September 11th, 2014
11:34 PM ET

Can we defeat the Islamic State?

By Fareed Zakaria

The Obama administration has mapped out a smart strategy in Iraq, pressing the Baghdad government to include more Sunnis. But that has yet to happen — the Shiite parties have dragged their feet over any major concessions to Sunnis. The Iraqi army has not been reconstituted to make it less partisan and sectarian and more inclusive and effective. This is a crucial issue because if the United States is seen as defending two non-Sunni regimes — Iraq and Syria — against a Sunni uprising, it will not win. And it will be hard to recruit local allies. While a minority in Iraq, Sunnis make up the vast majority of the Middle East’s Muslims.

The Syrian aspect of the president’s strategy is its weak link. It is impossible to battle the Islamic State and not, in effect, strengthen the Bashar al-Assad regime. We can say we don’t intend to do that, but it doesn’t change the reality on the ground. The Free Syrian Army remains weak and divided among many local militias.

Read the full Washington Post column

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Topics: Fareed's Take

soundoff (91 Responses)
  1. EN Bengali

    Sent via iBall mobile

    September 11, 2014 at 11:39 pm | Reply
  2. Allan Kinsman©

    The middle east has deep divides. We began influencing them along political lines pre world war 1. However, the EU did the most interference. There has been a progressive reaction to the west. Most of these has surfaced from differing sects using arguments against interacting with the west. The staggering monies brought in with oil has been spred around. We seem to be lost with how we should interact with these peoples and the results of our recent interference has only given greater argment to radical elements. Let us remember we supported Sadam, gave him access to poison gas, lets see D.Cheney was the secretary of defense then. Yeah a great job we have done there in fact the guy which has created the now problem in Iraq, giving us another problem ISIS because he was trying to get even with those who supported Sadam. These people live by their rules of society which seem cruel and archiac but we let politicians go to war over oil when all we really wanted was to find justice for 9/11. Yet the middle east seems more in turmoil than ever?

    September 12, 2014 at 12:37 am | Reply
  3. Ferhat Balkan

    By now, most people should know that getting involved in a war will not resolve the conflict in the Middle East. In fact, it does exactly the opposite. Engaging ISIS in a bombing campaign will only serve to the local populace there and in the long run create even more local support for the insurgency. It will also serve to create more enemies of the US. We've seen this over and over historically and it seems we still did not learn our lesson. Why do they hate us? Well... We're bombing in Somalia, Yemen, Afghanistan, Pakistan, Iraq and now Syria. Then you wonder why they hate us Fareed?
    I always respected Obama and his approach with caution. His latest "strategy" in Iraq is pretty much bending the knee to the war mongering Republicans and other corrupt politicians. I mean, let's face it.. Where is the threat to America? Are ISIS terrorists coming across the border from Mexico? Are they in any way a direct threat? Recent CIA reports showed that ISIS did not pose a threat... We elected the president twice, so that we can stay out of wars and here we are again at the precipice.. I'm disappointed in Obama.
    Let us assume for a moment that somehow the Kurds and the Shia Iraqi army somehow defeat ISIS with help from the US.. What do you think will happen? Do you truly believe that the Kurds and Shia will play nice with the Sunni minority after all the beheadings that took place? Already, there are reports that the Shia military are doing their own beheadings of Sunni Arabs. There are also reports that the Kurds are saying there's no way after the war that they'll accept unity in Iraq, that they'll fight to achieve their independence... So after we bomb ISIS and somehow "destroy" them, do you think that the Shia and Kurds will play nice with each other? First of all, bombing a terrorist threat does not get rid of the threat. How did bombing all those countries that I mentioned earlier "fix" the problem or "destroy" it? When did that ever happen? It never will and we'll always be hated as a result, as long as we think war is the answer.

    September 12, 2014 at 1:46 am | Reply
    • Ferhat Balkan

      Slight correction: I meant to say "Engaging ISIS in a bombing campaign will only serve to further terrorize the local populace there"

      September 12, 2014 at 2:00 am | Reply
    • All the US has left is its killing machine

      Thanks Ferhat. Brilliant comment. Think about it like this. After giving 50 million jobs to Asia, on a sliver platter, over the last 30 years, what does the US have left to produce at home? You guessed it. Bombs, bombs and more bombs. That's it. Everything else is made in Asia. Most Americans have no clue. The analogy between the US in 2014 AD and Rome in 470 AD is just scary. All Rome had left, in 470 AD, was its killing machine. They were past masters at marching Roman Troops all over Europe and North Africa and the Levant, they had murdered them, they had enslaved them, they had watched their neighbors being eaten by lions and tigers in their coliseum for their entertainment, they had over spent, and become softees, rife with divorce, drugs, debt, decadence & deception. Their SPQR senators were arguing in circles, for decades, and getting a huge paycheck, for doing nothing. Their Roman military industrial complex was great at producing military hardware, which was bankrupting the empire. They were in big trouble, and they did not know it. All they knew how to do was: kill, kill, kill. Nothing else......... SOUND FAMILIAR????????????? And in 476 AD, Rome and its Empire collapsed into rubble.

      September 12, 2014 at 4:06 pm | Reply
      • rupert

        Yes Ferhat. That was a brilliant comment. U took the words right out of my mouth; per batum too.

        September 13, 2014 at 11:19 pm |
    • All the US has left is its killing machine

      Think about it like this, Ferhat. If there were no muslims to keep on murdering, just WHAT would the US military industrial complex do???? They would be in a huge fix. All they would have left would be their jobs in their City and State police and fire departments, their government jobs, their tax department jobs, their spy industrial complex SIC, which btw, has become HUGE in the US!). Their would be a massive vacuum, with nothing to fill it with. Its almost as if they would have to seek out and find a new enemy. so that they could bomb and kill again, and go back to "normal".......... how sick it that???? And how many Americans are willing to admit to this sad fact. Most Americans are like this Joey Isotta Fraschini nutcase, who think they are major patriotic, mucho All-American, love baseball and apple pie and pepperoni pizza........ AND............. bombing & killing muslims.......... they have no clue that their nation has gone astray, and is completely out of control.......... very sad.

      September 12, 2014 at 4:15 pm | Reply
      • rupert

        Dear Lord in heaven
        Thank u for giving this country might and wisdom to bomb and destroy thy true enemy in the middle east. Please help us rid the terrorists over there. But most of all, as for the americans that sympathize with ISIS, or are fully against the bombing, take away their ignorance and stupidity so that they may see the light.

        September 13, 2014 at 11:28 pm |
    • They have not learned from their past follies

      You would think that, by now, after Korea and Vietnam and Afghanistan and Iraq, and CIA supported coups in over 25 countries, the US would have learned from their past follies...........but nooooooooooooo........... they continue on, like this out of control 800 lb Gorilla combined with a Bull in a China Shop........... bombing and destroying everything they touch.......... just so that their US military industrial complex can make billions of profits each year!!!!!!! During the Vietnam War, the US MIC was billing the US Government approx 4x times the free market price, for each and every single piece of military hardware......... as if that was not bad enough.............. during the Iraq war, the US military industrial complex was billing the US Government 10x times the free market price, for each and every single piece of military hardware. Every American should read the excellent book on the Iraq War, written by Joe Stiglitz........... you will be shocked out of your boots!!!!!!!!!!!! Dick Cheney and his buddies got away with much much much more than murder......... they got away with bankrupting the hand that fed them........... the US taxpayer............ never forget the video snippet we all saw of GW Bush at his "secret" republican fund raiser, for his second term, where he was SURROUNDED by US military industrial complex CEO's, and he had his arms around a couple of them, and he said the words: "These are my friends, the haves and the more haves..........." what could be more sickening than that????????????

      September 12, 2014 at 4:48 pm | Reply
  4. Joey Isotta-Fraschini©

    The USA can neutralize the threat from the Islamic State on a continuing basis. A permanent elimination of any threat of violence from other nations or groups is unrealistic.
    The least realistic goal is to eliminate a threat of violence from adversaries by convincing our adversaries that they should love us, stuff rosebuds into the barrels of our guns, and give peace a chance while we strum electric guitars.

    September 12, 2014 at 4:34 am | Reply
    • Buck Ofama

      Well said, Joey. Thank you. Our illustrious President needs all the help he can muster against his ever noble fight against the ISIS and "rebuilding" Iraq!!!!!!

      September 12, 2014 at 8:49 am | Reply
      • Joey Isotta-Fraschini©

        @ Buck,
        I do very much support President Obama, and I have done that since his first campaign for the presidency. He has done many wonderful things for our country.
        HILLARY 2016!

        September 12, 2014 at 10:28 am |
      • Philip

        President Obama IS Muslim you donkers. Get a clue. Holy crap.

        September 12, 2014 at 9:17 pm |
      • LaBella

        Obama is not a Muslim any more than you are, Philip. Get a life and stop lying about your superiors.

        September 12, 2014 at 9:22 pm |
      • Joey Isotta-Fraschini©

        I have no reason to think that the President is Muslim. He says that he is Christian, so I believe him.
        Were he Muslim, his pretending to be Christian would probably benefit our country, although that is debatable.
        I know that the President understands the teachings of Islam, as we all should.
        Eclectic spirituality is valuable even to atheists, in my opinion.

        September 13, 2014 at 2:22 pm |
  5. The GOP Solution

    The GOP Solution: Turn all the Old, Sick, Poor, Non-white, Non-christian, Female, and Gay people into slaves. Then whip them until they are Young, Healthy, Rich, White, Christian, Male, and Straight. Or until they are dead. Then turn them into Soylent Green to feed the military during the next "unfunded/off-the-books" war. And don't forget the GOP all time favorites........TAX CUTS FOR THE RICH!!!..........and........GET RID OF SS AND MEDICARE!!!

    September 12, 2014 at 9:01 am | Reply
  6. The "Compassionate" GOP Solution

    The GOP Prayer/Mantra/Solution: Dear God...With your loving kindness, help us to turn all the Old, Sick, Poor, Non-white, Non-christian, Female, and Gay people into slaves. Then, with your guidance and compassion, we will whip them until they are Young, Healthy, Rich, White, Christian, Male, and Straight. Or until they are dead. God...Grant us the knowledge to then turn them into Soylent Green to feed the military during the next "unfunded/off-the-books" war. God...Give us the strength during our speeches to repeatedly yell........TAX CUTS FOR THE RICH!!!..........and........GET RID OF SS AND MEDICARE!!!
    In your name we prey (purposely misspelled, or is it?)........Amen

    September 12, 2014 at 9:02 am | Reply
    • Joey Isotta-Fraschini©

      @ The GOP "Prayer" Leader:
      Please continue to pray your didactic admonition of the Lord, as well as your defamation of the successful.
      As for me and my house, we will continue our advocacy of military defense for Americans at home and abroad.

      September 12, 2014 at 9:50 am | Reply
      • Joey Isotta-Fraschini

        This I totally disagree with, Joey. We Americans haven't defended anything since WW2 when we had enemies to fight. The right-wing thugs in Washington sorely need to quit abusing their power!

        September 12, 2014 at 10:29 am |
      • Joey Isotta-Fraschini©

        @ My Troll,
        I shall also continue to write "World War II," instead of "WW2" as you did, no matter what the progressive young whippersnappers who edit the CHICAGO MANUAL OF STYLE have to say about it: illiteracy should not be promoted, even though Roman numerals confound the USA#

        September 12, 2014 at 11:30 am |
      • Joey Isotta-Fraschini©

        "...even though Roman numerals confound the USA's younger citizens and residents."

        September 12, 2014 at 11:36 am |
      • LaBella

        You disagree with a book first published in 1906? Before the World Wars were even fought? How old are you, anyway, Joey?

        September 12, 2014 at 12:01 pm |
      • Joey Isotta-Fraschini©

        @ LaBella,
        The most recent edition of the Chicago Manual that I own is the Thirteenth Edition, published in 1982. It still rerecommends "World War II."
        I wrote that comment with the expectation that it would be changed sometime later.

        September 12, 2014 at 12:21 pm |
      • Joey Isotta-Fraschini©

        Oh, and @ LaBella, I forgot, in a senior moment, to answer your question.
        I'm 75.

        September 12, 2014 at 12:28 pm |
      • LaBella

        Lazy is as lazy does, Joey. Similar to those pesky kids writing "u" instead of "you". Time to go and shake my fist at the sky futilely while telling small children to get off my lawn.

        September 12, 2014 at 2:46 pm |
      • Joey Isotta-Fraschini

        Joey, I'm 70 years old and if there's one thing I learned in life, is never to put anything past neither the liars in Washington nor the C.I.A.

        September 12, 2014 at 3:17 pm |
      • Joey Isotta-Fraschini©

        @ My Troll,
        Why, you write as if you were five years younger...I mean, in the good meaning of that. Weren't you in high school during the Cuban missile crisis?
        When you're a little older, you'll have learned never to put anything past anybody: even the Castros, brothers and convertible sofas.

        September 12, 2014 at 4:33 pm |
  7. Cyrusz

    Rafsanjani number 2 Mullah Iran regime told today: We must give more weapons and rockets to the Hamas as much as we gave to the Hezbollah in the past to make the region safe against the Israel!!

    September 12, 2014 at 11:07 am | Reply
  8. chri§§y

    I agree @ Ferhat, and yes im disappointed as well. I believe though, that he has been beat down so badly over his time in office, by the warmongers that he just doesnt have much fight left in him! Look how much hes aged? And all i can say is it is quite similer to domestic violence and anyone who has endured THAT im sure will agree! One thing i do know...he cant run for office again so he didnt cave just to bring his ratings up, as some have implied.

    September 12, 2014 at 12:22 pm | Reply
  9. chri§§y

    Lol and a very spry 75 you forgot to add @ Joey! Im bettin you could run circles around some men half your age!

    September 12, 2014 at 12:56 pm | Reply
    • Joey Isotta-Fraschini

      Even at 75, one is still not too old to learn, chrissy. Joey needs to take this into his account and quit putting credence in those liars in Washington!

      September 12, 2014 at 3:20 pm | Reply
      • Joey Isotta-Fraschini©

        I learn new tricks every day, so watch out.

        September 12, 2014 at 4:38 pm |
      • Joey Isotta-Fraschini©

        One need not necessarily put credence in political leaders to choose and support the politicians who will be of the greatest personal benefit to one's interests.
        If fact, that is how democracy functions.

        September 12, 2014 at 4:44 pm |
      • LaBella

        Faux Joey should learn that it is impolite to steal another's name. At 70, that lesson should have been long learned.

        September 12, 2014 at 5:01 pm |
      • Buck Ofama

        Barack Obama may be a good liar but he'll knock off as many of those Mussies as George W. Bush did, if mot more. This I fully believe. We must keep up this killing, we simply must or how else is the M.I.C. going to make so much money in order to buy off our politicians?

        September 12, 2014 at 5:59 pm |
    • Zandie

      I haven't had it.

      September 12, 2014 at 11:15 pm | Reply
  10. j. von hettlingen

    Fawaz Gerges is right about the self-proclamied caliph Abu Bakr al-Baghdadi's short-term goal. ISIS is focused on liberating the oppressed Sunnis in Iraq and Syria under Shiite and Alawite rules. The jihadists have been able to exploit the deepening Sunni-Shia schism in Iraq and the sectarian civil war in Syria. In order to cement his authority in Iraq, Baghdadi builds a powerbase. He reaches out to disenchanted Sunnis and wins support of former loyalists of Saddam Hussein and tribal leaders. In Syria the ISIS fighters get rid of the moderate Sunni rebels and take advantage of the regime forces' war fatigue to capture territories Assad can't defend.
    Al-Baghdadi is quite frank when he says, the US is not on his agenda right now, explaining ISIS is "not ready to attack the United States". Yet he welcomes US boots on the ground, hoping the ISIS "could directly engage the Americans — and kill them.”
    Now many in the US question whether Obama is making the right decision by declaring war on ISIS, if it doesn't pose any immediate threat to the US? ISIS can't beat the US militarily. Yet it wages a psychological warfare against the US. The beheading of the two American journalists had served as a "bait" to provoke rancid emotions. It works! Fareed advises: "Don't overestimate the enemy"! Not militarily! But we can't underestimate the appeal ISIS has to angry young Sunnis.
    Obama knows the crisis needs a political solution and he is trying to form a grand coalition in the region to take on ISIS. Unfortunately many Sunni Arabs do fear that Iran would benefit from a weakened ISIS, making politics entirely sectarian. So support for US intervention to fight ISIS is quite tepid. Their mentality is different from ours. Realpolitik and hubris are their main objectives, and making compromise is seen as a weakness.

    September 12, 2014 at 3:50 pm | Reply
    • Buck Ofama

      Don't worry. barack Obama will beat the ISIS one way or another! He will, he will. Just you wait and see, everybody!

      September 12, 2014 at 6:03 pm | Reply
  11. chri§§y

    Lol @ Joey (the REAL Joey in blue) your memory is pretty good too i see ;)! Yes i also remember comments made by your troll on the cuban thread! Lol

    September 12, 2014 at 5:05 pm | Reply
  12. chri§§y

    And @ fake Joey while i agree with your feelings on our government members, as there are very, very few i trust or believe. I do however respects others to have their own opinion, no matter how gullible it appears to me! And at 75 i seriously doubt either you, i or anyone else will change that opinion!

    September 12, 2014 at 5:10 pm | Reply
  13. chri§§y

    Our politicians were bought off along time ago!

    September 12, 2014 at 7:27 pm | Reply
    • Philip

      Exactly, @Chrissy. World political leaders bought and paid for by one single foreign group of bankers operating out of Basel, Switzerland. Headquarters of all the world's federal reserves/central banks.
      Of course dumbed-down Americans think that major corporations bought them long ago. And so are totally ignorant of above truths.

      September 12, 2014 at 9:05 pm | Reply
      • Joey Isotta-Fraschini

        Quite true Philip, quite true indeed!

        September 13, 2014 at 1:18 am |
    • Joey Isotta-Fraschini

      Quite true, chrissy. The vast majority of them have sold out to the M.I.C. Since it has the most money and this is precisely why we have constantly been at war ever since 2001!

      September 13, 2014 at 1:17 am | Reply
  14. Philip

    What about the Jewish State? Can they be defeated. The "Christian" State? Hardly. All of organised Big Religia has been corrupted. If you have not figured this out by now is because you haven't done your homework.
    All organized religions need to be banished forever. If there be a true form of organized worship, God himself would obviously protect them from being disbanded.

    September 12, 2014 at 7:45 pm | Reply
  15. Philip

    Religious states cannot possibly be defeated. One man's organized freedom fighter will always be another man's organized terrorist.

    September 12, 2014 at 8:58 pm | Reply
  16. stuart

    Hi just got back fron Greenland. No internet there.

    September 12, 2014 at 11:22 pm | Reply
  17. Thomas

    It can only be defeated by a rational , creative progressive thinking Islamic people .

    Allah's words of compassion , tolerance and respect have been lost , there was a time when islam contributed to science, literature , architecture.

    It's an inside job , a body must want to rid itself of cancer if it wants to be healthy again.

    September 13, 2014 at 1:06 pm | Reply
  18. chri§§y

    Lol @ Joey of course its true! Thats WHY they wont allow an audit of the Federal Reserve! And i seriously doubt we will see that happen in our lifetime! Also its most likely the reason Ron Paul was forced out of the election 2 terms ago. Because that was one of his pledges to the American citizens! To have an audit done! DC is filled with corruption!

    September 13, 2014 at 1:15 pm | Reply
  19. Nsamba Taufeeq

    The situation in iraq may reach its end but the roots of the chaos will ive to see another day,the religious/ethnic divide,prejudice,the scars of sadaam hussein's dictatorship,the emerging regional prowess of iran and the rise of the entire shiite block are all indicative of possible chaos in the future.....
    In my opinion,the sheer economic stagnation in the region is critical to controlling the development of any chaotic situation that may arise,the US has done a magnificent job of pressing the iraq government to become inclusive of sunnis, but this is hardly the end,the US needs to ensure that corruption and any poor governance is monitored and dealt with,needs to ensure the government of iraq has economic development spread across the iraq to prevent seeds of another violent opposition.

    September 13, 2014 at 1:51 pm | Reply
    • Joey Isotta-Fraschini©

      "The roots of the chaos will live,' you say?
      Delightful! The USA will remain in a state of perpetual alertness.

      September 13, 2014 at 2:34 pm | Reply
      • Joey Isotta-Fraschini©

        ", not '

        September 13, 2014 at 2:39 pm |
      • get over it, nitwit

        Get over it, JIF, you nitwit......... this person is saying something very important........... you just don't have the brains to see it........... yeah, yeah, yeah............ bomb, bomb, bomb............ that's all you know............ so sad............ 😦

        September 13, 2014 at 4:18 pm |
    • Philip

      True. Water and oil simply do not mix and iron and clay cannot be molded together. For there to be any semblance of peace on earth, all organized religions would have to be disbanded. Religious segregation is what divides the world's citizenry. And then there is the criminal elements to disband. Even perverted priests and outlaw biker gangs.

      September 13, 2014 at 2:35 pm | Reply
  20. banasy

    Banasy was here.

    September 13, 2014 at 2:43 pm | Reply
  21. rupert

    @ philip. I am dating banasy. She is a hot russian babe. This weekend we are going to Manhattan to visit joey and his wife. We have plans to watch a movie eat italian food, then watch tv at joey's exclusive home.
    Please don't argue with my girlfriend.

    September 13, 2014 at 2:53 pm | Reply
  22. rupert

    @2:47. Go away jif troll. He does not like people to use his name.

    September 13, 2014 at 2:55 pm | Reply
  23. rupert

    @allen kinsman. Get a job,u bum

    September 13, 2014 at 3:11 pm | Reply
  24. rupert

    Can we defeat the islamic state? Yes. Send in the french and british troops. And mexican army. Opps. Forget the mexicans. We know they don't have an army or navy or airplanes. The mexicans are just too dumb.
    Ever notice how salt n vinegar chips are full of flavor?
    Hi joey baby. How are u?
    If philip and joey played chess, who would win?????

    September 13, 2014 at 3:19 pm | Reply
    • Philip

      Who are "the Mexicans", Rupert. And no matter what, one man's religious freedom fighter is another man's religious terrorist. Organized religions themselves would have to be banished in order for radical religious warring to end.
      Banish organized religion and Jew vs. Muslim ends. No more Christians robbing bombs on Christians once religious orgs are disbanded.
      Same holds true for organized street and outlaw biker gangs. Cutting off the head simply dies not work. These divisive orgs will have to be gutted. That's just how it is.

      September 13, 2014 at 5:10 pm | Reply
      • George patton

        @philip. What this country needs is zero tolerance for biker gangs.

        September 13, 2014 at 7:18 pm |
      • Joseph McCarthy

        Well said, George!

        September 13, 2014 at 7:20 pm |
  25. rupert

    @ Labella and chrissy. How bout I feel u off???

    September 13, 2014 at 3:22 pm | Reply
  26. rupert

    carbs are worse than fat.

    September 13, 2014 at 3:31 pm | Reply
  27. rupert

    Oh oh. They'rrrrrre back.
    Monitors have arrived

    September 13, 2014 at 3:32 pm | Reply
  28. Philip

    Religions are more divisive than national border lines. Care to wager?

    September 13, 2014 at 3:56 pm | Reply
  29. zero brain level numbskulls

    rupert, do you realize that you have sunk to being a "zero level" uneducated, ignorant, numbskull? And the folk having huge conversations with you are lowering themselves to your level? We really don't need to show the rest of the world just how low the American intellectual level has sunk you know........

    September 13, 2014 at 4:01 pm | Reply
    • Joey Isotta-Fraschini

      Please, zero brain level numbskulls, this rupert who posted the above is only trying to be funny, so just ignore what he says and don't dignify any of his posts by answering them!

      September 13, 2014 at 7:15 pm | Reply
      • rupert

        @fake joey . U don't say.

        September 13, 2014 at 9:54 pm |
    • rupert

      @zero brain level..really? For real?

      September 13, 2014 at 9:52 pm | Reply
  30. Thomas

    The hardline al Qaeda offshoot Islamic State has destroyed several Sufi Muslim shrines and tombs in the eastern Syrian province of Deir al-Zor, a monitoring group said on Saturday.

    These Destroyers of Humanity are not true believers of Islam , they are of a Marxist Khmer Rouge doctrine who wear black masks pretending to be righteous .

    September 13, 2014 at 4:42 pm | Reply
    • Philip

      The hardliner offshoot of Christian British Imperialism invaded and occupied Afghanistan and Iraq, leveling many structures including an entire city of over 200,000 Iraqis. Thousands of victims being Iraqi Christians.
      Those destroyers of humanity do not follow The Way of Christ, they are of pagan origin.

      September 13, 2014 at 5:02 pm | Reply
      • Joey Isotta-Fraschini

        Well said, Philip. Much of the current troubles stems from the British expansionism in the Middle East. In fact, it was the British who created Iraq back in 1919!

        September 13, 2014 at 7:11 pm |
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