Editor's note: Ravi Agrawal is the Senior Producer of "Fareed Zakaria GPS." You can follow him on Twitter @RaviAgrawalCNN
By Ravi Agrawal, CNN
The winners of last Sunday’s elections in Greece and France would do well to consider “Juncker’s Curse.” It’s named after the Prime Minister of Luxembourg, Jean-Claude Juncker, who famously quipped: “We all know what to do. But we don’t know how to get reelected once we've done it.”
Juncker would know. He’s the longest serving democratically elected head of government in the world.
But it raises an interesting, philosophical question. Is populism our greatest obstacle to growth and success? Are world leaders really just sitting on solutions to all our problems – but they can’t implement them because of us?
In other words, are people the problem, and not politicians?
A few recent events make one wonder.
Exhibit A: Nigeria, the world’s 8th largest exporter of crude oil. Until the end of 2011, gasoline prices in Nigeria averaged $1.70 a gallon – less than half the U.S. average, and nearly a third of prices in India and China. But cheap oil came at a heavy price: Nigeria was spending $8 billion a year to subsidize gasoline – 4% of GDP. Rolling back those subsidies would give the government funds to build refineries; those new refineries would in turn make Nigeria a more effective exporter of refined crude, generating far more wealth. The International Monetary Fund – as well as many other economists – all agreed that cutting subsidies would be a vital first step towards fixing Nigeria’s finances.
So Lagos boldly decided to double prices. Suddenly, on January 1, 2012, a gallon of gasoline was worth $3.50.
Riots ensued. But President Goodluck Jonathan vowed to stand firm – after all, this was a decision that was good for the people, right?
It took sixteen days to cave. The government dropped prices much of the way back down, to $2.27 a gallon.
It seems Jonathan backtracked in time. A Gallup poll from April shows he has an 81% approval rating.
If there is a moral, it is this: You can break promises you never meant to keep; but never, ever take away a gift you’ve already given.
The story isn’t new. Jordan’s government reversed similar cuts last year in the face of protests. In Venezuela, if gasoline costs $0.18 a gallon – less than bottled water – it’s not because President Hugo Chavez likes being generous. The last time a leader there tried to raise prices, in 1989, all hell broke loose. Hundreds died in riots. In India last year, a proposal to allow Walmart to enter the country was met with mass strikes – despite the fact that economists agreed it would revolutionize the market and increase supply-chain efficiency. One could go on.
For all of these countries, subsidies or nationalist policies can be a populist, short-term crutch. They tend to skew markets and hold back investment in infrastructure and wide-scale development.
I put that to Ken Rogoff, a Harvard economics professor who was once chief economist at the IMF. He says that almost everywhere, people want the government to deliver more while paying less.
“The problem isn’t nearly as much the politicians as the voters. Every poll you look at shows the public has huge expectations of what the government can do for them. And it’s just not possible.”
So is Juncker right?
There is a flipside, as Rogoff himself pointed out to me. The issue isn’t just economics – it’s trust.
Just ask the Nigerians. Transparency International ranks the country #143 in the world on corruption. No surprise then, that the rioters weren't convinced oil money would end up in the right hands.
The deficit of trust isn’t limited to countries perceived to have high levels of corruption. Let’s go back to Greece and France’s elections last Sunday. Nobel Laureate Paul Krugman diagnosed it as a vote against policies – against austerity. “Europe’s voters,” he wrote in the New York Times, “are wiser than the continent’s best and brightest.”
So maybe the people do know what’s best for them?
The most heartening thing I heard this week came from an eastern neighbor of France and Greece. The Czech Republic’s Foreign Minister was lamenting the mood of anti-incumbency around the world.
“The next elections are lost anyway,” said Karel Schwarzenberg to the Financial Times. “I should be astonished if we won. And in that case, if you can’t keep power, you should do what you promised to do.”
Now there’s something both the people and the powerful won’t disagree on.
© 2012 Cable News Network. Turner Broadcasting System, Inc. All Rights Reserved.
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The solution is one term of, say, 6 years. In that way a politician has the mandate to do what he or she promised and not be distracted by taking the last two years of office to get re elected. After two years in office, an independent panel should evaluate this person to ensure he or she is doing what was promised and if not, then the politician would need to step down.In this way, the people who did the electing would get what they voted for, like it or not. Maybe it sounds drastic but what we have in the world is even more drastic. We are headed for more chaos if we don't revolutionize our thinking.
@ James, This is exactly the kind of perspective and thinking we need. Not that I would instantly agree with the details because it would unfortunately be a little more complex than just that, but the mechanisms to elect/appoint, remove, correct, control, direct, police and hold accountable our governing bodies and the processes are absolutely critical. And why would anyone want to limit a term to someone who is doing a great job ? It's amazing how we can file and process hundreds of millions of complex tax returns and tax bills every year, or go through umpteen millions of lottery tickets with daily draws, and process a trillion things on line everyday, but when it comes to the actually having a real say, it's limited to that one time vote every 4 years with no critical input or simple means of revocation. And even then, the guy you vote in becomes a powerless puppet or high paid stooge snoring away somwhere, and sometimes even worse ! What a crock of horse manure !
You are right RZ in your observations. I wouldnt mind two terms if the politician was so good he or she didnt have to campaign for the second term or play politics during the last year of the first term just to get elected.
@ RZ
I agree completely that we need a "mechanisms to remove, correct, control, direct, police and hold accountable our governing bodies" Perhaps make the presidential term one based on 8 year term and apply such checks and balances based on approval ratings. Also in the case of a president with hold the tax exempt perk of having served in that office to those who complete the entire 8 years.
@ j. von hettlingen
I think he raised a good point in stating "Many voters aren't interested in politics but they give their votes to those who would serve them best." What should the electors motives be? should the be to serve the group or themselves? The purpose of humanity clumping together in settlements, towns, cities at its basis is to provide security and and benefit to those in the small or large group. Through selfish voting practices we only undermine that purpose. The situation also makes me think of the illustration of i think it was governing dynamics in the movie "A Beautiful Mind". John Nash and friends are attempting to pick up girls at the bar consisting of a beautiful blonde and her 2 slightly less attractive friends. If 2 guys both go for the blonde the one that is shot down would now have no chance at the brunettes who would be upset that they were 2nd choice the conclusion was to go for the brunettes. This would provide a slighter reward but also better the results of the group. Our votes in my opinion should be to serve the group not ourselves but also this logic can be applied to our legislative bodies. Sometimes the slightly less attractive path is the better one. http://www.google.com/url?q=http://movieclips.com/gx3fc-a-beautiful-mind-movie-governing-dynamics-ignore-the-blond/&sa=U&ei=fs6rT9_qOoTb0QGruNzDBg&ved=0CBMQtwIwAQ&sig2=5ZpyHWeFoze_f6JGykGsfQ&usg=AFQjCNG19UfAqTUb5T3kOABJcY1y6UzfyQ
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There is a New Message for humanity. It speaks of Great Waves of Change, it speaks about Alien Intervention, it speaks of the future and saving humanity and it says it will all happen within the next 20 years. It is within the individual, within their own Inner Knowledge. It is for this time the message has come to show humanity how to unlock their own Inner Knowledge, to assist in saving humanity. To read more go here:
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The one-term office is a good idea. The powerholder does his job and goes. There's no need of kowtowing for another term.
In a democratic election candidates are at the mercy of the voters, many of whom are easily influenced and shortsighted. Politicians in general aren't candid or are too afraid to explain the complex problems. Populists manipulate the reality. Many voters aren't interested in politics but they give their votes to those who would serve them best.
please read: there's no need to kowtow for another term.
j. von: "The one-term office is a good idea. The powerholder does his job and goes. There's no need of kowtowing for another term."
It's a good idea until you realize no one could actually get anything done because everyone would be perpetually new, inexperienced, etc. in Congress.
On top of that, if politicians had no one to answer to, they could try to ram through any legislation they chose during their one term. They could be as stubborn as they wanted. They could do virtually anything because they don't have to worry about keeping a job.
The one term idea is dependent on politicians being (a) good willed, (b) far sighted, and (c) enthusiastic about doing what's right.
2 terms max (in case they are doing a good job)
What if it was one 6 year term with a type of review/confidence vote 1-2 years in, like a probationary period? Two years is adequate time to get acclimated. State and national level politicians should be elected partially based on their ability to perform immediately anyway, we're not talking about the minor leagues here.
It takes one term just to learn how to do things. Experience matters.
I wasn"t around yet but my parents and grandparents voted for FDR all four times!
The solution is very simple.
Take money out of politics.
If you are caught taking bribes (yes, lobbying money is bribery), you go to jail for a minimum of 5 years. You also lose the government pension and healthcare.
Sounds like a good idea. Who are you going to get to sponsor it, and who are you going to get to vote for it?
Best idea i've ever heard.
I agree this makes sense. The only problem is that we would need to send lobbyists to Washington to make it happen. ...and If a politician can't take bribes, what would be the incentive to become a politician?
They are supposed to be Public Servants. Not self serving servants. What happened to the notion of doing what is best for the our Country?
@cleek- We can just throw some money together and get some lobbyists to... oh wait... nevermind.
Try Buddy Roemer for president. He wants to take the money out of the process.
Too everyone saying you'll never get something like this passed....
Simply ask your senators to bring it up. And if they don't bring it up, vote in the next senator or house member. If people did this in every state, it would pass.
Keep pushing it as the number one issue. Get people to focus on it. Don't stop talking about it. Eventually everyone will demand it from their senator.
Only thing can things begin to change.
Ron Paul doesn't meet with lobbyists no does he take any bribes from lobbyists.
As long as the concept of corporate speech is protected on the level and with the fervor that indivdual free speech is protected, they will have their loophole to accept money and call it donations. As if changing the language and altering the frequency and sums of dontions affects the fucntion of the process. As if there is no resulting, ongoing relationship estabilshed by this process.
The solution is simple: Take Bohemian Grove out of politics, and take the politicians who attend these sick meetings in Northern California out of politics. Does David Gergen really have anything to do with CNN? Ron Paul 2012.
Come on are you serious?! This is laughable. A temporary tyranny is your solution?! People should not be forced into bias policy solutions. Free association is the answer. The idea that politicans represent solutions for large populations is also laughable. Politicians 99% of the time represent a few bias view points of the majority that elected them. I think it is incredibly naive to believe that there are propper solutions that can magically solve our problems and make people happy. This is the same mentality that most people in dictatorships have "That a propper lead knows better for his people than the people do themselves".
Thanks, but I will keep my freedom over what you propose. Good luck with this theory, historically it has not worked out so well though. Read Hayek's 'The Road to Serfdom'.
I agree. Would also stop the lobbyists from gaining their friendship over their many years of service and corrupting them.
There is no way to ensure an independent panel. Our Supreme Court was intended to be independent and see how that's gone. Every potential system of government I have considered is corruptible. In the end, the only truly independent group is the people who are easily manipulated. You can either set up a system that reacts quickly and corrupts quickly or a system with many checks that slows down progress but also slows corruption.
As long as all higher goernment positions are one term, we have reps from both houses that have been on the floor for 20+ years, most of their views equate to the 1960's, it is a huge failure.
Rather than extending the terms, what I would suggest is splitting them up. Make all offices follow the same 4 year term and make it the law that any politician who is currently in office (and the office does not matter – President of the US or local dog catcher) is legally prohibited from running in any current election. Only once they have been out of office for a single election cycle can they run for an office (again limited to 1 term). They can run for the same office as many times as they wish, so someone can be President for 4 or even 5 terms, but no two terms can be served consecutively.
This would force politicians to focus on making lasting improvements, because they have to wait several years after they leave office to run again. They can't rely on "pork barrel" politics (i.e. if you re-elect me, I promise to buy you "x") to win their next election but have to actually do their jobs. After a term out of office the public should have an idea if the changes they made were working as intended, then decide if we want to give them another chance at elected office.
Won't ever happen of course, since the people who would have to make this the law are the same ones that would be forced to do their jobs – the politicians!
Rob.... This sounds like a workable plan to me. Now who and how many do we have to bribe to "get er done' ?
Oversimplified and does not take experience into account. 6 years of service then the boot? It takes time to establish relationships, gain experience, trust, and many other things. By the time they got their boots on the ground and established a reputation then it's time to move on. Who evaluates them after two years? It seems that the people in oversight can be just as corrupt as the politicans themselves. The article makes many good points. If we want a better future for our kids, we need to sacrafice now. But its easier to blame politicans and rich people.
I'd like to add in one point although I think it is a huge one. We need to stop mixing politics with everything else which means people need to start minding their own business. All of the current social issues are preventing those we elect from governing. And from that perspective, it is our fault for letting it happen.
I hate to tell you this, but politics is all about social issues. We have laws to enforce ethical/moral behavior. We have to talk about social issues to determine if a new law is necessary.
The problem with that, James, is people with experience do their jobs better than people without experience. If I were to have surgery I would much rather have a surgeon with more than six years experience than a new surgeon. Ditto the guy who flies the airliner I might ride. Or the man who fixes my car. And the same with Congressmen and Senators.
So yes, limiting terms has some very real benefits. But the policy has some very real drawbacks, too.
Exactly. Hate to break it to everyone, but the majority of "the people" are idiots.
You are so right. a PERSON may be intelligent, open minded, thorough in their decision making process but PEOPLE are easily manipulated and extremely short sighted. and that is what a career politician banks on. that no one will remember their "position" on an important social issue when they were last running for office. Look at what is going on now. Interview clips from years past of all of our current candidates pushing/supporting positions that they now have to distance themselves from in order to appease a small, yet apparently vital, segment of the voting public. Be very afraid people. If you think our country got screwed up when the House, Senate and the White House were all "controlled" by the same party, wait until that same scenario occurs on the other side of the aisle.
you may want to eat my shorts
I usually read these comments for a laugh, but ya'll actually made good points. As for what the problem is, its both. People and the media have turned politics into one great big reality TV show. And the politicians use it to there advantage. Its just gross anymore.
Consider:
Our system of governance is utterly corrupt.
Our corrupt politicians and the lobbyists who corrupt (buy) them are the problem.
Nero fiddled (actually he played a harp), while Rome burned.
Americans are worried about who was voted off of the island, who won the Voice, Can They Dance, etc., and they are so distracted by their cell phones, that they aren't watching, as our leaders fleece the nation.
We can thank Ragan and Clinton for the deregulation, which allowed this.
Agreed. I don't know or care about the party affiliation of that guy in Michigan that just lost but he was 80 YEARS OLD! He had been in office 36 years, for God's sake! Parasites. I term limit them every time I go to the polls.
Been saying something similar for years. One term would make all the difference in the world.
How absolutely ridiculous. How long do you think your "independent" panel would remain independent? If you think lobbyists are bad now...
The problem isn't the population or politicians, it's politicians relating to the lowest common denominator in society and ignoring the vast majority of intellectuals who listen to the pros and cons of policy. Unfortunately, the Jerry Springer crowd is louder so that is who they go after.
Sounds good ,But the word promise is the problem here .It takes 2/3 of congress to pass what you promise. And you have 2 heads of congress to disagree House and Senate . Then you have the president to veto . Even if it sound good or you disagree with what like or dislike . The main problem is World Gov't and Lobby monies that dictate .
You forget that inefffective government is the best kind of government for a people to have.
A perfect people need no government – their liberty and rights are protected by the goodness of the people around them.
Governments, therefore, serve only to restrict and control – a necessary evil due to the follies of man.
The larger the government, the greater the control it has. This quickly turns into a government with much more control than any one member of society can endure.
Therefore, we are blessed with incompetent governments that cannot get much of anything done. If they were effective, they would do more and the more they do, the more they cost and the few freedoms we retain.
There is a reason history favors a buerrocratic divided government over a pragmatic totalitarian government.
Please help me I'm being helded held hostage at this address 7065 Belding Rd Rockford MI 49341. Please call the Grand Rapids Michigan Police and 1-616-874-3177.
This address has been checked numerous times, the poster Jennifer is incarcerated in a mental facility, however, CNN refuses to remove the post which ties up local resources whenever someone reads this.
any way in all these idea's we can get campaign adds to be honest, this would help in determining if a person has done a good job and should stay. But with all the sound bites and quotes taken out of contexts how do we really know what a candidate stands for.
independent panel? but who will judge the judges? 'merca is the most corrupt nation in the world and the best at hiding it . . .
The problem is the political parties... they tell our elected officials how to vote. George Washington warned us about political parties in his farewell address.
I believe Benjamin Franklin was once quoted as saying, "When the people find they can vote themselves money, that will herald the end of the republic."
True, both Aristotle and the Founding Fathers had observed that politicking was as banal as horse-trading.
It hasn’t worked out that way. It has become that the rich and big corporations thru campaign donations and paid lobbyists can get money or whatever they want.
It was Alexis de Tocqueville and he said: “The American Republic will endure until the day Congress discovers that it can bribe the public with the public's money”
Indeed, de Tocqueville was a great visionary. That's why his work "Democracy in America" will continue to fascinate future generations.
You could boil this down to "why don't these poor people let our smarter western companies exploit them more easily?"
What I don't understand is why were so many people in France stupid enough to vote for Nicholas Sarkozy. But then again, some were war profiteers making large amounts of money out of both Afghanistan and Libya while many others just simply hated the Muslims very much like we Americans do!!!
Good posting, George. Thank you.
George why did US people were stupid enough to vote for Bush back then?
Elections are so broke they are fixed.
Bad posting, George. No thank you.
My question would be why some people in France were so unwise as to vote against Sarkozy.
Exploiting poor people? What a joke. It is the successful that are exploited by the government in the name of the poor.
Yeah ok Mitt!! Go listen to Rush, Rove and Cheney you puppet. I agree that we often times hold the hands of those struggling, but to actually say that, wow! This government is made up of the rich, funded by the rich and in the end serves the rich – exploited is the right word, but the middle class is the victim not the rich. Small business has been under assault since Reagan – Bush himself tried to dismantle the SBA (small business admin). 70 – 80% of employment in this country is supplied by small business not corporate lobbying. You folks get your info from the exact folks who are pulling the strings and assume you have the truth???? We are screwed because of folks like you! live with that you corporate lacky!!
Please! Do you even listen to the dribble you write?
Both. Most of the electorate is ignorant and most of the politicians are ROADies (retired on active duty)
It can be both ways, Too many politics and very little get done. Balance the budget like reall american have done. TIme to clean house and get elect some people who have moral values like Thomas Jefferson. The consitution was written very well buy early americans who knew what the values are.
poorly written but well said. Until our politicians realize that Americans value a balanced budget our country will continue down this self destructive path.
it's the people first then the politician, then from the politician to the people again, then on and on....it's imperfection, greed and enough dossage of eccentricity that is the engine of these cycle. this proves and demonstrate that we're not designed to manage fellow human. this calls for a higher order of management, no matter how we deny it, and the whole of humanity is already on edge.
Theres only so much oil once its gone its gone the faster you pump it the quicker it goes
AND THE GOVERNMENTS ARE THE PROBLEM
I recognize ploiticians to dutifully respond to those responsible for their being in office, as it should be. It's not the masses! I recognize many citizens around the world as having government and media controlled by powerful few. History reveals they must control both for sustainment.
I may be naive but I believe the original intention of a representative republic was that politicians were elected to represent the people who elected them. Too many of our politicians today have a prime directive to gain power and enrich themselves. They are willing to lie, cheat and steal to that end. Most politicians are modestly wealthy when first elected and at the end of a few terms they are mufti-millionaires. That doesn't happen by accident.
There is the problem perfectly stated. How does a person of average means become an elected official? When would they have the time away from their job to campaign?
You made a good point Keith.
Good point and good comments. How does a person of average means seek a position in office while still working a job to support his family...
They don't because we are all slaves to the money and the system that is saturated with it. Even if we own our homes we still needs jobs or means to pay taxes for the property on which they sit. We are birds in a gilded cage and if we don not realize our small world is a cage we will not want for more.
STUPID QUESTION.
The problem is that they are ALL PEOPLE, and PEOPLE are IMPERFECT. IMPERFECT people CANNOT create a PERFECT society.
End of story.
True, Jay, WE, people make mistakes and we make the society. I don't want to live in a perfect society. It will be too BORING. As long as there are interactions among people, there will be the Hobbesian concept of state of nature: In this state anyone has a natural right to freedom to do what he wants and can to preserve his own life, and life is "solitary, poor, nasty, brutish, and short". Now and then we have such a state as "every man against every man".
Boring? How so? Think of how much energy and time is wasted on killing each other in this world? Imagine what could be done if the world really did live in peace and harmony. Based on principled love for our fellowman... Theres no limit.
I saw a really cool graphic the other day. It show a simple drawing of space. The caption read "We could be exploring the cosmos, If we could just stop being d * cks for like 5 minutes."
Boring?? I think not.
The problem is neither the people nor the government. Rather, it is the unlimited money of the international corporations. They directly or indirectly pay politicians to do their bidding, and their ownership of the media controls the news resulting in people voting against their own best interests. The fact that your headline didn't even dare include the real source of the problem only exemplifies how bad it is.
People - uneducated, ill-informed, naive, and easily swayed people, people who refuse to think for themselves, people who are irrational, unreasonable - that is part of the problem
Politicians - on the take from special interests, lobbyists - seeking power and money and indifferent to compromise - preferring ideology to rationality, reason, statesmanship - that is part of the problem
Another problem? Money taking control of the elections - where corporations and super paks can give as much money as they want to give and buying the politicians and elections
Oh, they're informed. Let anyone offer to take away any of their handouts, and watch them mobilize.
Abby you have the finger right on the problem. Abby is one of a rare person to have his eyes open.Well said Abby.
2 parts to this: voters not voting makes the crooked lawmakers think they can do anything and not be noticed. On the other hand, they, these crooked politicans are suppose to be honest, and run the United States for the betterment of the country and of the world. Instead, they gobble up all the freebees from the lobyiest and fill their pockets. These damn senators and reps. should all be indicted for bribery, not doing their jobs and ruining this country. To which end, IT IS THEIR FAULT THAT ALL THINGS ARE WRONG.
People are idiots. Politicians are people, therefore...
There should be a test required that demonstrates a minimum understanding of world affairs, government functions, science, and economics, before anyone is allowed to vote. The stupid among us (90+ %) should support such a thing since they will inevitably and stupidly vote themselves into even worse situations than we have now.
I like the idea of a test. Should the Texas Board of Education write it?
It depends on the intelligence of the people.
If citizens are smart enough to see the long-term consequences of their government's actions and they understand the benefits of delayed gratification they should be fine.
Instant gratification and "feel good" policies will destroy a country. For example, temporary deficit spending to stimulate an economy in a recession makes sense. Deficit spending to pay for eternal welfare when there is no plan to support self sufficiency is dangerous.
Deficit spending used to pay for wars that are not necessary is just insane.
The politicians are indeed representative of the people. When the majority of the people have no functioning conscience, so sense of shame and only vote based on who they think will shovel the most goodies their way, what do you expect. Insult religion all you want, but when more people were in church, less people were in jail.
Politicians
We can vote in whoever we want but when they are all bought and paid for by the same big businesses, corporations, etc, it just dosen' t matter. While we need politicians above that, they need money to buy tons of ads smearing each other. The one who dosen't no matter how good or honest, will loose. We need campaign reform, limits to spending, by candidates AND supporters ie, PACS, and time limits, so we don't end up with another 2 yr Republican primary which did what? Prove the Republicans could always find a half dozen extremists who wanted to mouth off on national TV in the guise of debates?
Why won't this happen?
MONEY!
Of cousrs the rich and corporations (ie the well paid execs) protecting their ability to double their income and wealth every 10 yrs, while cutting their workers.
also
MEDIA, who reap litterally ONE BILLION DOLLARS in campaign ads during a presidential election cycle. Yes boys and girls, google it, it takes nearly 500 million dollars to become president, and they are'nt the only ones running for election.
If you think the Media cos are going to let go a billion dollars in ad money every 4 yrs, another half billion for the mid term elects, more billions on local elections, you are crazy.
The people can't change this, ONLY the policians can, by collectively growing morals, and a spine.
BOTH
And don't forget about the Military Security Complex for some countries. Our buddy Ravi seems to have conveniently overlooked that factor.
Let us not forget the US has the best governments that money can buy. They are bought and sold daily! From Congress to the states to the municipalities; government is bought and sold.
What a stupid and snarkey comment. Those politician's are elected by "the people". We tell THEM what to do, not the other way around. If a politician doesn't represent the people, we dump them. And we dumped Lugar, will dump Hatch, and will dump Obama. THE issue in this election is ending free trade, imposing sky high tariffs on Chinese imports, smacking Apple and other corporate Benedict Arnold's along side the head and giving them the choice of moving their jobs back here or being kicked out of the US market. The single commercial with the highest hit, one where voters minds were changed, was one attacking Obama on job outsourcing and guest worker visas. He's going to lose on those issues, be kicked out of office and replaced by Romney. And Romney has one very short window, 6 months at the outside, to correct that mistake before the voters tear him to shreds. The global economy, free trade are DEAD.
someone's been drinking the Kool-Aid.
Its 50/50. People are dumb enough to keep electing morons who want to donothing but give themsleves money and simply say no to what the other side wants and thats exactly what those morons keep doing. I have yet to hear more than a few politicians in my lifetime that have actually presented a detailed idea/plan on how they would adress a certain issue before they were elected.
It's neither. People place the votes, and politicians fill the positions, but in between these two poles is a machine, a machine that ensures every elected official is a mouthpiece for vested interests, rounds up the votes and ensured that they go to the proper place. Every politician for every office down to dogcatcher gets run through this machine and by the time they reach the end of the line and emerge as an elected official, they've been worked on to the point where they can only do what they've been programmed to. And the individual people who are voting, they don't have the choice of whether to vote for a properly machined candidate or not. There's no real choice for voters, and the politicians who get elected don't really have any choice either, they're filling a role which has no room for free will, only for going through the motions and repeating the talking points. You open these people up, you'll see they're actually running on an elaborate system of gears and levers. And how can you blame a machine? Really the only time any of us notice it is when a part comes loose or a mechanism gets gunked up.
Respected, Mr.Editor Garu,problem is police dept. Becavse, they are doing mal practices and they support to politicions towardsilligitimate works. Now a days in police dept. so many employes were taking bribes and they suppot giving to who is given bribes, in meamwhile politicions also support to police dept.because theirs work will done fast. Here public is innocents. And problem is police dept. and next politicions .
The problem involves both. Politicians who can lie to gullible people who end up believing them. Then whine, and cry because the ones they voted for end up hurting them. Too bad these uneducated voters will never get a clue to who really wants to help them because all they see is black, and white. They just keep voting for the people who will never compromise, and will never move this Nation forward. Obama/Biden 2012! They're all such haters!
Thank you, Franny. Good posting.
You are correct. I happen to be a Republican but admitting that makes me want to duck and look out for shrapnel. 'My' party has all but destroyed our country over Obama's reign. Virtually EVERY piece of legislation that has been put forth by a Democrat has been discounted and ignored out of hand JUST because it came from "the other side" – the "dark" side. This perception and it's subsequent lack of results are killing us.
NOTHING gets done and 'my' party just points fingers and shouts "see – see what we mean? It's THEM and THEY got to go". Hey, that will get a lot done. NOT – and it's destroying our country. People need to actually fire up their brains and think – don't just follow your party because that's what you do – that's what your folks did. THINK, LOOK and REASON. IF you see negative results coming from 'your' party as I do, you don't HAVE to vote for them and continue the massacre of our way of life. Stand up and vote your conscious.
Obama only needs to be fairly silent and he'll win the upcoming election easily or would IF people thought for themselves. Maybe that is too much to ask?
Both people and politicians are the problem! For example, no matter what the republicans do to trample the American people and destroy this country, Americans in red states (though I don't consider these people Americans by any means whatsoever) will continue to lend their unlimited support to these un-American communist teapublicans in this country even if it means the end of America as we know it! And what is even more sad about the situation is that the teapublicans can do no wrong for these people! The teapublicans are in such an advantage in that they will still get these people support no matter what they do to harm them and these people will still support the teapublicans even when the teapublicans come out in the open and tell these people strait out that we don't care about you and your families whatsoever because our only concern is that of millionaires and billionaires! And that is the problem with this country! GWB and Dick Cheyney and company destroyed this country and murdered thousands of innocent Americans and yet, they can go on the campaign trail with no repercussions and still get the unwavering support of these red state illiterate trailer trash! Yes, the problem is two-fold! Both politicians and people are to be blamed!
You almost have a point but your violent approach obscures any wisdom in your retort.
Why go to places as far as Nigeria for examples? Look at our own Tea Party.
It is my belief that, at least in the United States, it is the idea that one MUST support one's PARTY at fault. IF I am a Republican and yet the candidate running is an absolute tool, I personally will NOT vote for him but many if not most "Republicans" will. Same with the Democrats. Steadfast support for ones party, even though the proffered politician is not good, seems the norm. It's been pounded into US voters forever. We are not voting for a human being but a body of ideals whether we believe them or IN them or not.
Foolish cattle. Just go to your local Elections office and TRY to change your party affiliation to see what I mean. You'd think you suddenly were declaring that you are a Nazi.
Great point!!!!! Why are people so brainwashed?
I disagree with your analogy! This is a free country and people are not bound or comitted to a party or ideology! i don't support a party because it is republican or democrat, I support the party ttha's more concerned with the welfare and well being of the people! When the Founding Fathers created our system of "Checks and Balances" and a two-party system, the goal was not to have one party prevent the other party from governing but rather for both parties to work together and find common ground for the welfare of the Union! Unfortunately, what we have here today is a situation where the republicans and their tea party are bent on serving the interest of the wealthy ONLY at the expense of the middle class and the poor, cutting social programs, implementing voter suppression laws and laws profiling citizens because of their ethnic origin and preventing the democratic party from governing and serving the welfare and interest of the American people. Now we also have five conservative judges on the supreme court supporting a conservative agenda and giving the teapublicans all the ammunition they need to undermine the will of the people.
Recently, Senator Richard Lugar who has spent 36 progressive years in congress reaching across the isle and working with democrats to serve the American people was voted out of office because some radical extremist teapartier in Richard Mourdock has campaigned on an agenda to prevent any future bi-partisan leadership in the future! Mr. Murdoch fault Senator Lugar for working with democrats in getting legislation passed and he argued that conservatives must "stand their ground" and avoid any bi-partisan work with democrats! Well, is that what the Founding Fathers wished for when they created our system of "Checks and Balances" and a two party system? I doubt it! And I may add that this practice by conservatives is detrimental to the stability, growth and prosperity of our society in the long run!
The problem is human nature: herding instincts, including fear and the belief that there is safety in numbers, the need to be as close to the center as possible because those on the outter edges of the herd will get eaten, herd mentality, group think, tribalism, the attraction which enablers have for narcissists, ignorance, agendas and personal interests which affect judgment, lack of ability to engage in inductive or deductive reasoning, the failure to recognize the need for objective analysis, laziness and being moved by the lower brain functions where the primitive instinctive and impulsive emotions and passions lie rather than the higher powers of reason, narcissism.
The problem is both. Dishonest and self-serving politicians, and a public too eager to accept and encourage bad behavior... As long as it benefits them.
en. wikipedia. org/wiki/Bourgeoisie
en. wikipedia. org/wiki/Modernism
en. wikipedia. org/wiki/Bourgeoisie en. wikipedia. org/wiki/Modernism
en. wikipedia. org/wiki/Modernism en. wikipedia. org/wiki/Bourgeoisie
en. wikipedia. org/wiki/Modernism
en. wikipedia. org/wiki/Bourgeoisie
Every conman knows it takes at least two people to make a scam work; the guy running the con and the greedy mark. The political machine running the con promiss a better tomorrow, justice or what ever usually at the expense of someone else preferably an unpopular group. The voting public (the mark) laps it up hoping they benefit
One term is only good if you're no good... It we do one day get someone who can run the country we sould still need to vote him out after two terms which puts us back to base one.
So you are saying that there would be NO possibility of a another good person? That is a pretty wide brush to paint.
If you want to know if the problem is the"people" or the "politicians". All you have to do is look at the commits on this board. Everyone pointing fingers at the "other party" as the problem.
When are all you brainwashed Dems and Repubs going to wake up and start thinking for yourselves? Following your party lines is really not much different than being in a cult.
I don't think for one minute that the democrats are lying or have ever lied to the American people because every policy supported or passed by democrats in the past three and a half years are legislations to help the American people and their families in these hard economic times! That is in contrast to the teapublicans doing everything within their means to slash much needed programs devised to help the American people survive the economic perils the republicans created! Let's face it, the democratic party is the party of the people and the republican party is simply un-American and evil!
And I may add that the republican party whos's only concern is wealth, is also the party that benefited from four hundred years of free slave labor! Unfortunately some things never seem to change at all!
Hey blah blah boy... creating wealth beats the heck out of economic malaise, which is what we've got right now.
Never trust a socialist or a liberal democrat to build an economy.
Oh, yeah... one other thing.... it was the Democrats who opposed the Civil Rights Act.
Get your facts straight Blah Blah Booo-oy.
Your commits are a perfect example of "brainwashed".
"I don't think for one minute that the democrats are lying or have ever lied to the American people"
Are you really serious with this?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bp9RsO84TXc ... speaking of cons and behavior - it's so close they seem to be the same person!
The problem is too many people with their hands out for government freebies paid for by working people. Things like Social Security (plan for your own retirement), social programs (promote charity not govenment confiscation based on what someone else's view of what's moral), earned income tax credit (work to get a better job), home interest/real estate tax credits (pay the expenses for your own house), student loan subsidies (pay for your own schooling -many have), agriculture subsidies, corporate welfate to public television (pay for your own TV) and Planned Parenthood (pay for your own "healthcare").
If you read Zakaria'a book "the Post American World" you would know that government handouts led to the downfall of many great cultures.
Europe is falling apart due to social programs and giveaways.
Stop asking for handouts. Vote out politicians who support them. And get rid of Dinosaurs (people who have served too long) in government. If a congress rep has served more than 5 terms, toss him or her, a Senator more than 3 terms, toss them – they are now a big part of the problem. These are the people who come up with these handout programs to keep getting re-elected.
And what did four hundred years of free slave labor and free slave handouts do to the confederate south? It made them wealthy! Let's face it, the conservative teapublicans shouldn't talk about mother-f-ing handouts in this country whatsoever because they and their offsprings benefited from four hundred years of HANDOUTS!
You're so full of schidt your eyes are brown.
If people wouldn't be so stupid we wouldn't be asking and replying to this question. People just don't get it, since day one politics showed it's ugly face and amazingly people just don't get it and they keeps on voting and asking for more. The most stupid planet in the whole universe.
The masses don't know about solutions, they only know about the problems! Governments actually create the problems. Subsidies of things like oil is a prime example, the governments foolishly gave the people price controls and now are having trouble taking them away. In the US the situation cannot be blamed on the people, since the government follows supports many wasteful and inefficient programs like the wars on terror and drugs and the inability of the country to even regulate it's financial system properly.
I agree that the fickleness of the general population can be a road block, but with that said politicians don't have the skills to resolve our issues. Most of them don't even understand the true root of the problem. Our biggest problem is the monetary system. It's the road block to the real solutions that would improve everyone's life dramatically. Don't believe me ponder this – "If money disappeared tomorrow, but soil, energy, all technologies we currently have remained would society still be able to function?" The real solution is abandon the monetary economy, proclaim all the Earth's resources as common heritage for everyone, stop with all this nationalist BS, and adopt a resource based economy. Do that and I'd bet in 10 years or less you won't even recognize this world.
EVERYONE is the problem.
We the people are at fault for not holding our politians accountable.
"When the People fear the Government there is tyrany. When the Government fears the People there is liberty."
Not only do they not fear us; they're attention is focused on their own, selfish, hidden agendas
The quote was Thomas jefferson.
So let's get this straight. The French elected a socialist because they need to create jobs in the private sector?
This is the part of the cartoon when Ren turns to Stimpy and says, "Steeeempie.... yooo eeeedeeeyott!"
People or politicians? The problem is clearly people. We neither reward courageous or just behavior nor punish inappropriate behavior at the voting booth. Most people lack the ability to see through the spin, propaganda, and pandering. Most people lack the intelligence or motivation to focus beyond sound bites, or the here/now/me aspects of policy. The people we elect are a reflection of ourselves – not a pretty thought.
European Socialism is alive politically, but economically it's dead.
The French just haven't figured it out.... yet.
why do we no longer have a "flag" option? Good god...
The masses are asses.
"Who's the problem: People or politicians?" Both. People who want politicians and government to make all of their discussions because they incapable of self thought and politicians who are too willing to give these same people what they want just so the politician stay in office.
This morning CNN ran an article about a white supremacist in Florida and his wife trying to recruit neo-nazzis to start a race war! If I had advice for this man and his wife, I would tell them if they want to divide America, there is no better way to do so than to put their names on the ballots for congress! It seems as though that is the trend today where white supremacists in this country are hanging up their white sheet and burning cross to run for congress on the teapublican ticket!
That's funny I thought that the one time longest serving elected offical in DC was a Dem and he was also a "former" Grand wizard for the KKK. See Byrd WV.
In the USA it is Fox News audience voting that causes us the vast majority of our problems. The political equivalent of wrestling fans who think it's all real. Fox watchers are lie believers and repeaters basing their votes on anything but reality.
They're ignorant hillbilles from the south.....generally
Obviously people are the problem. It's them who vote politicians in to office.
This story greatly over simplifies the issue at hand but the bottom line is the politicians can't do anything without the (tacit or implicit) approval of the people. If the people do not hold their representatives accountable for their actions then the people are tacitly showing their approval of those actions. Politicians are just people selected out of the masses. They are no different than the masses. They have all the same idyllic qualities as well as the baser tendencies. They are as corrupt as, as honorable as, as perverted as, as biased as the rest of the people. It is the responsibility of the masses to eject or dismiss those representatives that no longer act in the peoples best interests. But it is also the responsibility of the people to ensure that they are informed and aware of those issues which are most pressing to their form of government. When a people allow the government to dictate what the people want, then the people get the government they deserve. In America, we the people have allowed corporate interests, special interests, and big money to steal away our voice. Where is the outrage, where is the patriotism, where are the patriots?
True DAT
One very major problem with this whole issue is LOBBYING. My God, why in the world is lobbying still permitted? It is one of the fundamental issues in politics, when a company can approach politicians and shape the way they think, which then shapes the way they govern, by simply going to the Hill and putting their SPECIAL INTERESTS before the people. And all the while, they do so with their piles of money that only major corporations have (no one single person can go lobby to the politicians). Lobbying should be OUTLAWED, plain and simple. The fact that the SUPREME COURT allowed superpacs to even exist is crazy. This isn't fair. Until these things change, it's no use trying to decide if politicians or the people are the problem. Right now, I would say it's the people who are in favor of, and permit, lobbying to take place and superpacs to exist that are the problem. Get rid of this and then begin the moral debates! If not, lobbying will forever cloud morality.
The system is broken because money and special interest influence everything. That makes both people and politicians a part of the problem but it is the rules keeping it honest that need to be changed because it no longer is honest and no longer about the majority of the people but a select few.
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Think about this: If moms and dads could lobby their childrens' schools for better treatment of their own kids, as long as they have the funds to do so, while other moms and dads, who do not have the funds to lobby for the better treatment of their kids in school, cannot do so – we would see demonstrations, and perhaps even riots, at the schools all over the place! So then why the heck are we not incensed about lobbying in Washington?? I would not recommend rioting, but a concerted effort by the people to attack this oldschool way of politics, when a company can send it's own troops to Washington to lobby the politicians for better treatment compared to others, would be a start. And by the way, the way it is right now is no different than if a parent went to their child's school and lobbied for better treatment of their child, JUST BECAUSE they have the money to do so......and because it's LEGAL to do so. People should be outraged, but instead, like many have posted up here already, people are mostly concerned with themselves and as long as they are getting what's good for THEM, they have no incentive whatsoever to act for others. Morality in this country is going, going, gone!
There is no question it is the politicians who have sold their soul to the highest bidder-the ones who give most to their campaign fund and probably some fell into their pockets.
"In India last year, a proposal to allow Walmart to enter the country was met with mass strikes – despite the fact that economists agreed it would revolutionize the market and increase supply-chain efficiency." The premise of the article is in the status quo. All things economically have to grow and be based in consumption. The masses consume and the powers to be make money. The example of Nigeria and gas prices was so simplified to make the authors point seem of import. The oil industry/energy industry is ecologically distractive and will shorten the effective life supporting ability of the land used by these industries. To cheapen the argument down to the masses getting in the way of the supply chain is week, week, week. But, this is what our media and journalists pay each other to produce.
Half the people working to support the other half not working while both halves have equal voting rights. Eventually a strong supporter of the none workers is elected to office. It's socialism from then on.
Nice to see that you've swallowed the right's rhetoric hook line and sinker. I don't know know one so-called "lib" who doesn't think one shouldn't have to work.
Look at Florida and I *dare* you to say that there is no problem with the U.S. electorate. Every person that voted for Rick Scott ought to be forced to publish a letter of apology. It's not a partisan issue... the guy should have gone to jail for fraud. And you elected him for governor. Shame on you.
I think we should fire 95 percent of the federal GOBBERMENT and let the states decide whats right.
At this point, we are witnessing the "dependency" that politicians/government have created over the years blowing up in their faces. As Margaret Thatcher said, "The problem with Socialism is that, eventually, you run out of other people's money."
Speaking for the Oligarchy:
The right scares you into picking a side, the left guilts you into it. Really doesn't matter which side you pick. We like it best when it's dead even then we only need to tilt it a little to get what we want. It's looks like we side with the right but that's just to get the boot lickers to do what we want. They actually believe we will hold the ladder till they get up it.
The Tea Party is very similar to the ruling conservative party in Iran. They attempt to obstruct or shutdown anything that isn't 100% with in their agenda, they view compromise as weakness and under the myth "they know what is best" for you, it is a constant war on civil rights.
OMG I KNOW. A LIBERALS ARE LIKE NAZIS. THEY BOTH WEAR CLOTHES AND TAKE PEWPS IN THE MORNING!!!!!
That you're so taken in by fallacies, and let them dictate your political positions, is telling about your intelligence.
Namely, that you have none.
lol AJ has a point though, and its funny you fail to see it. during times like these, you should not make it your goal in congress to not work with the president until hes out of office. how is it a good idea to paralyze the nations legesilative branch for 2 years just to get someone out of office.
Our Democracy works well. Too well. The people get exactly the politicians they deserve. The ones they vote for.
The best thing any citizen can do in this country is to internally reject the idea of a two-party stem.
I agree with this, why do we have to have a two party system? Why is it that we have to vote for either a democrat, or a republican? I know, I know, there are libertarian candidates, independent candidates, etc, etc. BUT, if a candidate is not Dem or Repub, then they do NOT make it to the main election. Why is that? Why isn't our country focused on the BEST candidate for the presidency? I know why. I'm just aasking a rhetorical question in hopes of making some narrow-minded folks think a little bit in terms of what's good for the country overall. I used to be republican, that is, until I grew up and became somewhat intelligent. I am NOT a democrat, or a liberal, either. I AM AN INDIVIDUAL WHO THINKS FOR HIMSELF AND VOTES FOR THE BEST CANDIDATE. PERIOD. I have ZERO allegiance to republicans OR democrats. I pledge my allegiance to the United States of America, and ONLY to the United States of America, not to the cronies in both political parties within it.
All governments are corrupt at this point, as history has shown this leads to a new governing body if the people stand up, the people have yet to fully stand against the corruption.
Being a good citizen is hard work. It means taking time to study problems, discuss possible solutions intelligently while listening carefully to others doing the same, and then make necessary compromises to implement them. Until individuals want it in their hearts, there will be no change. If you spend hours a day watching television and not educating yourself, then you are part of the problem. If you don't participate in the political system then you are part of the problem. Our country succeeds or fails because of us, the citizens. Blaming politicians for destroying our nation won't save us from the destruction; we can either save ourselves or perish.
Question: Who puts (elected) politicians in power? Answer: Voters.
Individuals are often smart – it's people who are usually stupid.
We elect leaders to LEAD....it's impossible to do that when you are worrying about the next election.....We voted you in to lead us...so do what we elect you to do for one term without fear of political recourse....and keep it moving...that is leadership
Politicians are at fault, but the people who allow them to spend us into oblivion are responsible. We've allowed this to happen. Now, it's time to find out if we'll allow them to take the necessary, but unpopular, measures to dig ourselves out of this hole without the country going bankrupt. I hope Juncker isn't right.
All the suggestions about how to put people in and take them out of office are all well and good but, we, the people have to allow them to take a few things away so we can become prosperous again in twenty years or so. But there's little doubt we need a twenty-year" dry spell, where government is shrunk in order to pay our debt and start operating on a cash basis once again. We could afford a lot if we didn't owe most of our revenue to interest on our debts.
The people and the politicians are both to blame. The people for blindly relying on primitive instincts and impulses rather than objective reason to determine policy. The politicians for appealing to the herding instincts, mostly fear. Narcissism, tribalism, group think and herding mentaility are all to blame.
Objective evaluation, unaccompanied by impulsive primitive passions which reside in all of us, is essential. However, objectivity is lost on those people and politicians who are passionately interested in the results of any contest and who otherwise have agendas, either disclosed or undisclosed to the public eye. We actually need a group of "priests" who are disinterested in the results of any policy decision to make difficult decisions.
There are many of us who will make some compromise to allow for the concerns of those whose views we may disagree with. The ultimate problem, however, is the view and primitive passion of those who will not make any compromise and who will insist on very risky stratigies which will inevitably push us over the edge of the cliff.
It's against human nature but until people run for office with the intent to do what's good for the country (or state or whatever) rather than what's good for their careers, nothing will change.
PEOPLE are the problem. Politicians simply say what people want to hear, while not necessarily fully understanding the repercusiions of the demands, most of the time. From Facist, to Conservatives, to Moderates, to Liberals, politicians say and do what they must to keep their jobs, and the moment they forget that, they are GONE. So blame politicians if you like, but all us will answer for our own sins, and no contribution will save you from judgement. Which leads me to believe that while 50% of Liberals will burn in Hell, around 95% of Conservatives will join them there.
HL Mencken said it best: "Democracy is the notion that the common man knows what he wants and deserves to get it good and hard".
The real problems is that rich people can buy politicians but the poor people can't. THAT'S the problem!!! Hahaahahahha
Spot on.
There have been a lot of intelligent comments on this page today. Not many flaming posts. We need these types of conversations on the national stage. Intelligent, thoughtful, non-idealistic. Anyone busy this fall? Why aren't folks, like these people commenting today, occupying the seats that are for running our country?
Of course, my previous post HAD to fall under Hahahahahaha! (Srry, no offense hahhahaha.)
At least my post is the real answer and your's is just.........nothing. Hahahahahahahaha
This is a significant point to open to discussion Mr Agrawal. I am sure common people and conseuently the politicians will benefit from the outcomes. The public has a nose to smell out most politicians who are in politics for personal benefits. Meanwhile, some very valuable minds are grinded between the wheels of politics and not on the path to democracy. Maybe the remaining minority is though enough to face the necessities of politics. The result is that they spent so much time on the trivials of politics that they have little time or power left to carry out what they have been elected for. In shorts, they end up doing a career on demagogy rather than anything useful.
Politicians elected by the people. So yeah, its the peoples fault.
"Is populism our greatest obstacle to growth and success? Are world leaders really just sitting on solutions to all our problems – but they can’t implement them because of us?" That's a joke question, right? Look, in a representaive democracy, the people ARE the government. There's no one to blame but ourselves, by definition.
Yep! People chose them in the first place. Some politicians may make false representations just for those votes. Those type of politicians usually have no means left but to make the same-if not more- promises on the next term. That'is why a strong opposition party and an honest, descreet and free social media and press is necessary. Everyone who has access to news is clever enought to make a choice, only if he/she has information.
Who's the problem? People or Politicians?
If you read most of the comments on this question THE PEOPLE blame the Politicians. I bet if you could here a private gathering of Politicians discussing this question they would say THE PEOPLE are the problem.
In my honest opinion, we the people – which includes the politicians, ARE THE PROBLEM. In a democracy, Politicians are simply a mirrored image of the People who elect them.
Speaking from my US perspective, it seems that The People want "things" to be right. They want the economy to work, they want the government to help create jobs, to give tax breaks to the needy, to tax the one percent. They want politicians to do for them what they cannot or will not do for themselves.
Our world is getting smaller and smaller. Each nation taking on symbiotic relationships with multiple nations to the point where if one nation, such as Greece, were to fail, WE ALL FAIL!
We struggle, as a nation, with so many divisive issues, that we loose sight of the fabric that holds our world community together.
What is worse for humanity? Isolation and ignorance? Or a fully connected humanity that struggles to find common ground to live together?
We talk about "them" all the time – the politicians, the elecorate, the Jews, the blacks, the 1%, the poor and on and on... When are we going to start talking about our problems in the context of US? All of us will live with what happens in Greece and in Spain. We will all live with what happens in the Mid-East.
We all will have to live with the decisions our governments – who are US, make, The decisions made yesterday, today and tomorrow – all of them.
Solution: Get involved, get informed, make a difference every day to your own life and try to make a great difference to the people within your abilities and within your reach. The begining of change starts with the invdividual and grows!
Rant OFF...
You are quite right Herschel. In my case I was a dirrest opposition to the now ruling party in Turkey. I was upset for months after the election. But this government proved to be so good for Turkey- generally- that I came to admire them. Not that I will vote for them ever... But it is just a respect for the democratic outcome of an election and an admiration of things well done although I can not say this government represents me in person. I believe in humanity. I also believe that they will find the best way if they are not BLOCKED or misdirected.
The people are the problem. There are good representatives where I live, but those that appeal the the clinically paranoid and the just plain hateful will get 30% of the vote tied up right there. Throw around a few tax breaks and some anti-whatever-is-in-fashion and you get yourself elected.
Both politicians & voters are at to blame
Politicians in congress should have term limits, we should out law corporation lobbying it creates to much corruption and greed.They also need to be handle accountable for insider trading (all of them both parties are guilty of this) Second if your already rich you don't need 174k salary and free goverment health care and there is no need for pensions when they will have more money then they can spend in a life time!!!
Voters should be held accountable and should know who there are voting for. Most of the people don't know the people running for congress or the house and will only vote them in becuase they belong to one party and not the other. then there are the young people who just don't give a crap what is happening to this counrty there too busy watching dumb reality stars..but the same fools will be crying when they get old and nothing we are promised is gone when there ready to retire
Both. In a democracy, people get the government they deserve.
There is a saying from a well known person, I cannot remember the name of
" In every hierarchy each individual rises to his level of incompatiency and stays there".
The Peter Principle. Dr Laurence J. Peter, 1969
"Who's the problem: People or politicians?"
Both–politicians lie, and people believe the lies long after common sense suggests that they are no more than lies.
"If there is a moral, it is this: You can break promises you never meant to keep; but never, ever take away a gift you’ve already given."
Which is one of the reasons the Welfare State is close to unmitigated evil: Politicians promise what cannot, in te long term, be sustained, simultaneously betraying their countries and the people of their countries.
“Europe’s voters are wiser than the continent’s best and brightest.”
It would be nice to believe that. It would be nice to believe it about California voters. But it's not true. And it's it's especially not true of voters who have nothing to lose by voting themselves endless benefits, secure in the knowledge that some one else will be stuck with the bill.
A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until the voters discover that they can vote themselves largesse from the public treasury. From that moment on, the majority always votes for the candidates promising the most benefits from the public treasury with the result that a democracy always collapses over loose fiscal policy, always followed by a dictatorship.
–Anonymous
Or to those who make the largest promotion. Like brand awareness.
Remember Caos and Chosmos shaped the world.
Here is the full , correct quote:
"A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until the voters discover that they can vote themselves largesse from the public treasury. From that moment on, the majority always votes for the candidates promising the most benefits from the public treasury with the result that a democracy always collapses over loose fiscal policy, always followed by a dictatorship. The average age of the world's greatest civilizations has been 200 years.
Great nations rise and fall. The people go from bondage to spiritual truth, to great courage, from courage to liberty, from liberty to abundance, from abundance to selfishness, from selfishness to complacency, from complacency to apathy, from apathy to dependence, from dependence back again to bondage."
Who penned the above words? If one were to put one's faith in the reliability of the internet, the obvious answer would be Alexander Tytler. Or Alexander Tyler. Or Arnold Toynbee. Or Lord Thomas Macaulay. Or...
The truth is that despite their frequent use, the above text actually has its origins in two separate and independent quotes, and the author of the first half is, to date, unknown. With regard to the first quoted paragraph, the Library of Congress' Respectfully Quoted writes, "Attributed to ALEXANDER FRASER TYTLER, LORD WOODHOUSELEE. Unverified." The quote, however, appears in no published work of Tytler's. And with regard to the second, the same book says "Author unknown. Attributed to Benjamin Disraeli. Unverified."
do you mean corporations (they think they are people now) or the actual humans?
Both obviously. First off the public is at fault for not being more responsible in their duties as citizens and it's the politicians fault for not being a check to the will of the people. Both sides can bring a lot of good to the table but lately both sides have brought a lot of bad.
Both...
The policitians do more harm than good but the people keep voting for them. During an election, the general population is left with the lesser of the 'evils' to choose from. My question for the political parties is: is this the best you can do? Are these my only viable options? If I vote my conscience, then my candidate will not be voted into office. Both policiticians and Americans can do better in the poliitcal process than the candidates that are offered. I believe that term limits should be established with ALL political offices and get some fresh eyes in office to look at the problems and fix them, rather than rely on a legacy candidate.
I predict that someday soon the Sarah Palin family trailer will become as big a vacation destination as Graceland. It will be called Sarahland. Teabaggers, birthers and evangelicals from the four corners of the bible belt will make the pilgrimage, gladly paying $25, $35, or more for the chance to tour Sarah Palin's trailer and to go out back and see the actual outhouse where she took her morning dump.
It's the people.
"A democracy cannot survive once the people realize they can vote themselves benefits" – Alexis DeTocqueville
Do-nothing politicians stay in office because too many people vote for a party ("I'm voting for whoever the Republican/Democrat is") and not for individual merit. So loser Republicans stay in office because their district is heavily Republican (same idea for loser Democrats) even if they're doing a lousy job because voters can't handle the idea of voting for someone in a different party.
The politicians don't have the guts to run the countries because all they want to do is get reelected, NOT run the country, and the people historically have not had the guts to vote them out of office. Now they are being voted out of office, but they are being replaced by some real idiots who also won't run the country, but this time it is beacuse they won't work with the other side.
The problem is both are at fault. People don't kick up enough fuss soon enough and politicians take advantage when they know it's wrong. Simple as that. Now, how hard is that to understand?
Voters are to blame. Voters don't actually take the time to get to know what each candidate is about, they vote based on party affiliation and advertising, which means the most money or effective ads wins. Voters need to be smarter than we are superficial. When politicians can be shown we know what we're doing they will do what WE need them to do rather than politicians telling us what we need.
The voters are only the start of the problem. Don't forget the lobbyists and the Military Industrial guys bribery, or being strong armed by the Party Leadership. Reforming Campaign Contributions and getting rid of the lobbyists is a good place to start.
One term "per office", ie: local – regional – state – national regional – national – president. Experience and good work will get you elected to the next higher office. This way we can avoid a novice president or other office.
Each term is 6 years and elections are staggarred so no one can run for office while IN office (they can spend their own time applying for a new job – like we do)
WRT people or politicians ? Both are problematic unfortunately. The media also create more confusion according to their inluential forces ! Maybe in a few decades with the net exchanges and involvement things will improve ! Under the premise that common sense will always rule !
How about the idea of the Presidency being a 3 person executive board.
6 year term .. divided into 3 2yr segments.
1st 2yrs = "Junior President" whose job it is to oversee congress.
2nd 2yrs = "Sitting President" who is in charge of Domestic issues.
3rd 2yrs = "Senior President" in charge of foreign policy issues.
All 3 will .. consult and advise each other, have executive vote (majority passes). In this case there will be change but no "overnight" complete reversal of the office while gaining experience as world leader.
Of course there's more detail but this is enough for this posting space. I'd like to hear opinions on this "brief" concept description.
"Is populism our greatest obstacle to growth and success?"
Yes, absolutely and unequivocally. The only politicians that get elected are those the promise to not solve the problems. To get elected, you MUST say the following, to enough people, in so many words:
"You can have your cake, eat it too, and have another piece. It will be paid for with other peoples' money."
This is an absolute.
With respect to your story exhibit A, the price of gasoline in Nigeria is billed per Litre not Gallon. If the price you are reporting is what we are having in Nigeria, no one will even riot. We are paying 4x more.
The problem is the unregulated financial markets (investment banks) that make money by extending credit to those that cannot pay, ie Greeks or the indigent, selling such loans to retirement funds, profiting from making short bets on economic collapse and sticking governments/taxpayers with all the long positions. The elderly statesmen, all those we elect, cannot wrap their minds around this not only because they are past their prime thinking age but also because the cash keeps comming. There should be mandatory retirement age for politicians. Say 55 years, hopefully before Alzheimers. The problem is the BANKERS, not the businesses, the indigent, the middle class or even the blokes on the Hill.
The problem is the politicians.
The politicians all accepted the responsibility of their job when they took the post. Even if it means doing that job ends up ending theirs, they have a responsibility to keep their oath to office.
To take a position, and do otherwise, is an act of treason.
One inherent problem with a democracy is when voters don't know what they're doing. You can't have the patients running the asylum. (.. or voting who runs it)
Wherever are people, there are politicians, and wherever are politicians, there are liars.
The problem is the education system. We need to teach people to think critically, to know how to find the truth, which is only possible by being open-minded. Then, instead demagoguery, telling people what they want to hear, politicians can talk to the people like they are intelligent, and win with intelligence. Heck, maybe even politicians would talk and listen to *each other* in such an intelligent way. Naaa, too idealistic.
As Edward R Murrow said "Cassius was right. "The fault, dear Brutus, is not in our stars, but in ourselves."
In democratic socities, people elect the politicians. Therefore, in democratic societies, it must be the people who accept 100% of the blame. This couldn't be more true than in Greece and France, where the voting population has told their policitical leaders to go back to burying their countries under an increasingly impossible mountain of debt so they can contniue to get the goverrnment dole they've been collecting.
As unpopular and uncool as it is to say, I definitely believe the people share equal blame. Especially in democracies. And, to me, it's not just because they elect the wrong people, it is behavior too. C'mon, the housing crisis in many ways was a bunch of the people, not politicians, buying houses through screwy financing schemes that they should've known they couldn't afford. And, if you buy the "how could they know argument", then it's the real estate agents and lendors. Aside from the housing crisis is the whole "we want everything, police, roads, schools, clean air and water, a strong military" etc, etc...but don't dare raise taxes one bit. Tax levels, at least in the US, are at their lowest levels in decades (just look up IRS tables or check the Tax Foundation site).
But, let me emphasize I say equal, not all the people. Politicians whose campaigns are heavily funded by others then get into office to answer to their donors definitely aren't always making decisions in the best interest of the people.
I just tire of the always blaming the politicians with zero accountability pointed back at the people. Let's face it, the media isn't going to blame the public for fear of offending them and them turning to other news. Politicians certainly aren't going to blame the public, they need to get elected!
It always boils down to education of the people. The better the education level – the better the politicians that will be elected and retained or dumped. Does not matter the country, or the politicians. Better educated, women with equal rights, make for a better country.
Our system of governance is utterly corrupt.
Our corrupt politicians and the lobbyists who corrupt (buy) them are the problem.
Nero fiddled (actually he played a harp), while Rome burned.
Americans are worried about who was voted off of the island, who won the Voice, Can They Dance, etc., and they are so distracted by their cell phones, that they aren't watching, as our leaders fleece the nation.
We can thank Ragan and Clinton for the deregulation, which allowed this.
In regard to people knowing what's best for them: time and again, I see large numbers of people who are not anywhere near the upper economic classes, who are struggling and have watched their homes and 401Ks lose value, step into a election booth and vote against their own best interests because somewhere, someday, some girl who they will never know MIGHT decide to have an abortion. Incomprehensible.
Relgion is at fault. Get rid of religion and allow people to become human again and use their brains and most intolerance will fade. Religion has caused more harm to mankind than even the Koch Brothers and other powerful moguls who would like to control the planet. Forunately, mankind won't last because there are not enough natural resources to sustain a much larger population.. Of course, the earth dies when the sun does in about 6 billion years. (Yeah I know, the creationists believe the earth is 6000 years old; there is no accounting for such stupidity).
Ric you'd be stoned for being opposed to the Whatever Spring.. Or at least out of the current years' Spring fashion.
Politics are too polarized. If you don't like "all the way left", you get "all the way right." And vice versa. We need a ranked voting system (aka alternate voting, instant runoff voting) that will allow people to vote for a candidate they like, instead of voting against a candidate they hate. Frustratingly, this is what politics in America are all about. As Ross Perot showed us that if you don't vote for one of the two powerful parties, your split vote winds up losing the election for the party closest to your views. That's not a very good model for democracy. And it encourages candidates to be as extreme as possible.
Ah, Ross Perot. I remember a long time ago in a speech about international trade agreements, he said "That giant sucking sound you hear is all the jobs being pulled out of the U.S. and going overseas." He got laughed at pretty hard, including by me. Live and learn.
Yeah, I voted for him. It made sense to me, back then, that slaves and 3rd world labor were a lot cheaper than domestic talent. Honestly, it took a lot longer for our economy to sink, and everything worked a lot better for us than I would have thought. For a while.
People – We are all greedy in one form of the other. Please do not justify....and yes, I am too.
Greed is not natural and many consider it one of the Seven Deadly Sins.
I remember reading a short story (written by Ibsen most probably-I am not sure). There is this flowering tree and children playing around it. The flowers start to fall down and children collect it as much as they can. When all the flowers on the ground are finished those children who are stronger force other children to hand over the flowers they have collected.
Both. Politicians lie to get in office, then voters are too lazy to get them out before elections come around again.
how many politicians are homeless?
The problem is the whole system. Man was not created to rule himself. When he tries to, well, the results are obvious. Jeremiah 10:23 That's the reason why our Creator has made alternative arrangements and informed us of them too. Matthew 6:10
POLITICIANS are at fault but by the time the 1%ers who own all the mainstream media anyway are done robbing the general population, they will have them believing it's their own fault.
Would stop ranting about the 1%. Tell me, who costs the country more rich people and their tax break or medicare? Which, by the way, the people are unwilling to pay for.
The problem is the POLITICIANS, who are greedy, self-serving PEOPLE!
This discussion is getting to a disgusting version of using slave power. It is generally used by the advanced states of the world but not stated out vocaly. It involves a measure of immigrants and also illegal workers who are somewhat tolerated or overseen. This is a reality used by developed or rich states. But an unspoken politics that I fear to voice out. And since it is routinely done by most advanced countries, it is way out of this discussion as a human's rights problem.
Both but it's more the fault of the politician. I mean if a conman cons lots of people for money we don't blame usually blame the victims.
“The next elections are lost anyway,” said Karel Schwarzenberg to the Financial Times. “I should be astonished if we won. And in that case, if you can’t keep power, you should do what you promised to do.”
So why do we allow this to go on? It's our fault if the article is correct~ ?... Mandate single terms of office? Run until you win, but not subsidized-Your own money. Only run once if you win a office?
"So Lagos boldly decided to double prices." The capital of Nigeria is Abuja, not Lagos.
Both... Politicians are going for control and people have given up their own sacred sovereignty. A marriage made in hell...
As much as I agree with your article, the Nigerian situation lives more to be desired. While it is true that more revenue for the Federal Government will enable it take up capital project for the prosperity of the nation. However you also stated that it is the 8th largest exporter of Crude oil. The question is ' where does the revenue from the crude oil go?' The January protest was more about the Governments refusal to address corruption. If the Government claims that The 8b spent on subsidy is being embezzled, then they should address this issue 1st before removing the existing subsidy as it will also be embezzled. Also it is wrong for you to compare fuel prices in Nigeria to that of the US and Canada. These countries have existing and efficient social system compared with that of Nigeria. Every family unit in Nigeria generates its own electricity. Our country has become a dumping ground for Asian technological experiments as all sorts of alternatives including hazardous one's are being let into the country.
I expected more in terms of serious governments and societies in your article. Citing Nigeria shows once more that the west and media lack knowledge of the situation of the developing world or is purely engrossed in its interest to care how the rest of the world is run!
both, politicians are in it for money and most people are to busy trying to make ends meet and to busy to know whats what and not there fault
The last time I checked, politicians were people – unless some of those theories on 'Ancient Aliens' are true and the politicians are just waiting for the mothership to arrive...
Neither. The problem is the problem. You will have to go way back to the beginning of the Universe (about 14 billion years).Examine the complete history of events that took place during this time. Even to the "Butterfly Effect", where the mere flap of it's wing could result in an apocalyptic event in the future which would cause a disturbance in the air pressure, in the North Atlantic Ocean, producing a light haze on the still water that can produce a mirage, preventing the "Crow's Nest" from spotting the berg, until it was too late. (based on actual research). We'll have to wait for history to run it's course.
Actually both the people and the politicians are to at fault, first of all the government is at fault because it has kept old laws on the books for the sake of getting that vote. Then you have the people that vote for those politicians that are willing to give people the kitchen sink. If government were to terminate the old laws that should not be used today, the people would not be so quick to be a burden. So equally the final fault is that of We the People that allow an administration that's is willing to enslave it's citizens all in the name of keeping power.
The answer is an enlighten plutocracy, just like in the US.
It is the News fault and especially CNN. CNN glorifies Democrats that give all FREE MONEY We lie about our Race problems Black are the Racist and we have thrown trillions to get rid of Black poverty they just STEAL AND BEAT INNOCENT PEOPLE.like in NORFOLK recently Blacks killed that kid not Zimmerman there would not be a Neighbor Watch if it weren't for Racist Blacks
It's the people stupid. We as Americans election politicians who promise us free stuff. (e.g. health care, infrastructure, etc) When a politicians says that we have to give up some of the free stuff, it's too expense. We vote them out. When a politician says we need to raise taxes, we've got stuff to pay for, we vote them out of office. We can't even stop giving money to public broadcasting, or tolerate the convenience of losing Saturday mail delivery. Americans are essentially greedy little children.
I find this to be grotesquely ironic. The "Left" has taken a deep drink of the same supply side economics kool-aid that the "Right" did years ago. Predictably, their prescription is spend more, the mirror image of the "Right's' prescription to tax less. Each side claims that its ideas will magically create growth, and economic difficulties will simply dissolve. Anyone interested in some seaside real estate in Paraguay?
congress is a big circus for the people. and the people put their trust in those entertainers.
The problem is there is no sense of pragmatism in elections, particularly presidential election. I propose there should be candidates pre-qualifications ensuring them having proven capabilities prior to being voted. Just similar to any private business organizations, the board will select a CEO basing on his or her track records. Therefore, may be, only good state governors are eligible for presidency. It seems Jon Huntsman once said political election is show business, and it is quite true in reality.
The problem in my opinion begins with an uninformed voter, or a folks who don't vote at all. I really believe "people" are the ones who really create their own problems in believing the Politicians every word without checking if it's true. Voters really need to investigate their candidates with some fact finding before making a decision on their candidate. It's disturbing that the media, and Religions influence so many in this Country to make really bad chocies. Especially those who are uneducated, and very gullible.
You can't give the public what they want because YOU want a fat salary, or you think it's a good idea. Most of the world's economies are going broke through loose fiscal arrangements. You CAN'T promise fat wages for public servants when your tax base is not able to support those future payments. Taxes pay for everything and the burden falls on small business, middle class self employed. In fact you should say to police, teachers, administrators "we will pay you tax free" cause whats the point of paying them tax money and then taxing them, your only getting back what you gave them, may as well save money and paperwork and give them less.
The erroneous assumption in many of the previous comments is that there EXISTS a single political / economic outcome in any state or nation which would satisfy a significant portion (let alone a majority) of the electorate in that state or nation. . There are simply too many feet to be stepped on.
As the article points out, even some dictators have a miserable time of it !
it does not really matter how many terms one serves but what kind of job they do while they are there. if congress is like a revolving door just like any company you have turmoil and lack of continuity. The key is for congress to focus on simplifying and making government more accountible and reliable. If they could sit down a write legislation that are long term solutions instead of short term then they would not have to pass new legislation every 4 yrs.
And this is why democracy fails... Politicians have to focus too much on their approval rating and getting elected to focus on the real problems. I love how our election processes are pretty much like choosing a highschool prom king/queen. We'll spend millions on campaigning and elections just to get our favorite in office. No wonder so many philosophers thought democracy is the worst form of government next to tyranny.
The forefathers knew democracy was a bad idea, that's why they didnt' make one. They formed a republic where the rule of law was to supercede the intent of a majority that would take from the minority. Benjamin Franklin said democracy was like two wolves and a sheep voting on what's for dinner. "Democracy" is closer to anarchy than any other form of government. Greece tried it and failed. Rome refined it into a republic and let it become an Empire. We have followed suit in an ALMOST IDENTICAL fashion. And like Rome we will fall financially, its happening right infront of our eyes.
AMEN! Hope there are more out there who have you critical thinking skills.
Mostly agreeable to the philosophy but strongly opposed to the wrong example I.e Nigeria. First, the Capital of Nigeria is Abuja not Lagos as suggested; Secondly, Nigerians are opposed to 'fuel subsidy' removal because of the mistrust for a government that decides to make the people it's major point of austerity measures whilst it does nothing to its over-payed and over-sized government; lastly where did anybody get the "81%" popularity credited to the president in a country that is yet to ascertain its population?? With perhaps the most hated president! Stick to the examples you know!!!
Jewish media and politicians are the problem! This is America not Israel! All real Americans have to do is turn on the TV and all they see are Jewish people hiding election polls and votes and pushing Israels agenda! How did that work out for you in Germany Wolf? 2% of Americans are Jewish 95% of people on tv are Jewish! 75% of politicians are Jewish and 80% of wall street are Jewish and this countrys tax money is going to the Jews! Now who is screwing Americans? THE JEWS!
Kojac, there is a difference between Jews and Talmudic Zionists. The later is the elite group in control of the media. The former is a race of people that were nearly annhilated multiple times over the past 4000 or so years. The problem is a group of people and their idealism, not a race of people. If you can't get that I hope choke on a ham sammich, the world could do without your blind hatred.
We see whats happening now more than ever! Your future in America is bleek because of your greed!
I want the government to f off and mind its mandate which is to protect the liberties of people through the rule of law. They have, nor should have ANYTHING to do with economics. The people create the market, determine the prices, and make the rules so long as those rules do not infringe on the life, liberty, or pursuit of happiness of others in the republic.
I can't speak about other countries, but in America the president doesn't and shouldn't have anything to do with the cost of gasoline.
Government are also there to regulate commerce. If not, crooks would abound. Commerce is not only the price of gasoline. It is also regulating Banks and other business, so that ordinary people are not abused. In countries were oil is a national property, the government regulates the price.
Term limits for the President IS a good idea. However, in our representative democracy, the Congress has a significant power as we have seen during the prior budget debates etc... Realistically both the President and the representatives both of the Senate and the Representatives should have term limits. This should be long enough and also staggered to allow continuity. The presidential term could be 6 years and this amount of time should be sufficient to accomplish the campaign promises and to bring about change and to see its effect. As for the Congress, their terms are staggered. For the senators a single term of 8 years and for the representatives, two terms of 4 years each ought to be adequate. If half the congress is elected in one 4 year cycle and the other half in the next four year cycle, then there will be continuity fo understand what went on when the freshman come in.
At this time we essentially have a two party system and both parties have their platforms that may or may not be acceptable to the majority. There is very little liklyhood that a third party candidate will win a presidential election. In order to give that chance we may need to change the voting system. We, the people should be given an opportunity to vote for more than one person but rank them in order of our preference. No electoral college! Now we have a chance to elect a thrid party candidate.
Unfortunately all the talk that is generated here is these forums will not get any traction.
No, I am not the problem. Government as practiced now is the problem
Politicians are living the life that they say isn't attainable to the rest of the country – who happen to be paying for them living the lush perk lifestyle they enjoy. Figure it out.
“We all know what to do. But we don’t know how to get reelected once we've done it.”
Well, at least he's honest about politicians' priorities.
We need less government and more administration
You need to define your statement better if you want a discussion.
One fallacy regarding the need for multiple consecutive terms has always been that it takes one term to learn the job. That is complete nonsense. To begin with, in the case of our House of Representatives (a two year term) consider how many corporations would allow a new employee two years to become productive. Not many.
Most of the real work is done by staff and the office holder is a mere figurehead. How else could a member of Congress spend, on average, two days a week in their office or on the floor, spending the balance of their time shmoozing prospective campaign donors, pandering to voters and sucking up to the lobbyists.
"The last time a leader there tried to raise prices, in 1989, all hell broke loose" No, although politicians are greedy and power crazy and the masses are so stupid they might as well be dead, the real problem lies with media hackery. Hacks who use cliches like "all hell broke loose" reflect the degree to which the witless and incompetent have become professionally embedded. When those who crave truth and full connexion with actuality become media writers, the truth will emerge. Until then, all we have is lies.
A representative democracy will never survive an ignorant and unimformed electorate, and we truly have an ignorant electorate. They may be somewhat informed but they are so lost in partisan rhetoric that they fail to acknowledge facts, even when they are presented to them.
I would like to add a third/fourth culprit (they work in tangent to one another,) corporations and lobbyist. But yes, the politicians and people are also part of that problem. We have a major problem when millions are poured into a politics and extraneous information is bombarded to the public. Take, for example, Grover Norquist. Most people may not know who he is, but he controls 95% of the Republican politicians. His policy makes it almost impossible to reach to an agreement.
An uninformed public is just as dangerous as a misinformed public.
Voters put politicians to power mainly because of the benefits and advantages they have been promised, and naturally smart leaders would throw out all possible goodies to get elected.
Once in power, the leaders would dig into whatever left in the treasury to please the people and to keep their promises. When coffers turn empty, money could be printed, loans taken by selling bonds domestically and internationally. Gradually, people who are so used to be given privileges and well fed by their governments, think these are their rights that should not be taken away. Any counter measure would provoke immediate resentment.
Hence, coupled by human avarice, all kinds of related crisis are surfacing everywhere nowadays. (btt1943, mtd1943)
Sounds like yo would prefer a dictatorship. Who do you have in mind to be the Beloved Leader?
It doesn't matter what we do with term limits, changing the electoral system, etc...as long as the populace is stupid they will continue to make stupid choices.
jdk - It is not "stupid" for the people - the owners of the government - to use their government to improve their lives, improve social justice, and make it possible for them to have access to the benefits of modern life they have created through their work.
One example of intelligence is the people of Argentina, whose government told their foreign creditors that the money supposedly owed to them would not be paid. Instead, that money was put to use improving the lives of the people and the economy, which has grown at 8% a year ever since.
Why aren't Americans smart enough to do likewise? Maybe because they've been conned by the swindlers and cheats who have caused the current recession?
I mean if the people get angry at government policies when it's government trying to establish long-term goals, if the government has the commitment to actually improve infrastructure, then wouldn't it be able to respond to the peoples' discontent by telling them that the country needs this for long-term growth and that a transparency system will be put in place in which people can verify that corruption isn't occurring? I'm shocked that this hasn't happened already..
Each country has its own sets of problems. Everywhere, people get the politicians they deserve. There are though countries which can be fixed by either people or politicians. Such country is Greece, where the problem is beyond the reach of normal human beings. politics, and procedures. To fix Greece what is needed is new ideas. China comes to mind: Why China is doing better than Greece? It's not just large population. It's Politburo and being pegged to the dollar ... and getting away with this! Perhaps, time has come to emulate China. pegging the dinar to the dollar, and creating an autoritarian one- party Politburo! I can't see a better solution for Greece! They should try it for a decade, to see if it works.
The Greeks did "try' dictatorship in the late 60s and early 70s. Their military seized power and ran the country by decree, imprisoning and torturing anyone who disagreed. people with democratic principles were outraged that this should happen in the cradle of democracy, and disgusted by the brutal violence of the colonels who decided they were chosen by god to tell everyone else what to do. The 'experiment" was a failure, and a democratic republic was installed when the colonels were ignominiously forced from power.
Let's say nowadays the politicians are under severe stress that may cause catatonia whereas societies have a tendency for mass hysteria.
Depends on which country it is. Populous places like both the people and the politicians are the problem. The first mired in poverty and the other corrupt. Both expect the other to pull it out of the quagmire but are stuck in the poltiical quicksand.
CORRECTION: Should read "POPULOUS PLACES LIKE IINDIA BOTH THE PEOPLE.......". My apologies
The problem is really complicated, but in the end, politicians are giving us what we (collectively) ask for. We just don't like rhe price tag.
I've seen the term-limits rule actually backfire. There was a Congressman in my area doing an excellent job and a very honest public servant – he had to step down by law.
Problem are both, when we/people elected the politicians for their job to fulfill what they promise,when they don't that it"s
politicians problem.After he or she come back to us/people for reelected we forget every thing,we never ask them why
they don"t & we re-elected them,it"s people"s problem.
Term limits are the answer.....
People get elected, basically to get bribed. Why would you get a law degree to be a politicians? Because of the money.
They pander for votes by giving people tax money. The governemnt is based on other peoples money.....
When they get power then the payouts get bigger, from lobbists. All of our federal politicians are multi-millionaires after 4 terms! Some of them in congress were on welfare before they got elected and now are multi-millionaires. How did that happen?
Term limits eliminates politics as a career, puts it back as service. 12 years is enough for anyone, including state service.
Politicians are like diapers, change them often.
Fareed Zakaria is a member of the American policy elite, and his show is a chance to get a prettied up version of what that elite is thinking. On today's show he let us know what some of his elite contacts are thinking about the future of democracy. According to him, they think it isn't working any more. They are distressed by the repeated and increasingly resounding defeats their policies have been receiving from voters in France, Greece, Britain, the German state of Schleswig-Holstein, and now in the most populous German state, Rhineland-Westphalia, in all of which governments committed to the Austerity Agenda have been thrown out of office or seriously curbed. In the Netherlands, the government fell recently, also because the majority in Parliament refused to support Austerity.
Zakaria did not endorse the view that democracy had lost its usefulness. But by raising the question, he made clear the growing contradiction between corporate capitalism and democracy.
The question he raised is: Who shall rule - the tiny group of rich people who control the major corporations and the banks, or the vast majority of the people?
Shall the Greek people decide their future? Or shall the rich bankers decide it?
Shall the French people govern themselves? Or shall they be ruled by a tiny group of rich people?
Shall the Nigerian people have democracy? or are they too "irresponsible" to be allowed to govern themselves/
Shall we submit to rule by 'experts" acting in their own interests? Or shall we govern ourselves in our own interests, and compel the rich and their "experts" to defer to the will of the people?
The incredible arrogance of the 1% who have managed to hog the resources of the world, leaving millions to starve, die of easily controlled diseases, or die in wars over the resources coveted by the rich - their abominable arrogance has now reached the point of discussing whether they will simply seize all the power, and use their paid goons, uniformed or not, to subdue us.
Fareed Zakaria is a well paid shill for his rich friends, well trained to mouth their fatuous nonsense as if it were the highest wisdom. He should perhaps stop spending so much time with them, stop listening with such craven deference to their self admiration and contempt for the rest of humanity. Instead, he should put some effort into listening to those who, like Mr Tsipras in Greece, Mr. Hollande and Mr. Melenchon in France, and many, many smart, thoughtful (but not rich) people who articulate the disgust so many millions of people feel for the ruthless cruelty of the Austerity Agenda, and who have some damned good ideas about how to replace it with policies and programs that serve the vast majority of the human race, instead of the swindlers and crooks who muse about the "irresponsibility" of those whom they have cheated and robbed.
Term limits based on years, not term counts. So everyone gets a max of 12 years (2 senate terms). At least we'll get one term from each politician where they will do what's actually best, not what's best for their reelection chances. There is also the people problem. While a most people think congress is a bunch of overpaid shills for some rich company or person, too many believe that THEIR congress person is ok so they will vote for that person again. So, in the end, it doesn't matter that most people think all of congress sucks because each individual keeps getting reelected. That is why congress does not care that their approval rating is in the tank. The only way to fix it is for each person to accept that THEIR congress person is, indeed, part of the problem and vote them out. Only then will attempts be made to do what is right for ALL of the people.
People are difinently the problem! Look what they put in the white house in 2008! ...have you had enough of Obamagheddon yet people? ...LOL
The power holders are the people, through the voting cards they choose the leaders. Unfortunately some of our voting patterns are based on wrong reasons e.g racism, tribalism, nepotism and religion.
The root of the problem is that politics is about who will be in government. While government is about what those in government do. And the main role of government is to prevent people from harming themselves and others.
The basics of it: "do not kill", "do not steal", "honour your contractual agreements", "do not deceive others", "control your reproductive urges", "earn your daily bread honestly by the sweat of your brow". But the people want to be free to do anything they want and that the government provides them with anything they (the people) wish. This cannot work. But promising this does place politicians into government, and gives them powers without responsibility. This is what DEMOCRACY is.
But, if the duties of government are limited to the basic necessity and strictly defined, and adequately controlled, and those in government are held responsible for what they do, then everybody will know what to expect from government and whether the government perform their duties competently and honestly.
It is not about WHO is in government. It is about HOW they govern. But this is MATHEMATICS (or Theocracy).
Aren't politions people? Politicians are just another reason to keep the beaucracy going. It's a two party system with a dictator. What if we had seven parties, like Norway. They (our poiticians) all talk alot, but don't say one blessed thing.