quentin, High Desert, and California Correctional Center–3 moves for a year & a half sentence. EVERY prison I went to tobacco, marijuana, and meth was available. The prison system is a waste of tax payer's money. Prisoner's watch tv all day, do exercise in the yard, are fed, clothed and housed. Plus, the drug offenders can partake of drugs if they wanted to. The guards know it and the wardens do too. The legislators and judges should. What about you?
Because we are the greatest country in the world wherein if you get sick, you go broke and then die. To get an education, you have to go into debt for the rest of your life. But if you go to prison, you will get that healthcare that the rest of the world has.
"The state spends $8,667 per student per year. It spends about $50,000 per inmate per year."
<< so sad
The war on drugs has failed because the federal government refuses to secure the US border with Mexico. Both the democrats and the republican presidents have refused to enforce the laws already on the books.
That sounds like a good idea. Let's turn the entire country into a walled prison so that we can be free of the evil weed.
lol
We are a nation of incarciration because we have laws for a nation to follow. Thank God for this country, which, while not perfect, is a model for many reasons to the rest of the world. The rest of world unfortunately cannot afford food and shelter for its citizens, let alone jails where they must feed prisoners....even if only dog food they may provide. I have never been in jail......I do not believe it is because jails are big business. And if they are, so are American-owned cigarette, alcohol, oil, tech, and many other companies in diversed industries. WE are world leaders in so many ways which help society. Stop knocking good 'ole USA. Celebrate that we live here. Not perfect, but envy to millions outside who wish, and would consider it a priviledge to reside here. Long live USA!
brainwashed
Peter that's the point!
America has a huge rate of homlesness, starving, and people that fall below the pverty line and we are spending BILLIONS of dollars on not violant criminals......... The CJ system is using Banishment Laws, and Waste Managment style incarceration to combat the social problem of Poverty. Can't you see that this isn't working???? Why not free these people from our prison and put the money into social programs!
Yes, long live the cheap slave-produced Chinese products that allow us to live in luxury for a little while longer until China pulls the plug on our unsustainable debt. You might as well be extolling the virtues of the Holy Roman Empire.
Maybe you should change your name from Fareed to Mr. Obvious. Oh, wait, Bob and Tom are using that name in a comedy bit.
Anyway, yeah there's a HUGE prison INDUSTRY in this country. DUH!
'Bout time somebody noticed.
Mr. Zakaria,
I liked this entire post until the last paragraph. Your reasoning for the outsized growth of California prisons versus colleges is that
"Prisons are a big business. Most are privately run. They have powerful lobbyists and they have bought most state politicians."
I don't disagree with what you said, but rather what you didn't say. In addition to lobbyists, the Prison Guard union (public-sector union) has used its outsized influence and resources to expand the prison culture of California government as well. Lobbyists and public-sector unions are both powerful special interests, and both have contributed to this problem.
dead serious – quit the foolishness, legalize weed which is less dangerous than alcohol – and free up the kids imprisoned – and end the "crime" associated with weed and even coke and crack – i guess i would only outlaw heroin – because you could die in one incident – but seriously free up weed for usage and sale – weed is healthy and it does not bother anybody – and i am tired of our kids being in jail because of weed – i dislike all the prejudice in this world, you know – look you got drunk fools crashing cars and murdering folks – and you be there all kinds of proud locking up good peoples who was caught with some precious weed in they pockets – that ain't right – my sweet friends
It's a prison bubble. Big investment opportunity that is ready to collapse, too. It's all tuna!
One of the biggest reasons for all these prisoners in the US is that we have more laws than just about anybody, and they are far more rigidly enforced. The "Land of the Free" is now nothing more than a myth and a buzzword.
We throw people in prison for anything. There is no rehabilitation, they want to throw some people in a throw away the key.
Remeber you only get one life and unless you do something extremely violent you should not be in prison.
We already have enough death, injuries, and property damage in this country from people drinking and driving – if we legalize marijuana we will see those numbers rise (no I don't have proof of that – but the logic follows) – add to that the auto insurance premiums will go even higher as well. I will support legalization of marijuana IF and only IF the punishment for driving under the influence of alcohol and marijuana both increase up to and including the permanent lifetime suspension of driving privileges of the worst offenders.
The logic does NOT follow! In states that have liberal mj laws, studies have been done which show that as mj use rises DWI auto deaths falls, as people stop drinking and start smoking. Please do some research. There are even posts in this comment section detailing that fact.
The logic goes more like this: Alchol companies realize that people will stop buying their products if mj becomes available, so they lobby against legalization. They've done the studies – because it affects their profits – so go take a look at their stance on legalization and then see where the logic follows!
Good article until you reach Zakaria's conclusion that "Prisons are big business. Most are privately run. And they've bought most state politicians."
Wow! REALLY? The prison lobby has "bought" "most" state politicians?! Simplistic much?
Zakaria's editorials are smug, one-sided, simplistic and pedantic. This is a really complex issue. You deliberately confuse legalizing marijuana with people in prison on all drug offenses.
What percentage, exactly, of the prison population is in prison for marijuana possession? I would guess it's close to zero for people arrested without an amount considered intent to distribute/sell.
This column is stupid.
What's stupid is someone, like you, saying things that are completely and utterly incorrect and baseless because they are too lazy to look up actual information. 12.7 percent of state inmates and 12.4 percent of federal inmates incarcerated for drug violations are serving time for marijuana offenses. In 2008, roughly 800,000 people were arrested for marijuana offenses, out of 1,841,182 drug arrests in the United States; that's 47% of all drug arrests going to marijuana. And, the Department of Justice reported that 89% of those marijuana arrests were for simple possession, not manufacture or distribution.
Where did you get your stats, a Grateful Dead website? According to studies by Columbia University inmates incarcerated for marijuana possession is significantly less than 1 percent.
Matt: I believe his stats come from the Department of Justice. Yours come from a university which is most likely only local information. Either way, both of you need more than one source of information as bias is always a factor.
So many people are behind bars _because_ it's a big industry? I'm going to go with something slightly more controversial, and that is that so many people are behind bars that it makes the industry big. Call me crazy.
The people who want to throw people in prison should think twice. You have never been to prison and you don't know what its like.
Gee, our crime rate has been dropping and it is about the lowest I've seen in my 54 years on the planet. I wonder if putting the CRIMINALS behind bars has something to do with that. I think all bases sentence rules should be DOUBLED. Criminal humans can't be fixed; but them away!
It was dropping before the switch from rehabilatation to mass incarcerations policies! Also, crime rates are very trick because they are coming from police data which are very skewed! And even if crime rates are on the decline why does it make sence that more people are being incarcerated?
So what do we do to resolve this issue?
and you got the big piggy cops paid by the temporal and obfuscated govt to trip up the weed sales and make profits for the big businesses of the jails – and you got all the Ivy League sensationalism and false pretenses (folks playing fake and cruel) and suspension of real justice (they in their towers smoke the weed and keep us from smoking the weed) – what ever happened to common folk living heartily off the land – like French Revolution style (rising up to get what you want come hell or high water) – the common folk (so very brave) knowing what they need and getting it – instead in America you got the corrupt Ivy League dictating everything and enslaving the common folk by paying for the guns (the piggy cop folks) and making the laws with which to enslave and kill the common people (any fake and sad law in America like all the anti-woman laws for example so sad) – it is sick and sad – my friends – distrust those pretentious fools and trust nature which will never turns its back on you
I discovered that when I bought a mutual fund, one of the companies which was a part of it was a prison company, Corrections Corporation of America.
That meant that I was profiting from prisons paid for by taxes by lots of people who didn't own stock in it.
The thing about corporations is they try and grow their profits. What better way than to have three strikes laws and lifetime incarceration for three minor crimes? Someone with two strikes shoplifts some flashlight batteries and he gets life. That kind of crap.
I'd gladly give up that part of my mutual fund. I don't want to profit from others' misfortune.
Just wonder – of the 25% prison inmates, how many % are blacks and how many hispanics?
http://www.prisonpolicy.org/graphs/raceinc.html
Having spent 36 years in Federal, state and local law enforcement, I am convinced we are absolutely wasting our time enforcing illegal drugs. I have put a lot of major international traffickers in prison. It made sense I guess in 1973 when Nixon declare the War on Drugs but then was when top violators might be able to produce a kilo or two or heroin or cocaine per month and our criteria was that these people were close to being capital killers. But almost forty years later, it does not make any sense and we are spinning our wheels and spending billions with no deterrent effect plus millions of Hispanic drug traffickers descending on our doorways. And I am absolutely correct. Different society, different generation, and different standards entirely. Oh haters, please do not condemn me. My wife of almost 34 years is Mexican and my little daughter gets married on Cinco de Mayo, so we've hired a huge Mariachi band to celebrate and serenade the attendees. But for those of you who insist on answering, I've been there and done that and I am correct. Tons of arrests, prosecutions, convictions and prison time, but no deterrent effect...
It helps when Law Enforcement veterans speak up. Maybe now these stinking politicians will vote to spend more money on rebuilding roads, schools, and factories, not prisons.
This is the most ridiculous post I have ever read even for Fareed. The prisons are not full of pot smokers. They are full of drug dealers, burglars, rapists, murderers, corrupt politicians and organized crime figures. Maybe we should just open the doors and let everyone out you idiot.
I think the point is that millions are incarcerated for non-violent marijuana offenses, and anyone with half of a functioning brain and 6 seconds to think about it can see that it's a victimless crime.
I agree that prisons are a big buisness, for state unions the ARE.
THEY'RE TRYING TO BUILD A PRISON! THEY'RE TRYING TO BUILD A PRISON! FOR YOU AND ME TO LIVE IN! ANOTHER PRISON SYSTEM! ANOTHER PRISON SYSTEM! FOR YOU AND ME! OH BABY YOU AND ME!
Many people already live in a prison; it's called poverty. Now they're taking jobs from one population and giving them to another because it's part of a social plan. But they keep getting more criminals from the ones they are trying to get to take over the nation. Epic Fail and the cost is and will be high.
I guess it never dawned on anyone that it could be because we have become an immoral nation, with cultural rot as our only legacy to our children, have overthrown our Judeo-Christian foundation, are so full of sin and corruption that it's not even remotely funny, and have leaders that are both immoral and amoral, or that we worship a ton of false gods...athletes, show biz people, corrupt, lying role models ...and refuse to engage in work, education or religion, or that we have decided that technology and opinion will be our guides instead of faith, justice, honor, morality or honestly. Why we have even become a nation which allows, condones and legitimizes murder (abortion) and refuses to allow God or Christ to be spoken of in public. Oh, no, it could never be THAT!
If we are such a rotten nation, it is because of the corrupt system putting away relatively harmless people.
If you travel, you can see how intolerant we are relative to our European cousins.
I agree with much of what you said Cheryl, and if we turned back to God as a nation things could change, but our laws also need an overhaul, someone could spend more time locked up for a bag of weed or copying a DVD than a Bank Robber.
God is an abortionist. More than half of all fertilized eggs don't attach to the walls of the uterus and are flushed out during a woman's period. If it's good enough for god, it's good enough for me.
Hell it should of been legal 40 years ago.
Up until 1860 it was legal, and many other drugs as well...
Incarceration is an effective way of keeping the U.S. unemployment rate, even at 9%, one of the lowest in the world. I haven't done the analysis, but there may be an inverse relationship between the rates of unemployment and incarceration.
I am sick to death of hearing that liberal professors are the reason for the skyrocketing cost of higher education. My state has lost population in the last thirty years, but the number of persons under "corrections supervision" here has tripled. Consequently, the state is about to do away with public higher education, making college an exclusive club for the wealthy who can afford private colleges–the only kind there will be.
Legalize weed, bring back Death penalty for the harder drugs,
THIS STORY IS BACKWARDS!!!!!!!! The reason we have so many people in jail is because in America we have the weird habit OF ENFORCING OUR LAWS. So is Pat Dumb A** Robertson saying that the laws we have should not be... well illegal? What is a "bad law" that people get put in jail for? What steeling "really small stuff?" Coupled with actually ENFORCING our laws we have GREAT FREEDOM to choose to BREAK THE LAW! in America. ...I mean this is the cornerstone of our country...we are a country guided by THE RULE OF LAW...not opinion or preference or religious belief or by how much money we have like 90% of the rest of the world....it ain't rocket science.
The "law" is an opinion of a group of people.
you are dumb
I just did a bong hit.
YES WE DO HAVE LAWS,WE LIVE BY THE RULE OF LAW, MOST OF THE UNCIVILIZED NATIONS STILL LIVE IN THE PAST. WE OBEY THE LAWS WE MAKE AND KNOW THE DIFFERENCE IN RIGHT AND WRONG. WHEN WE CHOOSE TO
BREAK OUR LAWS WE TAKE THE CONSECQUENCES. MOST COUNTRY'S WILL JUST KILL THE LAW BREAKER AS
IT IS BETTER THAN HOUSING THEM–GET MY MEANING. WE DO NOT KILL FOR CONVIENCE. WE HAVE LAWS TO
BETTER SERVE LIFE.
We try to stop smoking by banning it everywhere we can and we still have Liberals who need their mind altering smokes! What other countries do to stop the incarceration – they don't let stupid people exist.
In 2007, 12.7 percent of state inmates and 12.4 percent of federal inmates incarcerated for drug violations are serving time for marijuana offenses. In 2008, roughly 800,000 people were arrested for marijuana offenses, out of 1,841,182 drug arrests in the United States; that's 47% of all drug arrests going to marijuana. And, the Department of Justice reported that 89% of those marijuana arrests were for simple possession, not manufacture or distribution. Reports have estimated the cost of these marijuana arrests at $1 billion a year. Currently, there are between 40-55,000 US citizens behind bars for marijuana.
Legalizing recreational drugs will increase the incidence of DUI-caused accidents. Face it, we can't keep the drunks off the road, what makes anyone think we would do any better with any other habit-forming drugs? I have used marijuana and then driven and I will say this: I (and you) would be a lot safer after I had two or three beers than after I pulled down two or three good joints.
wrong, most people drive slower and more cautiously when stoned. drunks drive faster and more reckless.
I smoke daily and 2 or 3 beers does not equal 2 or three joints. I'd say that 2 or three beers amounts to about a third of a joint of regular weed. Either way, driving under the influence of either is not something to take lightly. But alcohol is much, much worse to drive on.
Actually I have driven while being pretty stoned and I can tell you that I can drive through the McDonalds Drivetru just fine.
States which have liberal mj laws see a decrease in DUI deaths as people switch from booze to mj. Please base your comments in facts and research.
Its more important to avoid getting caught than to obey the laws. We can stop the madness! We all get jury summons. Next time your on a jury for a non violent crime vote not guilty. Next time your in court for a non violent crime plead not guilty and refuse to give up your right to speedy trial. If everyone did this the court system would collapse in a matter of weeks.
Um.
Nation of Laws.
Not true of many nations. (Unless you count growing heroin poppies and cutting women's lips off.)
This is the same warped statistical %%(^&*7 reflected in the "FL justifiable homicides up by 200%."
Sadly, the writers here (among others) seem to hope that everyone will just gobble up their golden words.
So, some more statistics:
Ten out of nine people have difficulty with math.
100% of every man, woman, and child living today will perish in the foreseeable future.
Of those killed by gunfire, 100% have been in contact with a firearm product.
Of black Americans killed by black Americans, 0% have been killed by white Americans.
And of course, after detailed questioning by CNN, CNN has been informed that more than 95% of those incarcerated do not belong there.
In a private, non-scientific poll it has been determined that of those participating, only 20% believe CNN commentators to be functionally literate.
These are frightening numbers.
So let me understand the logic here. We had a large increase in the crime rate in the 70 & 80s. Laws were passed to increase penalties and three strike sentences imposed on repeat offenders. The crime rate has continued to drop since that time. Now you believe that we should lower sentences and have less people in prison. Perhaps, I'm just saying perhaps, you haven't correlated these facts into your position.
"Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it".
George Santayana
Most of the drop in the crime rate is attributable (sp?) to the legalization of abortion and the corresponding reduction in the number of unwanted children being raised in poverty (no hope for the future so then turn to crime).
crime rates have dropped because of better surveillance systems, security systems and because of better science DNA specifically. relaxing drug laws would not increase crime in fact just the opposite would occur.
Fareed...thanks for having a brain AND using it for something besides making a buck at the expense of others
The ALEC, the American Legislative Exchange Council, literally writes laws for Republicans. ALEC has a financial stake in anything that sends more people into the courts and the prisons, whether it’s exaggerated fear of racial minorities or Arizona’s draconian immigration law that followed an ALEC template almost verbatim.
Why does this sound exactly like why there are so many people in college who don't belong and don't want to be there?
Both situations are identical – others think they belong there.
The inherent problem with marijuana is that it is essentially a pharmaceutical, and people shouldn't just take pharmaceuticals to "feel good". If you make marijuana legal and available without a prescription, why is Percocet only available with a prescription.
That being said, it should be legal to smoke it in your own house, illegal to smoke it in public (it is a serious allergen for some people), and selling it should be regulated carefully. They also should make it illegal to perform certain jobs (cop, firefighter, taxicab driver, bus driver) when under the influence.
Ermm, that is a pretty messe dup law you have there. That is like trying to regulate someone's choices in life because they decide to drink some beer, or smoke a joint with their buddies.
And it is actually very very very rare for someone to be "allergic" to Marijuana.
Thank you Fareed, You sure have guts to brings hot topics on the table.
Very well written article. I agree with the article. It seems as if we are the ones creating the criminals. We send people to jail for petty offenses and expect them to succeed with a criminal record when they get out? Of course they will look to crime to survive, they have no other option. The only criminals that should be behind bars are Murderers, rapists, child abusers, and thieves.
If someone gets caught having a joint, police put that person in jail. It is no worse than alcohol. Why not legalize marijuana, decease crime and collect sales tax so each state will benefit. They are always looking for money. A win-win situation.
Wow, Pat Robertson said something that made sense. Well I'll be damned.
Why are you burners so brain dead? You're going to look like chit when you're 50 years old and drooling at the mouth smoking that crap, and then we're going to have to support you with our tax dollars.
Regardless of the legality of drugs, people will continue to do them.
The question is; do you want to pay to incarcerate them, or do you want to allow cheaper and more effective organizations to treat people for addiction?
Either way I don't want to support them. And you can't regulate an unlimited supply. You're in NeverNeverland if you think the drug cartels are going to roll over and play dead with legalization of marijuana, cocaine, and meth. Legalize those, too?
You are a complete idiot. Your illiteracy is astounding! Maybe you should try to limit your responses to things you actually know something about.
Let me get this straight. We have laws against drug possession and use. Many people are violating those laws and going to prison so your point is that laws should be changed if they result in too many people in prison. I don't think so – what happens when too many murders are committed – we change those laws too. Since when is the number of people in prison a measurement of how effective the laws are?
People are not saying murder is OK. They are saying possessing marijuana is not a crime. They are looking to repeal an outdated law based on poor medical science.
The topic is pot, a naturaly occuring plant, not murder. If pot is so bad why do our brains have built in receptors for using and dealing with cannabenol just like the receptors that deal with chocolate?
No one would ever release murders in the real world nor has anyone but you suggested that. The reason our jails are over populated is because we live in a society where everything is blown out of proportion and everyone thinks if they don't like something a law should be created to prevent everyone from doing it. If everyone would start minding there own business we would be better able to see the things that really matter not all the petty bullsh** of trying to control every aspect of every person on earths life so they are as miserable as you.
Very easy answer-incarceration creates jobs. Lots of em.
Hard to believe Robertson understands something. The poll here indicates that over 80% readers are in favor of legalizing marijuana. Here in California we had the silly 'medical use' marijuana law that benefits a few enterpreneurs and propagates disregard for the law. I understand we will have a chance with a proposition basically legalizing marijuana.
If Obama is re-elected, the Feds, hopefully, will not enforce the federal ban too vigorously. Even if the Republicans loose some House seats, the Congress is not ready to follow California and other states. Only a benign neglect (not by any Republican president, of course) can make rational behavior possible.
With Robertson campaigning (???) for our proposition, we have to make some progress here. Of course, adding another mind altering substance to the existing legal ones is not a great idea but not only humans love to get hight.
Currently, I feel bit better after a few cups of good coffee... President Romney will not able to do that.
Even a stopped clock is right twice a day, at least if it analog.
could also be because in other countries the criminals roam free or even run the government (worse than in the US)
Let the potheads out. Problem solved.
Those possesing or using small amounts of MJ are not sent to prison. No matter how many times you make this claim it is not true. Legalizing MJ will not reduce the prison population by even a fraction.
The Department of Justice has reported that 89% of marijuana arrests are for possession. NOT manufacture and distribution. 2% of the US prison population is in prison solely for marijuana possession charges. That's 50,000 people, behind bars, for possession only, right now. Those figures do not include people who were arrested for possession in conjunction with another charge.
The United States might as well be #1at something. Pretty hard to argue this is the freest country in the world.
If these stats are being compared to European countries like Sweden which has less people than the state of Massachusetts that is really retartded when the US has 300 million people.
Read it again Sam.
Why should I take the word of Pat Robertson why prisons are overcrowded? He knows nothing.
Most people have no idea that the majority of prisons are privately run corporations. They have lobbyists just like the tobacco industry. Their product is incarceration, they want their jails filled to 90% + capacity at all times. The only way to do that since most people aren't murderers or rapists is to lock people up for minor offenses. Until the legalization movement gets the same or better financial resources that the prison lobby does it stands no chance. Lawmakers side with the highest bidder. The day Norml can donate more to senators than the prison lobby is the day we see legalization.
no one should ever go to jail for possession of drugs. our so called free country is imposing the views of some on everyone. prisons should be to keep dangerous people away from everyone else. putting people in jail for using a drug that they enjoy is barbaric. at the very least drug offenders should be fined and given treatment but they should NEVER be locked up in prison.
putting a person in jail for a marijuana offense is so wrong, such a waste of resources, so unfair that it upsets me just thinking about it.
the land of the free has a higher percentage of its population in jail than any other country in the world. this is such a travesty we must change our drug laws.
I know a guy that was thrown in jail because he was having a hard time paying child support due to loss of employment. The week after he went to court he was to start a new job. They threw him in jail anyway and he likely lost the new job.
The same line of thinking happened to a relative. He was paying off a fine @$65 per month to the court. Somehow the court did not record a payment properly. They issued a bench warrant and two officers showed up at his house to arrest him. He was not there, but his wife was. She showed the officers the receipt for the fine in question. Their response was "tell him to turn in self in – it may take a few days while he is in jail to sort things out". Figuring the cost to the taxpayers (me being one of them) , was nuts. The county gets paid $190 for the intake night, and about $50 for each night. Sending two officers out @ $23 per hour for an arrest comes to about $100. Now to his personal estate. Assuming he looses 5 day of pay or worse even his job. Why 5 days ? The sheriff's posted policy is that it may take up to 48 hours after bail is arranged or the charges are dropped to be released. So a few days while the court system corrects an accounting problem and up to a few more days while the sheriff's department pushes their paperwork through. No common sense. No one takes ownership of the problem in the system. Just put the guy in jail until we sort out the problem.
Mr. Robertson for once actually makes a reasonable, logical argument.... to bad he had to ruin it by trying to blame the problem on liberals.
You hit the nail "Right" on the head. It is all about the money.
stay with the story,, how many illegals are being counted in this story,,they make up the majority in our prisons costing millions of dollars each year!!
Of course, the fact that the US is almost 40% non-white has no effect on crime in Zakaria's universe.
Currently more people die from prescription drugs than street drugs.
We should probably stop comparing ourselves to other countries.
In addition to the drug war, there's another very important factor. The US is a wealthy nation and most of the wealthy people are white. We also have a substantial percentage of blacks and hispanics who don't have money. This is like dangling meat in front of a hungry dog. The poor want money and will commit crimes to advance their goals. Our neighbors in Canada have a much smaller minority population and they have much less crime. The correlation is very clear.
Blacks and browns are more criminality-prone by nature.
Their crime rates are much higher than those of poor whites.
This is really interesting how Mr. Robertson started by criticizing the system for criminalizing the drug users, yet somehow he ended up attacking the liberals for passing laws that involves the white color criminal. People that their acts has a dire effect on all of us. The beauty of this is that only a religious right winger can change the rule of cause and effect.
So USA has terror problem, jihadi problem, incarceration problem, drug problem, gay-lesbian problem, racial problem,
AIPAC problem, immiration problem, Enemy combatant problem. what else I am missing!!
Not taking into account that 33% of federal prisoners are illegal aliens, are you?
Decriminalize drugs and drug use will go down. This happens in other countries. It's the same old story with people -tell them they can't have something and they'll want it. Let them have it and the demand will go down.
I have never understood how it is more humane to throw someone in prison for years when some very harsh physical punishment (caining) can be adminstered and over with quickly. It might leave a mark but you have taken your punishment and can get on with your life after a few weeks or month.
There are many ways to punishment other than expensive, life destroying prison. I think caining is a great punishment that leaves a very good impression that is not expensive and life destroying. Get caught for minor offenses and get a good caining. Get caught again and get a few more additional wacks.
Other countries learned long ago that physical pain is a good deterant without costing taxpayers hugh sums and taking peoples lives away for years.
Hahaha funny but I think I agree.
drunks run stop signs. stoners wait for them to turn green.
ROFL!!! Thanks for making my day!
Too much time on Fareed's hands. Huge assertions; no facts, such as:
1) What percentage of today's prison population were incarcerated for "white collar" crime?
2) What facts (even one) support the assertion that prison population is high because it is "big business"?
"Prisons are a big business. Most are privately run." Wrong! Only 200 prisons are privately run, and there are over 1200 prisons. These guys should not be able to get away with just writing whatever. They need to be held accountable as journalists. Always do your fact checks guys, even if your reading a news article.
And for the record, I’m actually FOR the legalization of marijuana. Just hate to see people talking bulls**t.
The hidden message is do what the other countries do; execute the felons. Then the prison population would be in line with the rest of the world.
So CNN is STEALING MY IDEAS.I was one that pointed to this for years.
I am ashamed to live in a society that keeps millions of people trapped in cages and goes to great lengths to torture them in every way that they can get away with. I believe one day true justice will prevail and the people responsible for this will be held to a higher account for every detail in their crimes against humanity.
The inmate problem is a problem of too many laws written by politicians more interested in stuffing their campaign coffers and getting reelected than the public benefit derived from the laws they passed..
Every politician wants to be able to point to their legislative record and say "Reelect me, I am tough on crime, look at the stiff prison terms I put on___ (insert any petty annoyance)___"
Legalizing drugs would drop the price for users even with the taxation of it. Taxing these drugs as well as elimntaing the tax exemption for all "religious" organizations (doubt Mr Robertson is for that cutting into his million dollar houses and luxury cars) would provide an influx of money for those of us worried about the national debt. Providing it would actually be used to do that.
Most people in this country that kill someone else, or themselves, or both, are messed up on PRESCRIPTION drugs.
The real war on drugs should be directed against the pharmaceutical companies.
I'm sorry, but I don't believe that there are a lot of people in jail because of marijuana. I know people that steal cars etc. and get caught. They get a number of chances before they are put in jail for any amount of time. I think they are in jail for repeated offenses. I suspect this topic, as presented, has been oversimplified.
Wake up America! Our government is your enemy. They create wars so some people get rich, but kill you. The entire justice system is designed to support government minions and generate revenue.
We are allowing the government to take away our freedoms.
Do The Math
If 7.1 million Americans are incarcerated as per Fareed, and the US population as of 2011 is 313 million, that means roughly (mentally calculating) 2% and some change of Americans are in prison. However, in the next paragraph he states that we have 760 prisoners per 100,000 people. That, on the other hand, is just .76 percent, a difference of three-fold. Disappointing, as Fareed doesn't seem to be doing scientific research.
The article states there are 7.1 million people under correctional supervision, that includes those behind bars and those who are on parole, house arrest....
Fareed did the research you must have missed a couple of words in that sentence.
Either way the prison system is a corporate racket that is a government funded cash cow.
Thanks jimbo -
You are 100% correct – I missed the difference between those incarcerated and those in the system. Bottom line, though, is that it is a racket. Guess I'm just sensitive to journalist pushing buttons for readership, thanks again
PS -
Apologies Fareed, I enjoy your work.
Pat Roberson said something sensible? What is the world coming to?
The fact that the government could make some tax money on the sale of marijuana is a pi$$ poor reason to legalize it. A better one is simply because it is relatively harmless and will be used whether it is legal or not.
Prisons must have product... product = young black and hispanic men.. no product, no profit.. Way past time to get the corporations out of corrections!
I guess the author should ask the Chinese what they do with their criminals and ask for help with ours. That would be the obvious way to reduce the percentage in prison.
Great idea – let the Communists take care of our prisoners??? How fast do u want us to go broke???
The war on drugs is a complete failure for us, the taxpayers and citizens. It has been a boondoggle for the prison industrial complex. While this war has cost our states trillions of dollars and robbed us of the ability to educate the population with reason and occupational skill, it has also caused great harm to other countries that are lobbied by our very own federal government for the military industrial complex who want to sell arms and technology to them, mostly with American taxpayer subsidies...Mexico is a perfect example of what our intervention has born. This is also a way to further disenfranchise huge demographics of people who lose their right to vote. This is a sinister and corrupt form of government welfare as they continue to redistribute wealth of this nation and many others into the pockets of sick industries that should be locked in their own prisons. I'm an unabashed Liberal but I feel every so called Liberal president including Obama have shown no stomach or backbone or leadership in this matter.
visit infowars dot com or prisonplanet dot com
Prisons being big business isn't the reason we have so many behind bars. Tough on crime to get re-elected is. The judges decide who is going to prison. If they don't send the criminals to prison then they don't get re-elected.
Well, to some extent the article seems to be trying to conflate marijuana illegaility with over-crowded prisons, to suggest that other countries with lower imprisonment rates are as beset with immigration eagerness as the US or with domestic violence, gang crime, or multiculturalism's incoherence of any kind of social protocol that could govern a lot of the mishaps we criminalize and would prefer not happen (and therefore use prison to control.) Ask yourself this: if the high-school parking lot becomes so fetid with the punky smell of weed, are we going to be going toe to toe academically with the Chinese scholars who are going to dominate the world of science and then the world?
"High Priest of the religious right"? Looks like Fareed has some strong prejudice about them. Religious aren't always right and no one has appointed Pat Robertson as the "High Priest" and he is no representative of the "religious".
"Follow the Money" – as soon as big business can find a way forward to enrich themselves with THC sales – they will move forward with Congress and flip the necessary switches (campaign contributions). As for people incarcerated or required to pay bribes to the legal system to avoid incarceration for smoking marijuana – Pathetic! As for the "dangerous substance" argument – if that were true – Congress would be lined up to force compulsory rehabilitation on tobacco addicts to free them of perhaps the most addictive and harmful drug known killing nearly 500,000 Americans each year. I am far more likely to die from "second hand smoke" than at the hand of a so called "terrorist". Incidently, I do not smoke anything.
LEGALIZE and TAX NOW !!
.
Legalize and don't tax...
There has never been laws more ignored in this country than the prohibition laws.
The majority of society has just totally ignored these laws and used their recreational intoxicant of choice.
It is impossible to enforce laws that society ridicules and outright ignores.
And what is worse is that it creates contempt for other valid laws.
It is time to end all forms of prohibition.
And deal with things like addictions in a sane manner through the medical and mental health systems.
Already in the urban communities, every family has a mother, father, brother, sister, uncle, aunt, or cousin who is in prison, on parole, or have done time. We are unfortunately creating a new class of people. Sooner or later, they too will have a voice.
here's a question I have- when you evaluate the differences between all countries and jail population- how do we evaluate the amount of persons ( no matter what color/gender ) – who are in jail that have not been raised by a set of parents?
drugs or any other crime– how many are brought up in a 1 parent household over the last 50 years? we will probably find that all other countries, having a lower incarceration rate ( plus higher education rate, etc etc)- had a higher incidence of a father and a family life. hey, I am a democrat- but figures do not lie.
who has done that analysis per country???
One of my relatives got arrest for possession of a a few ecstacy pills at the age of 18. Got hit on three felony charges – possession – intent to sell (because he had more than one pill – and drug paraphernalia (a very small zip lock bag). Because of multiple felony counts being charged, the DA's office would not let him plead to a misdemeanor. He ended up with 2 years of close probation and about $3000 in fines. He could have got 2.5 years, plus the fine and probation If he had just one MJ joint on him, he would have faced a separate drug charge and received a minimum of 7.5 years. So for that one joint taxpayers are on the hook for $412,500 (7.5 years @ 55,000 per year). Add in the cost of probation and the much lower taxes paid by the prisoner due to being only minimally employed and we are pushing $500,000.
The laws need to change. We are locking up way too many people, paying way too much in taxes to keep them jailed, and impairing people to never be able to be a full part of a productive society. The word "corrections" is a joke when used with the context of jail. Cesspool is a better term.
Excellent letter, well-written, to the point. Communities are always looking to cut costs, but they equate changing the laws to less law and order, instead of more. Common sense must be brought back to our daily lives, the creation and enforcement of all levels of rules and laws. There are far too many citizens languishing in all confinement levels because of arcane drug laws, and laws related to the possession of illegal drugs. We are way behind the rest of the world. Confinement is big business, but we it allowed it to get that way. Prison should be for violent offenders and chronic re-offenders, financial crooks, etc. It is not a place to send citizens for minor infractions better corrected with fines and community service.
Prison is big business like splendid little war here and there with Tax payers's money.
private contractors have learned how to siphon money out of our government into their pockets quite well. more corrupt america and ruin people's lives to make a buck and feel important. a lot of this is training issues (patriarchy and the way we train our boys. girls too, but we know that boys have problems earlier in life trying to digest a lie, and that they are often lonely later in life because of it. go to mitworld video and watch Learning to See in the Dark. books are better). And that we have corrupt court systems and yes they make money off of it.
Prohibition didn't work; the war on drugs hasn't worked. Morality cannot be legislated!
"...every time the liberals pass a bill – I don't care what it involves – they stick criminal sanctions on it."
Liberals? Sorry, Pat, somebody's weed smoke has you confused. It's conservatives who like to outlaw everything and toss people in the slammer.
I laughed my a$$ off when I read that phrase. Pat obviously has not seen the thousands of laws that these rightwingers have put on the books. Including all the ridiculous "Stand Your Ground" laws which enable anyone to commit murder with impunity.
.
A stand-your-ground law states that a person may use deadly force in self-defense when there is reasonable belief of a threat, without an obligation to retreat first. The difference between immunity and a defense is that an immunity bars suit, charges, detention and arrest. A defense permits a plaintiff or the state to seek civil damages or a criminal conviction.
We have established a whole MASSIVE business in the United States known as Prisons-For-Profit.
Their whole Fascist business plan revolves around incarcerating MORE people in the U.S. not less.
Private ownership of prisons needs to be outlawed immediately in every state in the Union.
.
Yeah, pathetic, a healthier drug than alcohol is illegal because of recent tradition... again, pathetic.
Eighteen year olds are routinely arrested here in Maricopa Co. for minor infractions such as possession of alcohol or being drunk in public (not DUI). Instead of writing them a ticket and or calling a cab for them, we arrest them, transport them, photograph them, fingerprint them, type a report on them, issue them a jail outfit, give them a quick medical check, hold them for an initial hearing in front of a judge, and then, maybe then, release them so they can come back to court again, to pay a fine. It's a racket that keeps the law enforcement, jail custodians, and legal communities employed. It has nothing to do with common sense, or justice. If we issued tickets for these minor offenses, jail/court/probation traffice might drop as much as half, and that would just KILL the economy. Couldn't have that. Bunch of lawyers running around, looking for work to support their mortgages.
That's horrible. Where I live, this kind of thing never happens to our pampered teens. I live in a community which is upper middle class in Massachusetts. It was the same story in New Jersey, where my cousins lived and smoked their pot without ever falling afoul of the law.
I agree 100% that prison is a big business.If you have been in a fed prison you could she for yourself.I know from experience.How do you keep pot smokers in prison and turn out murders and molesters.Now how hard would it be if the
United States and Mexico together to track down the drug lords.If we go half around the world to fight enemies we can't go across the street into Mexico.We are the problem as well as Mexico.Regulate the pot business like alcohol.You get caught smuggling pot make their sentences and punishment be as bad and hard as possible.Use the money from sales to help pay for drug treatment of addicts and fight the cartels.No market can't sell it.Pretty simple? I'm a former pot dealer.
When a person excepts thay are a criminal because thay smoke weed its easyer to except real crime.
It's just common sense.
I guess ya all think- if a Nuke is comming ur way- thares enought time to kiss ur butt good-by! Right!? Keep dreaming ya bunch of butt holes!!
Comparing our incarcerated to other countries incarcerated is dumb. It doesn't mean we have MORE lawlessness nor necessarily stricter laws, but it might indicate that we ACTUALLY enforce laws or less bribe-able police?
America has gone off the rails!
nothing but supply and demand – if the idiots would quit committing the crimes, the jails would be empty....
I don't agree with Pat Robertson on everything, but he is justified in his apathy for marijuana use and his concern for over-criminalization. He supports this with a few statistics and suggests a reason, "every time the liberals pass a bill – I don't care what it involves – they stick criminal sanctions on it."
It's strange how Fareed Zakaria, after "siding" with Robertson, seems to co-opt Robertson's argument in the last paragraph, with an unsubstantiated, neo-liberal "[Prisons] have bought most state politicians."
Prisons have bought most state politicians? What? Is there any proof of this? In California, at least, the people voted to outlaw gay marriage and keep marijuana illegal. Are you sure it's not... the people wanting to vote on how other people live?
Or... could it possibly be that we have a high proportion of law-breakers that most other countries? Answer: Yes.
Too much freedom that comes with such a low price tag attached is the reason that so many are in US prisons. Big business yes, but look at how much money is raked in from fools trying to win a shot at 640 million by the govt. I would bet that over 100 billion in lottery ticket prices was made as profit with just that one form of GAMBLING, which in itself is a huge consequence of lax laws in all states nowadays!!!
I realize that "Legally" this is a flimsy argument since cigarettes are legal, but don't forget that marijuana causes cancer and destroys your lungs. Don't lie to yourself; smoking marijuana DESTROYS your lungs.
Thats not an argument for keeping it illegal... You don't need to smoke weed, you can Vape (Which is fine for your lungs) you can cook with it and make cookies, or popcorn, or bread, or anything really. You can make milkshakes yum. Ice cream, Candy even. But really it doesn't cause cancer nor does it do as much damage to your lungs as cigs... Not to mention the air outside is probably worse than the weed smoke
please try again your arguments are invalid
http://www.cancer.gov/cancertopics/pdq/cam/cannabis/healthprofessional/page4
http://jama.ama-assn.org/content/307/2/173.short
The prisons have nothing to worry about if they legalize pot, they will be filled with people busted for driving high.
Imagine a doctor and nurses high on pot in the OR:
Doc: "Whoa dude I think I just dropped a purple bong in the left ventricle"
Nurse: "Hehehe...nah that was just a condom where I kept my stash"
yeah, 'cause docs never drank themselves into oblivion and then wondered into an OR.
Consider this: Smoking marijuana is illegal – PERIOD. Yet those in jail for it have chosen to break the law and suffer any possible consequences. If marijuana were made legal, at least a fair portion of those people would be in jail for something else. They're not in jail for smoking or dealing marijuana; they're in jail because they have no regard for the law.
We aren't a nation formed on obeying the letter of the law when that law is stupid and tyrannical.
"Nation" means an organized system of behavior based on an agreement. Part of that agreement is to follow the laws, and to change them when they need to be changed.
The baby boomers have done everything in their power to disembowel the millenials. Voting against universal healthcare for us while we pay THEIR social security/medicare and drown in student loans. Locking us up for drug offenses. Breaking the economy with their greed then calling us freeloaders because we're at the bottom of the hill when the s**t roles downhill. Meanwhile we're the ones who actually make their companies work because we know what the hell we're doing with technology. We should just refuse to do any IT for their companies, form our own, and let them sell fruit next to the road for a living.
Marijuana is less harmful than alcohol.It never will be legalized in America because too many people with power are raking in big bucks on the black market selling it.Where is an Elliot Ness when you need one?The other problem is that there are too many corrupt politicians that will make sure it stays illegal.It's all about the money.As usual.
The Criminal Justice system is the largest job creator in America, from the arresting officer to the prosecutor to the judges, court officers, correction officers and vendors who supply prisons with supplies. Just imagine if marijuana was legalized, arrest rates would plummet which would cause many people to lose their jobs. America is the only country who depends on imprisoning one segment of our population to keep other parts of our population employed.For that reason alone marijuana will not be legalized.The best thing that happened for the CJS was the harsh drug laws and mandatory sentencing. It's sad but it's our system works.
Just face the facts people.. Only the US Govt can kill or harm you (9/11 false flag, war, draft, reverse economic recession draft, police brutality, ect...). Buy a hydroponic kit, grow your own, if the police kick your door in just grab your 12 guage and rejoice for those around you who transform into the force.
Its funny because people like you who complain about the government are also the ones dependant on the government..welfare, subsadise utilites, section 8 housing, food stamps..hypocracy?
We have a large population because we have the most efficent anti crime system in the world. We have a large population because...gee people break the laws? We have a large population in prison because prisons are glorified retirement homes, free food, free bed, free roof over your head, free utilities, free games, free education, free health care etc. We also have a larger population then other countries because many countries either execute for drug offenses, see Africa, Asia, Middle East...and we have the most laws on the books to violate. Oh and when you compare our prison poulation to other countries with equitable populations were are all about the same, save for China. As twisted as our government is it is also one of the few that actually enforce laws and is not subject on a regular basis to bribes. Other countries dont "COUNT" work camps either, can we have work camps? Will the ACLU just roll over?
I am Brazilian and I can't tell how glad I am that U.S handles criminals the way it does. I feel safe in here, something I can definitely not say about my country.
If part of the population is behind bars, it is so because they deserve it.
Look at Mexico, look at Brazil, look at Crackland in Sao Paulo, this is what happens when drug is liberated. Do you want that in U.S?
I would say it's because we have so many descendants of slavery. The slaves that were brought to the US and sold were from tribes that caused many problems in Africa. These traits have continued throughout the generations. They have trouble following authority.
LOL your saying bad behavior is genetic? Ok Hitler.
No, I'm saying it's a "learned" behaviour and you learn best from your parents, etc. If they set bad examples such as poor speech or poor behaviour then you will learn it. This has been proven by both good and bad people for ages. Also, there's always the possibility that each race of people are developed in part by their place in the life cycle of their own race.
You know little about American history I guess it's badge of honor to be ignorant.How unfortunate for you.
I never killed one person and I spent a considerable amount of time "back in the day" rather stoned (and often very stoned). Just thought I would add my 2 cents worth.
Thats good, but then how do you explain the parents too "stoned" to take care of their kids. Google Drug addict lets baby starve. Or should we as Americans just allow that to happen?
Stevan, you can't be serious! The number of children harmed by parents who drink exceeds the number harmed by parents who smoke pot by a factor in the hundreds, if not thousands.
robertson can love weed all he wants, he is still a bigot in my book.
Obama's Attorney General, Eric Holder, recently stated that there is no way marijuana will become legal under Obama's watch. If actions speak louder than words, then the federal crackdowns on dispensaries in California and Colorado (with more promised to come in Oregon, Washington, etc)speak volumes!
Or ... we could just end Obama's watch in November.
Perhaps we have more criminals than other countries?
Being a criminal is a subjective term, determined by anyone with enough power to make that judgement. It is not something that is objectively true or false. We have more criminals because powerful people decided we have more criminals.
Thank you Fareed. Turn it up.
Blessings,
Robert
Pat Robertson was correct that drugs and a prison nation are a problem – but his reference to "liberals" is typical and asinine at best – it was Nixon that first coined the term, and Reagan that brought it into full force – its unfortunate that so strong a statement be muddied by partisan nonsense.
hey keefer how about the doctor that has been drinking alcohol before he gets an emergency call to do a surgery?I honestly believe that 99% of the people that have jobs as important as a doctor/surgeon would not be doing drugs or drinking alcohol at all.They have too much responsibility and too much to lose if they were.At least I would hope so.
Marijuana may not be 'good', it may even be a little 'bad' BUT,
There is no way that imprisoning someone for it's use, possession or sale is justifiable.
It's ABSOLUTELY IMMORAL TO SEND PEOPLE TO PRISON FOR THIS!!!
NOBODY that supports imprisonment for marijuana use, possession or sale has any right to criticize Hitler or Stalin – because they are very close to being as bad!
The world laugh at us for letting grown men do nothing but eat, lift weights, and sleep behind bars. who is getting rich off of this injustice (help CNN)!
The story misse the point of Hard Time vs Soft Time.
10 year prison time in America equals 1 year in my country. Any one that has ever been to prison in my country will never accept going back.
In America, TVs – Gyms – Monpoly – daily food.
Definitely! If we tax it like we tax cigarettes and alcohol we wouldn't have a budget crisis!!!
If each segment of American society committed crimes in proportion to their percentage of the population then we would be about average. I tried to word that as nicely as possible.
Not only should marijuana be made legal, we should legalize all drugs with criminal penalties including heroin and crack. Put the drug dealers out of business. Eliminate the DEA and move the resources to the FDA to administer medical substances and procedures.
Marijuana should be legal. It makes common sense. Prisons for profit is a crime.
Yes, prison IS Big Business. So is Welfare Breeding, Poor Over-Breeders are worth 100s of BILLIONS to corporations. They do not care it it's the Tax Payers money, hence NO US-MX Border, NO Welfare Reform.
Another point, to be fair, Why even have a jail in R'Wanda, El Salvadore...etc.
I take issue with Pat Robertson's "statistics" in the pull quote. It's meaningless to lump the USA in with countries that routinely choose execution over incarceration (China, Saudi Arabia, Iran, etc.). - whether officially or otherwise - and the many, many lawless countries where criminals have the upper hand (numerous African nations, Haiti, Mexico, Russia...). In the US,mew have a reasonably fair, if imperfect, court system and an ironclad bill of rights. You could say that our high incarceration rate is proof that our system works.
Fareed, you are the real deal. God bless you for focusing on these most critical issues of our country. The statistics are shocking that we are spending more on our prison system than on higher education.
Wake up America !
Once again, our liberal, America hating muslim lover Mr. Zakaria, has missed the point. Big business isn't causing people to commit crimes. People are committing crimes on their own. Robertson is an idiot too. No one, I say again, NO ONE is behind bars in the US for 10 years for possession of one joint. If you liberals believe that, you're brainwashed! Most cops won't even arrest someone for marijuana b/c of all the paperwork and lack of punishment. I can't believe CNN would continue to publish Zakaria's articles. He's so full of it in every thought, it amazes me. TYPICAL LIBERAL...BIG BUSINESS IS THE PROBLEM, NOT THE PERSON/PEOPLE DOING THE BAD THINGS! It's always someone else's fault!
Here's the solution: make prisons similar to what they have in Europe and I'll guarantee that our crime rates drop. Let criminals stay cold and eat bread, rice, and water, with no showers, weight rooms, televisions, radios, etc... Then, see how many crimes are committed.
I told you. And now let you be warned. As soon as the rich find a way to turn humans into food, we will be on the rich's' menu at the finest eating establishments. That will get around that annoying taboo of "cannibalism". We are just cows in waiting to be slaughtered for gullets of the 1%. They are greedy and hungry.......and without souls.
Soylent Green is People!
yup, let us all go back to the caves like your brethren and bow to the east five times a day to avoid any constructive thoughts we may have.
Maybe we don't legalize marijuana, but at the veryy least we should decriminalize it. Make it a violaion like a speeding ticket. If we still want a public policy that discourages its use, then a serious fine will do this.
Putting people in jail for simple possession is simply insanity. Doing something over and over again and expecting a different result is insanity. Exactly what about what we have been doing is or has ever worked.
I am not sure it should be legal but I am sure you should not go to jail for it. Put a fine on it and be done with it.
Stoners are lazy and don't want to work. I say the punishment should be community service. Prison just won't fix them.
You are completely wrong. I myself am a smoker and I have a job, a family, a house, and a great life. Many people, probably even some you know, are smokers. Doctors, lawyers, judges, cops, these are just a few examples of people who use marijuana. Your view is a bit biased.
It's not just the drug laws that's gone crazy in America. It's just about anything and everything. Something as simple as a minor traffic stop can turn into an arrest, left up to the "discretion" of the cop who stops you. In some neighborhoods, primarily poor and minority, walking down the sidewalk or standing on a corner a certain time of day or night can lead to an arrest. That creates that revolving door, that once you're arrested for one thing you're likely to be arrested for another and another. Especially in the poor white and poor minority communities. Because they're the most like to be arrested for minor, and even made up charges, and the least likely to be able to fight those charges or pay off fines. Fines which can lead to future arrests or the denial of jobs or being able to join the military. Unpaid court fines can keep people from being allowed to join the military. It's a trap that once you're in you can't escape. The more you struggle to escape the more you become entangled in the trap.
Here's an interesting factoid. Marijuana is in the same genetic family as hops. You can graft hops onto marijuana roots,and the result is a plant that looks, smells, and tastes like hops, but has a natural THC content like pot. Admittedly hops are rank, and no one in their right mind would ever smoke them, but just imagine the righteous beer you could brew up from them. Drew Carey, who owns the trademark on the name "Buzz Beer" could make another fortune.
Put this this in your pipe and smoke it govt/drug companies... I have tried every illegal drug out there (heroin, xtc, meth, coke) and never got addicted to anything until I tried Oxycontin. Stuck on it for years now
This article is complete rubbish
Legalization would not decrease crime as very few people are in jail just for drugs... usually drug charges, according to research, are thrown in to increase jail time for more egregious offenses. The increase in prisons is due to the US more effectively incarcerating criminals, not the cause of it. The reason, crime has significantly dropped in the last few decades is because of more police, more bad guys getting caught, and more incarcerations. The underpinnings of why criminal behavior is more ubiquitous in the US vs Denmark has to do with the vast difference in the population who compose these two countries, not in the funding of prisons.
That being said, I am pro legalization, as no one should be in jail just for drugs, IMO, and legalization would decrease income streams for criminal types and increase tax revenue.
you clearly did not read the entire article......and Yes, MOST PEOPLE IN JAIL ARE THERE FOR DRUG CHARGES
It is HEROIC to draw attention to this crisis, THANK YOU Fareed. If we're not careful, this police state mentality will spiral out of control. I usually don't use words like "evil", but thats exactly what our "justice" system is.
In the land of the free the top 1% of population accounts for 25% of all US personal income, whilst the bottom 1% accounts for 25% of planet earths prison population. What a nation!
The illegality of Marijuana is causing much more harm that the plant itself. There is obviously a big demand for it and so people have organized to produce it and distribute it. There is also millions of dollars being exchanged with no taxes paid. The marijuana produced has no health controls and so often it is contaminated with pesticides and fertilizers. It`s distribution has no control and so there is nothing to stop it from getting into the hands of young people who have not yet fully developed into adults. The huge profits have lead to gang rivalry which has resulted in rip-offs and killings just like in the days of alcohol prohibition. Marijuana does have some negative side affects but overall it is a safe drug and brings many people joy and creativity. For the ill, it is the only thing that gives them relief and brings some happiness into their lives. To incarcerate people for using pot is draconian and medieval. Those responsible for the "war on drugs" have brought pain and suffering with their outrageous prohibition laws and these people should be identified and sued. It is time for peace in the US, not more domestic war. Legalize it, control its production and distribution and tax its sales and put that money into helping anyone who has a problem with it. It is time people marched in the streets over this.
While it's nice to blame "big business" for everything – didn't anyone notice the other CNN front page story? Ya know, the mass movement demanding someone's incarceration?
Wonder who's sponsoring Trayvon Martin's family....
Bingo – spot on.
Thanks, this will be good campaign material. Expect a call from the team sometime soon. Comparing the murder of an innocent teenager to smoking a joint?
Humans need to dismantle the monetization system and go to a free based societies. Remove land ownership. And all goods should be borrowed like library books. Food, water, energy, medical care and housing should all be free.
Humans should ditch electing an alpha male to lead. We are not monkeys anymore. We do not need representative government anymore. We can represent ourselves. We have the Internet to voice our opinions.
Human civilization should be based around education, technology, innovation and creativity. Once humans our challenged to innovate instead of working to by shiny boxes to drive around in and big boxes to live in humanity will blossom into something unbelievabley special.
Every recent example of organized society being left without government has resulted in gangs of rapists and murderers taking over. Yes your ideals would be an ideal for human society but face it the majority of the worlds populace are little more than angry chimps whimpering for more food whilst breeding like rabbits.
It is proven that people that are educated do not breed like rabbits. People don't want to be greedy or selfish. People want to belong to something more and be involved. Give people all they need and they will want to contribute to a whole.
Truly an eye opener of an article.
THANKS TO YOU PAT ROBERTSON !!!!
Thanks to Mr. Zakaria for COPYING IT FOR ALL OF US IN THE LIBERAL MEDIA who would have otherwise missed it.
You are TRULY GREAT at SKIMMING OFF from other published material, adding little bit of your own and making it into YOUR OWN STORY......
We hope your next story will NOT be on RACIAL BIAS on crack cocaine and powder cocaine which indeed is a fact that most Americans are already aware of and has been largely rectified under the Fair Sentencing Act of 2010.
We are also looking forward to your next story linking the HOODIE & HIJAB in the Trayvon Martin and Shama Alawadi cases to portray Americans as inherently racist.......in line with your agenda!
This sand niiigger doesn't seem to understand that the bulk of our prison population are his 'brothers' who are there because they are parasites and belong in prison. His brothers commit the bulk of the violent crimes and drug deals ergo they are the bulk of the prison population. His country's prison's contain fewer criminals because crime is their way of life. If you don't like it here in America – Get out – you won't be missed and our welfare roles will likely drop.
I can't believe I agree with Pat Robertson AND Fareed Zakaria at the same time, I dislike the thoughts and opinions of both very much. However, prisons are big business and a big problem. We lock up more per capita than any other country, INCLUDING the paranoid dictator / communist countries. Hopefully people will begin to realize that we "free" Americans actually live in one of the most oppressively policed, monitored, taxed, and regulated countries in the world. And with the passage of new laws like NDAA, Enemy Expatriation Act, HR247, NDRP, our government has begun the secret surveillance of it's citizens. We're more closely monitored than we monitor al-Qaeda for pete's sake. How much longer until it's illegal to speak out against the government? I mean with HR347 you're not allowed to protest where Secret Service MIGHT be in a near future event. It's about time to leave this country.
I absolutely agree that we should take a real hard look at sentencing guidelines and crimes.
But when it comes to NATIONAL SECURITY we should never let our guard down.
Radical Islam remains the #1 threat to America......the FBI and CIA and every INFORMED American knows that too well.
As the adult child of an alcoholic father and prescription drug addicted mother with a sibling who was addicted to both I can tell you I found peace and security for the first time in my life when I married my pot head husband. My family looted the college fund I'd built up for myself to fund their addictions. I was 17 but I worked any time I could just to get out of the house. By comparison last year my hubby bought me the 40,000.00 truck of my dreams, 1/2 down, the rest on his good credit. Growing up I was physically, emotionally and verbally abused while my husband has never been anything other than loving. True, no Twinkie is safe when he smokes but I am. A perfect world would have no drug use of any kind, but there would be no war, no hate, no prejudices etc. I say go Pat – legalize pot!
I did not read all the comments but another consideration is if we lessen the punishment or even legalize it to some extent we will also take away a lot of the problems with the drug cartels in Mexico and the problems along the border.
Incarceration has become a business nowadays.......it's only a matter of time before its entrenched in the system that a "privatized" facility needs more prisoners to make a profit and incarcerating Americans turns into a very lucrative way for corporate prisons to meet the bottom line......and the way our politicians are in Big Businesses pockets, this will be a norm
We had a judge busted fairly recently for being paid by a private prison company to send more people to their jails because they get paid per prisoner and a full prison is a profitable prison. Next we will have them doing slave labor and we can just put everybody in jail and make iPhones and Droids in the US with our prison labor.
That sounds lIke what our forefathers envisioned for America.
Our government has to spend $50,000 per inmate per year? No wonder they want to be criminals! They probably can't make $50,000 a year outside of prison. Why not go to prison and have someone spend $50k of care on me every year?
I'm all for this legalizing marijuana, but I think it's quite ridiculous that Robertson implicates the liberals in this. The war on drugs was completely a Republican thing. Now I'm not saying liberals don't carry on with the same dumb laws and sure we have too many laws coming from all sides, but our love for incarceration and the war on drugs in particular is really primarily due to Republican policies.
I have worked for the government for over 20 years. I am married for over 30 years. 2 kids. I have a college degree. I am considered a subject matter expert in my field. I have paid off my home – I own it. I have a credit score in the 800"s.
I speak 2 languages. I contribute to disabled vets. I have traveled to over 40 states. I rescue homeless dogs. I have never been arrested or in prison. And guess what everone ? I have smoked pot for over 35 years.
America has become a police state. I go home to visit my parents in Missouri from my job in California. I'm in my hometown of 250 people on a pothole road (my mom told me to go pick up my dad). I'm pulled over by a Highway Patrolman. I'm 3 blocks and one railroad track from the state highway. I don't even remember seeing a cop in my hometown when I lived there. The cop says "Open your trunk". I do. Four days later I'm driving to the town where I went to High School, population 2000, I'm pulled over by another Highway Patrolman who says "Open your trunk." Yeah there looking for drugs because I have California license plates. I come back to California. My doctor tells me to lose weight or get diabetes. I decide to lose weight by riding my bicycle and walking. A cop passes me when I'm legally riding a bicycle through a residential area at 9 mph. The cop makes a U-turn and comes back and takes my picture. I called the cop headquarters and told them what a bunch of losers they were. Did they thank for giving them a clue? No 2 weeks later, while out walking, they put a decoy car in my walking path trying to get me to steal it. It's parked on the wrong side of the road, the side I'm walking on, pointed in the direction in which I am walking with the engine running and the driver's side door blocking the sidewalk, like my dad would lay hoopnets out in the Missouri River to catch fish. I'm not a fish. My IQ is 136, the same as Bill Gates. This is followed up when I'm walking laps around a park I see a senior citizen volunteer hiding behind a truck. He thinks I'm going to steal something from an open garage door. They can't me to steal anything, so they say "Let's try drugs." I get up one morning and perfectly centered on my driveway 5 feet out in the street is a bag labeled "Medical". I suppose they think I'm going to find medical marijuana in the bag and take it in the house and smoke it, so they can kick my door in and shoot my basset hound in the back, like they did to the mayor's black labs in Maryland. I tell my wife "Don't touch the bag, it's a police plant." She tells me I'm paranoid, but gets in the truck with me and we drive a block down the street where the guy whose job it is to monitor the bag in his police car positioned right where the road starts to bend. If you stood on the bag and I told you to point where you'd hide the cop, you'd be pointing right at him. That's the truth. A 14 gallon blood donor and retired Nuclear Engineer who has never been in trouble with the law, only harassed by those idiots.
All of this keeps the rest of us in civilized western countries away fri the mess you have there in the Us. Man it's scary even flying over your land. Definatley not land
Of free
pot-smokin' cpa here...to all you folks who think that your motivation automatically has to go out the door if you smoke pot...you'd be wrong. Wouldn't recommend kids mess with it until they're college-aged. Whether we accept it or not, our future is our own. You can find the lazy folks smoking weed, but go to any college town and you'll also find the curious, inquisitive types with ambitious goals smoking a bowl of good weed and getting ever so engaged in their work. I smoke nice exotic stuff because one day, God smiled on me and I met my current connection. Prior to that, I had to venture into the hood because I didn't have any friends that smoked. I gave them $20 and they give me about $5 worth of the crappiest stuff you've ever seen and kept the rest for their own habit. These are/were dangerous people.
Bottom line, you folks on the right with all the liberty talk...I'd like the liberty to buy weed from a provider of my choosing who has had the liberty to be the best weed farmer they can be...yep, i'd like me some liberty. "Nope" you say? Well, then I'll just take it. Let's ramp up our child predator cops and leave me at liberty to smoke a bowl of purple kush and get back to my yard work.
Zakaria knows,for example,that India has a huge prison population but its statistics of such population is pretty poor and inaccurate.Must be the same with China.
I wonder why CNN or the other big news companies did not cover an entrapment of US soldiers wanting to train and fight along with the Zetas in Laredo, TX. Gun battle and 1 soldier killed as the other three were apprehended, big story right? This is spill-over violence that is starting to affect every level of society, yet we are more concerned so many articles that do not define our lives. Mariguana is just one drug and is not mariguana that these wars are fought for. These wars are for control of the country and the distribution rights for meth and coke... mariguana? Nobody cares about in Mexico.
My alcoholic dad and pill addicted mom beat me and stole my paychecks when I was 17 living in a rented rat hole trailer and saving for the college I never made it to. My pot head hubby worships me, works 40 to 60 hours a week and bought me a 40,000.00 truck last year that sits in the drive of the home we own. True, no Twinkie is safe when hubby smokes but the world is not a perfect place. God bless you Pat – legalize pot!
If legalizing it in order to curtail the drug trade from Mexico helped, I would be all for it.
Fareed, The system is broken. Legalization is not the issue, regulations is the issue and government dont feel compelled at this time for another 100 years or perhaps more.
Knowing the above will never be solved. I think we need to to change our strategy of privatizing prisions and rather outsource the criminals to cheapest 3rd world countries which will cut our costs by 3/4th and meanwhile the bad blood is thousands of miles away.
In the entire history of the usage of the plant cannabis there has never been a single death from an overdose. Do you people think this plant was just created???its been around for however long plants have been on this earth. God gave us this plant and its made illegal? Hahaha its outrageous how corrupt the system is. As soon as this country started straying away from its fundamentals its only gone downhill. Once this country decided to have a larger goverment there's only been problems. We're stuck with two political parties who are actually very similar and they're all in it together running the show
The poll should have the option "decriminalized", which is not the same as legal, but is a more accurate description of marijuana's status where its possession for individual use is tolerated.
For the most part, don't care that Robertson wants to blame liberals for senseless incarceration levels. If that's what it takes for him to get on board, then so be it. A part of me finds it irritating that he thinks liberals are the ones who want to criminalize everything because, after 40 years of watching politics, I know darn well who always cried "get tough on crime" the loudest. And it wasn't the liberals!
If it was liberals, then it wouldn't be big news that someone like Robertson is advocating pot legalization. All through the 80's and 90's all I heard out of the right was, "build more prisons!", "three strikes your out!", "get tough on crime!", "mandatory sentencing!", "win the war on drugs!", "just say no!" and the like. That was all right wing doing. They got just what they asked for. Now they look around at the disaster of one their policies and they want to blame liberals for it.
But, like I said, if blaming liberals makes him sleep better at night and allows him to see the underlying problem, then so be it. Blame the evil liberals and legalize it already!
Maybe it's because we don't shoot or behead most of them.......
good point!!
According to the FDA 106,000 die from prescription drugs. Approximately 100,000 die from alcohol, 443,000 from cigarettes including second-hand smoke. That is a year. Compare that to 10,000 for all "illegal" drugs combined. What do the first three have in common, you do not go to jail unless you harm another and they all are taxed by the government. The government hasn't figured out how to tax a weed.
Its actually not a weed. Its a flower
Believing Fareed or Donald Duck...... Tough Choice..... They are about even in expertise on soooooo many subjects....
How dare you make such a statement!!!!!
Donald Duck is much smarter.
You take that back right now or I'll report you to the moderator.
Our extenal wars are small compared to Viet Nam and even more so to the world wars – so now this so called drug war starts to look much more absurd, as it should. Let's stop the pointless fighting with ourselves and start the healing.
We have a cultural addiction problem. The hypocrisy of not even regulating tobacco as it is 1000's of times more harmful than any other "drug" . By keeping an almost totally harmless substance (Marijuna) illegal what is gained? We are addicted to oil, while we are the country that could so easily create a sustainable energy infrastructure. And our addiction to fiat currency which makes money the goal and in the process has lost track of the actual value of life.
Fareed's take clearly shows how the direction our culture is headed is not sustainable or desirable.
Welcome to the Prison Industrial Complex.
I hope your wife or daughter doesn't run into one of these innocent victims of the prison industrial complex in a dark parking garage.
The drama!
I hope you people reading this stuff are taking notice- in 1970 US had 350,000 prisoners, we now have 2.5 million- the population has doubled. This is nothing less then a quiet holocaust and our government are as evil and rotted as any ever, to perpetrate this horrific ordeal, on the citizenry of our country- because we profess to be so pure and moral. Every person that goes prison, life is ruined- family is shamed and destroyed – they and they're are marked and treated like lepers as we have all criminal records on the internet. Every prison incarcerated is a human being, that god made in his image- with feelings and heart and soul- and mother that loved him, and family that destroyed forever. Remember that judge in PA, taking bribes to throw kids in prison for long terms for no reason? Do you know how long it took catch him?
If you do not like living in America, go home to Syria, Iran, Iraq with the other islamic ca ca raisers babbling ca ca in this discussion.
What I find most interesting is a large majority of people are willing to debate at such subjects as pot. I grew up in the 60's and 70's. I know all that culture first hand. Not that I have partaken in decades, but know it nonetheless. If only half the people in this response section cared even a twinkling for our gmint doings, the inevitable economic meltdown, or anything of that nature, something might actually get done. But people want to argue about friggin pot. Go figure. Ask any plumber, "stuff" runs downhill. The true arguments should be directed at the upper levels. The rest will fall into place...eventually. Just a thought.
You must take other drugs also?
I am not amazed by these *not so scientific facts* but I do believe them. Its been happening for the past 20 years or so.
My son is an example of worthless judgements. He and exgirlfriend were having an altercation in public and they were both arresteed. They didn't search him until he was at the jail and the found what amounted to a joint in his possession. Of course at government facility, its a fellony to have any drugs or paraphernalia.
He has TBI and metal rods in his back. Accident that he had in very early 20s. He is now 37 and the use of cannabis helps him with the pain and also makes his personality better, without it he's mean, sullin and very forgetful. Which is who I deal with everyday.
The reason for that explanation: he is on probation still due to his occational use, he slipped up on pee test and the arrested him on the spot went of to the local penal system and spent 6 months in custody. Still paying probation costs and 35 dollars a month for someone to write on a piece of paper and shuffle him through.
It also amazes me the size of the office that houses the PP. 40 offices and 35 in use with only have of the staff there at one time.
Got a little long winded but I'm just one example in thousands of the same. Wasted money , time, community resources, and as was said made him into less desireable employee due to one joint.
I really have never seen a valid argument for weed being illegal. Almost all the people who oppose it use it very inconsistent logic. People often point out how it can make people lazy and have a negative effect on lives. Well so can a ton of other things like alcohol, tobacco, prescription meds, and half the ingredients in our food today. When it comes to violence and getting behind the wheel on substances weed is basically in last place. So if you want to make all that other stuff illegal I still disagree but at least you would be consistent. I believe living in a free society means you can put stuff in your body that isn't good for you if you want. I mean if you've drifted to the right of Pat Robertson on an issue you might want to take another look and see how you got there.
Here's an idea – don't committ crime and you won't go to jail.
Can we be politically correct with just actual TRUE FACTS from the FBI Statistics? Black people are only 18% of the population.
Crime Rates:
Blacks are seven times more likely than people of other races to commit murder, and eight times more likely to commit robbery.
When blacks commit crimes of violence, they are nearly three times more likely than non-blacks to use a gun, and more than twice as likely to use a knife.
Hispanics commit violent crimes at roughly three times the white rate, and Asians commit violent crimes at about one quarter the white rate.
The single best indicator of violent crime levels in an area is the percentage of the population that is black and Hispanic.
Interracial Crime
Of the nearly 770,000 violent interracial crimes committed every year involving blacks and whites, blacks commit 85 percent and whites commit 15 percent.
Blacks commit more violent crime against whites than against blacks. Forty-five percent of their victims are white, 43 percent are black, and 10 percent are Hispanic. When whites commit violent crime, only three percent of their victims are black.
Blacks are an estimated 39 times more likely to commit a violent crime against a white than vice versa, and 136 times more likely to commit robbery.
Blacks are 2.25 times more likely to commit officially-designated hate crimes against whites than vice versa.
Gangs
Only 10 percent of youth gang members are white.
Hispanics are 19 times more likely than whites to be members of youth gangs. Blacks are 15 times more likely, and Asians are nine times more likely.
Incarceration
Between 1980 and 2003 the US incarceration rate more than tripled, from 139 to 482 per 100,000, and the number of prisoners increased from 320,000 to 1.39 million.
Blacks are seven times more likely to be in prison than whites. Hispanics are three times more likely.
I'm surprised this post got past the CNN moderator.
The truth really stings them.
Good post, Steve.
Thank you.
You are surprised that his comment got past CNN.
You are not making sense.
What is wrong with the comment that would be deemed as inapropriate?
I would like to see the NAACP, Sharpton, Jackson, et al, jump up and down on these people of crime and straighten them out. That would do wonders to change everyone else's views of this race.
What "race" are you talking about?
Thank you Steve!
Its hard for Americans to get their head round, but the country is worse than China or Russia. Not America basing, just observation.
You are totally clueless. And you have no idea what it was like to live in those countries.
Count your blessings, junior.
You people are so foolish if you're concerned about if it was the liberals or the conservatives fault. Because guess what they're both to blame. Theyve been running the country for too long and have made too many problems. I would like liberty and freedom back
Drugs, like war, is big business.
I am a lawyer in New York. Yesterday, I negotiated a plea agreement for a man whose ex called 911 when he came over to visit their child. He was charged with disorderly conduct for placing the woman at "risk of annoyance" by making an "unreasonable noise". I believe that if a judge sways the case against me, I'll craft an absurd plea deal that my client can show to others. This is the federal VAWA.
unbelievable
If you think America is democracy think again.... in no other country in the world you can go to jail for almost anything you do or fail to do...
If Media Matters had their way you could be jailed for your political beliefs.
What??
Which media???
With a statement like that, it leads us to believe you are trying to incite some ca ca.
I find it hard to believe that I am about to type these words but.....for once, I fully agree with Pat Robertson.
Reblogged this on eSurvival.
You wanna stay out of prison? It's simple. Stay away from drugs and don't act like an idiot.
You wanna stay out of prison? It's simple. Stay away from drugs and don't act like an idiot. The true definition of a conservative: A liberal who was mugged and beaten up last night.
test
Although blaming the enforcement of Anti Drug laws is convenient it isn't the primary reason for the increased prison population although the number of incarcerated drug offenders has increased twelvefold since 1980. In only 22 percent of those in federal and state prisons were convicted on drug charges.
"Incarcerated America" Human Rights Watch (April 2003)
United States Crime Rates 1960 – 2009. Source: FBI, Uniform Crime Reports.
The US Freedom Party created the Federal Intoxicants Act which allows for one to purchase a federal license to grow hemp. It reduces crime, grants freedom and produces revenue for the government without having hemp sold as a product. It is more than workable. Google us freedom party intoxicants act and it will be at or near the top.....
Well, it sort of is the "Wild West" here in the United States. Most of these crimes were committed from other than drugs. Freedom to do what you want will get you in trouble too. Keeping crime down is also very good in any situation. There is a reason that most Americans have guns, to protect and defend their loved ones and property. Keep the prisons, make them harsher and not as plush....
The only thing I am curious about is how these "incarceration for profit" laws are blamed on liberals.
Take a quick look at incarceration stats, and the bible belt has a much higher incarceration level... and those places are decidedly neo-con run.
Neo-cons are far more authoritarian then liberals.
Google political compass to see this, and even take the test yourself.
You are leading people to believe that the prisons being privately run has something to do with the incarceration rate. Prisons don't put people in jail. If people don't want to go to jail, they shouldn't buy, use or sell drugs. It's a pretty simple equation ... No Drugs = No prison for drugs. Don't be a criminal and you won't go to jail.
the more blacks that are in jail the better!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
an we be politically correct with just actual TRUE FACTS from the FBI Statistics? Black people are only 18% of the population.
Crime Rates:
Blacks are seven times more likely than people of other races to commit murder, and eight times more likely to commit robbery.
When blacks commit crimes of violence, they are nearly three times more likely than non-blacks to use a gun, and more than twice as likely to use a knife.
Hispanics commit violent crimes at roughly three times the white rate, and Asians commit violent crimes at about one quarter the white rate.
The single best indicator of violent crime levels in an area is the percentage of the population that is black and Hispanic.
Interracial Crime
Of the nearly 770,000 violent interracial crimes committed every year involving blacks and whites, blacks commit 85 percent and whites commit 15 percent.
Blacks commit more violent crime against whites than against blacks. Forty-five percent of their victims are white, 43 percent are black, and 10 percent are Hispanic. When whites commit violent crime, only three percent of their victims are black.
Blacks are an estimated 39 times more likely to commit a violent crime against a white than vice versa, and 136 times more likely to commit robbery.
Blacks are 2.25 times more likely to commit officially-designated hate crimes against whites than vice versa.
Gangs
Only 10 percent of youth gang members are white.
Hispanics are 19 times more likely than whites to be members of youth gangs. Blacks are 15 times more likely, and Asians are nine times more likely.
Incarceration
Between 1980 and 2003 the US incarceration rate more than tripled, from 139 to 482 per 100,000, and the number of prisoners increased from 320,000 to 1.39 million.
Blacks are seven times more likely to be in prison than whites. Hispanics are three times more likely.
So racist!
Fact: most prisoners are blacks that are incarcerated.
Fact: incarcerating is a business where prisoner equal dollars.
Conclusion: incarceration is basically slavery. Slavery still exist in America and it is state sanctioned.
Wow, did you have to draw dots so that you could make these outrageous connections?
Could it be that in some of those countries the prison population's low because they just shoot them post haste?
Good point!
Probably they be rehabilitated and change to become soldiers and be brought to South Korea front line.
I get a hoot out of Pat's reasoning that liberals are the ones responsible for all the people in jail. So mandatory sentencing is now opposed by conservatives, that is a new spin I never would have expected. Next thing you know Pat will be questioning whether the prisoners of GITMO are really a menace. Pat is right about too many people in jail, but he needs to learn a little a introspection so he can do the Christian thing an admit he was wrong in the past and not blame someone else.
10 YEARS FOR HAVE A JOINT OF MARIJUANA, WHILE RAPIST DO 12 YEARS OR LESS.
Do you have names to go with these cases?
I would like to look them up.
I agree with Pat Roberson. OMG I never thought I'd say that! He's a Repuplican Conservative, but on this he is right. Education funding vs pot? I choose education funding 100%
We have totally archaic drug laws, class inequality and for profit prisons. What else would you expect?
For those who think Marijuana is evil, let me tell you about myself. When I was 21, I had a very bad motorcycle wreck, that did some damage to my spine, and nervous system. I suffered from seizures, and chronic pain. I was on over 7 prescription meds, that controlled my seizures somewhat, though I still had at least 2 a month. Anti anxiety meds, and opiate painkillers. I could not do anything physical, without extreme pain, and nothing that would be dangerous, if I had a seizure. A few years ago, a friend talked me into trying medical cannabis. My seizures, well I haven't had one in 2 years. I still have chronic pain, which is managed through medical cannabis. I now hold down a full time job, and am a taxpayer again. I do not take any additional medication, besides medical cannabis.
I grow my own cannabis, which took a bit of time to learn to grow properly. I had 2 failed crops, before I got good enough to have a decent end product. It is not an easy plant to grow. It is very heat sensitive, it is PH sensitive, and has to be fed just right, or you burn your plants up, or substantially diminish their yield. I am now the medical provider, and grow for 5 other patients. I also run a hydroponic supply store, and teach new growers, as well. I could not do any of that, if I was still strung out on pharmaceuticals.
Thank God, for cannabis.
I would like to agree with you, Fareed. On many levels your agrument makes sense, but as someone who has been directly impacted by marijuana use I can understand and empathize with both sides of the argument and I am not sure where I stand anymore.
I personally have never consumed alcohol or drugs and raised my children to "just say no." A few years ago my 14 year old son became a regular marijuana user in high school. It was easy to get and everyone he knew did it. He used to tell me that he didn't know anyone who didn't smoke at least occasionally. He and his circle of friends became prolific users, smoking multiple times a day, and when he was 15 he was expelled from high school after being caught with rolling papers in his book bag. He was an advanced placement student prior to being expelled but not being in school really stunted his social and emotional development. By the time he was 19 he was experiencing extreme mental health issues – illogical thought, paranoia, delusions and hallucinations. At 20 he was diagnosed with Bi-Polar disorder and is now drawing SSI Disability. Every doctor he has seen has told us that marijuana abuse is most certainly a factor in his illness. None of his circle of friends, about 20 or so young men, graduated from high school either. They were just too busy getting high and drunk, and all are now drains on society in their early 20s. These were all such nice kids with so much potential when they were 11-12 years old. What a waste of young minds.
Sometimes I think that if marijuana had been legal my son and his friends would have at least been able to finish high school. On the other hand I see how completely this dug can destroy young lives when abused. I don't profess to have answers. I am just angry and confused. Should we have a national debate about the legalization of this drug? Probably, as long as we don't drown out the voices of reason and advocacy for all the young people who will use this drug and destroy themselves in the process. For starters, a pre-condition for legalization should be a diversion of some of the prison funds into education and treatment programs for teens and young adults.
Mom,
How many kids do you see selling alcohol on street corners?
Why not?
Because is is regulated and those caught selling to minors loose the wright to sell alcohol.
Marjuana is illegal thus who sells it?
Criminals some of which have a moral conpass so far off they sell to anyone regardless of age.
Not only is the sales a problem the quality is unchecked do to lack of regulation.
For what it is worth we have had multiple Presidents that admitted to using this drug and were able to rise to the highest office in the land.
Do not give up on your son as his success should not have be limited due to experimentaion with drugs.
Hope this helps
If your son gets busted for smoking a joint guess what he now has a record. You want aid to go to college. Go to the government web site for FAFSA and notice Question #1, drug conviction? If so tough luck, go pound salt. I know plenty of people that are today business leaders, scientists and other contributors to society. If they got caught with that joint they would have never gone anywhere. George W Bush?? The bong master himself.
It gets worse people look at the following link to stated report.
We have been and continue to be lied to about the evils of this substance.
Commissioned by President Richard M. Nixon, March, 1972
http://www.druglibrary.org/schaffer/Library/studies/nc/ncmenu.htm
As for our law Law Enforcement brothers and sister see the following and help correct this injustice.
Law Enforcement Against Prohibition
http://www.leap.cc
Finaly see the following especialy if you are one of the victums of this failed policy
http://norml.org/
Thanks and God Bless America
If marijuana were legalized, what happens when its users need a bigger, longer lasting, more powerful high? Do we then legalize heroin, cocaine, etc.?
I think you must be joking??? Right??
Time out
Go educate yourself first
This war on drugs has failed.
For the cost of one heroin fix per day (current policy) we could legally administer one months worth of fixes and the user could continue to be a productive member of society.
Maybe then the user would not have to steal to support their habit (wow lower violent crime too).
Anyway how many people would just want to start using herion if was made leagal tommorow?
How about are you just waiting for it to be legal so you can start using?
Again
Time out
Go educate yourself.
Tough love yet we still love ya
I can't bring myself to agree on "de-criminalizing drugs"; but there needs to be another alternative than prison for users. Just -users-... not those who commit the resulting crimes (robbery, burglary, etc – all in the name of getting cash to buy the drugs). Thirty, fourty, fifty thousand dollars a year to incarcerate a user... gotta be a better way.
Too many laws, too many laws, too many laws. More law make more criminals. Failing culture, failing. Parking permits, speeding tickets, seat belt laws, 21 to drink, juveniles sentenced as adults, death penalties, arrests for filming police, pat downs at airports, cops left and right, court dates that never end, criminal registries after release. This is a country full of scared people thanks to the local news, hollywood, religios preachers. We televised courtooms, have spectator areas for executions, television shows for cop chases, NANCY GRACE.Americans are angry and afraid and in love with crime and punishment.
why dont we put the boughten, filthy politicians in the prisons? american politics is nothing to be touting to the rest of the world. its the sickest system of any..
Did most of the US population learn anything from the collapse of 2008 – 2009? I saw first hand that when things are unsustainable, ugly things happen. This was clearly true of the property bubble.
Prohibition creates crime, it's that simple. Hypocricy creates resentment. Populating prisons instead of educational centers is obviously a terrible investment. They either get out of college or leave prison – we choose! Keep the prisons for the sociopaths. psycopaths and killers of course – but stop this dark business of keeping the wrong people in jail!
Americans have argued about evolution, equal rights and global warming. How long before this manufactured crime trend collapses under it's own weight? Wasted lives, wasted money, and wasted time. Let's be adults!
Bark – You might want to work on your reading skills. I mentioned minor offenses not violent crimes.
There are many ways to punishment other than expensive, life destroying prison. I think caining is a great punishment that leaves a very good impression that is not expensive and life destroying. Get caught for minor offenses and get a good caining. Get caught again and get a few more additional wacks.
Other countries learned long ago that physical pain is a good deterant without costing taxpayers hugh sums and taking peoples lives away for years.
I have never understood how it is more humane to throw someone in prison for years when some very harsh physical punishment can be adminstered and over with quickly. It might leave a mark but you have taken your punishment and can get on with your life after a few weeks or month.
Most people don't know that at the University of Mississippi, they grow and research medical marijuana for the FDA. They send a canister of 300 joints to out-of-states patients but they don't do that for Mississippians. Recently, Sen. Deborah Dawkins, a democrat senator wrote a bill to legalize medical marijuana for the 4th time..but the bill died before reaching the committee. Not surprising. As I'm from Mississippi, it is sad to see our State being behind on this sort of thing. Republicans are hypocrites bigots!
More about U. of Miss. marijuana research program:
http://www.theweedblog.com/does-ole-miss-grow-medical-marijuana/
Another link to go look at:
http://www.druglibrary.org/schaffer/hemp/mjleg1.htm
There is scant evidence to show Pat Robertson's theory is correct. It will have to go through some tests and scrutiny. If the majority of countries criminalize marijuana, impose prison terms on its use and possession and have a significantly smaller jailed population, Robertson's reasoning may be faulty. Marijuana might not be the main problem. Secondly, there has been steady, large decline in crime rate since our laws stipulated tough sentencing for drug use and all other violent crimes. More prisons may be the cause of reduction in crimes. Many researches on this topic point to multiple causes behind lower crime rate. Will our crime rate increase as we decriminalize marijuana? The experiences of legalized marijuana in Europe seem to suggest a rise in crimes. Robertson would be wrong again if we decriminalize marijuana only to see more crimes.
Lastly, we have to look at the enforcement issue. Today we have great difficulty preventing teenagers from using alcohol and cigarettes. Does Robertson think the country would do a much better job on marijuana?
And I don't know how Pat Robertson would feel when people are gathered to smoke a joint or two in the church parking lot every Sunday.
We do not need to legalize marijuana to solve the problem you cite. A more sensible approach is to give offenders community service and other probationary penalties rather than sending them to prison. In a future article, you should cite statistics on how many people are imprisoned for specific drug offenses so we really know what the impact is of different drug laws.
Dan
Do you work for the DEA?
If you do start at the Leap link first.
If not and you believe all the goverment told you over the years try the Nixon report.
It gets worse people look at the following link to stated report.
We have been and continue to be lied to about the evils of this substance.
Commissioned by President Richard M. Nixon, March, 1972
http://www.druglibrary.org/schaffer/Library/studies/nc/ncmenu.htm
As for our law Law Enforcement brothers and sister see the following and help correct this injustice.
Law Enforcement Against Prohibition
http://www.leap.cc
Finaly see the following especialy if you are one of the victums of this failed policy
http://norml.org/
Thanks and God Bless America
We have a very polarized society, both our distribution of wealth and our political system. The extreme disparity in financial and social conditions might well be a more significant cause of the high percentage of our citizens who are behind bars. While we are the world's wealthiest country, we have many urban cities with high school graduation rates well under 50%. How is that going to lead to a positive outcome?
get rid of the drug prisoners who haven't committed murder. there is at least 20% other who will stumble along and be alright without prison...a lot of prisoners need to be right there. sorry i've been there and the whackcos are dangerous and have to stay till it hits them one day to do different. it happens, thats why you "do" time.
Well can we be politically correct with just actual TRUE FACTS from the FBI Statistics? Black people are only 18% of the population.
Crime Rates:
Blacks are seven times more likely than people of other races to commit murder, and eight times more likely to commit robbery.
When blacks commit crimes of violence, they are nearly three times more likely than non-blacks to use a gun, and more than twice as likely to use a knife.
Hispanics commit violent crimes at roughly three times the white rate, and Asians commit violent crimes at about one quarter the white rate.
The single best indicator of violent crime levels in an area is the percentage of the population that is black and Hispanic.
Interracial Crime
Of the nearly 770,000 violent interracial crimes committed every year involving blacks and whites, blacks commit 85 percent and whites commit 15 percent.
Blacks commit more violent crime against whites than against blacks. Forty-five percent of their victims are white, 43 percent are black, and 10 percent are Hispanic. When whites commit violent crime, only three percent of their victims are black.
Blacks are an estimated 39 times more likely to commit a violent crime against a white than vice versa, and 136 times more likely to commit robbery.
Blacks are 2.25 times more likely to commit officially-designated hate crimes against whites than vice versa.
Gangs
Only 10 percent of youth gang members are white.
Hispanics are 19 times more likely than whites to be members of youth gangs. Blacks are 15 times more likely, and Asians are nine times more likely.
Incarceration
Between 1980 and 2003 the US incarceration rate more than tripled, from 139 to 482 per 100,000, and the number of prisoners increased from 320,000 to 1.39 million.
Blacks are seven times more likely to be in prison than whites. Hispanics are three times more likely.
I agree completely. The war on drugs has wasted untold amounts of treasure and lives and to what end? It's time for it to end and to grant amnesty to most drug related offenders.
Let's be clear though, the war on drugs started under Nixon and the current spiraling incarceration rate started under Regan.
They are both the brain children of conservative politics.
J,
And Nixon lied to us see the following:
We have been and continue to be lied to about the evils of this substance.
Commissioned by President Richard M. Nixon, March, 1972
http://www.druglibrary.org/schaffer/Library/studies/nc/ncmenu.htm
Why is this never an issue with politicians, talking revolves around defense, healthcare, taxes, economy, immigration. America is one ugly place. A world leader in all the shameful categories. Military spending, prisoners, pollution.
These facts and statistics should have every American (I'm sure with the unfortunate exception of those who have been hopelessly brainwashed by decades of "War on Drugs" propaganda) cringing in horror. Between the federal, state and local governments, we annually spend $27 billion on marijuana prohibition, not to mention the denying of jobs to users of marijuana and the devastating effects on lives and families of those arrested and incarcerated for marijuana offenses. It's beyond bizarre that after 9 years our government figured out that alcohol prohibition simply didn't work, but it's been 70 years of marijuana being illegal in this country and the government still doesn't get it. Bizarre indeed...
25% of high school students don't graduate. Until education becomes a priority in this country, we'll build more and more prisons.
Thank you Zakaria! There seems to be a general agreement that marijuana is safer than alcohol, and doesn't cause overdoses. It seems like lunacy that someone can get ten years for simply having a joint, or 20 years for having a single plant. Considering this, it's amusing in a sick way anyone can legally grow opium poppies in their garden and buy liquor made with coca leaves. And when will marijuana be legalized and regulated like alcohol on a federal level? If it doesn't happen soon, is it proof that America is akin to countries that are not free?
legalize marijuana and I am very sure the economy will improve because more people will be able to get better jobs.
One thing that wasn't mentioned there and which I would like to know more about, is that a lot of that huge population of incarcerated people are apparently being used for labor of various types on behalf of businesses. As such they get paid very little (50 cents an hour or something like that) and cost a company almost nothing while doing manufacturing jobs. Since the prisons themselves are privatized to begin with, this would be verging on slave labor if its true.
As well, I have often wondered if the "War on Drugs" was in part a broad attempt to make the US more conservative by ensuring a larger portion of the population is unable to vote – having been convicted of a crime and done time in prison. I realize that sounds just a bit paranoid of course, but aren't the sort of people who do a lot of drugs *less* likely to vote conservatively? Perhaps they are simply less likely to vote
Its amazing how one always hears how much it costs to house a prisoner. Mr Zakaria quotes $50K annually. No one ever mentions how much the lawyers make "defending" these prisoners. WIth so many lawmakers/lawyers having a vested interest in this continuing, its highly unlikely that things will change.
It is clearly out of control in this country...the media breeds paranoia and constant fear, and the lawmakers capitalize on this to make decisions in their personal best interests. It's corruption under the facade of public safety.
I concur
the problem is pharmaceutical companies can not develop marijuana in a pill for that reacts with your body the same way a joint does. Therefore if the pharmaceutical companies cannot profit from this they form a super pact to influence the politicians of the U.S
RE:Incarceration nation
Yes. Have known all about this for a while. Indeed, having had the dubious distinction of serving on a Bureau of Prisons engagement, I most shocked by the incorrect statistic of the number of incarcerated Americans. In 2001 it was roughly 6 Million, or half the 'published' figure.
And what about tobacco? It's an addictive drug and causes horrible cancers, yet is legal. But marijuana, which doesn't cause cancer and doesn't need to be smoked, can result it 10 to 20 YEARS in prison? Similar to a murderer? What is this saying about our country? This needs to end now.
Erratum! Looks like the published figure has finally been corrected! 7M and rising....
It cracks me up that Republicans constantly accuse Liberals of expanding government, yet they are behind numerous laws that expand government and criminalize EVERYTHING, from smoking a joint in your own home to having mental issues when you are pregnant (google Bei Bei Shuai). We are left with a society of people revolving through prison, where they often become REAL criminals, or more efficient criminals. People need to recognize their sick need to control society and that prison is NOT the answer to a better society. People with drug problems or mental problems need HELP. They need to be getting treatment, not in prison which just ensures they will be WORSE when they get out. We were much better about treating addiction and mental health problems in this country before Reagan and "just say no." Today it's just a mess. I guess in this country it doesn't matter what is BETTER for SOCIETY, you have to be making millions for Congressmen. That's all that matters.
"yet they are behind numerous laws that expand government and criminalize EVERYTHING"
Can you name a couple of these numerous laws that you are complaining about?
If you did, you might become somewhat more knowledgable.
I believe what Sunny is saying is what seems to be hypocrisy when a lot of the GOP are always saying liberals are expanding government and want to impose all these mandates on you which will limit your freedom. You asked for some examples and I think a few of the obvious ones are their stance on weed (which we are talking about), along with their opposition to gay marriage and abortion. I would say telling people who they can't marry and telling women what choices they shouldn't have is government really getting involved and telling you how to live your life.
The best path to a true drug-free America is to follow the example of post-war East Germany. Ensure half the population is spying on the other half - kids are great for doing this, we just need to empower DARE a little more - and throw all the offenders in jail for at least a decade. And just like the Stazi-ridden state, the 1% can exempt themselves from this law.
If you date the War on Drugs from Nixon, it's about as old as Eastern European communism was when it met its end (and about as successful ignoring those with vested interests). If you date it from 1982, the "Just say no" year, it probably has another decade left before it implodes and leaves the nation in worse shambles than it's in now.
Double standard: The excessive US prison population with regards to the population was first mentioned in the UN general assembly September speech by Dr. Ahmadinejad, the Iranian president. The same people who appreciate the information coming from Mr. Pat Robertson walked away when Ahmadinejad talked about it among other issues!?
I want to know who it is that disagrees with the legalization of marijuana. These are probably baby boomers who ate up all the propaganda that the mid-century politicians and businessmen fed to them. They apparently don't realize that marijuana has PROVEN medicinal uses (even many cancer, AIDS, etc. patients who had never tried it before in their lives tried it after being stricken with the disease after being recommended it and discovered how useful it was to battle their illness), it's been around for god knows how long (ancient China folk smoked the stuff), and it was NEVER illegal until the mid-20th century. Hell, George Washington grew an abundance of it after he resigned his presidency and became a full-time farmer. Do you celebrate Columbus Day? Because he carried ganja with him, too. And of course, these people will also probably deny its immense benefits in our declining economy.
As for the prisons here, what a joke. We're essentially turning people INTO criminals by imprisoning them, and then putting them back out on the streets with a list of connections for their future. Then they have jail time on their records forever, even though all many of them did was pack a bowl after their 9-5 and lit up. Politicians have their heads sky-high in their rectums, and a large chunk of the populace isn't much different.
I couldn't have said it better myself.
Whenever you ask why someone is against marijuana, they always regurgitate the same old BS. Regardless of how many scientific and patient approved studies there are, those against it will have a closed mind that is nearly impossible to be altered.
Flogging is a better punishment. A few good floggings will be a lot more effective that fines and jail time. Pot heads is just that: Pot heads.
What about Xanax heads? And all those opiate prescription drugs? Should we flog them too? Marijuana won't cause an overdose but those will. Should be flog anyone who takes more pills than are prescribed, or just log everyone who takes them at all for anything other than truly serious conditions?
The media is correct on the US being #1 in priosn population. However they are incorrect in potraying us as being way ahead of every other nation. Check your facts. Russia is not that far behind this country. They were not that long ago #1 themselves. Also other nations biting at our heels are the Cayman Islands and Belarus.
yea the problem is we create a problem by incarcerating people for breaking the law. lol just another stupid writer with cnn who doesnt have a clue. maybe we just have too many people commiting crimes? fareed you moron.
What I see is a masked veiled comment hidden behind the drug issue. "So we have the jails filled with people who are white collar criminals" READ: Let us remove all laws that let the wealthy politicians and lobbyists defraud the average man.
I have been an Emergency Physician for 25 years. Alcohol, tobacco and obesity have kept me very busy. Marijuana...not so much.
Frank, you don't think there is a correlation between the legality of alcohol and tobacco and the harm? I am still not buying the argument from the "occasionaly weekend pothead" that this drug is harmless. When it becomes legal and available to anyone who wants it whenever they want it, do you still think the devasting effects of chronic use and abuse won't become apparent? This will be just another social blight like alcohol and tobacco.
I'll echo the concerns of an earlier responder: I am not sure decriminalization is the answer, but there has to be a better way of enforcing consequences than throwing people in jail.
Mom, Frank never said marijuana is harmless. Nobody in this forum has. He said it is less of a problem. It is interesting how people take someone elses statements, then twist them to suit their own views.
yup, interesting.
Just move to Colorado, pay your $70.00, tell the nice doctor you hurt your back playing golf twenty years ago and you will have the sweetest weed on the planet.
Exterminate serious CRIMINALS ON THE SPOT. (not 10 years later). the goverment save billions and the street are safer.
you are not worried about due process?
See the wikipedia Incarceration_in_the_United_States article. It says right under the top-most graph "Number of inmates. 1920 to 2006.[1][2] (absolute numbers) General US population grew only 2.8 times in the same period, but the number of inmates increased more than 20 times."
Google "inc_federalprisonpop.pdf" or "u.s. non-violent offender prison population" and click the first link (sentencingproject dot org). 72% of federal prison inmates are NON-VIOLENT offenders, with no history of violence.
The product of lack of consequence, and unhindered, responsibility free, freedom? There's a lot of talk of liberty and freedom, but no good moral, or spiritual, education, balanced out, on how to handle it! Too bad there isn't any education on the subject of love.
How about making ethics a required course in schools? Teach in schools what some parents do not teach their children at home. Just another input.
They penalize us too much. They want us to be perfect citizens to an imperfect society. Change must start from within all of us, or risk putting more people in jail!
"Most [prisons] are privately run." Are you sure about this?
It's time to recognize that conservative repuglicans have a mental disorder by default.
What changed was the war on drugs and the mindless proliferation of laws that created criminal penalties for anything and everything.
CNN literally stole my story and my LINES I have been using for years.
if that is your story...
The problem with this country is that people are raised on an assembly system. This is the reason anyone who tries to do something other than what the assembly line has taught them the go to prison. And this is for everything imaginable. This also breeds another group of so called justice people who probably do the same things that the people in prison do, but within the society acceptable lawful limit. This factory line system has to stop to make real progress, otherwise in a few generations we will have a bunch of people who are really good at flipping tablet and smartphone pages, but none of them will be good at designing methods which will cure a disease of endemic proportions or throw an asteriod out of its earth hitting orbit or solve the energy problem or the climate change problem or something that the society has to really be worried about. This also wastes the police or judicial resources to keep the really bad crimes in check. There must be something wrong in a society where games such as first shooter sell like hot cakes, well to do teenage girls work in sleazy environments to make lots of money. Factory environments are never good. Even china has realized this and is moving up the value chain. All they do is pigeonhole people or criminals in this case to continue doing the same thing or crime.
AMERICAN GULAG is what this country has become. Here anyone faces police harrassment all the time and you can go to jail for nothing. America is punishing and destroying its own people. American police reminds me of Gestapo. In other countries you may be affraid of thieves but here we are all afraid of the police and the judicial system. It is all about money.
It's easy to say legalize it but people need to understand. when you get rid of one problem you create 100 more. More careless people, more drugs sold on your street corner, More guns being smuggled in and more violent crimes. Look how many people die from drunk drivers. Look how the prison inmates use cigarettes as currency to smuggle weapons and more potent types of drugs. If you legalize weed your legalizing pcp and other additives people will add for a bigger high. The war on drugs is a losing battle but imagine the world if no puts up a fight. People walking around like spaced out zombies on street corners begging for money to buy legal weed. Weed is only the beginning and that will lead to a society of careless idiots who kill, rob and steal for the next high. You may say a lot of this is already happening but if you open the flood gates it will be more devastation than u can imagine. The prison system will stay pack regardless because there are plenty of arrest that have nothing to do with smoking weed. Even if they saved a billion the people would never see that money put to good use to benefit where they live in the country. Only the fat cats who control the money would see the difference. Don't be fooled! And look at all possibilities before jumping to certain sides.
I would rather live in a nation full of beggars than a nation full of robbers. Americas massive deficit due to the Wall Street bailout, private contractor operated foreign wars, and easy credit will bankrupt us faster than legalized marijuana.
Cocaine, heroine, meth. These are drugs that should never be legal and the response should be one of treatment. Lock up cold turkey if necessary. These particular drugs actually do destroy people all on their very own. Marijuana? Smoke till you have had your fill then smoke again. OK munchy break in there. OK two no three munchy breaks in there.
What a gross oversimplification of the problem...and please, cite a case where someone got ten years for nothing more than having one joint on them...I'm all ears. Should we legalize pot, maybe, but lets not suggest for one second that our jails are housing a bunch of single-joint-in-the-pocket accidents...its a ridiculous assumption. The 'War on Drugs' has failed, no question, but if we are going to legalize pot or any other drug, I don't want to pay for healthcare for those that use them...or cigarettes, or booze etc. I don't want to see wellfare dollars end up in the hands of those that spend money on drugs. How about injecting a little personal responsibility back into our system? How about us ending the subsidizing the morons who decide selling dope is better than finishing high school. This is a hack article that doesn't even begin to address the fact that we have a crime problem and that is exactly what people are doing when they are using pot or any other drugs...they are illegal which means they are breaking the existing laws. It also suggests to me that if you are willing to take on that risk you are willing to take on other risks or laws and where and when do we stop making excuses for people who chose to break our laws? Just because one disagrees with a law doesn't suddenly invalidate it and those that decided it was worth the risk have only themselves to blame.
Why is the poll about marijuana? The real issue is the way our prison system is the new form of slavery and how big corporations use slave prison labor to compete on the world market. For example, did you know that corporate farms use prison labor to work in their fields? What's that sound like to you?
like you pulled some facts out of your hiney and are trying to raise ca ca.
The prisoners are not working for free – they get $50,000 a year living expenses which is a lot more than the average tax paying law abiding citizen- we should be getting some labor out of them! I bet And – I'd love to know what "Corporate Farms" you are talking about!
The Police will lose their extra-cash income if marijuana is made legal
Cops love drugs to remain illegal, it justifies their jobs. Making drugs legal will remove the incentive for crime for many poor people, -we can treat them in return for surrendering. But cops won't like it, ... nor will suburban stupid white house-wives.
Funny I thought keeping the public safe, answering 911 calls and risking there lives everyday justified there work. Not to mention the robberies, fire arms, drugs and assault arrests they make everyday. The violations they prevent and the people that are arrested for bigger crimes because they were caught doing smaller ones. I thought the six cops that died last year doing the right thing and all the critical decisions they make on a daily basis justified there stressful job. In new York there there is 30,000 911 calls a day every day. Next time there is a shoot out put on a vest and grab a gun jump right in the middle of it .
LAND OF THE FREE ? This is the biggest joke about our antemn !
I do not put much respect, or fear to the justice system at all anymore. The cops have already proven, firsthand to me, that they can be just as corrupt, or worse, as the rest of us!!!
Iran, as well as America, has "land of the free" in its anthem?
I did not know that.
One thing we Americans do really well is create a need for a need for a certain product, be it a short term solution to diabetes, cancer or recidivism. Have a product to sell? Not a problem. Sell bad food, contaminate the environment with chemicals, destroy education and the middle class. All you have to do is buy off the politicians, get the right supreme court justices and corrupt/disempower or empower the right agency.
I relate the US to a bad parent. We suffer from bad parenting, a stifling environment, and abusive punishment.
nice
If you hate living in America, go home to Syria, Lebanon, Iran, Iraq, Egypt, Jordan...
I agree with everything except the conclusion that blames all these laws on liberals. I think it is conservatives, such as George Bush, Cheney, Reagen, etc., that create all these laws designed to enforce conservative views on everyone. Liberals are for freedome of citizens and less freedom for business, conservatives stand for business freedom and less freedom for individuals.
I have said for years that probably two major prisons in the US would hold all the offenders that are truly a menace to society and can never be released and I may be overestimating by one.
Absolutely prisons are HUGE business...for many many people.....including the corporate culture,the small towns and those who administer and survive from the so-called JUSTICE system.....I am thankful that this is finally being addressed in the media......this is just a small start but perhaps our citizens will begin to analyze why so many of our citizens are incarcerated
and/or have a criminal record.
where are my comments?
Mine too I've tried posting several times even went back and checked to make sure it didn't violate terms of use?
A web administrator has deleted your comments. It has happened to me too. Im not sure why they do this. It just might be that they are running out of hard drive space, but I doubt it.
I write too well.
One interesting fact that has been left out in this report is that the US has the LONGEST prison term times ordered by our judicial sytem. And we have been number one in the world at keeping our prisoners incarcerted for very long periods of "easy" time. Our prisoners learn to become dependant on a structured environment and cannot handle themselves independantly once they are released. Ergo recitivism. Short hard time is best to reduce recitivism and even the thought of committing a crime.
Mass murders, terrorists and those who get death and life sentences are the only ones that should remain in jail for more than a year. Everyone else should be incarcerated only as long as they need mental health evaluations and counseling. Our politicians need to understand that jail is a silly punishment that does no good to rehab the criminal, does not protect society once they get out, and does not repay any debt to society. (community service and fines are the only way to pay back society)
Even violent offenders, rapists, child molesters, etc. should get supervised parole within a year (i.e., a quarter-way house). What good does it do to put someone in prison for 15 years and then let them out on the streets again? Every criminal should be sentenced to hundreds or thousands of hours community service as punishment. Electronic monitoring and at-home imprisonment should be standard. $50,000 a year is too much for too many criminals. Get smarter America!
I find this interesting.
The legalization of marijuana (or any other drug) in the United States will forever be a catch22. For every pro there is a con and for every con there is a pro. You can sit here and debate this topic or the war on drugs all you want and still just be going in circles. You can talk about how good or bad legalizing pot would be for this country and it's inhabitants for years and not get anywhere. When are we going to realize that the problem is not the drug itself but the people who choose to use and abuse it as well as the flawed criminal justice system that needs to control it? We already live in a society that loves to degrade, demoralize and slowly kill itself, why give people another legal excuse to ruin their lives and the lives of others sending our country further down the rabbit hole of destruction? Yes, this is a drug just like any other drug whether it is over the counter, at your local pub or in your favorite grocery store (I am referring to prescription drugs, alcohol, nicotine, caffeine or even sugar) but it still has the power to dramatically effect and change the lives of people. We live in a society of selfish, self-indulging, addictive people who have learned that it is far easier to live off of the success and hard work of others. Many of these people are already stoned, or drunk, or lazy, or high or otherwise incompetent. But they do it illegally, so it is harder for them to obtain and there is more risk involved. The risk also keeps many well-meaning but ill-minded people from taking part in it and causing more destruction. One commenter got it right when they said that those high on pot just want to sit on the couch, do nothing and get the munchies. Is that not a problem? Do we really want a nation that is even lazier than it is now? Do we want to support more individuals who now have a legal excuse to sit in their house (mom's basement/flop house/alley) all day and do nothing? Those would be and are OUR tax dollars at work, legally supporting the poor choices of others. Before we can address the pros and cons of legalizing certain drugs we need to take a hard look at our society and ask the question of whether or not it is really worth it. Other countries, such as Amsterdam, have legalized marijuana but they do not face the same socio-economic crisis and laziness that our country faces. I work in social services and in public schools and I see how this drug (and all the others) have to potential to do so much damage. As it is there are not enough funds or resources to help these people. Giving them a legal scape-goat (which alcohol/nicotine/scrips already has) will only make it worse. It may be fun to get high on your own, you may be responsible with it but there are millions of others who are not. Those are the people who are not ready for the legalization of marijuana.
The same pro and con arguments you make for marijuana are EASILY transferred to using alcohol (which is quite legal).
Whether or not you are in agreement with legalization, can we at least come to an agreement that possession should not carry a jail sentence? I really cant understand why anyone thinks it is a good idea to put a young person in jail for smoking weed. It will ruin his life by giving him a record, and it will cost the tax payers a fortune. The lobbyists are the real reason it is illegal. What on earth would we do with the empty jail cells?
Cal state students paying around 10,000/yr and inmate cost is around 80,000/yr. is what I heard, A powerful prison guard union exists but it is a disagreeable job to frisk men, knew a couple guys that took that job as they struggled with finances, they get rich and then retire for sanity. I think today's marijuana is too strong–wouldn't advise it for an elderly person without them getting used to it, the buds are not good type (like bogus marijuana), they're getting more hospital emergency admissions on strong grass. Legalizing would help Mexico (all that crime for US illegal drug use), its going to be here in force some day if we don't find a better way. We had heroin addicts in the 70's and they stole to buy the drugs, then when they had methadone they stopped and felt better too, my mother rented to them, I was her security detail.
Although this is a discussion, the facts presented have to be valid, reliable, verifiable.
Can you provide any fact?
GET LEGAL IN MICHIGAN!! http://www.naturesanswerinfo@gmail.com
our prison and justice system is soo out of proportion: someone steals then confiscate what they own; someone drives drunk then confiscate their car and with electronic monitoring keep them in their home (outside from going to their job); white-collar crimes and tax-evasion put them to work in community services there is soo much that could be covered that way especially since we have everywhere budget-shortages --revamp the entire sentencing system: only violence against other humans require prison time /// prescription drugs and alcohol are as terrible damaging as illegal drugs, no difference there
Never thought I would agree with Pat Robertson. Great piece.
BLACK PEOPLE WAKE UP and smile the coffee, too many of us are incarcerated for no reasons.
Female
Male Totals White Black Hispanic Female Totals White Black Hispanic
2009 2,096,300 693,800 841,000 442,000 201,200 92,100 64,800 32,300
Note: Detailed categories exclude persons who reported two or more races. All totals include persons under age 18.
aIncludes American Indians, Alaska Natives, Asians, Native Hawaiians, and other Pacific Islanders, and persons identifying two or more races.
and you would like us to believe you are American?
hehehehehehehehe...
Pat Robertson is absolutely right. Now, just don't listen to ANYTHING else he says – he's a nutcase!
you are complex, aren't you habibi?
Patrick, you seem to think that everyone who has progressive ideas are eastern immigrant. I am a 33 year old white male who was born in Houston. Ditch your preconceived notions.
sure thing habibi
Here is the definition of progressive:
Adjective: Happening or developing gradually or in stages; proceeding step by step.
Noun: A person advocating or implementing social reform or new, liberal ideas.
Synonyms: adjective. advanced – onward – forward
noun. progressist – progressionist
So, what progressive ideas were proposed?
Hes onto the point ~ but didnt really get to the root...which is this in a nutshell; when you educate a person (and this statement is COLORBLIND) you have no vested interest (besides well, having an intelligent, productive society!) in that person once they have graduated. However; the recidivism; the churn of prisoners "in the system" is what keeps literally millions of people employed at a NOMINAL SALARY. You have just here in California for every ONE inmate you have 6 YES 6 people that make a "living" off of that ONE inmate (court clerks, staff, Law Enforcement, Judges, Marshall's, bounty hunters, bail bondsmen, traffic schools. This is the root of the problem and when the spiderweb grows outward you find and again just here California, OVER 650,000 (YES THOUSAND) codes/statutes/(LAWS) on the books waiting to FEED THAT MACHINE (the system). If you really want to change it, take a book of the "laws" and go thru line item by line and DELETE it; and then you will have made a difference and we can get on EDUCATING people instead of incarcerating them.
spewing poison and trying to raise ca ca.
As long as prisons remain open to FOR-PROFIT corporations at the taxpayers expense we will always have this problem.
So strange to see all the people taking Fareed's lead with the words, "Never thought I'd agree with Pat Robertson about anything". It's pure idiocy. I'm sure you are all shocked that Pat loves his kids as well. You might find it shocking that Mr. Robertson frowns on the torture of small animals as well.
Is it just that this forum is just chock full of Christian haters?
Actually, Yawn-o, most of the arguments in this forum are based on economics, addictive properties of marijuana, and the expense of incarceration. You might want to actually read others posts before u write yours. Most of the people in this forum are probably Christians like yourself (not that it matters). Churches oppose marijuana, but that is not our best argument to promote its legalization.
and you are islamic jihadist?
Such a clever play on my name! I bet that goes over well in 5th grade.
My post was about what is clearly visible in the comments section, not the article itself. Thanks for filling the stereotype.
Wait, did Robertson just accuse the liberals of creating the laws that put so many people in jail? Really?! I thought "law and order" was a conservative thing. Oh, I get it, things like law and order, a booming economy, and wars are all the conservatives doing - until they go south. Then it's the liberal's fault.
Actually... when marijuana laws were first being passed Mayor la Guardia (a republican) had commissioned the report that contradicted Anslinger. politics is a confusing flip floppy world.
depending on the current facts.
For example, if you open the fridge and find no milk, you can assume there is no milk in the house.
What if your teen age son took the milk to his room?
Then you do have milk in the house, its just that the milk is not in the fridge.
The article was written by someone who doesn't know anything about the criminal law nor does he want to learn about what is really going on in the court system. Instead, he misinforms the WORLD by quoting a man who doesn't know what he is talking about. Quoting someone who doesn't understand probation/parole or the number of crimes committed in the US every year is irresponsible. Thank you for making up the news.
News Flash: Someone said that God just pulled up at the corner 'Stop and Rob'. Get on your next story Zakaria.
Ooops, it turns out that it wasn't God, it was Rod, the ICEE guy. Since, you won't look into the facts, this shouldn't be a problem. Put in big letters at the top of your article, "GOD is actually a guy named Rod who makes ICEES". You can thank me later.
You are doing a pretty job of pasing misinformation yourself habibi.
The only way to solve all of the worlds problems at once is for money to not exist. Money really is the root of all evil. What funds war, cartels, governments and all things bad.
so you would have us return to trading camels and carpets?
A large proportion of the comments concern the so called "War on Drugs' and drugs in general, but the core issue regarding the American penal system is neither, but the significant number of laws which can result in incarceration for things which should have no connection to prison whatsoever. Any law might have provisions for jail time for violation, but does making jaywalking a crime for which a person might serve years in prison make jaywalking deserving of the punishment? The senselessness of all too many laws which make all too many things illegal is profound, much more so than the logic behind the laws themselves.
There is NO logic behind most laws, only politics and perceived public opinion. Our legislators pass laws out of expediency. They have in innate “knee Jerk” reaction when they smell the power of manipulated public opinion. If they vote tough laws they can appeal to the moral majority (or at least those who think they are moral at other’s expense). They can tally their votes as the jaywalkers rot in prison, but what concern is that for them; they most certainly wouldn’t “jaywalk”; if they did, they would pay off the authorities so it is not reported.
some of the petty criminals should be just caned like they do in Singapore and thrown back in the streets. it seems to be a real deterrent. at least we don;t have to feed them with tax payer money.
pretty strange!
Fareed got it right when he said: "the mindless proliferation of laws that created criminal penalties for anything and everything". It does not matter if it is marijuana or any other offense that can be sensationalized, politicized, demonized or reap profits from. If our nation continues at its current rate of NEW LAWS and incarceration for offenses that cause no harm to ANYONE, we may all be behind bars for simply voicing our opinions. Now where have I heard that? Might it have been a tad east of New York in a land of tall blond men, or was it during a period religious questioning and inquiry? I know, let’s get together and pass a law to stop passing inane laws.
unbelievable!!!!!
Apparently somebody forgot to invite Pat to the ALEC conferences where the For-Profit Prison Industry writes laws and gives them to GOP legislators to pass in order to make sure for-profit prisons are increasingly for-profitable.
There should NEVER EVER be a financial incentive to send somebody to prison. How many conservatives think it would be a good idea that the police should get to set up radar speed traps so they catch you speeding in order to take away your car and sell it so the police officers themselves get the money? Any conservative who claims they think that's a good idea is lying. No conservative wants to worry about cops hiding around every corner ready to take away their car and sell it so the police officers themselves can make a profit.
there should never be any incentive to lie–but you do it all the time.
The war on drugs has failed. Whether or not you agree with the legalization/decriminalization of drugs (specifically, marijuana), the negative effects of this 'war on drugs' significantly out-weigh what little benefits (if any), in my opinion. Our leaders have invaded citizen's privacy for far too long. Why is it a crime to smoke marijuana in a house with children while it is perfectly legal to smoke countless cigarettes, even with a child in your lap when the Government itself said that marijuana smoke is less harmful than cigarette smoke? Why are we sending non-violent small time marijuana offenders to jail for 5-10 years? And, when they are done with prison, they can't find good jobs, their reputation is forever tarnished and then this 'war on drugs' separates families. It's time we start calling out greedy and corrupt politicians who pass legislation that curtail our rights under disguise.
unbelievable!!!
12.5% of the Federal prison population are marijuana offenders. On average 12.5% of the States prison populations are pot offenders.
The FBI reports that on average, a person is arrested for pot every 38 seconds, mainly young people for possession.
Legalizing pot will not only cut our drug war strategy budget in half, it will also reduce our federal and state prison populations by at least 10%.
legalizing pot would also free up the 16 states that have medical marijuana laws to regulate the markets instead of sitting back with tied hands letting violent drug gangs make millions on the backs of sick people.
I researched these stats and could not find them anywhere.
Could you please share you information source?
Not saying that the pot users have often a good level of educatiobn that could be beneficial for the economy. But everywhere you get that feeling that the governments are couscious of the vast waste of talent and intelligence it is for the society and the economy, and the prohibition creates armed gangs and all, but they prefer to put their head in the sand as this parallel world solves a part of the problem of underemployement of the more exposed populations. Maybe when the civil war is declared, in the hot spots like in the suburbs of Paris in 2005 and lately in London, and all over the place the governments finally decide to stop all this nonsense and legalize
The media likes to say "oh they are just simple drug offenders" but they neglect to tell you all the crimes they committ to pay for their habit. Robbery, burglary, mugging, all go hand in hand with drug crimes
Jon, that is a very broad statement that I am not inclined to entirely believe. There are a small percentage of people who will steal, burglarize, murder (etc.) for any nasty habit they have. To simply tag this to drug offenders is an injustice itself and makes you sound ignorant. Look at the facts, sir. Quite a few marijuana offenders in jail/prisons are non-violent first time offenders. It's sad.
It's insane and should be criminal that private prison companies pay politicians millions of dollars, from the billions of U.S. tax-dollars they receive, to enact harsher laws with longer sentences.
and where did you get that info?
Please do share.
personally I don't care if marijuana is legal or not, it is like alcohol and cigarettes in my opinion which I don't do either, and people who want to try and live a long healthy life will be better off not smoking anything, smoking still gives lung problems and cancers and waste of money etc. I also think there's enough evil people in this society that a little jail time is sometimes in order to teach them a lesson before they get even worse even though some people choose to let jail be their career or retirement home.
eat more plants (fruits and vegetables) don't smoke them. you'll live a better quality of life in the end
some countries would be better off having more prisons. You hear about outrageous crimes against women in Africa and the Middle East and other developing countries and it seems they don't even have a police system to call and report things to. I think Fareed's statistics are misleading.
How are the stats misleading?
You make a statement and then you do not explain it.
You might as well have said nothing at all.
Marijuana use can still be illegal without resorting to jail time. Community service can replace jail time. Legalizing marijuana may be popular but only because people are forgetting that it is a gateway drug. As a gateway drug, the drug user will still end up doing another drug that remains illegal. Drugs are a form of escapism; do we wish to promote escapism? Marijuana may seem harmless but ask how many crack users started with marijuana. To see legalizing marijuana as a cure for over incarceration is to not have thought this through enough, it may actually lead to more incarcerations and therefore more profit for for-profit prisons.
Oh look, another pro-weed article in disguise. *sigh* I'll support an article that just spits out the underlying message rather than hide it with smoke. The rest about big business prisons is slightly silly. Here's an idea – don't commit serious crimes and they'll go out of business.
America's last three POTUS-Clinton,Bush and Obama- all smoked pot. Bush was an alcoholic until he was 40. Obama did coke and dropped pills. "Legalize it" Peter Tosh It has become the road that leads to the White House.
Legalize all drugs, regulate them, tax them and educate about them. It will put the drug lords out of business and the prison industrial complex too.
do you have proof of what you are saying or are you just flapping your toothless gums?
...yeah, yeah, and keep throwing those unemployed fathers to prison for missing a child support payment, yeah, yeah...
There are so many people that have commented about how great it is that Pat Robertson is talking about this when they didn't even notice his real intentions for talking about the prisons being overcrowded! Fareed Zakaria didn't even notice and he quoted Pat in this article. Here is the quote again: "We here in America make up 5% of the world's population, but we make up 25% of jailed prisoners....We have now over 3,000 – the number must be might higher than that – but over 3,000 federal crimes, and every time the liberals pass a bill – I don't care what it involves – they stick criminal sanctions on it. They don't feel there is any way people are going to keep a law unless they can put them in jail.... So we have the jails filled with people who are white collar criminals." We have jails filled with people who are white collar criminals? And the truth shall set you free! This isn't about marijuana or the people jailed for it! This is about rich people being jailed for white collar crimes! Learn to read between the lines people!
As usual black people are invisible to Fareed. Blacks are in prison primarily as a result of the bigoted method of prosecuting non violent drug offenders. Blacks get steered into the criminal justice system while whites get rehab, probation or the charges get dropped. See Michelle Alexander " The New Jim Crow: Mass Incarceration in an Age of Colorblindness" and Khalil Gibran Muhammad " The Condemnation of Blackness : Race, Crime and the Rise of Urban America"
Fareed how about some black people -African, African American, Carribbean, Brazilian, Central/South America etc.- on your program for a change? There are far more blacks in America than there are either Jews or Muslims. And the same goes for Hispanics/Latinos. Why are they invisible to you Fareed?
Apart from trying to incite race division, you are not saying anything intelligent.
Explain yourself!.......in English
very simple, this person is realizing his end is near he is afraid of hell. he helped put these laws in place he'll probably end up in hell no matter what now.
You are so funny!
The cure for America's illness is quality education. Therefore, our prognosis is grim. Reading the comments from fellow voters is terrifying.
Show me ONE case of a single person doing prison time for simple possession of Pot. Just ONE. You can't, because their aren't any, and haven't been for over ten years. Yet Potheads are always whining about how sad it is that our prisons are full of recreational pot smokers.
I like how when you say it should be legal, the only real defense people have is to accuse you of being a stoner even when you obviously aren't. Not just people online, but people that know me in real life that know I work for a bank that gives regular drug tests.
Even if you have the skills, the revolving door is systemic. I have 7 years of experience in the mobile telecom industry. I was denied numerous jobs. Most don't call, but the ones that do don't hire ex-felons. By the way, not all felons are created equal. I helped a friend commit a burglary for a few hundred bucks when I was 18. Nobody was hurt and I spent 3 years and 9 months of total incarceration. In 2008, I was eligible for a waiver to enlist in the Army and a judge said to me "if the United States Army is willing to accept a convicted felon this country's in bad shape". I tried and continue to try to get ahead. I'll be 27 last month. Although I have good references from former employers, businesses like Radio Shack and many, many others discriminate against applicants with criminal convictions. After months of being out of work and trying to land a job in my profession and disclosing my history, I was never given a chance at a job. So for the first time I checked "no" in that section of the app, and lo and behold I'm hired...albeit for minimum wage. By not giving work and educational opportunities to people, you're almost guaranteeing that they'll go to/ go back to prison. But any 'aware' inmate can tell you that. The system doesn't want to rehabilitate people because the system needs those people. Thankfully I have my family who helps me out, but a lot of the people in question don't. Is it any wonder that many recommit crimes when they get out? Most have no work experience and little to no education which makes them practically unhireable. I see the system for what it is. It cares not about rehabilitation, and companies that have blanket policies against hiring people who were in prison are doing their communities a disservice. Goodness knows if that person is able to work and earn a decent wage he or she won't resort to mugging you. I'm not excusing, condoning or justifying this. But I live in the real world, and in the real world, all living beings are ultimately interested in their own survival.
our government loves to create more government jobs to make themselves look good and enjoy the tax payer's money. that's why there are so many prisons and you got a department of A-Z which creates so many red tape... just look at the IRS, most agents don't even know half of the laws they enforce.
Many on the right have been saying this, including Ed Rollins. Even though prison wastes more taxpayer money than unemployment, the improvement to the unemployment rate that comes from pulling more people into prison made it popular with Presidents Clinton and Obama, who has increased drug-related arrests. I don't think that people should be used like this, even though I recognize that this is begin used as a ploy by conservatives to drive a wedge between the NORML progressives and the "didn't inhale" liberals.
Getting tired of hearing Fareed complain about how awful the US is. There's a reason why he's living here and not Pakistan, and it's because the US is still a better place to live than practically anywhere else in the world.
I seriously think that the government legalizing marijuana and having the states sell it can increase its revenue. It my state, the local government regulates and sells hard liquor thru its stores, why no marijuana. Government gets revenue, less convicted criminals related to marijuana charges, and destroy the illegal drug trafficking....if and only if the marijuana is good and fairly priced as to what can be trafficked or home grown.
Fareed is not complaining. He is a patriot. He is pointing out a serious problem that has a relatively simple solution in the hopes of making our country a better place to live.
I do not think that marijuana is the issue this article causes me personally. What causes me concern is that we are a free society. It scares me knowing that on our watch we have allowed this great nation of free men to become a police state. We are a police state with the highest incarceration rate in human history.
Anyone who lobbies against freedom is an enemy of the people. We should be ashamed that we have allowed imprisoning free people to become a profiteering industry.
yup, we, followers of islam, would not dream of incarcerating "free men", only the slaves we keep in our caves.
Women are not mentioned because they only exist to be used and abused.
Everyone commenting missed the point.
Legalization of marijuana isn't the issue.
The issue is, we have more incarcerated people than any other nation on earth.
That in itself is tragic. I think Ohio has over 30 prisons now, just to name one state.
You see, in Iran, Syria, Iraq...we do not put people in jails, we chop chop chop their heads.
No criminals–no problems!
This is nothing new. People have talked about this problem for a very long time. More laws = more criminals. Most americans are in fact criminals. Anti piracy laws are ridiculous. They do nothing to help the many but they serve only the needs of the few.
You made the following statement:
" Anti piracy laws are ridiculous. They do nothing to help the many but they serve only the needs of the few".
Can you explain why these laws are ridiculous and how they serve only the needs of the few?
Also,you could explain who is the "few"
Legalization? It should have never been illegal. But the crimes committed while under any substance influence, not aggravated due to having consumed any substance in the first place. Living in the US seems like a pretty risky endeavor to me now. I will try to move to Europe, and provide them with my productive life, since there is a greater danger of living in the US. Anything that can go wrong, will go wrong. And I don't want to be in jail. It is a lot harder to be in jail in Mexico, and still I managed to fall accused of a crime I did not commit.
Au revoir, Auf widersehen, Asta la vista baby!
this is but one facet of National Socialism. by every definition the United States of America is a Fascist State.
Okay we are willing to listen to you.
Why do you believe that America is a facist state?
Right now, the only people that benefit from from current laws against Marijuana are Criminals!, ...and Prisons! Leagalize and tax Marijuana, ...and EVERYBODY wins!
How do criminals benefit from the current laws??????????????
Did you not say that there are too many people in jails?
Your thinking is a little convulated.
Where did Pat Robertson get those statistics? "We here in America make up 5% of the world's population, but we make up 25% of jailed prisoners"?
Oh, I know, because they don't count the dungeons of 3rd world countries as prisons.
Excellent article and a truth that has been far too long ignored. Criminal behavior and faux criminal behavior is big business here in the US. I think it's a pretty scarey Orwellian phenomena occurring in this country when you have rates this high. Now, you think you will ever see a decrease from this 7.1 million inmates? Think again – these prison families – judges – and other parasites (I'm looking at you bottom feeders of human filth called lawyers – will never let that happen – their comfy lifestyles depend too heavily on the outrage. God save us – this government will only seek to bury us.
What the hell is "faux criminal behavior"??????????
Maybe you should ask Trayvon Martin what faux criminal behavior does
Law Enforcement is always looking for low hanging fruit to pump up thier stats. Drug users are among the lowest hanging and easiest to use to say 'we are tough on crime – we a HIGH overall conviction rate'. Yea – arrest and convict 1000 druggies (users not kingpins); 25 murderers, 50 robbers 25 Assults – none of which result in convictions and you still have a conviction rate of over 90%.
The other reality is that most of the 'robbery' type crimes are commited to pay for drug habits – and they would rather prosecute the drug charges than the robbery type charges.
Having the larges prison population in the world is nothing to brag about.
What?????
Bottom line is this. We can no longer afford to incarcerate people for frivolous crimes such as drug use. Fine them and treat them. Unless they have committed a violent crime, jail time is not needed. Jail is to protect society from violent criminals.
For all of you out there saying "lets legalize drugs" step back and look at your statement for a second..Have you ever lived with or known somebody on drugs? I have and they wasted their lives and became junkies, with the fallout falling on their families. They ended up spending most of their money on drugs and forgetting little things like paying bills, buying food, taking care of their kids etc..Well, all of you say its a personal choice that should ultimately be up to the consumer..What about the lives that are affected by that "personal choice?" Who foots the bill when they get sick from their "personal choice?" What happens to the family and friends when their loved one or best friend goes down the tubes despite their best effort to save them? What about the cost to an alreadly struggling health care system? Alcohol and Tobacco is legalized and look how good we have done with that! What is the government going to do? Legalize and regulate drugs, like tobacco and alcohol, and then years or decades later make and pathetic and belated attempts to not do the very thing they promoted in the first place? All those people who want to do drugs and not have it be a crime, what are you going to do when the very thing you asked for destroys your life and you come begging for help? And dont give me that crap that marijuanna is harmless and doing drugs only hurts the person using them...Thats #@$% because i watched people and i have known people whose lives were ruined..
It is not the drugs fault for your friend’s downfall. It is the fault of the system. I smoke pot, have for 20 years, and it does not affect my life. I have known a great deal of people who live perfectly productive life while smoking pot. The real problem lies with hard drugs such as Meth, the new killer of the 21st century, crack, coke, and prescription drugs. The more we focus on Pot the less we have to focus on the killer drugs. Through education is the only way to prevent children from making dumb mistakes that will lead them down a path of disperse. Because we keep lying to our children saying "that all drugs are bad" causes distrust. Once they find out that Pot will not kill them or ruin their life they will be more apt to try other drugs that are highly addictive and destructive. Anything that is abused can become addictive and destructive. Make Pot legal will reduce the use of harmful drugs, especially in the prescription drug market which is now the main reason why it is kept illegal. Pharmcom stands to lose millions when their patience switches from their expensive highly addictive drugs to a cheap alternative like marijuana which has more medical benefits. It has been around since the beginning of time and it’s not going anywhere. Locking up non-violent offenders does more damage to their life than the drug could ever do!
"...the mindless proliferation of laws that created criminal penalties for anything and everything." I've been thinking about this for a while now. Glad you brought it up.
Since you are a deep thinker, could you identify those "frivolous laws"?
These are some of the disturbing truths about America that really pose some dangerous questions about where we're heading as a nation. This is the subject matter worthy of reporting on. This is one of the most important debates we need to be engaging in as a people, especially when it comes to who we're voting into legislature and the burden they're putting on society. I think an overwhelming majority feel as though it's absolute BS that we're entrusted to be adults when we drink, yet face prison if we should so happen to smoke some pot. Anybody who's honest about the matter knows damn well it makes no sense. And anybody who has so much as skimmed the surface about its criminalization knows the only criminals are the lawmakers that that made it such.
The "War on Drugs" is a for-profit enterprise to support banks, the military-industrial complex, and the prison industry.
You are a comedian,right?
Test
I’ve been smoking marijuana since I was 17 and I still smoke it on a fairly regular basis both for its medical benefits and for recreational enjoyment. I’ve never committed a crime or shirked off my responsibilities because I needed to get stoned and other than a few minor moving violations none of which included DWI or DUI, have I ever had any contact with law enforcement. I have always held a job, paid my taxes and if anyone of you ever met me on the street you would think I’m just another average Joe going about his business which I pretty much am. There’s nothing special or remarkable about me, I am simply just another citizen of this great nation trying to earn a living. I am God fearing a good friend and a good neighbor who likes to be involved with his community and who enjoys helping people who are less fortunate again pretty much just your average Joe.
I’m not a tough guy and I seriously doubt that I’m intimidating or strike fear in to the heart of anyone I meet but let me just say this. While I’m not a criminal nor am I looking for conflict it would be well advised that anyone that doesn’t approve of what I’m doing to keep their noses out of my personal business or there will be war!
It’s my business what I decide to put in my body and unless I am interfering with another person’s right to their pursuit of freedom and happiness or acting against the well being of another person you need to keep your judgmental noses out of what I choose for myself and well get along just fine as we have for the past 30 years. I don’t tell you how to live your lives so don’t be trying to impose your misguided and immoral will on me or deprive me of my freedom because you don’t agree with what I choose for myself!
They will have to carry me out in a body bag
before I will voluntary surrender myself
"ентитета" Translated to Serbian to bypass word filter. This is why I had to post my comment that way?
to any person or persons seeking to deprive me of my freedom simply because I choose to exercise my given right to freedom of choice.
“Deprive me”
Mitch, buddy, you sound a little too angry to be a pot head.
Peace man!
I agree wityh you Mitch. Genisis 9:3 Every moving thing that liveth shall be meat for you; even as the green herb have I given you all things.
My life has been threatened too many times.
I am never coming back here.
The islamic agenda wins.
You have been punked.
April Fools!
hehehehe...
Wow, wonderful blog layout! How lengthy have you ever been blogging for? you make blogging glance easy. The total glance of your web site is fantastic, let alone the content material!
A little confused here. I came away from reading this article thinking i) too many people in our prisons, ii) most of those people are there for petty crimes (marijuana) and iii) the cost of keeping them there is far too high.
I went to the Bureau of Justice Statistics and it says that in 2010 there were 1.5 million people in federal and state prisons, of which approximately 18% are drug related.
I was a bit surprised to see these statistics. it is possible I have misunderstood them or am missing the point.
based on the above - even if we eliminated most of the drug related incarcerations, it appears it wouldn't really make much of a dent in the total cost of prisoners.
Or is it possible that most of the ~5.6 million non-prison inmates (7.1 million stated in the article less 1.5 million prison) are drug related?
Can someone help me understand what is the real reason for our high prisoner % and cost? From what I can see, it appears people being sentenced for petty crimes is not the answer.
I am a retired career prosecutor and handled hundreds of cases involving marijuana. You seem to justify legalizing marijuana due to our overcrowded prisons. Well, in my State (California), simple possession of marijuana does not result in incarceration. Even sale or possession-for–sale of marijuana results in very limited incarceration, if any at all. Therefore, I do not believe that marijuana now being illegal is the reason for prison overcrowding. How about finding out how many incarcerated prisoners are in custody on charges pertaining to marijuana?
You would think because of your former position you would know what's happening in your own country, Some places are better than others, NYC has the highest arrest rate for MJ anywhere in the US, they stop people on the street search them illegally then detain them when they turn out their pockets and have MJ, "Oh its in public so your under arrest"
the prision population expolsion is in response to china's two party labor system in that the corps over here aretrying to make a second class of citizen, the felon, a slave to privatized prisions where labor is forced and you do not get paid properly.
Reblogged this on What a Dey, Oh! and commented:
My perfect would include having an impact on the conditions of confinement in our county, including the "condition" of over-population. With private prisons becoming a fast-growing industry, the problems so many incarcerated people are facing are being pushed into a realm of secrecy. Thank you to Mr. Zakaria for reminding me where some of my passions lie.
This is a deep and serious problem in America. In the mid 80's Americas demanded tougher crime laws resulting in the restructuring of the sentencing and the eliminating of prison rehabilitation programs.
The American citizenry excludes EX-CON from thousands of jobs causing them to lose hope and return to crime. The word EX-CON is a carries with it a very negative and untrusting mean in itself. Even if the offense is 10, 20, 30 or even 50 years old, limiting the person’s abilities to work and support them self and/or their family for the remainder of their life even though they have severed their time in prison and paid their debt to society as reinstructed by the judge.
I smoked for a few years as a kid than went 30 years without smoking anything. Than I got MS, Yup they have presciption drugs to manage the pain, I take oxycontin for pain most addictive thing I've taken in my life and that is something at this point in time my doctor said I would have to be admitted to handle the withdrawl if I was ever to stop this drug. They also give me Baclofen for muscle spasams that get so bad my legs quite working yet when I go into some kind of remission where this don't happen I just can't stop taking it without serious side effects and this is just a muscle relaxer on steroids. I thought when other people suffering from MS told me how much better smoking would control the pain and spasams they were crazy but I gave it a try and it works better than any of the meds I mentioned and the others I also take. The great thing is I can just stop without a single side effect, no withdrawl and no craveing for more. I'm lucky enough to live in a state that it is legal went got my card which the state gladly took, but low and behold our state has those prosecuters that think they need to make a name for themselves and twist every little word they can to make it illegal as they can. If your in a public office taking tax payer monies as your pay who by the way voted the medical use in than quit or do as the people did and get it put on the ballot and let the people once again vote. I do realize that even with the law there are people who abuse and try to profit off mostly the people who are truely sick, but you never see where they go after these people usually you see someone who has a couple to many plants. It should be taxed and regulated like the businees that it has become. I guess when the new drug Sativex becomes legal here that is made from actual Cannibis Plant that it will be ok for people to take just because a big Pharma company came up with it. That one drug, Sativex, will prevent the legalization at the federal level just because of the money Pharma gives big goverment. I guess it is better to give money to a private company than to help our own country out first.
Our incarceration rate is higher because of the demographics in the U.S. The average reading level of inmates is approximately 3rd-5th grade level so even if fewer are arrested for drugs, they aren't going to use their time to attend college to become petroleum engineers. While many would argue the benefits of legalization, the detrimental impact on the lives of the majority of users and their children is undeniable. However, I would support legal use for ANY adult who does not have children (and/or undergoes voluntary sterilization) as long as they are also banned from being able to EVER use any taxpayer funded aid (including Medicaid). Unfortunately though, most clamoring for legalization are not the financially secure masses. American public schools are already seeing an enormous drop in IQ scores. increased behavioral/emotional/psychological problems including learning disabilities due to herediatary and environmental factors including parental smoking, drug use and exposure to domestic violence which means we will have fewer intelligent/skilled workers and greater numbers depending on handouts from taxpayers. Legalization should ONLY be considered if steps are in place to protect children and taxpayers from bearing the burden for their use/abuse of drugs and any related outcome.
We have more people in prison because in other countries, if you have money, you simply bribe the cops or the judge, and you do not go to jail.
And, you know this how? Experience? Link? Somebody told you? You dreamed it up? What?
I agree with PorkNBeans!! Everyone is missing the point! We have too many people in our California prisons because the prisons are like country clubs! I thought when you broke the law you lost your rights as a citizen – California needs to bring back the chain gangs to work for the state!! Get the prison population doing something to earn their pay – no sitting around with color tvs, etc. Their work would be their "physical fitness" for the day. Maybe people would think twice about breaking the law if they had to WORK for their publically funded stay and it wasn't 'pleasant' to be in prison!!! Maybe we could get the bullet train built with prison labor!
Or, what? Torture? Thumb screws? Waterboarding? Solitary confinement?
What is wrong with you?
Hi there, I discovered your web site by means of Google while searching for a similar matter, your web site came up, it seems to be great. I have bookmarked to my favourites|added to bookmarks.
Great site. Lots of helpful info here. I'm sending it to a few pals ans also sharing in delicious. And naturally, thank you on your effort!
Well done Fareed – spot on. I would like to add also that the high number of readily available lethal weapons (guns) in America compared with other developed nations is likely also a reason for the high crime rate and imprisonment in the USA. Just as with prisons, guns are promoted by a powerful lobby in Congress: all very sad.
Thank you Mr. Zakaria for this type of reports it is clear that war on drugs is a lost battle and a waist of tax dollars.
Having people encarcerarated should NOT be big bussines for a couple of influential private companies, while the tax payers are left with the bill of $50,000 per year per innmate.
It's actually a great and helpful piece of info. I am satisfied that you just shared this helpful information with us. Please keep us informed like this. Thank you for sharing.
Great blog lots of information Looks like alot of time has Been taken here
Incarceration is a money maker for private prisons. Judges are colluded with private prisons to send "clients" as many as possible to these places.
So pat, answer me this: If the war on sin appears to be a failure, should we all switch sides? Isn't that pretty much your logic on drugs??
Your logic regarding drugs, is using a really old story to base your decisions on.. we all saw how that worked out during the Temperance movement.
RE: "Well then, if you have had enough, go back to Syria, Libia, Iran, Lebanon..."
Ah yes... the old 'things could be worse' defense. So if the patient is sick, we shouldn't try to cure them... just tell them to quit whining... at least they don't have something worse? Sheeesh!
LAND OF THE FREE.....(and the home of the jailed)!
Notice the numbers in the poll, here – over 80% of those polled want marijuana legalized. But, watch what our government does about it – nothing. Because, our elected officials care nothing about freedom or civil rights. They care only about stuffing their pockets with our money as fast as they possibly can, and they will change the rules if they must to do it.
Look for there to be NO change in the trend, here. They don't even care if we notice what they're doing any more.
I It makes too much sense, so it'll never happen in the United States, the new police state. Achtung!
Wow, this is a day that should go down in history. Pat Robertson finally said something that makes sense. We need to make this a public holiday, build statues, put him beside Lincoln. This is just so amazing.
Oh, give me a break! He's just profiting off of a popular band wagon. It doesn't take more than a double digit IQ to see the truth of the matter, here.
You know, I wouldn't be surprised if the drug cartels are secretly investing in private prisons so they can make money off both ends. They get to raise the prices of their products because the risk of prison is greater, and they get to profit off the revenues from the prison system, too. And, all it cost them was a few politicians.
Oh, and of course, the icing on the cake is that, if you own the prison system, you don't ever have to worry about being incarcerated by it.
In other countries a law is a law...So if you get caught stealing and stealing is a 10 year offense, then you serve 10 years....Here in the United States you get arrested, you get bailed out, you have judges who will not enforce the law so you can get arrested for meth many times and never go to prison, or get caught stealing and get probation...So don't tell me crime doesn't pay in the United States...Plus in our prisons you still have rights to tie up the courts with all kinds of filings...In other countries you lose your rights while in prison....Just like, you give money to people who won't work, and you think this is helping them when they refuse to help themselves...If your not going to enforce the laws we have and the regular crime breakers no this, then what should they be afraid of...Sell dope, make 5,000 dollars...get caught go to court, get a suspension or pay a $1,000 fine....I think I would sell dope under those rules...
So, smart guy, what is your explanation for why there are so many more US citizens incarcerated than anywhere else in the world? And, more importantly, what do you suggest to change that?
I find it intolerable that the US has become a nation of quitters. If something isn't working right – quit, especially if it requires effort to fix. The so-called "war on drugs" isn't working, so just stop it and quit. It has become the easy way out.
Perhaps the answer is to change the nature of the war, not stop it.
The War on Drugs was ILL-CONCEIVED from the start. Don't you get it? It's STUPID to continue doing something that you have identified as a MISTAKE.
What is wrong with you that you don't understand this as clearly as I do?
Apparently you haven't had your toke this morning.
It's not a war on drugs., it is a war on Marijuana.
Only one or two percent of drugs used are hard drugs like cocaine and herion.
The majority of drug use is marijuana.
like ninty to eighty percent of drug use is marijuana.
that is what the government fears most.,Marijuana.
Marijuana allows the user to think outside of the box the government put you in.
Have a nice life living in that box of Tyrany and Communism.
It's not a war on drugs.,
It is a war on Marijuana.
Only one or two percent of drugs used are hard drugs like cocaine and herion.
The majority of drug use is marijuana.
like ninety to eighty percent of all drug use is marijuana.
that is what the government fears most.,Marijuana.
Marijuana allows the user to think outside of the tiny box the government put you in.
Have a nice life living in that box of Tyrany and Communism.
My life would be so much easier knowing my kids were picking up their pot from a doctor than those damn kids they hang around.
Lobbying and the effect of lobbyists on government policy is the #1 domestic problem in this country. Big business lobbyists are destroying the economy and have a huge effect on the everyday lives of the people (i.e. voters). Government does what is best for big business and not the voters or taxpayers. Politicians quest for election campaign contributions is destroying the country. When you read that the largest companies (Exxon, Walmart, Apple) are more powerful and command more wealth than may countries this sets a dangerous precedence.
When I was a kid, the only reason I smoked pot was because I couldn't decide if I wanted to be anorexic or a Brain Surgeon...And the pot made me so hungry that it ruled out the anorexic dream, and the pot dulled my senses enough that Brain Surgery was out of the question....So I decided to be a politician...
The author mentions the incarceration rate of the 80's. Now also take a look at the crime rates during the 80's and 90's, comparted to now, and have another conversation about taking violent offenders off the street. Crime, particularly violent crime, has dropped to a third of its height, primarily because we have locked up the offenders.
Are some of the laws regarding non-violent crimes, particularly drug usage excessive? Yes, particularly if you look at the fact that many minorities will get a considerably harsher sentence for the same crimes.
One must, however, take serious thought about why we started to make the laws tougher in the first place.
We made the laws tougher in the first place because of the wrong-headed idea that stiffer penalties would equate to a lower crime rate – but, it doesn't.
Most violent crimes are crimes of passion or desperation – and, neither of those conditions lend themselves well to considering consequences. We are dealing with human nature here, not logic.
Yet, as I stated above, the facts suggest otherwise. What do you believe caused this drop? Try responding to my points.
"Crime, particularly violent crime, has dropped to a third of its height, primarily because we have locked up the offenders."
Oh, really? All the offenders were caught in the 80's? Even the ones that were not born, yet? Your argument falls flat on that point, alone. Did you care to try, again?
Want to know what Christians think about it all? Discuss Pat Robertson's comments about pot law reform on the world's largest Bible study website, Bible.org
http:// forum.bible.org/viewtopic.php?f=66&t=17240
the drug war is what has filled our prisons with non violent, victimless offenders.
A reschedule of pot would free up 12.5% of our federal prison beds and an average of 12.5% of the state's prison beds. It would also end the 800,000+ arrests made each year at the local level.
And, how many law enforcement jobs do you suppose that would eliminate? And, how much would be cut from their budgets? That's why it won't happen. They care more about their jobs and their budgets than what is fair and reasonable.
WE TREAT PRISONERS TO GOOD-UNEMPLOYMENT-SCHOOLING-MEDICAL CARE-3 MEALS PER DAY-GRANTS FOR COLLEGE-HELL I COULDN'T AFFORD SOME OF THAT STUFF OF MY KIDS. I THINK THEY SHOULD BE PUT TO WORK THERE IS CERTAINLY PLENTY OF STUFF TO DO. CUT BACK ON CABLE TV'S AND GAMES MAKE PRISON A NOT SO NICE PLACE. ILLEGAL ALIENS SENT BACK TO WERE THEY CAME FROM AND NOT PUT IN OUR JAILS YOU COULD REDUCE THE PRISON POPULATION BY 30%.
It would be nice if you learned how to stop shouting on the internet in all caps.
I don't want to like you Robertson but damn it, this makes it difficult.
I still don't like him or trust him. Look at the poll. He knew the numbers, too. He's just jumping on an identified popular bandwagon for a little attention. And, apparently, he is getting it.
if you smoke pot do you really need kids? its a drug
No, it's a flower.
Even GOD only gave 10 commandments. Well when the politicians die I am sure they will finally find out what pain is about. Why do you think we are in Afghanistan? The poppy over there have never seen growth over a 100 fold since we arrived there. Something has to fund our corrupt govt. and CIA. People is prison for smoking a joint. It just shows you our politicians are brainless and just have their pockets open for corrution from lobbyists. We need a new govt. period
Even GOD only gave 10 commandments. Well when the politicians die I am sure they will finally find out what pain is about. Why do you think we are in Afghanistan? The poppy over there have never seen growth over a 100 fold since we arrived there. Something has to fund our corrupt govt. and CIA. People is prison for smoking a joint. It just shows you our politicians are brainless and just have their pockets open for corrution from lobbyists.
No, they are not brainless. They are diabolically brilliant in the execution of their devious plans.
they really need to make it legal most people who write here need to smoke something and chill out.
gonna kill each other with all this hate..
This is an important issue and I feel passionately about it – but, not violent about it.
I will comment on juvenile perspective. The laws are insensitive to the preventive side of crimes. Our lawmakers are out of touch with reality. Our law implementers i.e. police are trained to deal with swat like operations and handcuffing and putting the people behind bars rather than preventing what could lead to crimes. Judiciary is too slow and bureaucratic. Schools, police, towns, judiciary are not communicating with each other. The private sector has hands tied by regualtions. Therefore jail all. For lack of a better analogy, 9/11 is an example of what is wrong with USA. Let the problem happen and respond with utter force....guantanamo..i.e. kill flies with a stealth bomber.
My question is how would the health insurance industry handle legalization of marijuana ? Furthermore, if they could prove someone is using marijuana, would it give the industry reason to disqualify people from receiving benefits.Not sure so does anyone have a thought on this ?
@Tom H: Not automatically. The insurance companies can do whatever they want unless we pass a specific law against it. As an example, if a person quits cigarettes and goes to an electronic cig, insurance companies still count them as smoking even though the only ingredient the two share is nicotine which is not the primary cause of the long term health effects from smoking. So insurance companies could choose to not cover anyone that smoked weed. Doubt it would be a good business decision though.
I have it on good authority that the government is working on a plan not only to make some drugs legal, but make them manditory. This has the desirable effect of ending all this spiritedness and making the populace much easier to control.
Life is good
Nice to hear... There are definitely some people on these forums that should smoke some and just chill.
As one who has been there and decided I'd rather pay taxes.
We need to be MUCH tougher on real crime and become libertarians on all other crimes. I could care less if you take drugs, as long as it does not affect me and mine. On the other hand if you are a pedophile, rapist, murderer, etc., you get sever treatment. And (again I speak from experience) you get the minimum required. Cots, beans an rice, etc. YOU put yourself in this predicament (prison). If you wanted a "special meal" or yard privileges you should have remained a free person (not committed the crime). Additionally, for other crimes (larceny, etc), when your time is up it should be up. Your record should be squashed and you should get all your privileges back. If you are not ready for that than you should be kept in prison.
Send all drug dealers to Russia they know how…
We should not pick on people just because they commit crimes.
Another factor that adds to our prison population is that the drug war through Federal funding expanded police forces throughout the US. Even the smallest town is equipped with swat type vehicles and armament. To keep this money flowing to the police forces they had to show results and that is why the so many states want to stay firm on zero tolerance.
The only wrong note here is Robertson's claim that high incarcerations are a "liberal" problem. That's just rewriting history. Zero-tolerance laws are consistently a product of the right, not the left (which leans toward social solutions, retraining and education rather than knee-jerk incarceration).
California has figured out a way to legalize the use of marijuana but still keep it's prisons full. Instead of just making marijuana legal, they have this hoky medical marijuana. Thus some use it and others get arrested for it.
More propanda...Does anyone really believe that there is a huge amount of people in prison for having some weed. In most places you get a fine...Give me a break. Even if its legal the prison population will not change.
after reading some of these comments, i think we need more looney bins in this country. oh, and i'm for legalization of pot. and i'm not 20.
Social issues beginning with a non nuclear family.
In Canada possession is not an offence.
When you put someone in prison for possession he stop to be productive for the country and when they get out of jail, i'm not sure they can find a job easily.
Prisons are also expensive.
Pot would be taxed if legal and criminality around would stop.
Why do it easy when it could be complicated
The war on drugs is too good a racket for the CIA, FBI and the DEA. You will never stop it, just like the Industrial Military Complex. Killing our own for fun and profit is just the way America rolls.
Because Black Americans do not want to work and get in trouble.
First. I'm not sure quoting Pat Robinson is really a quality metric. The guy has said some pretty crazy things in the past.
Second. I would agree that we have "too many laws" we do. It's insane. You never see lawmakers "removing laws" they just make more without a good evaluation of the old..
Third. You are probably partially right, on Drug laws. but what is the answer? There is a direct correlation to Drugs and other related crimes. It's something that needs to be strongly discouraged.. what are you going to do ? fine them? wont that just encourage more violent crimes like robbery etc? Give me a proven solution that works and I'll think it over.. but until then, current status quo must prevail
Did you ever consider the fact that drugs and crime are correlated is that they are both outside the realm of regulation (i.e. the black market), not that drugs make people criminals. When alcohol was prohibited, alcohol and crime could very well be considered to be correlated, due to the fact that criminals now ran the show. Once prohibition is lifted, it's legal and therefore not profitable for criminals.
This should be a no brainer. The war on drugs and the cost has been astronomical. If you legalize marijuana and tax it there would be a huge infusion of revenue to gov't, you would open up prisons and there would be tremendous cost savings. The cartels in mexico would be essentially put out of business, like the gangs during prohibition in the 30's. Pat robertson is right and this should be an issue for the right wing to bring up. Increased revenue, cost savings. The cost would probably go down cause the big tobacco companies would market it like ciggarettes. j
Our prison system is overly full because the U.S is a capitalist society and prisons are big business. In order to "feed the beast" we must imprison hundreds of thousands of individuals every year to keep it going. If punishment is achieved in the process of making a profit then it's considered a win, win situation. Otherwise, it's just business as usual.
does anyone even fear imprisonment in america? if i were an asthetic monk it would be a perfect place to meditate. three squares aday, solitary confinement to contemplate the universe, brief stints among a violent population to further my disregard for worldy poss.
Prisons should be reserved primarily for those who would represent a danger if out in the wider world. Punishment and rehab should be secondary goals (in most cases there are other ways to accomplish these rather than just llock em up). And the deterrent effect of incarceration for some of these crimes is overkill.
Zakaria and Robertson are exactly right here and this is a scandal of misplaced government priorities almost unknown to most Americans.
Better question would be, "Why isn't Eric Holder in the prison system?"
capitolism+impoverished nation=incarcerated nation
Actually American impoverished look like kings compared to the poor around the world, yet countless societies have almost no crime. Though lack of money can lead to crime, cultural behaviors usually have precedence. People try to always use poverty as an excuse for criminal behavior, but other cultures and their crime rates suggest otherwise.
Parents have failed to teach their children basic values concerning "right and wrong". The school system doesn't teach the children anything. Adults have failed to act like adults.
One has to ask then to your point, So? Not even sure how this relates to the story. Marijuana needs to be legalized and this ridiculous war of stupidity ended. The major reason marijuana was made illegal is because Mexicans used ot and to get the Mexicans out of the country it was made a dangerous drug. So when people make logical decisions why is this about parents? It is about people and understanding how stupidity in our politics has to change. It is more about how we need to stop all the stupid laws passed because of bigotry, such as the drug laws and even more recent the picture IDs laws. It is time we take a long look at anything put forward by the republican party who are the base party of most of the bigots and racists in this country. And it is time to make marijuana lega and stop the stupidity.
In my experience it is always the people that really do not have a clue what they are talking about that are so against Marijuana. Marijuana is less harmful than alcohol. Parents should actually step up and parent their kids instead of letting their computer, TV and video games do the job. You almost never see the kid that always had a good parent around and was involved in sports and healthy activities get invloved with Marijuana or any other bad lifestyle choice.
Since marijuana is less harmful than alcohol with which I agree why do you consider this such a harmful choice and one parebts should teach their children to keep away from? So many of those close parents show them it is ok to use alcohol and to me that is even more harmful. Again this has NOTHING to do about parenting but about ending the hateful racism and bigotry in this country.
If you break the law you should be in jail, if you murder or kill someone you should meet them 90 days after the trial, that will give the murderer 89 days to get their effects in order so that they can receive the needle. I'm sure that it will cut down on the population of prisons.
It wouldn't. Murderers are only a small fraction of the prison population. Also, if your really suggesting anyone that breaks a law should go to jail....well...that's crazy.
I'm not sure I understand the problem.
If you don't want to go to jail, don't do the crime.
If you don't agree with the law, then lobby the government to change it.
What else is there to discuss? Seems pretty clear to me.
A minority with more money influences the governments to go against their wishes. Due to years of propaganda, legalization is not an issue most people will base their vote on, but many will refuse to vote for anyone for legalization. Basically, the same major problems with a democratic system that we always run into.
Kind of telling isn't it? People won't vote for a politician who wants to legalize marijuana. Why?
Wow, what Pollyanna world do you live in??
As we are aware that God do created the earth, everything that grow were evolved as according to His eyes. Everything we see that grow like trees, grass, herbs, weeds, tulips, roses, brushes, crab grasses,dandelions, etc ....even cannabis. Therefore, I do believe that God put cannabis for medical purposes. We should not turn our eyes away from these facts.
Prison keeps the unemployment rate lower.
The American Way...Lock up non-threatening citizens for using drugs & create parentless children, spread poisonous pesticides over OTHER countries (not even our own for Christs' sakes) to erradicate plants that produce drugs, and waste countless dollars on imprisoning people & creating law enforcement to act as big brother and not truly protect the REAL criminal . & after it's all said and done, we sit there scratching our heads wondering why we are going broke??!! If an alien could study our society, by far the American one is the worst. We have made so many advances and we are capable of much more!
Genesis 9:3 Every moving thing that liveth shall be meat for you; even as the green herb have I given you all things.
... except for all the fatally poisonous plants in the world.
The reason is simple- Prison owners have found a way to make money guaranteed. ! Open prisons and staff them. 2. Use you money and influence to pass state and federal laws making common practices a crime. 3. Collect he money from the Tax-payers (Suckers)
This is why special interest groups should not be permitted. Why should a prison owner have a say in what is legal and what is not? How do these laws protect the public? They DON'T!
Why is no politician willing to stand up and point out the truth, that the War on Drugs is a failure for everyone except the prison owners and their employees? Legalizing marijuana and releasing these people from prison would save $ billions of tax-payer dollars, and create a number of new job-creating industries. IT is SO OBVIOUSLY WRONG and unconscionable in a free society. CNN might be able to help by running a story on who OWNS the PRISONS and how much they spend on lobbying.
Here's a thought...instead of jail time how about a big fine for pot? It won't make the prison owners happy, but it would help the taxpayers.
Pat Robertson has no idea what he is talking about. Marijuana was de-criminalized in most states 40 to 50 years ago. Possession of marijuana most places results in nothing more than a ticket which in most cases result in lower penalties than speeding tickets. Nobody goes to prison for possession a single joint. Furthermore, people possessing large amounts of drugs, and/or selling them, don't go to prison unless they've been arrested many times before. Read the papers, or better yet, visit your local courts and observe a few cases. You'll see that most criminals get probation or a slap on the wrist. Even violent criminals get their cases plead down and don't do jail time. You have to have a lengthy history of arrests before any judge will sentence you to jail time.
If marijuana was decriminalized in most states 50 years ago, then why do I not see people lighting up on the streets? Why am I still using code on the down-low. That's right, because simple possession IS a crime in MOST states.
First, Pat Robertson saying Liberals are to blame? Really? I thought it was the Republicans that had the tough on crime philosophy?
Second, FZ, how about the rates are higher in the US because they do a better job at identifying, locating, and apprehending criminals? Other places in the world have serious low corruption problems, people buy their way out of being arrested often.
unlike the USA where money has never protected anyone from legal trouble!
because we have a lot of victimless crimes made up by puritans. USA is still very much a theocracy.
Its not marijuana, but rather it's corporal punishment, stupid! When that was removed from families, schools and prisons, the United States quickly surpassed the Gulag Archipelago rate of detentions! In the Stalin's Gulag, you were greeted with corporal punishment upon entrance, and upon leaving. No one wanted to go back. In America, people live in prisons as if in hotels. They often commit a crime on purpose, to get incarcerated! Give them consequences, let's say twenty lashes at the moment of booking. They will think twice before going back! As for marijuana, it is irrelevant. No one should be in prison for that! You catch someone with a joint, you give them 5 lashes and release them. Second time, you give them ten, and so on. If they are caught six times, they get 60 lashes and are released. Finally, they will realize that the use of marijuana doesn't pay! The same with bullies in schools, with shoplifters, and other truants and thugs!
Two facts worthy of note;
1. With about 4.5% of the world's population the US has about 25% of the world's "inmates".
2. The ONLY nation in recent history to imprison a greater percentage of its' own citizens than the US now does was the USSR under Joseph Stalin in his gulags.
There is little "justice" in America and we should as a nation be ashamed of our senseless, so very costly practice of simply "throwing people in prison".
Meanwhile, we are bankrupting out states and creating a vast underclass of prisoners who will never be equipped for productive lives.
So, Zakaria....this being said by you. What is the solution, free them or kill them?
Did you miss the point of the article? If marijuana is legal, then marijuana users won't be in jail.
I did 1.75 years in 1997-98 for 4 grams of marijuanna in AZ. Obviously I had previous convictions (2) for possession (no violent crimes, no crimes with a "victim")... but still... I went in for sentencing on my lunch break from work and I couldn't believe that judge gave me the ag-max. Today I don't smoke, but I have to be honest – 14 years later the simple possession convictions shut many doors in my life. Kind of overkill, if you ask me.
Judge must have been suffering from erectile dysfunctional , see back in the days we had no treatment, nowadays judges are more happy and might even smoke a joint with you
Who the hell is Pat Robertson that we should listen to him to begin with? He's no more knowledgeable than we are on this subject.
Why isn't Portugal even mentioned, they have decriminalized almost every drug including marijuana with great success. The money that was going to incarceration is now going to drug treatment programs and etc. The drug use in Portugal has significantly gone down instead of going up.
On the other hand, it definately is a stimulus that procreates survival of the fittest. The stupid shall smoke and the high shall die.... or rot in mental oblivion. Have you ever been to Portugal?
Your not making sense
We have a large prison population because how nice prisoners are treated. Try getting caught in turkey with drugs and see what happens. We also made liquor legal in this country for people said we are loosing the war. Now this country is in a drunken stuper.
You have a short memory and/or are unable to think your opinions through to conclusion. Go look up prohibition and the upsurge of gangsters and mobsters. Going after people who drink irresponsibly is better/easier/cheaper than going after people who drink irresponsibly (because they will, whether it's legal or not) AND a whole new breed of gangsters.
you must be high, because what you just wrote doesn't make any sense. You just said "Going after people who drink irresponsibly is better/easier/cheaper than going after people who drink irresponsibly". Say what? lol
Man kind (specifically americans) drank before, during, and after prohibition. TO think laws will stop people from using mind altering substances is a fantasy.
Things we wish we didn't need should not be money making enterprises. Of course prisons are full as their owners use the legalized open bribery of our political system to ensure it is so. End the drug war and stop thinking that locking inner city thugs in cages with psychos is a deterrent. People from bad neighborhood grow up with psychos so it doesn't scare them. It DOES scare rich white collar criminals; but they end up in country club Martha Stewart jails. The whole criminal justice system needs to be rebuilt from the ground up..
Didnt we just have a great singer that overdose on drugs that is proof against drugs.
We are talking cannabis here not coca. BTW 1,000s die from alcohol and thats legal.
Ever since the Repubs decided to "privatize" the prison system, the for-profit wardens have lobbied to criminalize just about everything. If you wake up with bad hair one day, then you should go to jail as far as they're concerned. It's how they make money.
Those who oppose the decriminalization of marijuana claim that it is a "gateway" drug. The ONLY reason that their assertion is an accurate one is because marijuana is illegal. Therefore, to get marijuana, a person needs to go to a "dealer," who, not infrequently, deals in hard drugs to which they want to expose their marijuana customers. Decriminalizing, if not legalizing, marijuana would make it available through legal channels that don't offer hard drugs.
Legalize marijuana, then regulate and tax it like alcohol and tobacco. Gives the prison problem some relief and provides a huge source of revenue for the government. And has the benefit of making lots of people happy.
As of this date of my posting the poll has 40k people and 82% believe it should be decriminalized... 8% say it should be criminal... 7% aren't sure.
So 82 vs 15%..
It's time to make the change...
Although managing prisons may be big business, those people rotting in jail for stupid things could be earning their own keep in this world and being even MORE productive, OFF the taxpayer's dime.
When the religious Right agrees with a liberal idea, its time to move on it
amerika! land of the uptight , home of the neurotic
"Why is this happening? Prisons are a big business. Most are privately run. They have powerful lobbyists and they have bought most state politicians."
Yet, Lame Stream Media is confused to what OWS is all about.
On the one hand, I'm happy to see how many commentators on this board have an understanding of what you just said. On the other hand, it makes me so mad to see that marijuana is STILL a crime, even when the vast majority of people are clearly saying that it shouldn't be.
How many people promise to not go to work stoned if we legalize pot? Surgeons? Judges? Police officers with guns? Security guards with guns? Truck drivers pushing the "big rigs"? Nurses administering meds ? Druggists filling your prescriptions? Ferry operators? Airline pilots? Civilian pilots? I guess it just doesn't matter since marijuana has absolutely no effect on the society where it is legalized right? Oh..... so you say that once pot is legal, no one is going to do those things while high? .... Then... why do we have DUI/DWI laws? Do you think THC is going to make it all better? With the legalization of pot, you are akin to cutting off your nose to spite your face.
Prison. The article was about failed war on drugs and prison.
so many ppl do these things already and do you see headlines of ppl that were high on pot that commited crimes and what not no, not saying it couldnt happen but i think there is greater good in taxing it then throwing people in jail over it. our country is in so much debt and we are throwing money away over such petty crimes. war on harder drugs yes war on pot no.
A) this already happens. B) this already happens with alcohol C) that is why there are drug tests if someone appears intoxicated.
It's amazing how many true Republicans actually exist to comment how marijuana should be legal in order to create a business!
Hard work good and
Hard work fine
But first take care of head.
Prisons feed the nation's economy, government aid, and job creation
The cops in your area are pawns in this game.
More made up laws = more made up crimes = more made up criminals = more prisons = more made up jobs = more money!
Lesson complete.....
BD
I agree with the decriminalization of Marijuana. In fact I would go one further. I think it should be Federally regulated, taxed, and sold to any person over the age of 21 (just like liquor). You could sell packs of Doobie 100s for $25, with 95% of that going toward the national deficit. We would be out of debt in a week. Just like alcohol – you cant show up to work drunk or drink on the job or drink and drive... pot would need to be treated the same way. You might say, "But if you decriminalize it, no one will buy it – they will just grow it" – and I agree that some would, but TBH most Americans are all about convenience. Legalize it, Sell it, Tax the hell out of it. – That's just my personal opinion.
Why are our prisons full?
Too many bad parents.
Too many teen parents.
Too many who don't know their right hand from their left.
Too few good role mokes.
Too many bad role models.
Too much expectaion of privilege and too little sense of responsibility.
That's a true statement in any society Barry but the issue is far more insidious as there are corporations who are profiting off of the head count of people in prison. It's a lock and load mentality that leads to bunk prosecution, extended sentences for laws that should not be on the books in the first place...
It would be better to free up our prisons from people being held for selling weed and refill them with white collar criminals who do the same crime over and over again.
A.papa
The United States has never had a war against drugs. They have declared a war against it's citizens. The sheer number of our friends and family behind bars proves this fact.
Sorry A.papa but I have no friends or family members behind bars. Could be that you just hang out with the wrong crowd???
He said "our" friends and family members. He was speaking as a group. There are too many in the United States.
If the govt wants to keep it illegal, then only go after the delears and growers – not the consumers. That would have a profound impact on the Prison system. Make all existing incarcerated 'users" Misdemeanor charges and let them go.
If the govt makes it legal – regulate it, tax it and make revenue off it like alcohol. And put all revenues towards education.
Let's be smart here. Legalize marijuana, tax it, and save space in our prisons for more serious crimes and violent offenders.
Please legalize marijuana. I would like to occasionally smoke a fattie and wistfully remember what it was like to smoke a some hand me down stems and seeds 32 years ago back when I was in 8th grade.
One of the greatest lies is that liberals are about freedom. Quite the opposite. Liberals, and Obama want to control everything you do – they try to hide that by presenting that they are giving you a choice – but their choices are between what they want you to do, and what they dont mind if you do. The Liberal agenda gives the people that rely on it enough to survive, but never enough to escape – while Obama and his crew tighten the reins of control and bondage. Look at the bill they just passed essentially making it illegal to protest (legally) at State Sanctioned events – Obama has stripped your freedoms faster than any president in history – he isnt about change, hope, or making it better for anybody – he is all about making it worse and more restrictive for everybody.
To say that about a single politcal party is just stoopid. Each party is slowly taking away our liberty in their own way.
Off topic.
so arent cigs more harmful than pot?...
Until the profit, career and retirement as well as the courts are removed nothing will change. DEA is a money maker pure and simple. Same with Law Enforcement, there are over 80 separate and independent federal sworn and armed agencies in DC. That includes the EPA who have dedicated swat teams of their own, guess they need them to combat those militant non recyclers. It is just another case of government out of control and empire building.
Once it's legal, big businesses will mass produce like they do with cigarettes. While they are at it, might as well legalize Khat. And then our taxi rides will be as exciting as they are in Djibouti and Ethiopia.
i have been moderated multiple times already on this topic so hopes this works... our rights as citezens in this country are slowly being eroded to justify our penal codes. imprisonment is not the answer for anyone but the most heinous crimes. petty crimes such as drugs/theft should not be long term prison times but forced labor on our infrastructure. cannabis crimes are not even a petty crime unless it hurts someone else just like alcahol. pharm. companies do more harm by pressing LEGAL drugs into the hands of stupid people than drug dealers who just deal in pot.
As of 2009, the percentage of total prisoners that were in private prisons was around 8% according to thinkprogress.org. (http://thinkprogress.org/justice/2011/09/26/328486/us-private-prison-population-lobbying/?mobile=nc)
I'd love to know how Mr. Zakaria got from 8% in 2009 to "most" in early 2012. Not that I disagree with most points of this article, but why are journalists so bad these days? Why do they not even try to source their figures and instead rely on making statistics up off the top of their heads that support their article the best.
He's not even honest with the incarceration rates of other nations. Comparing our "under correctional supervision" to what are actually in prisons elsewhere? There are 2 – 3 million in prisons in the US (yes, I think that is too many). Does that even come close to the tens of millions that China, North Korea, etc forcefully relocate and put into "work camps"? Does those not count because they are labeled differently by the nation that hosts them? Did Mr. Zakaria actually accomplish keeping a straight face when comparing the US to Stalinist Russia?
How about that college kids vs. prisoners spending. So a kid that goes to school, does not have to live on their dime 100%, be guarded 24 hours a day, etc, should compare to what it costs to watch an often violent criminal 24×7 365 days a year? Forget the fact that college isn't even close to 365 days a year for any student, even if they go to every single semester available in their state.
Mr. Zakaria...you are no journalist. You are the entire problem with the media, and the fact that most of these mindless posts are blindly agreeing with you because they'd love to smoke marijuana without the threat of prison (which I'd like them to do also, just not at the cost of their integrity), shows a major problem with this country: the supposed "media" is much more dangerous than just about anything they report on.
Thanks for those stats and thoughtful analysis!
Having said that, Mr. Zakaria has a huge a single point PRO-ISLAMIC/anti-Semite agenda and in that pursuit he will show any country (incl. his current homeland the US, and his former homeland India) in a poor light.
Also through such articles he tries to broaden his appeal to all Americans in general and liberals in particular to showcase his credentials as someone who cares deeply about this country, which he clearly does not.
I have commented extensively on Mr.Zakaria on many of his articles and you may check them if you wish.
In Arizona, the prisons are private.
The article was useless. It addresses weed but discusses prison populations in general. The author must have been high while he was writing it. It would have been more informative to find out how many prisoners were in prison for selling weed – and how much they had in their possession.
God bless the man that wrote this article. This is a police state. All cops are now are booking agents selling prison for the big money people behind it. Thing is they're not helping society anymore (police) they are not your friends. What friend tells you that what ever words come out of your mouth they Will use them against you. No matter how they have to manipulate what society hears or how ever they have to do it. They will use their education and experience to hurt you. Lie detectors are not able to be used in court because they are unreliable yet the police and prosecutor willl make sure that a cop will be on the witness stand to tell the jury when a person declines to use it.
More people in jail here than in the Soviet Union at the height of Stalin. Wow. Hey I don't want to be in a country like this. If there is a way anyone knows of tell me how I can denounce american citizenship and become a european citizen and live there and not here. I would do it in a heart beat. I am not and I repeat I am not proud of the police state this nation has become. Wow maybe the federal thought police r gonna get me and put me in a prison so someone can stick something up my kiester against my will or put a piece of metal in my torso 40 or fifty times just so I can be shown how much power they have.
So his take away is that there is a high rate because of privately run prisons? That is true because they save money. When dd a privately run prison force someone to commit a crime or write the laws that put them in prison. Ridiculous.
because the people that own the prison pay off the people that make the laws! Petty crimes that shouldnt put someone in prison do so that they can make more money are you slow or something? doing time for some pot is ridiculous when that 50k a year could go to better things.
Our total spend on prisons has not gone down since we privatized them; it has gone up. Way up.
Prisons are full because the bleeding hearts have killed America, not the killers. Death row inmates need to be ushered in and taken care of. If America put inmates to death instead of hooking them up with their little killer friends we could stop the violence a lot sooner. If you think you will die for your crime, you are less likely to do it.
It's amazing but the vast majority ignore the seriousness of the use of intoxicants. These substances, be they pot or alcohol, or whatever, affect the way the brain functions, they affect our thoughts. Yes, pot is a gateway drug, the gateway to hell. Think about it. There are a lot of murders in the world so should we decriminalize murder?
greg you sir are an idiot.
shut up.
Marijuana allows the user to think outside of the box the government put you in.
have a nice life living in that box of tyrany and Communism.
You can definitely see your enthusiasm in the paintings you write. The arena hopes for even more passionate writers like you who aren't afraid to mention how they believe. All the time follow your heart.
So how can we get to changing this??? I think most americans would see the logic in all this, but why isn't this coming up in the political forum? Someone needs to start taking the lead on this issue since it is clearly out of control. I spent 2 hrs in jail once for an unpaid ticket that I simply forgot about. They must have spent $150 checking me in, and then $100 checking me out, and they gave me a 4 course lunch. All that for an unpaid $120 ticket I paid immediately.
With that sort of logic we will get no-where.
To understand incarceration in the USA you have to understand that incarceration is big business.
It generates massive amounts of 'donations' to politicians and an incredible amount of money for prison suppliers.
Even political attempts at creating fear in the populace to get elected dwarfs in comparison to the fear created by this mega business prison complex. And as to pot being a mind altering drug possession of a joint should not be worth ten years to life. Talk about overkill.
Here is the problem, the very same zealots that happen to be conservative are the ones that voted for these insane laws in the first place; 3 strikes and Mandatory Minimum. Now that they see that they have create a problem for themselves now they want to change the rules to the game. We told you people from the very beginning that these laws would not work but, you allow fear to control your every being so much so the yellow was showing on your backs. Why don't you people focus on your own issues and wrongs instead of trying to control others
If your dumb enough to not know why this country has so many in prison then you need to leave because you are so ignorant and bound to be mugged. Do yourself a favor and get a clue. The culture of the US is just a mess and legalizing marijuana will make it even worse like drinking and driving.
Marijuana is not part of the PRISON population. Marijuana is a misdemeanor in most states. and usually does not even include
jail time. It usually is a fine and with no incarceration. This segment is highly uninformed..
A book called, "the New Jim Crow"by Michele Alexander hammers this point home. Legalize it, we'll be better off in the long run. You can't pay taxes when you're locked up. I will not be voting in November for a candidate that wont support this. too many people in prison for non violent crimes. Even Barack smoked weed and did blow when he could afford it. Dont believe me, google it. There is no way in hell he would have become president if he went to jail or prison for possession. This really is a no brainer, but our governement is clearly lacking in that department. Im not a user either.
Legalize it, tax the heck out of it and decriminalize it. The prison system is another corrupt big business that is broken.
The government could make a fortune taxing it, and put a major dent in the drug cartels income to boot. win/win
The Democrats should take this issue on in my opinion.
We've been discussing this issue for years, and yet nothing is ever done about it. What are we waiting for? Marijuana is harmless.
the reason our incarceration rate is higher is because we have a higher conviction rate. our law enforcement isn't as easily corruptible.
It's funny that Pat found a way to blame it on the liberals. The war on drugs is a conservative darling. And white collar criminals make up a small part of the prison population. Rich people won't follow the law without some severe form of punishment.
Have we so soon forgotten the movie, "Midnight Express"? Somehow I can't help thinking our prisons would be a far greater deterant if they compared to the one shown in that movie, and not so much the country clubs they are today.
Hey!! Free healthcare, free food, free shelter..what-ta retirement program for all us!! Just don't be a white male guilty of child molestation!! The government and the justice system is using child molestation to incarcerate as many white males as possible to offset the black male population. You almost never hear of a black male child molester, even thought their numbers dwarf white male molesters. Someone should flag this racist form of justice.
Prisons are certainly not country clubs. Any things the inmates get like TV & sports equipment are more to keep them quiet & occupied than to coddle them. If your 'get tough' ideas were followed the prisons would need to double the number of guards. Just having their freedom taken away is severe punishment no matter how they are treated.
I agree with Pat Robison, and applaud him for going public with his thoughts on legalizing marijuana, but would carry it one step further and legalize all drugs. Some of the money save by making drugs legal that now goes to pay for courts, police departments, and prisons systems, could be used for drug treatment programs for those who abuse drugs, and become addicted. This would be similar to how we deal with those who abuse alcohol, and deal with that addiction.
May the Flying Spaghetti Monster bless Pat Robinson for his comments on legalizing marijuana.
You're in reality a just right webmaster. The web site loading pace is incredible. It seems that you are doing any distinctive trick. Also, The contents are masterwork. you've performed a excellent task in this subject!